Why Aren't Spurs Trading Kawhi?

[irfuji]

So genuinely curious about this.

Kawhi is locked up by the Spurs for one more year. He has supposedly made it very clear to the league that he wants to go to the Lakers.

If all that is true, why don't the Spurs trade him to the Lakers?

I mean I understand that you don't want to make a team in your conference better. But the Lakers are probably going to give you the most for Kawhi. No other team is going to give the Spurs what Kawhi is really worth when they know it's more than likely a 1 year rental. Especially now that Lebron has signed with LA.

So it looks to me like you can either get some return for Kawhi, or none when he leaves next year.

I mean it's kind of like the Kyrie to Boston deal. Cavs did what they could with a guy who was going to leave anyway. Granted the deal looks terrible in hindsight, but at the time I thought the Cavs actually got more value for Kyrie than expected. Not sure what the Spurs are holding out for here.

[jcardstore]

They will trade him.

[mcgahee21nfl]

Because they will?

[Kingofkings1281]

He’ll be in a Laker uniform by the beginning of the season.

[GC1980]

Spurs have leverage right now despite what people are thinking. They know several teams are dying to add him for this season to make a major run. They have proven they can be competitive without him. They will extract the most they can for him to set themselves up as best they can. This is not a panic organization, never has been. They will come out fine. Worst case they let Kawhi show he is healthy because any baby games like last year and he just costs himself money. They only lose leverage if this drags to the deadline.

[indyguy]

Treat it like the Pacers with PG last year. Shop and get the best deal for the team.

[GeechQuest]

Spurs have leverage right now despite what people are thinking. They know several teams are dying to add him for this season to make a major run. They have proven they can be competitive without him. They will extract the most they can for him to set themselves up as best they can. This is not a panic organization, never has been. They will come out fine. Worst case they let Kawhi show he is healthy because any baby games like last year and he just costs himself money. They only lose leverage if this drags to the deadline.

I'd say they gain leverage toward the deadline.

If Philly is in 2nd behind Boston come February, and seem to be missing just one piece, then a trade gets done. If Boston remains hurt and Philly shows out, then you don't need a potential Kawhi rental.

If the Lakers aren't really meshing well by February, then a trade gets done. If you're a playoff team and playing above average basketball, make a run in 2019 Free Agency.

Teams that trade for Kawhi now have GMs that should be fired. There is no benefit to getting Kawhi now when you have until February to decide if it's necessary. If San Antonio lets him walk for nothing, it would be shocking.

San Antonio can try to play hardball all they want, but the reality is that they have no leverage currently. The good teams can just wait it out, the bad teams don't want the rental.

[indyguy]

I'd say they gain leverage toward the deadline.

If Philly is in 2nd behind Boston come February, and seem to be missing just one piece, then a trade gets done. If Boston remains hurt and Philly shows out, then you don't need a potential Kawhi rental.

If the Lakers aren't really meshing well by February, then a trade gets done. If you're a playoff team and playing above average basketball, make a run in 2019 Free Agency.

Teams that trade for Kawhi now have GMs that should be fired. There is no benefit to getting Kawhi now when you have until February to decide if it's necessary. If San Antonio lets him walk for nothing, it would be shocking.

San Antonio can try to play hardball all they want, but the reality is that they have no leverage currently. The good teams can just wait it out, the bad teams don't want the rental.

Think you're off there. If I'm a team that is going to make the one season run at the championship, especially in the East, then I'm trying to make a move now, so we can get him in and get some chemistry. Adding him at the deadline and then trying to fit him in will be a much tougher task.

[GeechQuest]

Think you're off there. If I'm a team that is going to make the one season run at the championship, especially in the East, then I'm trying to make a move now, so we can get him in and get some chemistry. Adding him at the deadline and then trying to fit him in will be a much tougher task.

I see that side of it, but I just disagree.

Risk vs. Reward

We have no idea how next season is going to play out, in terms of how teams actually blend and who gets hurt.

If you're Philly it's genuinely possible you don't need Kawhi. On paper you're the 2nd best team in the East, but the Celtics roster (After inserting Hayward) is a team that has never played together before. How effective will they be? What's their bench situation if they don't retain Marcus Smart? Does Tatum regress now that Hayward and Kyrie come back? You actually could end up better than them just with Simmons, Fultz, and Embiids natural progression. Is it smart to leverage the future of your team on Kawhi, who may only stay a year if you don't need to? Remember, Philly still has truckloads of money to add pieces this season to their team.

If you're the Lakers, reports say Kawhi is adamant about joining your team. Is it worth mortgaging your young core, who you own their Bird Rights, to get Kawhi a year early? If you sign Kawhi next year, you can sign your young core going forward since you own their Bird Rights. You can go over the cap to retain your guys. If you trade your guys away, then you'll be maxed out after a resign next year and free agency will be a little bit tougher than it has been this year. Is it worth it?

Also, San Antonio has 2 options. Take a trade offer or let Kawhi walk. Letting Kawhi walk would be absolutely detrimental to their rebuild. Getting nothing in return for a player is never the way to go. If neither Philly or LA budge on trade talks, then what does SA do? They get nowhere very fast by playing hardball. I just don't see how SA has any leverage in these negotiations.

[Longshot18]

I think it's a matter of time.

All sides seem to think they have leverage.

Spurs have the player, he's under contract. They also have a history of being a top quality organization who has great player relations so their thinking they can smooth things out is based on experience. So even though this is a different case, they have history to believe they can fix things. So I don't think they feel a dire need at this moment. Further, there are a few teams interested in him. And Im not even sure we can take Kawhi at "his word" that he's only going to Lakers and nowhere else. First- he has said nothing. Second, how many times in general do players say one thing, do another. Paul George put out a video about being a Laker for goodness sakes, then resigns with OK city. So I think it's presumptious to assume, if you are Boston, or Sixers, that they have no chance to trade and sign him long term. So with several teams interested, Spurs do still have some leverage in terms of being able to fend off low ball offers.

Lakers are of the belief that 2019 he's coming there with or w/o trading for him. So why move a nickel for him. Makes sense IF they are 100% certain of this. But it's risky even if Kawhi is telling them this, that things won't change in a year. Heck- look how quickly things changed in a drastic manner this year. Anyway, Lakers have reason to believe they have leverage too.

Here is the thing I would be scared of if I am the Lakers- hurting this freaking babies feelings. Clearly he has a fragile mentality to have this go this far with the Spurs. That same baby hurt feelings mentality could easily look at the lakers and wonder "why are you not coming to get me now- don't you love me"?. I don't claim to have spoken with Kawhi, only saying that the same general human principles involved in his attitude with the Spurs could easily come into play again.

Boston/Sixers, etc---their "leverage" in any deals with SA is that they feel it's a rental player. So they won't feel compelled to offer as much.

My gut is this: He will be moved. It won't be for the mother load. But that is as much to do with "leverage" as it is to do with the fact that the top 10ish players that get moved are never moved for gold mines. The team moving them never gets back perfect value. They get the best they can and move forward.

If I am a betting man, he goes to the Lakers and Ingram is part of the deal. As a Spurs fan I like that a heckuva lot more than Brown from Boston. Ingram has the potential to be a focal point of a team, Brown IMO does not. he's going to be a great role player, but hes not shown he can create shots on his own or do other things offensively to be the #1 option of a team. Ingram has at least shown signs of this.

[Siberian13]

When you act like a B....You get treated like a B....

[Longshot18]

When you act like a B....You get treated like a B....

I am a diehard Spurs fan. And until, oh about 2-3 months ago, Kawhi was one of, if not my favorite player in the NBA.

But this move by him, I have lost all respect for him as a person. Grow the frick up. I'd say that even if I hated the Spurs. The baby athlete has always grated on my nerves.

Bottom line is he's supposed to be a franchise player/leader. Just about everything he has done/not done/authorized his camp to leak- is anything but mature, or leadership.

And he better be careful what he asks for. You can be a quiet non-descript player in SA and nobody cares. But the spotlight on everything from his on court play to what he had for dinner is going to shine bright-very bright - in LA.

For someone so sensitive to scruitiny, he's about to put gas on the fire.

[spurs50fan]

When you act like a B....You get treated like a B....

This

Neither side has handled this well but I think Kawhi used the situation to further his crusade to skip town. Every statement that comes out of his camp proves he already wanted out. He ramped it up with his only LA bs

[Dnic]

Spurs lost the leverage with Lebron signing first and a 4 year contract the Lakers can actually wait 1 year and get Kawhi when he goes into free agency. Dumb management by the Spurs imo they could have possibly got the world a few days ago lol

[spurs50fan]

Spurs lost the leverage with Lebron signing first and a 4 year contract the Lakers can actually wait 1 year and get Kawhi when he goes into free agency. Dumb management by the Spurs imo they could have possibly got the world a few days ago lol

Lakers can wait but their willingness to hang for a year meant the Spurs weren’t getting much to begin with. If they could get the world before, that meant they put value on that year. Mainly because Lebron isn’t getting younger

[indyguy]

I see that side of it, but I just disagree.

Risk vs. Reward

We have no idea how next season is going to play out, in terms of how teams actually blend and who gets hurt.

If you're Philly it's genuinely possible you don't need Kawhi. On paper you're the 2nd best team in the East, but the Celtics roster (After inserting Hayward) is a team that has never played together before. How effective will they be? What's their bench situation if they don't retain Marcus Smart? Does Tatum regress now that Hayward and Kyrie come back? You actually could end up better than them just with Simmons, Fultz, and Embiids natural progression. Is it smart to leverage the future of your team on Kawhi, who may only stay a year if you don't need to? Remember, Philly still has truckloads of money to add pieces this season to their team.

If you're the Lakers, reports say Kawhi is adamant about joining your team. Is it worth mortgaging your young core, who you own their Bird Rights, to get Kawhi a year early? If you sign Kawhi next year, you can sign your young core going forward since you own their Bird Rights. You can go over the cap to retain your guys. If you trade your guys away, then you'll be maxed out after a resign next year and free agency will be a little bit tougher than it has been this year. Is it worth it?

Also, San Antonio has 2 options. Take a trade offer or let Kawhi walk. Letting Kawhi walk would be absolutely detrimental to their rebuild. Getting nothing in return for a player is never the way to go. If neither Philly or LA budge on trade talks, then what does SA do? They get nowhere very fast by playing hardball. I just don't see how SA has any leverage in these negotiations.

Just responding on the bold:

1. 100% agree

2. I'm of the mindset that Philly should try to run it back with a full season of Fultz along with all of their FAs they just brought back in. But, Philly did bring in a few solid looking prospects. Shamet, Zhaire Smith, and Shake Milton are some decent pieces to start trade talks. Of course, someone else would need to be involved to sweeten the pot, but Philly doesn't lose a ton in this kind of scenario.

3. Agreed. If I'm the Lakers I would sit, like they did with PG. Now, that didn't fully work in their favor, but they ended up with LeBron, so they can't be too upset.

4. I was thinking of New Orleans as possible destination. Maybe do a Cousins sign-and-trade. I don't know, spit-balling.

[Siberian13]

.
But this move by him, I have lost all respect for him


I think a lot of people were fans of him even if they weren't Spurs fans but they also lost the same respect. It's his decision but the way he has handled it and not speaking up is just weird.

[GC1980]

I'd say they gain leverage toward the deadline.

If Philly is in 2nd behind Boston come February, and seem to be missing just one piece, then a trade gets done. If Boston remains hurt and Philly shows out, then you don't need a potential Kawhi rental.

If the Lakers aren't really meshing well by February, then a trade gets done. If you're a playoff team and playing above average basketball, make a run in 2019 Free Agency.

Teams that trade for Kawhi now have GMs that should be fired. There is no benefit to getting Kawhi now when you have until February to decide if it's necessary. If San Antonio lets him walk for nothing, it would be shocking.

San Antonio can try to play hardball all they want, but the reality is that they have no leverage currently. The good teams can just wait it out, the bad teams don't want the rental.

I can see the argument but way I see it is if the Lakers want to make a push this season they need to have Kawhi on board ASAP to build chemistry and more importantly keep him from being seduced by another team (see: George, Paul). The longer this drags the more clear it becomes that LA is content to ride it out and bank on the allure of their brand, city and Lebron.

If it's teams like BOS or PHI that wants him, they will want him soon as well in order to give them time to make the big push this season and also to maximize time to sell him on their culture. The longer it drags the more likely its a rental and the weaker the deal becomes.

Just my feel on it. If SA is going to get a good haul it's important to move fast but not so fast.

[pennywise]

It's pretty simple really. The Spurs haven't yet heard an offer they liked and there's really no rush to move Kawhi right now. Their line of thinking (if they don't get a good offer in the off-season) is to let the season start, let Kawhi prove he's healthy and still the efficient player he is, and boom, trade value is back up. Now they're looking at more options than they had before. If they get a good offer before the season starts, they'll take it. It just hasn't presented itself yet. Reports are that the Lakers have offered peanuts and that's just not going to get it done.

I wouldn't be surprised if Kawhi started the season with SA, but he'll definitely be traded before All-Star weekend, and probably MUCH sooner. SA isn't just going to let him walk. There are a handful of teams that already want him now. Just imagine how many teams will be knocking on the door when Kawhi has played a few games and reminded the league how good he is.

Having said all of that, I still think Kawhi gets traded before the season starts, either to the Lakers or the Sixers. We shall see. If the Lakers are smart, they'll make a legitimate offer for Kawhi sooner than later. LeBron isn't getting any younger. Waiting a year for the chance that Kawhi goes to LA is just a waste of one of the few dominant years LeBron has left. If they're truly in win-a-championship-now mode, they need to commit.

[Braswell10]

It's pretty simple really. The Spurs haven't yet heard an offer they liked and there's really no rush to move Kawhi right now. Their line of thinking (if they don't get a good offer in the off-season) is to let the season start, let Kawhi prove he's healthy and still the efficient player he is, and boom, trade value is back up. Now they're looking at more options than they had before. If they get a good offer before the season starts, they'll take it. It just hasn't presented itself yet. Reports are that the Lakers have offered peanuts and that's just not going to get it done.

I wouldn't be surprised if Kawhi started the season with SA, but he'll definitely be traded before All-Star weekend, and probably MUCH sooner. SA isn't just going to let him walk. There are a handful of teams that already want him now. Just imagine how many teams will be knocking on the door when Kawhi has played a few games and reminded the league how good he is.

Having said all of that, I still think Kawhi gets traded before the season starts, either to the Lakers or the Sixers. We shall see. If the Lakers are smart, they'll make a legitimate offer for Kawhi sooner than later. LeBron isn't getting any younger. Waiting a year for the chance that Kawhi goes to LA is just a waste of one of the few dominant years LeBron has left. If they're truly in win-a-championship-now mode, they need to commit.

Kawhi said that he is willing to sit the entire 18-19 season if he does not get traded.

[pennywise]

Kawhi said that he is willing to sit the entire 18-19 season if he does not get traded.

I have heard those rumors but have yet to hear or read him quoted as saying that.

[Dnic]

Kawhi said that he is willing to sit the entire 18-19 season if he does not get traded.

Exactly what I read that now puts SA in a bind imo

[GeechQuest]

It's pretty simple really. The Spurs haven't yet heard an offer they liked and there's really no rush to move Kawhi right now. Their line of thinking (if they don't get a good offer in the off-season) is to let the season start, let Kawhi prove he's healthy and still the efficient player he is, and boom, trade value is back up. Now they're looking at more options than they had before. If they get a good offer before the season starts, they'll take it. It just hasn't presented itself yet. Reports are that the Lakers have offered peanuts and that's just not going to get it done.

I wouldn't be surprised if Kawhi started the season with SA, but he'll definitely be traded before All-Star weekend, and probably MUCH sooner. SA isn't just going to let him walk. There are a handful of teams that already want him now. Just imagine how many teams will be knocking on the door when Kawhi has played a few games and reminded the league how good he is.

Having said all of that, I still think Kawhi gets traded before the season starts, either to the Lakers or the Sixers. We shall see. If the Lakers are smart, they'll make a legitimate offer for Kawhi sooner than later. LeBron isn't getting any younger. Waiting a year for the chance that Kawhi goes to LA is just a waste of one of the few dominant years LeBron has left. If they're truly in win-a-championship-now mode, they need to commit.

What would be a legitimate offer?

If the rumors are true then the Lakers have offered Ingram and a 1st. That seems more than generous given the situation. It's better, in my eyes, than the reported Saric, Covington, and a 1st (unless it's the 2021 1st from the Heat which is GOLD).

[pennywise]

What would be a legitimate offer?

If the rumors are true then the Lakers have offered Ingram and a 1st. That seems more than generous given the situation. It's better, in my eyes, than the reported Saric, Covington, and a 1st (unless it's the 2021 1st from the Heat which is GOLD).

Kawhi is a top 3 player in the league and the Lakers know that or they wouldn't be interested. If Kuzma is truly "off limits" then LA needs to add Hart to the Ingram package. I think Ingram, Hart, and a pick would get the deal done. I'm not as big on Ingram as everyone else seems to be. I'd much rather have Jaylen Brown but that's probably not happening.

Thing is, there's no guarantee Kawhi goes to LA in free agency. He's getting traded this season/off-season, and he might wind up in Philly, maybe Boston... Say he gels with his new teammates, makes a playoff run, maybe gets to the Finals, now he's not thinking about LA anymore and signs an extension in the east. San Antonio has a little leverage there in the regard that LA needs another star next to LeBron or this is essentially a season that ends in an LA loss to the Warriors.

[GeechQuest]

Kawhi is a top 3 player in the league and the Lakers know that or they wouldn't be interested. If Kuzma is truly "off limits" then LA needs to add Hart to the Ingram package. I think Ingram, Hart, and a pick would get the deal done. I'm not as big on Ingram as everyone else seems to be. I'd much rather have Jaylen Brown but that's probably not happening.

Under normal circumstances I'd completely agree, but Kawhi is only available because he made himself available. If the reports are to be believed, Kawhi will be a Laker. This seems like a different situation than the PG13 situation. Similar but different.

Brandon Ingram is the best player on the Lakers not named Lebron. They have control over Ingram conceivably for over the next 6 seasons (similar to the Jokic situation). They can sign Ingram if they exceed the cap, which they can't do with other FAs who may become available.

Ingram is an integral part to the Lakers organization.

My gut says that if the difference in the deal was just Josh Hart or Kyle Kuzma, the deal would have been made already. If the Lakers are willing to part with Ingram and a pick, Hart and Kuzma could be added if they absolutely needed to get the deal done.

I'm not saying they won't make the trade, but the fact that the trade hasn't been completed coupled with the fact that the Lakers are signing 1-year deals this FA period tells me that they likely are setting up to bring Kawhi in next season.

If true, then the Spurs can't use the Lakers in negotiations with Philly, which is why I feel the Philly deal hasn't been completed either.

Basically the Spurs FO has turned into ebayer BlackRose and/or COMCer Joelshitshow.

[pennywise]

Under normal circumstances I'd completely agree, but Kawhi is only available because he made himself available. If the reports are to be believed, Kawhi will be a Laker. This seems like a different situation than the PG13 situation. Similar but different.

Brandon Ingram is the best player on the Lakers not named Lebron. They have control over Ingram conceivably for over the next 6 seasons (similar to the Jokic situation). They can sign Ingram if they exceed the cap, which they can't do with other FAs who may become available.

Ingram is an integral part to the Lakers organization.

My gut says that if the difference in the deal was just Josh Hart or Kyle Kuzma, the deal would have been made already. If the Lakers are willing to part with Ingram and a pick, Hart and Kuzma could be added if they absolutely needed to get the deal done.

I'm not saying they won't make the trade, but the fact that the trade hasn't been completed coupled with the fact that the Lakers are signing 1-year deals this FA period tells me that they likely are setting up to bring Kawhi in next season.

If true, then the Spurs can't use the Lakers in negotiations with Philly, which is why I feel the Philly deal hasn't been completed either.

Basically the Spurs FO has turned into ebayer BlackRose and/or COMCer Joelshitshow.

That's the thing though.

If the Lakers aren't going to sweeten the pot, the Spurs will trade Kawhi elsewhere. Where does that leave the Lakers? LeBron isn't going to take this team very far by himself. KCP? Lance? JaVale? Gimme a break. LA is making lateral moves to the supporting cast. The idea was that LeBron would team up with Kawhi or PG or both and now that PG is off the table, they want Kawhi badly. They'll either play ball or Kawhi is heading east.

[Cavaliercards]

Kawhi said that he is willing to sit the entire 18-19 season if he does not get traded.

He wouldn't make it a month, he already is pissed because he doesn't wanna be in SA, doesn't feel like Nike respect him. So sit out the season after people wonder if you can get back to the player you were and you turned on a team. That really will help your marketing value and your future.

[RogerGodahell]

Kawhi said that he is willing to sit the entire 18-19 season if he does not get traded.

Then i'd let him sit.

[pac213up]

I think they will but what is the rush. Wait for the deal that makes sense.

[irfuji]

That's the thing though.

If the Lakers aren't going to sweeten the pot, the Spurs will trade Kawhi elsewhere. Where does that leave the Lakers? LeBron isn't going to take this team very far by himself. KCP? Lance? JaVale? Gimme a break. LA is making lateral moves to the supporting cast. The idea was that LeBron would team up with Kawhi or PG or both and now that PG is off the table, they want Kawhi badly. They'll either play ball or Kawhi is heading east.

I would disagree to a point.

Every team knows that Kawhi is a FA next year. So his trade value, assuming his desire to play for LA is true, would be drastically diminished. It would have to be for a team that is willing pay for a 1 year rental/hope that they can convince him to stay long term.

LA is the best team for San Antonio here. They are going to pay the most relative to what any other team will pay because they know at least he will stay. Plus they would need to free up cap space (which they are already doing). All the one year deals they are doing now tell me that the Spurs want to much and the Lakers/Lebron are content to wait until next year.

[pgisback]

That's the thing though.

If the Lakers aren't going to sweeten the pot, the Spurs will trade Kawhi elsewhere. Where does that leave the Lakers? LeBron isn't going to take this team very far by himself. KCP? Lance? JaVale? Gimme a break. LA is making lateral moves to the supporting cast. The idea was that LeBron would team up with Kawhi or PG or both and now that PG is off the table, they want Kawhi badly. They'll either play ball or Kawhi is heading east.

Listening to all the pundits, the issue is who is going to trade young talent or first round picks for Kawhi when Kawhi has made it known that he wants to be a laker. It would be a risk for a team like Philly or Celtics to unload more than the Lakers for him if he just stays one year. Lakers have all the advantage because they got Lebron long term and can just wait a year and not give up anything for Kawhi. And Spurs, the longer they wait, the less they may get for him. Tough situation for the Spurs if the Lakers hold out.

[WaiverWire]

If I'm the Spurs, I tell Kawhi:

"Hey, if you want out of San Antonio this year, you are going to have to agree to play somewhere in the Eastern Conference, and agree to a 4 year sign and trade. If you want to play for the Lakers, that's fine, but you are going to have to wait a year. You can play for us this year and show everyone that you are healthy. If you look good, and we can get decent value, maybe we will trade you before the trade deadline. If you try to sit out the year, it might work, but everyone is going to hate you, and your endorsements aren't going to be worth much when everyone hates you."

If you can get Kawhi to agree to a sign and trade, then the offers that Philly or Boston would be willing to offer would be better than what they would offer for the 1 year rental. I don't think the Lakers are willing to offer much more than Brandon Ingram, Josh Hart or Kuzma, and a late first rounder.

[auctionjmm]

I think Magic is drawing a line in the sand right now by signing all of these veterans to one year deals. Why trade Ingram and picks now when you can buy Kawhi outright a year from now?

Philly and Boston need to decide what they are willing to part with for a one-year run at the championship. I'm not saying they won't compete beyond that, but putting Kawhi on either team could be enough to at least get one ring in the short term. One of those two teams is getting to the Finals either way. If LA pulls their offers and moves on, then Boston and Philly have a good chance to land Kawhi for one season without unloading every asset they have. The Spurs aren't stupid enough to let Kawhi sit for a year because getting something in return is better than nothing, and Kawhi isn't stupid enough to sit for a year if he can win a title with Philly or Boston before signing with LA.

[aaron2]

If I'm the Spurs, I tell Kawhi:

"Hey, if you want out of San Antonio this year, you are going to have to agree to play somewhere in the Eastern Conference, and agree to a 4 year sign and trade. If you want to play for the Lakers, that's fine, but you are going to have to wait a year. You can play for us this year and show everyone that you are healthy. If you look good, and we can get decent value, maybe we will trade you before the trade deadline. If you try to sit out the year, it might work, but everyone is going to hate you, and your endorsements aren't going to be worth much when everyone hates you."

If you can get Kawhi to agree to a sign and trade, then the offers that Philly or Boston would be willing to offer would be better than what they would offer for the 1 year rental. I don't think the Lakers are willing to offer much more than Brandon Ingram, Josh Hart or Kuzma, and a late first rounder.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that won't happen.

[pennywise]

Listening to all the pundits, the issue is who is going to trade young talent or first round picks for Kawhi when Kawhi has made it known that he wants to be a laker. It would be a risk for a team like Philly or Celtics to unload more than the Lakers for him if he just stays one year. Lakers have all the advantage because they got Lebron long term and can just wait a year and not give up anything for Kawhi. And Spurs, the longer they wait, the less they may get for him. Tough situation for the Spurs if the Lakers hold out.

Agreed, but one would think that if Kawhi gets to the Finals with Philly or Boston, he would have to strongly reconsider relocating in free agency. With LeBron in the West, the East is wide open and ready for a new star to dominate the conference. Kawhi would essentially be the new LeBron of the East. Maybe he wants that, maybe he doesn't. If he got bounced before the Finals, I think the concern is totally valid. He'd probably pack his bags for LA.

If I'm LAL front office, I'm making the deal for Kawhi before the season starts. Why waste what is likely one of two or three dominant seasons left for LeBron?

[GeechQuest]

Agreed, but one would think that if Kawhi gets to the Finals with Philly or Boston, he would have to strongly reconsider relocating in free agency. With LeBron in the West, the East is wide open and ready for a new star to dominate the conference. Kawhi would essentially be the new LeBron of the East. Maybe he wants that, maybe he doesn't. If he got bounced before the Finals, I think the concern is totally valid. He'd probably pack his bags for LA.

If I'm LAL front office, I'm making the deal for Kawhi before the season starts. Why waste what is likely one of two or three dominant seasons left for LeBron?

Because of the risk.

No player’s health is for certain. If you make this trade now you are getting rid of your young players (who all look like they will have lengthy, valuable roles in the League) and either Lebron or Kawhi go down it was a panic move. If you make the trade and can’t get to the Finals this year, with no more flexibility to sign guys in the future, it was a panic move.

The risk you run of not doing the trade is that Kawhi gets traded elsewhere and stays. If that’s the case then so be it. He wants to be a Laker, but he may not like playing 2nd fiddle to Lebron and decide not to resign.

There’s just too much risk, which is why the reward is so great. Learn from other great teams. Ainge wouldn’t do the trade, so the Lakers shouldn’t either.

[JustinVerlander07]

If I'm the Spurs, I tell Kawhi:

"Hey, if you want out of San Antonio this year, you are going to have to agree to play somewhere in the Eastern Conference, and agree to a 4 year sign and trade. If you want to play for the Lakers, that's fine, but you are going to have to wait a year. You can play for us this year and show everyone that you are healthy. If you look good, and we can get decent value, maybe we will trade you before the trade deadline. If you try to sit out the year, it might work, but everyone is going to hate you, and your endorsements aren't going to be worth much when everyone hates you."

If you can get Kawhi to agree to a sign and trade, then the offers that Philly or Boston would be willing to offer would be better than what they would offer for the 1 year rental. I don't think the Lakers are willing to offer much more than Brandon Ingram, Josh Hart or Kuzma, and a late first rounder.

This is the NBA, the stars dictate what happens, San Antonio is no different. if Kawhi really wants to play in LA, he'll get there eventually, and he seems cowardly enough at this point to believe he'll just sit out the season.

[imbluestreak23]

Don't care too much for Stephen A Smith but he's saying that he's hearing that Kawhi is willing to sit out this year if SAS don't trade him.

My Kawhi PC card is going to get relisted just to get rid of it at some point this week.

Guess I'm all in on the Giannis bandwaggon. Where are all of the good guys at or do they even exist?

[IronMonkey415]

You want good guys with honor and integrity you need to find foreign player.

These American born thin-hair, hair line going way back, flat booty whore are not worth our money. we need to start collecting other players.

[Pierce09]

Don't care too much for Stephen A Smith but he's saying that he's hearing that Kawhi is willing to sit out this year if SAS don't trade him.

My Kawhi PC card is going to get relisted just to get rid of it at some point this week.

Guess I'm all in on the Giannis bandwaggon. Where are all of the good guys at or do they even exist?

Just sold off 40% of my Kawhi collection. If Kawhi sits couldnt the Spurs file a complaint and make his contract extend another year so he would still owe the Spurs one?

[clipperboy24]

If they don’t trade him this summer I think his trade value will just continue to diminish. They should take the lakers offer of Ingram and Kuzman and a pick or two, that’s pretty solid for a player who has one year left and won’t resign.

[asujbl]

Spurs should talk to some Islanders fans right now

[mfw13]

Kawhi said that he is willing to sit the entire 18-19 season if he does not get traded.

Talk about cutting off your nose to spite your face....

Then not only does he enter free agency with no proof that he is healthy, but also with his reputation so low than he'll make mud look clean.....

[cp3fan]

Just sold off 40% of my Kawhi collection. If Kawhi sits couldnt the Spurs file a complaint and make his contract extend another year so he would still owe the Spurs one?

The players union would fight something like this tooth and nail, if it's even possible. It would also be a bad look for the spurs in the eyes of other nba players.

[pingbling23]

Can kawhi sign with the lakers for 5 mil?

[pennywise]

If they don’t trade him this summer I think his trade value will just continue to diminish. They should take the lakers offer of Ingram and Kuzman and a pick or two, that’s pretty solid for a player who has one year left and won’t resign.

If the Lakers had offered Ingram and Kuzma, the deal would already have been done.

Everything I've read has stated Ingram was offered but Kuz is "off limits".

[pennywise]

The players union would fight something like this tooth and nail, if it's even possible. It would also be a bad look for the spurs in the eyes of other nba players.

Kawhi sitting would be a bad look for Kawhi, not the Spurs.

[Cavaliercards]

Don't care too much for Stephen A Smith but he's saying that he's hearing that Kawhi is willing to sit out this year if SAS don't trade him.

My Kawhi PC card is going to get relisted just to get rid of it at some point this week.

Guess I'm all in on the Giannis bandwaggon. Where are all of the good guys at or do they even exist?

Malcolm Brogdon is a great guy, not just a good one

[cp3fan]

Kawhi sitting would be a bad look for Kawhi, not the Spurs.

Not in the eyes of the other NBA players. NBA players will almost undoubtedly stick for for each other before sticking up for the owners/teams.

[Cavaliercards]

Not in the eyes of the other NBA players. NBA players will almost undoubtedly stick for for each other before sticking up for the owners/teams.

Endorsements it would be a bad move and no intelligent agent will let his client do that

[pingbling23]

If the Lakers had offered Ingram and Kuzma, the deal would already have been done.

Everything I've read has stated Ingram was offered but Kuz is "off limits".

Kuzma is a consistent scoring stud, I would definitely hold him over Ingram. Kuzma scored more playing less and coming off the bench half the season.

[cp3fan]

Endorsements it would be a bad move and no intelligent agent will let his client do that

I was not talking about endorsements or any other things nor am I suggesting it is a wise move. Just how the other players would view. One thing I will say as far as endorsements go, it definitely would hurt him but if he managed to win on the Lakers somehow, it wouldnt matter. People in general have short memories and winning seems to make people forget about things that happened in the past (see Kobe Bryant). With all that being said, I would personally not go that route if I was him.

[spurs50fan]

Not in the eyes of the other NBA players. NBA players will almost undoubtedly stick for for each other before sticking up for the owners/teams.

Check out page 288 of their own bargaining agreement. I doubt Kawhi is that stupid

Article XI, section 3

http://3c90sm37lsaecdwtr32v9qof.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/2017-NBA-NBPA-Collective-Bargaining-Agreement.pdf

[pennywise]

Kuzma is a consistent scoring stud, I would definitely hold him over Ingram. Kuzma scored more playing less and coming off the bench half the season.

As a Spurs fan, I'd much rather have Kuzma than Ingram. Been saying it since the Kawhi to Lakers rumors started. Apparently he's off the table though. We'll see if that changes.

I was not talking about endorsements or any other things nor am I suggesting it is a wise move. Just how the other players would view. One thing I will say as far as endorsements go, it definitely would hurt him but if he managed to win on the Lakers somehow, it wouldnt matter. People in general have short memories and winning seems to make people forget about things that happened in the past (see Kobe Bryant). With all that being said, I would personally not go that route if I was him.

You stated that Kawhi sitting makes the players think poorly of the Spurs. I'm not getting your argument there.

[cp3fan]

Check out page 288 of their own bargaining agreement. I doubt Kawhi is that stupid

Article XI, section 3

http://3c90sm37lsaecdwtr32v9qof.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/2017-NBA-NBPA-Collective-Bargaining-Agreement.pdf

Probably not but if he did sit, the players union would fight tooth and nail to protect him and it would be a big PR nightmare. Hence, why teams dont void contracts of guys who violate terms of their contracts. Also, if Kawhi chooses to sit, I guarantee he'd go to his doctors to get some kind of medical diagnosis that keeps him out. I dont think there's much the Spurs can do about that. Just like Kyrie threatening to get surgery when he wanted the cavs to trade him.

[cp3fan]

As a Spurs fan, I'd much rather have Kuzma than Ingram. Been saying it since the Kawhi to Lakers rumors started. Apparently he's off the table though. We'll see if that changes.



You stated that Kawhi sitting makes the players think poorly of the Spurs. I'm not getting your argument there.

Yes, that is precisely my point. The fact that the spurs would let him sit rather than trade him will make the spurs look bad to other NBA players. Is that the right viewpoint? No but I'd be willing to bet that a lot of the players would take kawhi's side rather than the spurs. It will make the Spurs look anit-player to the other players. It's a player run league at this point. There is precedent that when a player is unhappy and demands a trade, they get traded. It's not right but it's the way it is.

[pennywise]

Yes, that is precisely my point. The fact that the spurs would let him sit rather than trade him will make the spurs look bad to other NBA players. Is that the right viewpoint? No but I'd be willing to bet that a lot of the players would take kawhi's side rather than the spurs.

Well, that's an interesting stance.

I'm not so sure the players would "side" with a player choosing not to play because he didn't get his way. Everyone knows Kawhi is under contract. Players aren't stupid. They know this is a business and surely they understand that if Kawhi sits, it's his choice and his choice alone. That's on Kawhi, not on the organization.

I get the feeling that you believe all players do, say, and think alike, like it's one big family, but they're still people with personalities and moral compasses. I'm sure there are many players who think Kawhi's handling of this situation has been deceitful at worst and unprofessional at best.

[Cavaliercards]

I was not talking about endorsements or any other things nor am I suggesting it is a wise move. Just how the other players would view. One thing I will say as far as endorsements go, it definitely would hurt him but if he managed to win on the Lakers somehow, it wouldnt matter. People in general have short memories and winning seems to make people forget about things that happened in the past (see Kobe Bryant). With all that being said, I would personally not go that route if I was him.

Kawhi's drawing power for endorsements was not 1/10th of what Kobe's was when that happened. He lost endorsements, kept himself playing well and out of trouble and they came back. He could manage that, Kawhi isn't even that highly regarded by Nike.

Time for him to get on the court and play.

[Cavaliercards]

Well, that's an interesting stance.

I'm not so sure the players would "side" with a player choosing not to play because he didn't get his way. Everyone knows Kawhi is under contract. Players aren't stupid. They know this is a business and surely they understand that if Kawhi sits, it's his choice and his choice alone. That's on Kawhi, not on the organization.

I get the feeling that you believe all players do, say, and think alike, like it's one big family, but they're still people with personalities and moral compasses. I'm sure there are many players who think Kawhi's handling of this situation has been deceitful at worst and unprofessional at best.

Players will judge and will wonder next time he is up for a contract will he throw a fit. If he gets injured will he listen to the team or will he run away to New York and listen only to his uncle. Players do not think collectively, but the behavior exhibited by Kawhi would make a rational competitor challenge whether he is all in.

[pennywise]

Players will judge and will wonder next time he is up for a contract will he throw a fit. If he gets injured will he listen to the team or will he run away to New York and listen only to his uncle. Players do not think collectively, but the behavior exhibited by Kawhi would make a rational competitor challenge whether he is all in.

Well put.

[cp3fan]

Well, that's an interesting stance.

I'm not so sure the players would "side" with a player choosing not to play because he didn't get his way. Everyone knows Kawhi is under contract. Players aren't stupid. They know this is a business and surely they understand that if Kawhi sits, it's his choice and his choice alone. That's on Kawhi, not on the organization.

I get the feeling that you believe all players do, say, and think alike, like it's one big family, but they're still people with personalities and moral compasses. I'm sure there are many players who think Kawhi's handling of this situation has been deceitful at worst and unprofessional at best.

I'm not sure what to tell you if you think the players wouldn't side with kawhi. Would all of them? Of course not but I think a lot of them would. Yes, the players are all individuals and have their own thoughts but they are also like a fraternity at the same time. I think they'd put themselves in Kawhi's shoes and would agree with what he's doing. Why? As I stated before, there is already a precedence for players demanding trades and getting their way. This has become acceptable behavior in the NBA. The players that do this or have done this in the past definitely would be against the organization playing hardball with them. At the end of the day, a lot of these guys are friends with each other, not so much the owners or others in management. the players relate better to each other and can put themselves in another players shoes more so than they relate the owners and others running the business. I'd be willing to bet more players side with the player rather than organization.

[Pierce09]

Check out page 288 of their own bargaining agreement. I doubt Kawhi is that stupid

Article XI, section 3

http://3c90sm37lsaecdwtr32v9qof.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/2017-NBA-NBPA-Collective-Bargaining-Agreement.pdf


Exactly what I was thinking.

[cp3fan]

Players will judge and will wonder next time he is up for a contract will he throw a fit. If he gets injured will he listen to the team or will he run away to New York and listen only to his uncle. Players do not think collectively, but the behavior exhibited by Kawhi would make a rational competitor challenge whether he is all in.

You think so? It doesnt seem to be affecting Lebron's opinion of him as the Lakers and Lebron want him to play on the team. If he said he would be willing to sign a long term deal if traded to teams that arent the lakers, do you think a majority of the players on teams that could trade for him (i.e. the sixers and celtics) would be upset that he's on the team? I very highly doubt it, especially since those particular teams wouldn't want a bad locker room presence or to mess up their chemistry. I have not seen any players come out and say anything of that nature or even imply it. I bet if he would have came back to play in the playoffs, his teammates would have forgiven and forgotten him sitting out as long as he did this past season. As I said before, people have short memories. Think of all the things that players throughout history have done on and off the court. People are still willing to play on the same team as them. I think you are applying how you feel if you were a player to how the other players might feel. You might say the same about me but I dont agree with what Kawhi's doing. However, I have seen enough in the NBA to know that the players tend to side with each other.

[cp3fan]

Kawhi's drawing power for endorsements was not 1/10th of what Kobe's was when that happened. He lost endorsements, kept himself playing well and out of trouble and they came back. He could manage that, Kawhi isn't even that highly regarded by Nike.

Time for him to get on the court and play.

Kawhi's lack of endorsements is going to be more affected by his lack of personality (or at least what he shows the public) than anything else. He didnt do well with endorsements before this whole thing. There is a huge history of athletes in sports doing crazy things but when they start playing at a high level and winning, people forget. This same principle is applied to musicians, celebrities etc. My point in this is Kawhi may not be affected long term with endorsements (relative to the amount he was receiving before) if he plays at a high level and wins even if he sat out a year.

[cp3fan]

Players will judge and will wonder next time he is up for a contract will he throw a fit. If he gets injured will he listen to the team or will he run away to New York and listen only to his uncle. Players do not think collectively, but the behavior exhibited by Kawhi would make a rational competitor challenge whether he is all in.

I will also add that the players are all in the same union. so yes, this does affect how they view things going on with another player in their union.

[Cavaliercards]

You think so? It doesnt seem to be affecting Lebron's opinion of him as the Lakers and Lebron want him to play on the team. If he said he would be willing to sign a long term deal if traded to teams that arent the lakers, do you think a majority of the players on teams that could trade for him (i.e. the sixers and celtics) would be upset that he's on the team? I very highly doubt it, especially since those particular teams wouldn't want a bad locker room presence or to mess up their chemistry. I have not seen any players come out and say anything of that nature or even imply it. I bet if he would have came back to play in the playoffs, his teammates would have forgiven and forgotten him sitting out as long as he did this past season. As I said before, people have short memories. Think of all the things that players throughout history have done on and off the court. People are still willing to play on the same team as them. I think you are applying how you feel if you were a player to how the other players might feel. You might say the same about me but I dont agree with what Kawhi's doing. However, I have seen enough in the NBA to know that the players tend to side with each other.

Am basing my comments if he sits out the season as he has threatened.

If he went to LA and pulled half the mess he has this year with the Spurs, Lebron would turn on him after two days of it.

We have seen he wants to be a Laker and Lakers would take him, but they aren't bending over backwards to get him, nor did Lebron wait to see if it happened before signing. Lebron did what was best for his future outside of basketball.

[Cavaliercards]

Kawhi's lack of endorsements is going to be more affected by his lack of personality (or at least what he shows the public) than anything else. He didnt do well with endorsements before this whole thing. There is a huge history of athletes in sports doing crazy things but when they start playing at a high level and winning, people forget. This same principle is applied to musicians, celebrities etc. My point in this is Kawhi may not be affected long term with endorsements (relative to the amount he was receiving before) if he plays at a high level and wins even if he sat out a year.

He did not do well, but his value within the shoe world has been torpedoed by this past year and yes he may get the Kevin Love level of endorsements if he joins Lebron, but he is not going to get the amount that he told Nike he deserves.

[Cavaliercards]

I will also add that the players are all in the same union. so yes, this does affect how they view things going on with another player in their union.

Yes they are in same union, but they do not think collectively about players or how players act. Kawhi acts like that with another team and those players too will have an issue and it will cause problems in another franchise. Players will be guarded and as I said above, if he sits a year that is going to make more question if he is all in.

[Kingofkings1281]

Come on over to LA, Kawhi. Losing Ingram isn’t a huge blow. The Lakers could genuinely give the western conference all-stars a run with that roster. Pesky and annoying defenders/shooters led by the greatest player on the planet will most definitely have a shot.

[clipperboy24]

If the Lakers had offered Ingram and Kuzma, the deal would already have been done.

Everything I've read has stated Ingram was offered but Kuz is "off limits".

Interesting I thought it had been the opposite, no Ingram, until recently

[csrockerzero]

Well, Kawhi to the Lakers better happen if they want any chance in to be in the same galaxy as Golden State.

[pennywise]

Well, Kawhi to the Lakers better happen if they want any chance in to be in the same galaxy as Golden State.

Kinda what I'm thinking. With the GS addition of Cousins, one would think the Lakers want to get a Kawhi deal done even more now.

I think it's interesting that there haven't been any reports of a restructuring of the offer. LA is set on Ingram as the centerpiece. Why not a package of Kuzma, Hart, and a pick? Lakers keep Ingram and Ball, SA gets the player they really want. Seems like a win win, given the circumstances. I haven't spoken to a single Spurs fan that wants any part of Ball or Ingram, and I'm in that same camp. We want Kuz.

[GeechQuest]

Kinda what I'm thinking. With the GS addition of Cousins, one would think the Lakers want to get a Kawhi deal done even more now.

I think it's interesting that there haven't been any reports of a restructuring of the offer. LA is set on Ingram as the centerpiece. Why not a package of Kuzma, Hart, and a pick? Lakers keep Ingram and Ball, SA gets the player they really want. Seems like a win win, given the circumstances. I haven't spoken to a single Spurs fan that wants any part of Ball or Ingram, and I'm in that same camp. We want Kuz.

In a vacuum the Lakers would give up Kuzma over Ingram any day of the week. The problem is that the Lakers are completely flush with wings (and would still be with the addition of Kawhi), but would be decimated at the PF/C position.

Currently that looks like:
-Moritz Wagner
-Kyle Kuzma
-Ivica Zubac
-Javalle McGee

Ingram is hands down the better player and better prospect, but the Lakers can afford to deal him especially when that involves getting Kawhi in return to fill his spot.

Take away Kyle Kuzma (the Lakers best big), and you can no longer play small ball like the league is trending towards.

[indyguy]

Yes, that is precisely my point. The fact that the spurs would let him sit rather than trade him will make the spurs look bad to other NBA players. Is that the right viewpoint? No but I'd be willing to bet that a lot of the players would take kawhi's side rather than the spurs. It will make the Spurs look anit-player to the other players. It's a player run league at this point. There is precedent that when a player is unhappy and demands a trade, they get traded. It's not right but it's the way it is.

Money talks and guys will stuff their pockets with as much as they can. Spurs aren't grabbing high end FAs anyway. They are drafting, making trades, and signing low risk players that fit their organization's style.

Not a guy out there in the league that would say, "Well, I don't like the way they let Kawhi sit, so I won't sign my 4 yr/40 mil deal just to show them."

Now, could it be a deciding factor if they have multiple options? Sure, but it is slim to none on the chances of a guy walking away from money, no matter who is forking it out.

Guys still signed with the Clippers and they had an owner who was forced to sell because he was a racist.

Guys still sign with New York and they are a trainwreck.

Guys signing in Phoenix right now and they aren't going anywhere but the lottery. Why? Money.

[pennywise]

In a vacuum the Lakers would give up Kuzma over Ingram any day of the week. The problem is that the Lakers are completely flush with wings (and would still be with the addition of Kawhi), but would be decimated at the PF/C position.

Currently that looks like:
-Moritz Wagner
-Kyle Kuzma
-Ivica Zubac
-Javalle McGee

Ingram is hands down the better player and better prospect, but the Lakers can afford to deal him especially when that involves getting Kawhi in return to fill his spot.

Take away Kyle Kuzma (the Lakers best big), and you can no longer play small ball like the league is trending towards.

I know Ingram is a stick but they're both the same height. I don't look at either one of them as "bigs" so it's weird to hear Kuzma considered a "big", but I digress.

I think Kuzma is not only the better player now, but will be the better player in years to come as well. I'm not on the Ingram wagon at all. He could be a good contributing player and probably will be but I don't see this transcendent all-star like others do. Just because he's built like KD, doesn't make him KD.

[irfuji]

Kinda what I'm thinking. With the GS addition of Cousins, one would think the Lakers want to get a Kawhi deal done even more now.

I think it's interesting that there haven't been any reports of a restructuring of the offer. LA is set on Ingram as the centerpiece. Why not a package of Kuzma, Hart, and a pick? Lakers keep Ingram and Ball, SA gets the player they really want. Seems like a win win, given the circumstances. I haven't spoken to a single Spurs fan that wants any part of Ball or Ingram, and I'm in that same camp. We want Kuz.

Why? I mean assuming Lebron is on board (and the 4 year contract seems to indicate he is), this could just be a lost year.

Next year there's a ton of very high quality free agents, including Kawhi. Why give up any promising prospect when they can just wait a year? I know it sucks, but if Lebron is Ok with it that's a year he can mentor and teach Kuzma/Ball/Ingram.

All the guys they are signing now (i.e. Rondo) are all 1 year deals. Plus they can easily package them in a trade to another team that might want to clear up cap space next year.

From a more than this year perspective I have to give it to Magic. He's positioned the team very well. He's got the best player in the NBA, a number of quality young prospects, and a bunch of 1 year contracts expiring when there's going to be a ton of top tier free agents.

[GeechQuest]

I know Ingram is a stick but they're both the same height. I don't look at either one of them as "bigs" so it's weird to hear Kuzma considered a "big", but I digress.

I think Kuzma is not only the better player now, but will be the better player in years to come as well. I'm not on the Ingram wagon at all. He could be a good contributing player and probably will be but I don't see this transcendent all-star like others do. Just because he's built like KD, doesn't make him KD.

I understand some would be in the Kuzma camp and some in the Ingram camp, but I'm just saying in terms of the Lakers and where their pieces fall that's why Kuzma is off the table (allegedly).

They'd have no money to really shore up their bigs and wouldn't be able to truly play small ball.

[pennywise]

Why? I mean assuming Lebron is on board (and the 4 year contract seems to indicate he is), this could just be a lost year.

Next year there's a ton of very high quality free agents, including Kawhi. Why give up any promising prospect when they can just wait a year? I know it sucks, but if Lebron is Ok with it that's a year he can mentor and teach Kuzma/Ball/Ingram.

All the guys they are signing now (i.e. Rondo) are all 1 year deals. Plus they can easily package them in a trade to another team that might want to clear up cap space next year.

From a more than this year perspective I have to give it to Magic. He's positioned the team very well. He's got the best player in the NBA, a number of quality young prospects, and a bunch of 1 year contracts expiring when there's going to be a ton of top tier free agents.

^Part of my point. My stance is that this year should be the Lakers' year. I think I might be in the minority that think LeBron can only remain dominant for so long. The man is 34 in December. I know he's built like terminator but this has to end eventually and I think the decline begins sooner than later, or at least sooner than most people think. Yeah, LA got LeBron. Their other moves have been highly questionable, and honestly pretty rushed. As their roster sits now, they're not winning a title, and probably not even reaching the Finals. That's a waste of one of LeBron's final great years, and if you think about it, this should theoretically be the BEST of his final few seasons.

Just my two cents. I'm interested to see what happens. I just hope someone makes a big splash, because right now we're all looking at a Warriors 3-peat.

[jstasyk1121]

Kinda what I'm thinking. With the GS addition of Cousins, one would think the Lakers want to get a Kawhi deal done even more now.

I think it's interesting that there haven't been any reports of a restructuring of the offer. LA is set on Ingram as the centerpiece. Why not a package of Kuzma, Hart, and a pick? Lakers keep Ingram and Ball, SA gets the player they really want. Seems like a win win, given the circumstances. I haven't spoken to a single Spurs fan that wants any part of Ball or Ingram, and I'm in that same camp. We want Kuz.

i feel like across the 5 threads where this is being discussed almost every spurs fan is sitting there posting "lets take ingram and that would be awesome"...not necessarily saying ingram over kuz...but havent seen much mentioning kuz over ingram at all...mostly it seems all of the posters are just saying "getting ingram would be awesome-he would be a great spur"

[pennywise]

i feel like across the 5 threads where this is being discussed almost every spurs fan is sitting there posting "lets take ingram and that would be awesome"...not necessarily saying ingram over kuz...but havent seen much mentioning kuz over ingram at all...mostly it seems all of the posters are just saying "getting ingram would be awesome-he would be a great spur"

"Haven't spoken to".

I've seen maybe one or two posts here in favor of Ingram, but the fans I've spoken to in San Antonio and the Austin area are not unanimously on board, and most of us prefer Kuzma. Take that info however you'd like. The general feeling is that Kuzma is a more developed player right now, a better scorer, and is more of the Spurs mold than Ingram, and I happen to agree.

[JackThree]

So it was reported that the Spurs wanted two players and three 1st round picks for Leonard. No team is going to give them that. The 76ers offered SA Saric, Covington and their 2019 1st round pick. Why not offer the Spurs that package, a 2021 second round pick and a swap of a future 1st round pick. It's like meeting them in the middle. Technically the 76ers is only giving up one 1st round pick. Philly from what I understand have a handful of second round picks in 2021.

[pejc300]

So it was reported that the Spurs wanted two players and three 1st round picks for Leonard. No team is going to give them that. The 76ers offered SA Saric, Covington and their 2019 1st round pick. Why not offer the Spurs that package, a 2021 second round pick and a swap of a future 1st round pick. It's like meeting them in the middle. Technically the 76ers is only giving up one 1st round pick. Philly from what I understand have a handful of second round picks in 2021.

I guess it's because - do you really wan to trade Saric, Covington, and a 1st round pick to rent Kawhi for a year? I think that's why no trades are getting done; SA wants people to give up the farm so they can rent him for one year before he goes to L.A. Not many teams are going to do that I don't think.

[elee712]

According to ESPN's Michael C. Wright, Kawhi Leonard's "preferred destination" is the Clippers.

Wright has covered the Spurs about as well as anyone, so this is noteworthy. He says that Kawhi wants to be the man and may not want to play with LeBron James. Wright added that Kawhi's people in New York kept him away from some of the Spurs brass, so things really aren't going well between the two sides.

[spurs50fan]

I think the Spurs are hoping his relationship with Brett Brown helps and maybe convinces him to stay. I can see why they don’t want to hand him over to the Lakers. Pop had a problem with the last trade that netted them a ring

[Devi8or]

According to ESPN's Michael C. Wright, Kawhi Leonard's "preferred destination" is the Clippers.

Wright has covered the Spurs about as well as anyone, so this is noteworthy. He says that Kawhi wants to be the man and may not want to play with LeBron James. Wright added that Kawhi's people in New York kept him away from some of the Spurs brass, so things really aren't going well between the two sides.

Michael C. Wright is on a podcast today and is dropping a few things today that is essentially leading you to believe, which most Spurs fans already assumed, that his Uncle Dennis is killing his career real fast. His uncle is burying him and it's gonna cost him a lot of money. He's saying a few crazy things

-Kawhi's uncle is saying the Spurs are too controlling, despite not having represented any other player or having any knowledge of how teams control players

-The Spurs tried to visit Kawhi in NY, when Kawhi's camp got word, they ushered him to a different part of the building so they couldn't see him

-Clippers are interested, but have s**t assets to return to SA

-Kawhi went to China, couldn't get in touch with him the whole time he was there

-rehab was turned over to his people in August 2017

Uncle Dennis is up to some shady s**t and he's dragging Kawhi down with him. Personally I'm just about fed up with this Kawhi situation and he seems like he's more trouble than he's worth at this time

[elee712]

Michael C. Wright is on a podcast today and is dropping a few things today that is essentially leading you to believe, which most Spurs fans already assumed, that his Uncle Dennis is killing his career real fast. His uncle is burying him and it's gonna cost him a lot of money. He's saying a few crazy things

-Kawhi's uncle is saying the Spurs are too controlling, despite not having represented any other player or having any knowledge of how teams control players

-The Spurs tried to visit Kawhi in NY, when Kawhi's camp got word, they ushered him to a different part of the building so they couldn't see him

-Clippers are interested, but have s**t assets to return to SA

-Kawhi went to China, couldn't get in touch with him the whole time he was there

-rehab was turned over to his people in August 2017

Uncle Dennis is up to some shady s**t and he's dragging Kawhi down with him. Personally I'm just about fed up with this Kawhi situation and he seems like he's more trouble than he's worth at this time

certainly sounds like a crazy situation and I can't see anyone other than the LA teams wanting to offload major assets for Kawhi at this time. If I were Magic and I know that Jerry West and the clippers is in the mix to trade for him or sign him next season, I'd probably step it up to acquire him knowing there is mutual interest with the Clippers.

[swerve]

I know in the long run it is not good for the franchise but at this point I let the dude rot. If he doesn't have the spine to speak up himself and follows through with "his" threat not to play if not traded the let him rot. Is some team really going to pay a ton of money to a guy who has been sitting out to what would amount to two seasons?

I am not playing the he said/she said game, the dude needs to speak up for himself.

[Arianny_Fan]

Fast forward to next season. Could the Lakers go after someone like say Anthony Davis? That would be awesome...!

[irfuji]

certainly sounds like a crazy situation and I can't see anyone other than the LA teams wanting to offload major assets for Kawhi at this time. If I were Magic and I know that Jerry West and the clippers is in the mix to trade for him or sign him next season, I'd probably step it up to acquire him knowing there is mutual interest with the Clippers.

Thing is the no one is going to pay the price SA wants for Kawhi, and that would have been even without this drama.

Unless/until Kawhi himself comes out and either says I do or do not want to go to LA next year his value is going to be maybe half of what it would normally be since it's just a one year rental.

Lakers don't need to pay out a ton because they'll offer the most for Kawhi (more than the Clippers can/will and less than what he's worth) because they can just wait till next year.

I know in the long run it is not good for the franchise but at this point I let the dude rot. If he doesn't have the spine to speak up himself and follows through with "his" threat not to play if not traded the let him rot. Is some team really going to pay a ton of money to a guy who has been sitting out to what would amount to two seasons?

I am not playing the he said/she said game, the dude needs to speak up for himself.

I agree that he needs to just come out and set the record straight. There's been enough unconfirmed talk from his camp at this point.

And the longer this plays out, the less I think SA will get for Kawhi. If Kawhi doesn't play he probably signs a one year deal somewhere and either proves he deserves a max or doesn't. If it's the Lakers I think they just work him out really well and do a very careful indepth physical and decide if he's going to get a max.

[drobfan8]

I hope Kawhi stubs his toe and continues to do so.

[spurs50fan]

Now they are hiding him like he’s the Pope?

[elee712]

Thing is the no one is going to pay the price SA wants for Kawhi, and that would have been even without this drama.

Unless/until Kawhi himself comes out and either says I do or do not want to go to LA next year his value is going to be maybe half of what it would normally be since it's just a one year rental.

Lakers don't need to pay out a ton because they'll offer the most for Kawhi (more than the Clippers can/will and less than what he's worth) because they can just wait till next year.



I agree that he needs to just come out and set the record straight. There's been enough unconfirmed talk from his camp at this point.

And the longer this plays out, the less I think SA will get for Kawhi. If Kawhi doesn't play he probably signs a one year deal somewhere and either proves he deserves a max or doesn't. If it's the Lakers I think they just work him out really well and do a very careful indepth physical and decide if he's going to get a max.

Not if what I'm hearing is true...that he would not prefer the lakers and isn't really interested in playing with Lebron because he wants to be the "man"

[spurs50fan]

What if this whole thing is to bolster big markets to mask the appearance of a dying fan viewership? To ensure the TV money does not disappear? Not just the Kawhi thing but his sticks out because this whole drama is so out of character for both sides that you can't help but wonder. The bigger fan bases' teams are looking good going forward.

Sorry.....Spurs fan.....day 150.....still looking for answers

[padsfan10]

While I agree this has turned into a circus and the time has come to get this resolved, there are a couple of things that people may or may not know about Kawhi.

First off and, most obvious, the guy has a quiet demeanor and a bit of a recluse. He doesn't enjoy the spotlight, lets his game do the talking and is a difficult guy to interview (I know I did it once following a playoff game). The guy's image is getting tarnished and from what it sounds like, it may be the uncle.

Secondly, his dad was murdered when he was in high school. It's still unsolved. That has to do something to his psyche but if any of you have followed his career trajectory, you will know his work ethic is one of the best and his game has shown vast improvement from it.

Who really knows what went down with the Spurs and his injury. I doubt we will ever get the real story, but one thing is for sure he and his camp should know there's going to be a lot of blowback and questions wherever he lands and he better be ready for it because it will be a major distraction for some time.




I know in the long run it is not good for the franchise but at this point I let the dude rot. If he doesn't have the spine to speak up himself and follows through with "his" threat not to play if not traded the let him rot. Is some team really going to pay a ton of money to a guy who has been sitting out to what would amount to two seasons?

I am not playing the he said/she said game, the dude needs to speak up for himself.

[Orangejello727]

Im predicting Kawahi doesnt return as the player pre injury.

[aaron2]

Usually not one for ESPN commentators but he gets destroyed by Michelle Beadle here...and she's right

https://www.12up.com/posts/6110176-video-watch-espn-s-michelle-beadle-go-completely-off-on-kawhi-leonard/partners/43790

[spurs50fan]

Usually not one for ESPN commentators but he gets destroyed by Michelle Beadle here...and she's right

https://www.12up.com/posts/6110176-video-watch-espn-s-michelle-beadle-go-completely-off-on-kawhi-leonard/partners/43790

Yeah she went in

But honestly think about it. Up to this point, he’s been getting the pass. That management is bad.....be pro-player talk that has done well protecting these players

However in this case, they want us to ignore 20 years of great management, great and stable coaching, model franchise, doing right by players, sticking up for them, being extra careful with injuries, resting etc ....even to the team’s detriment at times. We are willing to ignore all that and believe a mute Kawhi? Who may only want to be in a bigger market but is too scared to just admit it? He’s losing face quickly

[LC2nine10]

Yeah she went in

But honestly think about it. Up to this point, he’s been getting the pass. That management is bad.....be pro-player talk that has done well protecting these players

However in this case, they want us to ignore 20 years of great management, great and stable coaching, model franchise, doing right by players, sticking up for them, being extra careful with injuries, resting etc ....even to the team’s detriment at times. We are willing to ignore all that and believe a mute Kawhi? Who may only want to be in a bigger market but is too scared to just admit it? He’s losing face quickly

Agree completely, I can't think of a single team, in really any sport, that takes care of it's players better than the spurs. Plus he is "the man" there, what's he hoping to find in LA?

[jeace10]

Usually not one for ESPN commentators but he gets destroyed by Michelle Beadle here...and she's right

https://www.12up.com/posts/6110176-video-watch-espn-s-michelle-beadle-go-completely-off-on-kawhi-leonard/partners/43790



Totally agree with michelle on this one..

A DIVA !