Debate Topic: How good is A&G?

[thebigcheese44]

How good is Allen and Ginter? I personally don't like the whole codebreaking thing but if it sells, it sells. I also have a small problem with the fact that they mix in other areas of interest (i.e., boxing, politics) to a baseball product.

That is just me.


Thanks for reading!

[jimssouvenirs]

How good is Allen and Ginter? I personally don't like the whole codebreaking thing but if it sells, it sells. I also have a small problem with the fact that they mix in other areas of interest (i.e., boxing, politics) to a baseball product.

That is just me.


Thanks for reading!

Baseball card collecting wouldn't be around if it weren't for tobacco era cards, and A & G was one of the first. It's not like they just invent this product, it's a throwback to the days of old. It's not for everyone, just like collecting cards of old sea captains and boxers isn't for everyone, but I do enjoy the fact that they pay homage to the days of old.

[hoopster3977]

As it has been discussed here and on other forums, Ginter is not a rip and flip product bought in small quanities. It's about the sets, and inserts.

Many autograph stalkers also like the product for IP auto's.

[7290morint]

I personally don't get what isn't to like about this set. The artistry, the wide variety of subjects in terms of autos & relics from sports and non sports alike I think is one of the biggest appeals of this sport. The collection of relics, i.e. bat knobs and full letters, plus large cabinet relics with full name plates (last years) and full logos (this years) are some that aren't typically seen. I understand that people may not like a rip and flip type of product and I will agree that the baseball autograph checklist isn't always the strongest. That being said, how can you not love all on card autos?

[greenjdo]

I agree... Only got one box and only got 3. Relics! Goodwins is cool too... But it's certainly very hit or miss... Buy in bulk!

[death2redemptions]

I think it tanked...sales wise. I don't think holding onto cases for any longer is going to add any extra value. I only see Ginter going one way...down. Other than just sales I didn't like it. I like the idea of mixing different subjects and sports but I think they took it to far with insert sets like Ascent Of Man & Minds That Matter. It was impossible to put together sets, only 4 in two cases and not even one master set in my first case (while everyone was telling me 2 master sets & 2 base per case), and yet they sold for $h!t. As little as Topps Series 1 & 2 sets and with those you pull 7 sets per case. Not as many people as I thought were interested in it, or maybe the market was just flooded with them (the sets) because too many people were ripping & flipping. Still, I was disappointed.

[thebigcheese44]

I can't affored to bu in bulk or I would. But I guessI just not a huge fan of the throwbacks. I am of the opinion that as time changes, should so the cards.

[natbornkiller]

ginter back in 2007-2008 was great
but
the last 2 years it is down hill
when you get less base mini 's than combined inserts

and
this year you get practically the same amount of a&g mini backs and mini base cards

[mortatort]

who the hell wants sea urchins, flowers and a wolf in a pack of sports cards? At least the presidents do actually take the field from time to time...

[pakman916]

A&G is a niche product. It does sell well if you hit something nice (Bush, Pac, Stan Lee, Rip Card, etc), but as a whole, it sucks because the gu are practically useless.

I do like the card design. I think A&G card design year after year is spectacular. Also, set building is fun to do.

Just caution to the rip and flipper. This product is not for the faint of heart. I think in order to be successful from a money perspective is to either be REALLY lucky or buy lots of cases. Look at Brentandbecca. Even though he landed some nice cards, how many cases did he have to open to get those nice cards??? Quite a bit.

Honestly, if I were into A&G, I'd buy a set off ebay, and buy a few relics on the cheap for my pc. Then wait and see if the big hits simmer in price. I'd pick up the Pac auto, pac relic, and the stan lee auto and relic. Then i'd be done with A&G.

[remdawg1997]

AG is not about hits. It is about having fun ripping wax, which is what collecting should be about. Just because you dont make money doesnt mean it isnt a good product. While I do enjoy some of the non-sport inclusions, i would like it better if there were not as many non-sport inserts. With all this said, AG is a good product, but Topps could have a executed better this year. The AG brand itself is great, this years release is just good.

[Carrbeaz]

While the relic hits are selling for crap, I have been turning set building lots fairly well already. AG requires patience.

[death2redemptions]

The one thing I like about Ginter are the rip cards. I like the idea. I also like the idea of including people other than baseball players on the checklist but I don't like how hard they make them to pull. It seems all the non baseball player autos are short printed. I pulled ALL baseball players in 2 cases. They were also crappy, which they include a lot. I'm bored of the relics. But like I said before, if there were more non-baseball players, or at least easier to pull. I opened a case that had nothing but boring common player relics. OUCH. I guess my first case had some neat relics, but I'm basically bored of them (the relics). What I do not like about Ginter are all the stupid mini insert cards and the regular size inserts. Who cares about boats, animals & for God sake, flowers. While there may be some women interested in Ginter, the majority of collectors are guys who are into sports and we don't care about growing flowers. There should be more of the regular minis, less of the inserts.

[thebigcheese44]

What is supposedly so good that could be in the rip cards?

[7290morint]

What is supposedly so good that could be in the rip cards?

Can be a 1/1 wood parallel, #'d/10 Red Ink Auto, or a high number mini sp.

[Admetstiger]

Baseball card collecting wouldn't be around if it weren't for tobacco era cards, and A & G was one of the first. It's not like they just invent this product, it's a throwback to the days of old. It's not for everyone, just like collecting cards of old sea captains and boxers isn't for everyone, but I do enjoy the fact that they pay homage to the days of old.

I couldnt have said it better...

[7290morint]

I can't affored to bu in bulk or I would. But I guessI just not a huge fan of the throwbacks. I am of the opinion that as time changes, should so the cards.

If this is your opinion one would think that you are a fan of the A&G set. It has more than just baseball players to encompass the wide ranging interests in our society, it has all on card autos, and more than just jersey & bat relics. Time and time again topps puts sticker autos, with the same checklist and the same lame ass cuts out spelling stupid things like in triple threads, with the same single color jersey pieces and batch swatches. By your logic you should be a big fan of A&G...

[ElonU]

I personally don't get what isn't to like about this set. The artistry, the wide variety of subjects in terms of autos & relics from sports and non sports alike I think is one of the biggest appeals of this sport.

Agreed here.

This is a common thread between my wife and me...as far as sports and cards. She doesn't like sports, but she LOVES busting packs and boxes of A&G with me. It's a fun product and who cares if it makes you a ton a money. If we had the money, we would buy case after case!!!!!

[pakman916]

Agreed here.

This is a common thread between my wife and me...as far as sports and cards. She doesn't like sports, but she LOVES busting packs and boxes of A&G with me. It's a fun product and who cares if it makes you a ton a money. If we had the money, we would buy case after case!!!!!

I agree, if you are a collector, you shouldn't care. That's why I said it's a niche product. Card design, history, variations, etc...all great for a collector/set builder. But there are TONS of people in this hobby that survive off the rip and flip. This is where A&G is one of the biggest gambles of the year. It's LOVE or HATE. Not much in the middle. With most products that come out through the year, you don't have the same extremes.

Although the hobby started in "collecting", in the modern era, opening wax is not JUST about "collecting". I'm not going to get into that, because it's a whole different discussion.

If I was a set builder or a collector, I would look forward to A&G every year. If I was a big case breaker, I would also look forward to A&G. But if I was just your average Joe collector/rip n flipper, as many people on this site are...A&G is the biggest risk/reward product of the year. If you don't believe me, check brentandbecca's live break. I was watching it today and out of 3 boxes, he hit all gu relics, and they were all middle of the road players. Last year, I opened quite a few boxes and pulled nothing to write home about. As I said in my earlier post, you would need some major luck to pull something nice from a few boxes, or you'd have to buy a few cases to make Ginter a worthwhile rip. I'm not trying to bash Ginter. I'm just trying to set the correct expectation.

Actually, here's a better illustration. If you saw a group break for 1 case of Ginter, how many people do you think would feel they could get their money's worth from the hits or base cards. If I saw a Ginter break, I would never participate because I know there is a slim chance I would walk away with anything worthwhile. I'd probably have better luck going to Target and buying 1 or 2 packs off the rack. Just saying.

[dthimesch]

Ginger sucks. I never get the hype about it.

[Carrbeaz]

Ginger sucks. I never get the hype about it.

Yeah.. Maryanne was the hot one

[thebigcheese44]

Bowman all the way!!!!

[ilovethelakings]

Besides the regular old Topps cards, A&G is the one product I look forward to each year. The fun of not knowing what types of interesting cards I'll get makes it so much more fun than most other products. I just wish hobby boxes were cheaper.

[BostonNut]

For the people who UNDERSTAND what Allen and Ginter is....it is a profit machine.

For the people who don't do any research, don't know what Allen and Ginter is, and just buy a box because it is the newest thing...it is worse then buying a box of 1988 Topps.

[Sushiyoshi]

Besides the regular old Topps cards, A&G is the one product I look forward to each year. The fun of not knowing what types of interesting cards I'll get makes it so much more fun than most other products. I just wish hobby boxes were cheaper.

+1. I definitely would rip some boxes if they were cheaper. I really like the design and variety.

[death2redemptions]

Can be a 1/1 wood parallel, #'d/10 Red Ink Auto, or a high number mini sp.

Or an original 1/1 sketch. Probably the best thing you can pull

[7290morint]

Or an original 1/1 sketch. Probably the best thing you can pull

I guess that's really open to interpretation. Those 1/1 sketch cards don't always sell for that much and I'd venture to say you are better off with a 1/1 wood parallel or a red ink auto.