Your personal Goat calculator - surprisingly pretty spot-on I found.

[daeve]

https://nba-goat-calculator.onrender.com/

Found this on reddit and OP is still working on it... but I found it pretty accurate.

I personally rank the top 5 as Kareem-MJ-Lebron-Wilt-Russell and the calculator gave me Lebron-MJ-Russell-Kareem-Wilt. Got Jokic 15th, Giannis 17th, and Luka 23rd. It had my top 10 almost perfectly, just swapped Kobe in at 10th instead of Curry.

[Kobefan]

No consideration given to defensive skill set? At least include some defensive accolades as well, like all defense teams and DOPY. It's never going to be accurate given the differences in eras. Of course many players average more points and shoot more efficiently in the current era.

[GOATcards]

Needs a timeline adjustment and better accounting for defense (which I doubt steals and blocks do all that well) but:

Rank Name G-Score R-Score P-Score K-Score M-Score
1 Michael Jordan 1991.61 502.25 800.32 603 86.04
2 LeBron James 1939.7 514.04 796.53 513 116.12
3 Magic Johnson 1774.9 505.77 775.1 419 75.04
4 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 1713.69 455.15 652.66 486 119.88
5 Bill Russell 1612.06 398.72 637.03 500 76.32
6 Wilt Chamberlain 1604.98 543.79 723.67 248 89.52
7 Kobe Bryant 1602.94 433.44 656.87 402 110.64
8 Larry Bird 1599.16 487.71 722.81 315 73.64
9 Shaquille O'Neal 1568.76 424.13 647.87 387 109.76
10 Tim Duncan 1557.73 391.91 608.5 446 111.32
11 Kevin Durant 1550.6 476.52 730.32 255 88.76
12 Stephen Curry 1548.99 474.82 729.41 270 74.76
13 Hakeem Olajuwon 1491.61 423.22 707.87 262 98.52
14 Nikola Jokic 1477.86 471.21 819.88 141 45.76
15 John Havlicek 1458.8 378.6 586.12 398 96.08
16 Luka Doncic 1452.39 524.28 857.79 44 26.32
17 Jerry West 1441.63 474.55 690.09 200 77
18 Giannis Antetokounmpo 1418.64 452.67 747.05 163 55.92
19 Oscar Robertson 1418.1 500.56 680.9 158 78.64
20 Karl Malone 1367.82 451.01 641.44 163 112.36
21 Russell Westbrook 1356.43 465.94 714.37 84 92.12
22 Isiah Thomas 1354.01 439.39 679.82 160 74.8
23 Dwyane Wade 1342.49 412.11 630.25 205 95.12
24 Dirk Nowitzki 1340.03 384.62 652.33 186 117.08
25 Bob Cousy 1338.49 368.39 566.17 329 74.92
26 Chris Paul 1332.09 453.31 684.05 97 97.72
27 Charles Barkley 1330.62 448.51 684.87 111 86.24
28 James Harden 1330.12 482.55 668.61 85 93.96
29 Elgin Baylor 1328.85 450.76 662.29 143 72.8
30 Allen Iverson 1328.7 447.58 710.72 77 93.4
31 Scottie Pippen 1320.27 383.22 587.81 253 96.24
32 Bob Pettit 1300.91 440.92 628.39 170 61.6
33 Anthony Davis 1277.45 438.76 703.68 80 55
34 Moses Malone 1273.59 377.02 603.98 182 110.6
35 Kawhi Leonard 1267.67 391.13 626.54 193 57
36 Rick Barry 1262.33 429.7 636.91 137 58.72
37 Damian Lillard 1261.99 462.68 684.72 55 59.6
38 Trae Young 1256.25 494.33 727.72 7 27.2
39 Ja Morant 1253.68 447.94 776.45 9 20.28
40 John Stockton 1247.26 427.19 620.04 87 113.04
41 Walt Frazier 1238.6 395.36 640.33 135 67.92
42 Clyde Drexler 1230.46 422.75 638.62 76 93.08
43 Julius Erving 1220.66 416.51 621.67 117 65.48
44 Kevin Garnett 1218.59 388.64 580.66 128 121.28
45 Joel Embiid 1217.13 479.53 648.92 54 34.68
46 Steve Nash 1215.55 400.42 636.45 82 96.68
47 David Robinson 1211.01 418.1 556.91 158 78
48 George Mikan 1208.5 390.34 589 192 37.16
49 John Wall 1201.7 433.34 704.61 10 53.76
50 Kyrie Irving 1197.83 442.3 632.72 57 65.8


KG and Admiral in the 40s? Trae and Ja ahead of them?


2nd go-through after some tweaking (on meth of course)

Rank Name G-Score R-Score P-Score K-Score M-Score
1 Michael Jordan 2175.74 564.47 899.24 626 86.04
2 LeBron James 2123.71 576.09 900.5 531 116.12
3 Magic Johnson 1929.29 558.95 856.3 439 75.04
4 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 1913.47 526.31 754.28 513 119.88
5 Bill Russell 1908.94 492.57 792.05 548 76.32
6 Wilt Chamberlain 1887.91 654.35 886.04 258 89.52
7 Larry Bird 1783.57 556.42 826.51 327 73.64
8 Shaquille O'Neal 1762.3 490.93 752.61 409 109.76
9 Kobe Bryant 1757.03 484.3 734.09 428 110.64
10 Tim Duncan 1746.48 456.1 710.06 469 111.32
11 Kevin Durant 1722.32 536.96 827.6 269 88.76
12 Stephen Curry 1698.36 524.5 810.1 289 74.76
13 Hakeem Olajuwon 1692.97 495.57 823.89 275 98.52
14 Nikola Jokic 1663.58 535.87 936.95 145 45.76
15 Luka Doncic 1626.92 588.81 967.79 44 26.32
16 John Havlicek 1620.32 424.98 660.26 439 96.08
17 Giannis Antetokounmpo 1600.71 516.76 861.03 167 55.92
18 Jerry West 1577.71 529.57 763.14 208 77
19 Oscar Robertson 1551.35 555.43 753.28 164 78.64
20 Karl Malone 1539.18 519 743.81 164 112.36
21 Charles Barkley 1520.9 519.38 799.28 116 86.24
22 Elgin Baylor 1516.73 525.42 770.51 148 72.8
23 Dirk Nowitzki 1509.22 438.77 754.37 199 117.08
24 Russell Westbrook 1503.79 520.73 800.94 90 92.12
25 Bob Pettit 1502.96 524.02 744.34 173 61.6
26 Dwyane Wade 1485.03 457.59 704.33 228 95.12
27 Isiah Thomas 1480.11 479.37 748.94 177 74.8
28 Scottie Pippen 1476.62 431.38 668 281 96.24
29 Anthony Davis 1470.38 509.44 817.93 88 55
30 Moses Malone 1466.26 445.37 719.3 191 110.6
31 James Harden 1462.36 536.11 744.29 88 93.96
32 Allen Iverson 1460.63 494.71 788.52 84 93.4
33 Bob Cousy 1455.09 404.99 620.17 355 74.92
34 Chris Paul 1452 496.25 753.02 105 97.72
35 Kawhi Leonard 1416.51 442.3 714.21 203 57
36 Rick Barry 1405.16 484.82 717.62 144 58.72
37 George Mikan 1401.47 460.34 697.97 206 37.16
38 Joel Embiid 1401.27 554.52 754.07 58 34.68
39 Ja Morant 1389.53 493.38 864.87 11 20.28
40 David Robinson 1388.83 487.55 652.28 171 78
41 Kevin Garnett 1388.66 449.23 676.15 142 121.28
42 Damian Lillard 1387.64 509.32 757.72 61 59.6
43 Elvin Hayes 1383.29 459.34 721.59 108 94.36
44 Clyde Drexler 1375.22 474.41 718.73 89 93.08
45 Walt Frazier 1370.77 440 717.84 145 67.92
46 Trae Young 1369.55 538.97 794.38 9 27.2
47 Julius Erving 1368.19 471.7 705.01 126 65.48
48 John Stockton 1337.73 459.42 670.27 95 113.04
49 Dave Cowens 1337.24 456.6 702.04 118 60.6
50 Kyrie Irving 1322.65 488.03 699.82 69 65.8

[sammyjankis]

LeBron
Wilt
Bill Russell
Michael Jordan
Kareem

I don’t disagree with the 5 guys here. That’s not the order I’d put them in though.

[Nomad]

Julius Erving and Walt Frazier way down there. I mean I know who I would take over Harding, Westbrook, or Pettit.

[kaisersoze]

math is cool

[pcptrade]

This is what I got using the above calculator-

1. Lebron
2. Jordan
3. Russell
4. Wilt
5. Kareem
6. Magic
7. Bird
8. Shaq
9. Duncan
10. Hakeem

1 LeBron James 1871.69 546.56 720.04 506 99.09
2 Michael Jordan 1854.92 534.76 702.62 544 73.53
3 Bill Russell 1793.34 528.57 711.73 488 65.04
4 Wilt Chamberlain 1777.77 660.49 773.54 267 76.74
5 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 1744.9 524.72 624.27 494 101.91
6 Magic Johnson 1684.36 537.67 685.61 397 64.08
7 Larry Bird 1600.55 545.83 678.69 313 63.03
8 Shaquille O'Neal 1600.13 488.56 622.65 394 94.92
9 Tim Duncan 1595.66 463.26 599.51 438 94.89
10 Hakeem Olajuwon 1567.76 511.52 696.54 275 84.69

[GOATMJ]

1 Michael Jordan
2 LeBron James
3 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
4 Wilt Chamberlain
5 Bill Russell

not a bad list!

[GOATcards]

Applying as much of a medium weight as possible to all factors:

Rank Name G-Score R-Score P-Score K-Score M-Score
1 LeBron James 1253.8 390.4 514.31 250 99.09
2 Wilt Chamberlain 1251.05 471.78 552.53 150 76.74
3 Michael Jordan 1167.38 381.98 501.88 210 73.53
4 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 1162.62 374.8 445.91 240 101.91
5 Bill Russell 1145.96 377.55 508.38 195 65.04
6 Magic Johnson 1102.85 384.05 489.72 165 64.08
7 Hakeem Olajuwon 1092.6 365.38 497.53 145 84.69
8 Larry Bird 1087.69 389.88 484.78 150 63.03
9 Shaquille O'Neal 1073.64 348.97 444.75 185 94.92
10 Tim Duncan 1054.01 330.9 428.22 200 94.89
11 Kevin Durant 1046.01 363.18 466.06 140 76.77
12 Karl Malone 1044.55 363.62 435.25 150 95.67
13 Charles Barkley 1040.85 371.6 479.97 115 74.28
14 Kobe Bryant 1033.1 323.9 409.22 205 94.98
15 Nikola Jokic 1029.5 377.85 542.53 70 39.12
16 Giannis Antetokounmpo 1004.18 362.65 503.59 90 47.94
17 Luka Doncic 1002.21 396.5 542.97 40 22.74
18 Dirk Nowitzki 988.22 304.13 438.69 145 100.41
19 Stephen Curry 985.06 348.4 447.19 125 64.47
20 Moses Malone 983.26 323.78 438.94 125 95.55
21 Russell Westbrook 982.74 355.2 453.25 95 79.29
22 Bob Pettit 981.29 369.15 434.34 125 52.8
23 Oscar Robertson 978.08 368.57 417.12 125 67.38
24 Elgin Baylor 973.08 360.55 439.53 110 63
25 Kevin Garnett 970.27 325.85 409.66 130 104.76
26 Jerry West 968.52 357.9 404.47 140 66.15
27 Anthony Davis 965.62 365.42 487.34 65 47.85
28 Chris Paul 961.15 337.25 424.81 115 84.09
29 Elvin Hayes 953.63 337.23 441.03 95 80.37
30 James Harden 949.38 359.57 418.53 90 81.27
31 David Robinson 939.9 357.37 400.62 115 66.9
32 Allen Iverson 935.42 327.38 431 95 82.05
33 Joel Embiid 924.4 388.98 445.22 60 30.21
34 Dwyane Wade 916.77 309.73 399.91 125 82.14
35 Patrick Ewing 908.75 326.57 411.72 90 80.46
36 Isiah Thomas 908.27 321.4 422.97 100 63.9
37 John Havlicek 905.47 287.25 371.56 165 81.66
38 Clyde Drexler 904.85 328.88 415.97 80 80.01
39 Julius Erving 897.37 330.12 411.53 100 55.71
40 John Stockton 894.24 312.9 380.16 105 96.18
41 Dave Cowens 889.34 336.23 431.06 70 52.05
42 Scottie Pippen 884.3 305.95 395.97 100 82.38
43 Dwight Howard 881.13 319.67 392.25 85 84.21
44 Jason Kidd 875.67 306.45 378.5 85 105.72
45 Rick Barry 872.91 333.88 409 80 50.04
46 Damian Lillard 868.34 332.6 414.44 70 51.3
47 Dominique Wilkins 863.91 315.9 391.09 80 76.92
48 Walt Frazier 852.75 301.1 412.91 80 58.74
49 Chris Webber 852.64 338.02 387.84 50 76.77
50 Carmelo Anthony 846.32 300.22 373.09 80 93

[daeve]

To round out my top 13 [before the calculator really starts giving me current stars]:

personal:
6. Duncan
7. Shaq
8. Magic
9. Bird
10. Curry
11. Hakeem
12. Kobe
13. Oscar


calculator:
6. Magic
7. Shaq
8. Duncan
9. Bird
10. Kobe
11. Hakeem
12. Durant
13. Curry [one thing the calculator definitely can't do is know who was the best player on those GS teams given the criteria inputs]

[GOATcards]

I had a personal very-simple GOAT calculator a while back:

MVP Award Shares + Finals MVPs

Maybe I should develop a more advanced formula with appropriate weightings (like maybe normalizing for a maximum 100 score each) for:

The above two scores (for pre-1969, leader in playoff Win Shares gets 1 point)
Times leading league in VORP (Win Shares pre-'73)
Times leading league in BPM (WS/48 pre-'73)
Career VORP
Career BPM
Career playoff VORP
Career playoff BPM
Defensive Win Shares
All-NBA 1st team x 3, 2nd team x 2, 3rd team x 1
Eye Test

Along with a timeline adjustment, treating the '90s as neutral, taking away the equivalent of 1 MVP share/point for the '80s, 2 shares for the '70s, adding the equivalent of 2 shares for the '10s, etc.

Doing a rough calculation in my head, I end up roughly with the ranking in my sig :D

[jplarson]

Rank Name
1 Michael Jordan
2 LeBron James
3 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
4 Bill Russell
5 Wilt Chamberlain
6 Magic Johnson
7 Shaquille O'Neal
8 Kobe Bryant
9 Tim Duncan
10 Larry Bird
16 Nikola Jokic (https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1557061)

MJ first and Shaq above Jokic. At least we know the calculator is working perfectly.

[rats60]

Mine
1 Wilt Chamberlain
2 Michael Jordan
3 Bill Russell
4 LeBron James
5 Magic Johnson
6 Kareem Abdul Jabbar
7 Larry Bird
8 Shaquille O'Neal
9 Nikola Jokic
10 Tim Duncan
11 Hakeem Olajuwon
12 Luka Doncic
13 Giannis Antetokounmpo
14 Kobe Bryant
15 Kevin Durant

A little surprised at how high Jokic and Giannis are. Luka seems really high with no rings, no MVPs and only 4 1st selections.

[Tallboy]

Well, it's fun, but it doesn't work well for me because it's just not how I go about things.

Just to share, the Top 10 list that came out for me was:

1. Wilt
2. LeBron
3. Jordan
4. Kareem
5. Russell
6. Magic
7. Bird
8. Hakeem
9. Shaq
10. Duncan

I could complain about that, but realistically that's 9 of the 10 guys from my top 10.

I have a bigger issue with the fact that, for example, it lists Luka Doncic at #13, and that's just nowhere near to how I see him. Could I try to monkey with my weights to get him lower? Sure, but I'd think the hope for this tool would be to surprise you in a "I hadn't thought of that!" sort of way. Here I can see what happened - are points, rebounds & assists valuable? well yeah, how do I weight that? I dunno - and I'd just be chasing a list that fits with what I believe, and I already have that list.

[Asian62150]

So Russell is up there on most lists (6th based on my calculations).

But how were blocks factored for players that played prior to 1973? Russell officially recorded 0 blocks but some ppl that broke down some of the available game film think he averaged over 8 per game over his career...

[rats60]

So Russell is up there on most lists (6th based on my calculations).

But how were blocks factored for players that played prior to 1973? Russell officially recorded 0 blocks but some ppl that broke down some of the available game film think he averaged over 8 per game over his career...

I didn't use blocks, steals, 3 point % or 3rd team All NBA since those weren't tracked for all players. I did use Finals MVP. Russell is the only one it really hurt, Chamberlain and Havlicek lose one, but Bill would have had a bunch. I don't value Russell's rings the same as more recent ones. 8 of Bill's 11 rings only required winning 2 series, so that kind of evens out for me.

I redid my list giving more value to All Star selections and that seemed to filter out players who have played fewer seasons. My list with those valued higher is

1. Wilt Chamberlain
2. LeBron James
3. Michael Jordan
4. Magic Johnson
5. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
6. Larry Bird
7. Bill Russell
8. Karl Malone
9. Jerry West
10. Oscar Robertson
11. Elgin Baylor
12. Kobe Bryant
13. Tim Duncan
14. Shaquille O'Neal
15. Hakeem Olajuwon
16. Kevin Durant


It seems to me there is a clear top 3 with Wilt, MJ and LeBron, then 4-7 with Magic, Bird, KAJ and Russell, then another group that includes 8-16. Over time Luka, Nikola and Giannis seem destined to join one of these 3 groups.

[endthecurse]

Crazy... wrote down my top 8 beforehand, with MJ, Bron and KAJ 1-2-3, and the calculator hit 'em all.

Rank Name G-Score R-Score P-Score K-Score M-Score
1 Michael Jordan 1825.52 492.18 786.81 473 73.53
2 LeBron James 1791.13 489.74 763.31 439 99.09
3 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 1702.06 453.81 655.34 491 101.91
4 Bill Russell 1628.77 386.53 617.2 560 65.04
5 Wilt Chamberlain 1594.88 545.65 716.48 256 76.74
6 Magic Johnson 1585.44 454.18 691.18 376 64.08
7 Kobe Bryant 1560.04 421.33 639.73 404 94.98
8 Larry Bird 1513.85 465.6 689.23 296 63.03

[regularp]

My top ten was:

1.) LeBron
2.) Jordan
3.) Kareem
4.) Russell
5.) Wilt
6.) Kobe
7.) Shaq
8.) Duncan
9.) Magic
10.) Bird

My order would be slightly different but that's about in line with the ten guys I would pick though I think Curry is above Bird when it's all said and done.

[eastbayak]

1. LeBron
2. Jordan
3. Wilt

[dizzy4111]

The back 3rd gets a little ridiculous

[Torro]

Applying as much of a medium weight as possible to all factors:

Rank Name G-Score R-Score P-Score K-Score M-Score
1 LeBron James 1253.8 390.4 514.31 250 99.09
2 Wilt Chamberlain 1251.05 471.78 552.53 150 76.74
3 Michael Jordan 1167.38 381.98 501.88 210 73.53
4 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 1162.62 374.8 445.91 240 101.91
5 Bill Russell 1145.96 377.55 508.38 195 65.04
6 Magic Johnson 1102.85 384.05 489.72 165 64.08
7 Hakeem Olajuwon 1092.6 365.38 497.53 145 84.69
8 Larry Bird 1087.69 389.88 484.78 150 63.03
9 Shaquille O'Neal 1073.64 348.97 444.75 185 94.92
10 Tim Duncan 1054.01 330.9 428.22 200 94.89
11 Kevin Durant 1046.01 363.18 466.06 140 76.77
12 Karl Malone 1044.55 363.62 435.25 150 95.67
13 Charles Barkley 1040.85 371.6 479.97 115 74.28
14 Kobe Bryant 1033.1 323.9 409.22 205 94.98
15 Nikola Jokic 1029.5 377.85 542.53 70 39.12
16 Giannis Antetokounmpo 1004.18 362.65 503.59 90 47.94
17 Luka Doncic 1002.21 396.5 542.97 40 22.74
18 Dirk Nowitzki 988.22 304.13 438.69 145 100.41
19 Stephen Curry 985.06 348.4 447.19 125 64.47
20 Moses Malone 983.26 323.78 438.94 125 95.55
21 Russell Westbrook 982.74 355.2 453.25 95 79.29
22 Bob Pettit 981.29 369.15 434.34 125 52.8
23 Oscar Robertson 978.08 368.57 417.12 125 67.38
24 Elgin Baylor 973.08 360.55 439.53 110 63
25 Kevin Garnett 970.27 325.85 409.66 130 104.76
26 Jerry West 968.52 357.9 404.47 140 66.15
27 Anthony Davis 965.62 365.42 487.34 65 47.85
28 Chris Paul 961.15 337.25 424.81 115 84.09
29 Elvin Hayes 953.63 337.23 441.03 95 80.37
30 James Harden 949.38 359.57 418.53 90 81.27
31 David Robinson 939.9 357.37 400.62 115 66.9
32 Allen Iverson 935.42 327.38 431 95 82.05
33 Joel Embiid 924.4 388.98 445.22 60 30.21
34 Dwyane Wade 916.77 309.73 399.91 125 82.14
35 Patrick Ewing 908.75 326.57 411.72 90 80.46
36 Isiah Thomas 908.27 321.4 422.97 100 63.9
37 John Havlicek 905.47 287.25 371.56 165 81.66
38 Clyde Drexler 904.85 328.88 415.97 80 80.01
39 Julius Erving 897.37 330.12 411.53 100 55.71
40 John Stockton 894.24 312.9 380.16 105 96.18
41 Dave Cowens 889.34 336.23 431.06 70 52.05
42 Scottie Pippen 884.3 305.95 395.97 100 82.38
43 Dwight Howard 881.13 319.67 392.25 85 84.21
44 Jason Kidd 875.67 306.45 378.5 85 105.72
45 Rick Barry 872.91 333.88 409 80 50.04
46 Damian Lillard 868.34 332.6 414.44 70 51.3
47 Dominique Wilkins 863.91 315.9 391.09 80 76.92
48 Walt Frazier 852.75 301.1 412.91 80 58.74
49 Chris Webber 852.64 338.02 387.84 50 76.77
50 Carmelo Anthony 846.32 300.22 373.09 80 93

Yeah Charles Barkley before Kobe, seems very accurate indeed ��

Kobe being top5 player of 1 NBA team, yeah that’s why Kobe’s cards sell similar to the prices of Jordan and Lebron ��

[ThatGuyPal]

Pretty cool

Got

1) Wilt
2) Lebron
3) Jordan

[hauntedcomputer]

No consideration given to defensive skill set? At least include some defensive accolades as well, like all defense teams and DOPY. It's never going to be accurate given the differences in eras. Of course many players average more points and shoot more efficiently in the current era.

You can't use all-d and DOPY because they didn't exist until late 60s. Defensive greatness isn't factored in at all.

This should be O-STATcalc instead of GOATcalc. Bogus.

[daeve]

You can't use all-d and DOPY because they didn't exist until late 60s. Defensive greatness isn't factored in at all.

This should be O-STATcalc instead of GOATcalc. Bogus.

Yet Russell ended up 3rd on my list.

[GOATcards]

revisiting my timeline-adjustment theme:

I think the top 15 players quasi-ranked in my sig have the strongest resumes overall. Breaking down the 15 by 20-year time periods in which players' careers began (listed chronologically):

1956-1975:
Russell
Wilt
Kareem

1976-1995:
Larry
Magic
Hakeem
Michael
Shaq

1996-2015:
Tim
Kobe
Bron
KD
Steph
Giannis
Jokic

3 players in the first time frame, 5 in the 2nd, 7 in the 3rd.

Intuitively this seems pretty much spot-on for me.

Supposing that the top 10 were broken down the same, it would be something like 2-3-5. Who would those players be? I can't figure out what separation there is between Wilt and Kareem. We gonna go a tie for 10th place? A 3-way tie? I think the middle 3 for '76-95 are clear-cut; there is separation between Magic/Larry/Mike and the other two esp. with their shortened careers.

As for '96-15, I think when it's said and done, it's going to be Tim, Bron, Steph, Giannis and Joker in the top 10. (Among players whose careers began in that 60-year time frame.)

Contrast with the Athletic's ranking for example, which puts Kareem, Wilt & Russell at #3, 4, and 6. Half of the top 6 players in the game's history are from that time frame with that talent pool size?

[rats60]

revisiting my timeline-adjustment theme:

I think the top 15 players quasi-ranked in my sig have the strongest resumes overall. Breaking down the 15 by 20-year time periods in which players' careers began (listed chronologically):

1956-1975:
Russell
Wilt
Kareem

1976-1995:
Larry
Magic
Hakeem
Michael
Shaq

1996-2015:
Tim
Kobe
Bron
KD
Steph
Giannis
Jokic

3 players in the first time frame, 5 in the 2nd, 7 in the 3rd.

Intuitively this seems pretty much spot-on for me.

Supposing that the top 10 were broken down the same, it would be something like 2-3-5. Who would those players be? I can't figure out what separation there is between Wilt and Kareem. We gonna go a tie for 10th place? A 3-way tie? I think the middle 3 for '76-95 are clear-cut; there is separation between Magic/Larry/Mike and the other two esp. with their shortened careers.

As for '96-15, I think when it's said and done, it's going to be Tim, Bron, Steph, Giannis and Joker in the top 10. (Among players whose careers began in that 60-year time frame.)

Contrast with the Athletic's ranking for example, which puts Kareem, Wilt & Russell at #3, 4, and 6. Half of the top 6 players in the game's history are from that time frame with that talent pool size?

It depends on who you saw play. My list has 6 from the first group, 5 from the 2nd group and 4 from the 3rd group. My top 10 is 4/3/3. My top 3 has one from each group. I would expect equal numbers from each time period. Great players are going to be great in any era. Larger talent pool shouldn't matter. The guys filling out rosters today wouldn't have had a job in the 60s.

[GOATcards]

Larger talent pool shouldn't matter.

can't argue with that

[daeve]

https://nba-goat-calculator.onrender.com/

dude just dropped V3 based on all good feedback he'd received... my results changed. A lot more defensive parameters added, for those who were criticizing the lack of on Version 1.

MJ
Lebron
Kareem
Duncan
Russell
Kobe
Shaq
Magic
Wilt
Hakeem
Havlicek
Bird

is the top 12 on mine.


Big drops for Wilt and Bird. Timmy and Kobe gained most ground it seems, also the more modern guys fell, don't have Jokic and Luka in the top 25 anymore. Jokic fell to 30th and Luka 62nd... which is probably way more accurate.

[rats60]

My new list
Wilt Chamberlain
Michael Jordan
LeBron James
Magic Johnson
Larry Bird
Kareem Abdul Jabbar
Bill Russell
Karl Malone
Hakeem Olajuwon
Oscar Robertson
Kobe Bryant
Elgin Baylor
Jerry West

Biggest gainer in mine is Hakeem. Biggest drop was Tim Duncan.

[GOATcards]

both the older and the newer formula don't seem to properly credit Kobe (for example); he wasn't the top dog for 3 of his 5 chips, and he won only 1 MVP while being top 10 in MVP shares (the logic for the latter should also apply to DPOY vis a vis All-NBA first team defense)

[calmar]

My top 10 are in two tiers:
1st tier
Jordan
LeBron
Kareem
Russell
Wilt
2nd tier
Magic
Bird
Robertson
Duncan
Shaq

To me the most undervalued player on most of these lists is Oscar Robertson. He only won one championship, it's true, but he was a monster nevertheless. I like Win Shares per Games Played as a measuring stick, and his .18 is higher than, for instance, Magic (.17), Bird (.16), and Kobe (.13).

[kd the sniper]

https://nba-goat-calculator.onrender.com/

dude just dropped V3 based on all good feedback he'd received... my results changed. A lot more defensive parameters added, for those who were criticizing the lack of on Version 1.

MJ
Lebron
Kareem
Duncan
Russell
Kobe
Shaq
Magic
Wilt
Hakeem
Havlicek
Bird

is the top 12 on mine.


Big drops for Wilt and Bird. Timmy and Kobe gained most ground it seems, also the more modern guys fell, don't have Jokic and Luka in the top 25 anymore. Jokic fell to 30th and Luka 62nd... which is probably way more accurate.kd bout to start kicking in that door... great concept tho..

Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

[daeve]

both the older and the newer formula don't seem to properly credit Kobe (for example); he wasn't the top dog for 3 of his 5 chips, and he won only 1 MVP while being top 10 in MVP shares (the logic for the latter should also apply to DPOY vis a vis All-NBA first team defense)

You could knock his era down in the new formulator, though it'd also knock Duncan. I think part of the reason Tim and Kobe moved way up my list is that I knocked the earlier decades for less competition, but maybe I should only do that for the 50s.

[asujbl]

Magic and Bird are too low for me... and the Centers (some of them) are probably too high... but it's not bad



1 LeBron James 99.9 4971.24 1329.78 1562.47 1446.75 232.24 400
2 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 99.5 4790.88 1296.3 1387.82 1467 239.76 400
3 Michael Jordan 99.2 4627.23 1296.29 1532.72 1326.15 172.08 300
4 Wilt Chamberlain 99.2 4608.9 1656.16 1715.65 783.9 173.2 280
5 Tim Duncan 99 4525.35 1150.77 1326.09 1445.85 222.64 380
6 Kobe Bryant 98.8 4404.85 1115.65 1264.38 1403.55 221.28 400
7 Bill Russell 98.6 4319.35 1336.81 1595.21 974.7 152.64 260
8 Hakeem Olajuwon 98.5 4271.07 1223.95 1479.38 1010.7 197.04 360
9 Shaquille O'Neal 98.4 4233.2 1220.89 1389.41 1028.25 214.64 380
10 Karl Malone 98.1 4090.3 1250.65 1333.58 901.35 224.72 380
11 Magic Johnson 98 4041.32 1302.76 1484.15 837 150.08 260
12 Larry Bird 98 4033.99 1330.56 1464.23 839.25 147.28 260

[scotthenrichs]

My list sounds about right. Only real surprise is Havlicek.


layer Rank Player Name NBA-2K OVR G-Score (G.O.A.T. Score) R-Score (Regular Season) P-Score (Playoffs) K-Score (Awards) M-Score (Misc.) E-Score (Era Score)
1 Michael Jordan 99.9 5961.3 1041.95 1255.1 2803.95 495.3 365
2 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar 99.7 5836.95 980.51 1064.05 2643.3 699.1 450
3 LeBron James 99.6 5793.12 1023.88 1212.54 2485.8 670.9 400
4 Tim Duncan 98.8 5325.54 851.83 995.1 2441.7 644.9 390
5 Kobe Bryant 98.8 5323.53 884.71 1012.83 2383.2 629.8 415
6 Bill Russell 98.7 5225.04 925.3 1111.64 2630.7 442.4 115
7 Shaquille O'Neal 98.1 4888.24 922.66 1060.28 1895.4 594.9 415
8 John Havlicek 98 4801.08 780.15 918.92 2291.4 560.6 250
9 Magic Johnson 97.7 4628.3 926.43 1054.07 1890 432.8 325
10 Hakeem Olajuwon 97.6 4574.36 921.32 1138.14 1521 558.9 435
11 Wilt Chamberlain 97.4 4464.84 1248.89 1236.05 1310.4 489.5 180
12 Larry Bird 97.3 4401.09 1009.3 1109.09 1535.4 422.3 325
13 Scottie Pippen 97.1 4260.56 758.25 900.82 1649.7 551.8 400
14 Karl Malone 96.9 4177.87 966.38 1039.32 1058.4 652.7 450
15 Kevin Durant 96.9 4166.8 981.39 1150.39 1264.5 481.6 30