Basketball Fans...what are your thoughts on PER?

[SpastikMooss]

So there's a WAR discussion going on in the baseball section, and in it someone took a pot shot at PER, most notably saying:

"I was also looking at the "advanced" stats in Basketball on ESPN yesterday.

Brooks Lopez who has played 17 games in the season was the 2nd highest ranked player in the eastern conference.

Kris Humphries was the highest Celtic at 28th "best" in the east."

I think that points to a fairly poor understanding of PER, but it made me wonder in general, what do people think of PER? My thinking is that it's generally more accepted by fans than WAR is, but I guess I don't really know so I figured I'd ask. Anyways, what do you think of the stat?

[EMD34]

I think PER is a great stat that summarizes a player's impact by giving them one simple number instead of a ton of different stats, and it almost always coincides with my opinion of a player so I think it's pretty reliable. It could do a better job of showing defensive impact though.

[AdamG007]

I believe there is no possible way to quantify a player’s true value on the court. Stats can be misleading. I have seen countless games where a player has a terrific stat line, but their impact on the game was negligible; conversely, I have seen tons of games where a player has a pedestrian stat line, but completely controlled the game.

What I find troubling are the insufferable groups of people, especially ESPN contributors, that view PER and other “advanced stats” as indisputable calculations of value. Arguments such as “Player A is better than Player B because his PER or win shares are higher” are becoming more and more regular. I just do not believe things are that linear. Players who do most of their damage in the paint will generally be more efficient and have higher PERs than players who operate primarily on the perimeter. However, simply because one player is more efficient than another does not automatically mean that they are more skillful or more capable of putting a team on their back when the need arises.

I would not say that attempts to quantify a player’s value are necessarily awful, but they should not be viewed as the ultimate answer to anything.

[440shane]

I don't put too much stock into it as a whole because it has no way of showing/proving a players' worth on the defensive end. Since the game is dominated by two way players its hard to judge. In a vacuum it does a wonderful job showing a players offensive contributions and how efficient the are with those opportunities.

[asujbl]

It's the equivalent of a QB Rating.

I can tell with my own 2 eyes what QB I'd rather have but at the same time QB Rating (or Total QBR if you use that) gies you some sort of summary of what's going on.

PER is the same way. It's hardly the end all be all statistic - but it also gives you some idea of how the guy is playing on an all around level.

There aren't many fans that would rather have Isiah Thomas (as good as he is) over Kyrie Irving or John Wall - that you can tell with your own 2 eyes (or statistically as someone like Kyrie is ahead of Thomas in PPG/APG/RPG) - but at the same time PER gives you an indicator of how well Thomas is playing considering his PER is higher than both guys if you don't just look at straight stats.

It's not an end all be all stat - but it has it's place in how you view a player in his entire context.

[pac213up]

PER is fine as long as you understand what it is measuring and that it is limited to box score stats. Most importantly it does not account for defense and rewards volume shooters more times than not.

I like to use it along with adjusted plus/minus to get a good read on a players real impact on the court.

[Sikkcaden]

Im not a huge fan of Advanced Statistics in basketball, I don't feel like all of the kinks are worked out quite yet. Advanced Statistics seem to only work best in Baseball.

[smalltown]

They don't hold much weight in Basketball. Good and great players often defer to other players within the context of the team system. That doesn't make them less valuable players/worse players.