Hobby surge during NBA slump...

[Harper]

So the NBA has lost a ton of money this year and likely will next season too.
Meanwhile, card hobby is going strong likely netting panini record profits.
When does NBA look to capitalize on this and up the licensing fee or potentially go to another company who bids higher?

I’m f I’m running the NBA right now I’m looking for alternative revenue streams and this seems like low hanging fruit. What kind of contract is in place?

[Cavaliercards]

So the NBA has lost a ton of money this year and likely will next season too.
Meanwhile, card hobby is going strong likely netting panini record profits.
When does NBA look to capitalize on this and up the licensing fee or potentially go to another company who bids higher?

I’m f I’m running the NBA right now I’m looking for alternative revenue streams and this seems like low hanging fruit. What kind of contract is in place?


NBA needs fans back into the stands. If they can regain the Chinese revenue market, Finals Game was shown there, they can recover a lot of revenue and help their financials.

NBA tightly controls their license and have made more money from more products and Zion being the headliner, they do not have to have a new license deal with panini to profit.

Topps does not want the NFL or NBA they have see they are enjoying their success in Non-Sports and Baseball.

Panini already has the license and will continue to retain it.

There is no other company on the market that can afford it, unless Mark Cuban starts his own sometime soon.

NBA likes having one partnership on most products, yes this is a revenue stream, but there are better revenue streams that will actually enhance the league by a notable amount.

[frzg]

Isn't their a correlation here? With no sporting events taking up your disposable income, people are spending elsewhere in basketball. Same with lack of travel spending, save save save. I'm curious if it's a negative when everything is back to normal.

[thenashcollecto]

Don’t you think upper deck would figure out a way to raise money for a license if there was a chance for it?

NBA needs fans back into the stands. If they can regain the Chinese revenue market, Finals Game was shown there, they can recover a lot of revenue and help their financials.

NBA tightly controls their license and have made more money from more products and Zion being the headliner, they do not have to have a new license deal with panini to profit.

Topps does not want the NFL or NBA they have see they are enjoying their success in Non-Sports and Baseball.

Panini already has the license and will continue to retain it.

There is no other company on the market that can afford it, unless Mark Cuban starts his own sometime soon.

NBA likes having one partnership on most products, yes this is a revenue stream, but there are better revenue streams that will actually enhance the league by a notable amount.

[Harper]

Cavalier, how exactly does NBA license work? I assumed that panini pays a lump fee for the license regardless of their success. Is this not the case? Does NBA get a percentage of their profits?

[Cavaliercards]

Don’t you think upper deck would figure out a way to raise money for a license if there was a chance for it?

Not unless Jordan pays for it himself and then you have to convince the PA to agree as well. It doesn’t bring Jordan enough revenue to want to deal with it.

[Cavaliercards]

Cavalier, how exactly does NBA license work? I assumed that panini pays a lump fee for the license regardless of their success. Is this not the case? Does NBA get a percentage of their profits?

Things increase as product lines among other things increase. There are more products out because NBA sees the opportunity to profit this season.

[drobfan8]

Oh man.

If UD comes back Cavaliercards is gonna have a heart attack.

[drobfan8]

At the same time, the League is already fat and wealthy. They could use a pay cut and some humility.

Others are out of their $50k - $100k jobs

[Cavaliercards]

Oh man.

If UD comes back Cavaliercards is gonna have a heart attack.

We will be fine if they come back to basketball. We enjoy working with them in other endeavors currently.

[isles4life]

So the NBA has lost a ton of money this year and likely will next season too.
Meanwhile, card hobby is going strong likely netting panini record profits.
When does NBA look to capitalize on this and up the licensing fee or potentially go to another company who bids higher?

I’m f I’m running the NBA right now I’m looking for alternative revenue streams and this seems like low hanging fruit. What kind of contract is in place?

card hobby might still be surging but there was a noticable price drop in august imo. Whether it's market correction or people losing interest, idk. But it's guarantee'd to increase once the season starts up regardless of how many viewers the NBA has.

[oldgoldy97]

Holding out hope for UD coming back.

If UD had a dollar for every post made wishing they’d come back they’d actually have enough money to come back.

[tier1dc]

Don’t you think upper deck would figure out a way to raise money for a license if there was a chance for it?

No.

Panini makes $1+ billion every 4 years on World Cup stickers.

Topps net income is around $100 million.
Panini is just under $1 billion.

Upper Deck doesn't disclose finances but they are well south of Topps.

Not sure how they'd figure out how match that license fee and actual produce a product.

The wish for anyone other than Panini to make NBA product is just that a wish. No chance it ever happens.

[Vinny1984]

Any numbers gurus know what % of overall income panini is to the nba?

[Harper]

Does anyone have details on how the licensing fee works? I think competition with panini is an interesting discussion, but agree Panini is unlikely to be usurped. More my concern is that Panini will be asked to pay NBA 20% more, and instead of Panini keeping CEO salary steady, they’ll just buy less gamers and lose more auto exclusives and we will suffer from Panini greed. Then as customers, how do we react? We have a lot of people in the hobby who don’t really understand it... that don’t know the difference between game worm, player worn, event worn. Don’t really know about autograph saturation.

[tier1dc]

Any numbers gurus know what % of overall income panini is to the nba?

Privately held company. Nothing like that disclosed publicly.

Does anyone have details on how the licensing fee works? I think competition with panini is an interesting discussion, but agree Panini is unlikely to be usurped. More my concern is that Panini will be asked to pay NBA 20% more, and instead of Panini keeping CEO salary steady, they’ll just buy less gamers and lose more auto exclusives and we will suffer from Panini greed.

Current license deal goes through 2022 season. There's nothing to discuss really. Panini is an international corporation with 10-20x times valuation on all competitors combined. There's no benefit for NBA to increase license fee that much after 10+ years of successful partnership. Especially with Covid and mitigating circumstances.

The global reach and distribution of Panini products eclipses any other competitor. That's important to the global NBA initiative.

Kinda the same reason MLB and Topps are seemingly joined for life. The history and experience of working in tandem was cause for Panini's most recent license offer was rebuked even though it was rumored to be double Topps'.

[YeahBuddy]

They've already done what was needed ....

people with licensing background or experience realize.

Not about the licensing FEE ... its all about the licensing ROYALTY. ie. percent.

How do you make more if you are the NBA? Price of boxes raise.... it would be ILLEGAL for panini to do a dutch auction on their site and then still pay NBA X percent of the MSRP ... NBA is getting a cut of all that. 100% guaranteed or they would have already had their butts sued.

I'm sure all parties are happy. The fee, the exclusive arrangement fee deal... all that is simply the cream.

[Cavaliercards]

Does anyone have details on how the licensing fee works? I think competition with panini is an interesting discussion, but agree Panini is unlikely to be usurped. More my concern is that Panini will be asked to pay NBA 20% more, and instead of Panini keeping CEO salary steady, they’ll just buy less gamers and lose more auto exclusives and we will suffer from Panini greed. Then as customers, how do we react? We have a lot of people in the hobby who don’t really understand it... that don’t know the difference between game worm, player worn, event worn. Don’t really know about autograph saturation.

The cost would be passed on to the consumer in that situation. In addition the league licensing has tight control so no there won’t be a drop in hits. Licensing fee is pretty standard and if it goes up then it goes up as it has before in recent years and people barely noticed.