Flawless now on Ebay

[Morgoth]

Underwhelmed so far with design and whats been, pulled. Seriously that pink/purple design for rookies is atrocious.

The BIN's are absurd so far. Not many base diamonds being listed.

Anyone buy anything yet?

[Hawksmack]

Underwhelmed so far with design and whats been, pulled. Seriously that pink/purple design for rookies is atrocious.

The BIN's are absurd so far. Not many base diamonds being listed.

Anyone buy anything yet?

Haven't bought anything yet. But thinking about spending $1350 just to show how many awesome cards I could buy for the price of a box.

[Jnb0123]

Haven't bought anything yet. But thinking about spending $1350 just to show how many awesome cards I could buy for the price of a box.


You could say that for just about every product, but its so much more fun to bust products! Nobody should bust wax to make money IMo

[adamsbetter]

You could say that for just about every product, but its so much more fun to bust products! Nobody should bust wax to make money IMo

no sh!t. All of the hate over pretty much every product that's released and people breaking has always been the heart of the hobby, or was. If you can't afford to buy a certain product, why do you have to bad mouth it for the rest of the people that like to gamble and enjoy the rush of opening high end product?

The ROI isn't very good on any product and even if you plan on just buying singles wouldn't it pay to just shut up and let people bust it so there would be more singles to buy?

I just don't get it. Do people really think that there is supposed to be $1300 worth of resale out of these boxes? Do they not expect Panini to make a profit just like any other business? I personally love high end like this. They are the best looking modern cards period.

[Pat3ntP3nd1ng]

Underwhelmed so far with design and whats been, pulled. Seriously that pink/purple design for rookies is atrocious.

The BIN's are absurd so far. Not many base diamonds being listed.

Anyone buy anything yet?


Honestly, some of the cards are really great looking in hand; Jumbo Patches, Base Diamond, RPA's, Dual Patch Autos.

But lets be honest here, many of the pictures and/scans these sellers have up are utterly horrific and don't do the cards any justice. In reality, you could post the same card, one with quality photos that highlight the foil and etchings, and one that doesn't. My guess is you would see the one with better pictures outsell the other 100% of the time.

[mutigers77]

This product will be go up in price by the end of next week. Looks incredible in-person and there just isn't enough supply to drag prices down.

[BoxBreaker72]

I have yet to see a giant 2K+ plus card hit.

When a product costs $1400 a box, there needs to be "jackpot" type cards. Not seeing them yet..

[lisu]

I have yet to see a giant 2K+ plus card hit.

When a product costs $1400 a box, there needs to be "jackpot" type cards. Not seeing them yet..

I literally just bought a case on Ebay for $2200 - so $1100 a box. I feel like that's a good price. These boxes were never meant to be sold for $1400 a box out the gate - more like $1000 - $1200.

[pejc300]

So...turns out they did pack out Adrian Peterson after all....

2014 Panini Flawless Adrian Peterson Emerald Jumbo Patch Ed 2 5 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-Panini-Flawless-Adrian-Peterson-Emerald-Jumbo-Patch-ed-2-5-/121474849049?pt=US_Football&hash=item1c48771919#ht_21wt_1157)

[nibrugnerotto]

Seriously?
2014 Panini Flawless Robert Mathis Patch Auto Autograph Ed 10 25 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-Panini-Flawless-Robert-Mathis-Patch-Auto-Autograph-ed-10-25-/121474841014?pt=US_Football&hash=item1c4876f9b6)

I don't know how to post the pic from my iPad, so if someone could please do that.......

[DUCKanay]

Fck Panini for not getting any Raider rookie signers. Been killed in all my breaks.

[315BeardMafia]

no sh!t. All of the hate over pretty much every product that's released and people breaking has always been the heart of the hobby, or was. If you can't afford to buy a certain product, why do you have to bad mouth it for the rest of the people that like to gamble and enjoy the rush of opening high end product?

The ROI isn't very good on any product and even if you plan on just buying singles wouldn't it pay to just shut up and let people bust it so there would be more singles to buy?

I just don't get it. Do people really think that there is supposed to be $1300 worth of resale out of these boxes? Do they not expect Panini to make a profit just like any other business? I personally love high end like this. They are the best looking modern cards period.
Exactly it....I personally can't afford it and I definitely think 90% of the boxes will be non-profitable but honestly, I can only remember one of my boxes EVER being profitable. Seriously. So, if I had a couple extra stacks laying around...you're DAMN right I'd open a box.

[Diamondjake]

Flawless football isn't even on my radar of items to search for right now.

And I am a huge fan of Flawless in general...

[lisu]

Exactly it....I personally can't afford it and I definitely think 90% of the boxes will be non-profitable but honestly, I can only remember one of my boxes EVER being profitable. Seriously. So, if I had a couple extra stacks laying around...you're DAMN right I'd open a box.

This sounds like the same old ranting going on when Exquisite was released and then when NT was released. This year's products from both Topps & Panini have all been money losers - you can tell when all of the current releases are all below cost.

I think Flawless will be the only one that remains above cost this year until Contenders, Topps Chrome, NT, and Immaculate come out.

[Hawksmack]

The only complaint I have is Panini not spreading the hits around. Just watched a casebreak on Mojobreaks and Emmitt Smith was the case hit on both boxes. Great for the guy who bought the Cowboys but pretty crappy for the rest of us.

[arott23]

Edit: nevermind......

[Bars and Bar]

Mike Evans 1/1 RPA up for $499.95/BO. I haven't looked up what he has been selling for, but this seems like a great price.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-Flawless-Mike-Evans-RPA-patch-AUTO-1-1-SICK-PATCH-/271653321871?pt=US_Football&hash=item3f3fccbc8f

[Morgoth]

This sounds like the same old ranting going on when Exquisite was released and then when NT was released. This year's products from both Topps & Panini have all been money losers - you can tell when all of the current releases are all below cost.

I think Flawless will be the only one that remains above cost this year until Contenders, Topps Chrome, NT, and Immaculate come out.

Depends on whose cost your going by, most have had to pay 1250 to 1400 for a box, I think it won't sustain that. Maybe 1K a box if a rookie or two takes off.

I still think it will settle down just like basketball and there will be plenty of 20 buck patch autos for everyone.

[molarson23]

Luck #/10 auto just went BIN for 300.00 are you kidding... its that stuff that is ruining value on these cards...

[Morgoth]

Luck #/10 auto just went BIN for 300.00 are you kidding... its that stuff that is ruining value on these cards...

Seems low but again it's a third year plan OC auto, hell Peyton's exquisite autos numbered to 25 weren't bringing that much.

[molarson23]

Seems low but again it's a third year plan OC auto, hell Peyton's exquisite autos numbered to 25 weren't bringing that much.

But dont you agree that this is what killing the hobbies value?? I mean its happening in basketball too...

[xbignick]

no sh!t. All of the hate over pretty much every product that's released and people breaking has always been the heart of the hobby, or was. If you can't afford to buy a certain product, why do you have to bad mouth it for the rest of the people that like to gamble and enjoy the rush of opening high end product?

The ROI isn't very good on any product and even if you plan on just buying singles wouldn't it pay to just shut up and let people bust it so there would be more singles to buy?

I just don't get it. Do people really think that there is supposed to be $1300 worth of resale out of these boxes? Do they not expect Panini to make a profit just like any other business? I personally love high end like this. They are the best looking modern cards period.

This isn't a re-pack product. They're making a clear profit on what they sold it to distributors for and distributors are running the tables on it. How much do you think a Manti auto cost them exactly?

[Cubs_rock21]

All of the rookie QB's, which are the chasers have so far underperformed, except Manziel who hasn't played yet. This will be a tough product to break even on. You will be able to put together one hell of a box for 1200 by buying singles, just wait two weeks.

[Bars and Bar]

Jerry Rice 1/1 Patch Auto up at $1500/BO

Jerry Rice 2014 Panini Flawless Patch Auto 1 1 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Jerry-Rice-2014-Panini-Flawless-PATCH-AUTO-1-1-/221591526741?pt=US_Football&hash=item3397e25d55)

[studioU]

But dont you agree that this is what killing the hobbies value?? I mean its happening in basketball too...

I totally agree. All these breakers race to undersell each other. I would never list a Luck auto #/10 for $300 BIN, no matter what the product.

[kyle1707]

Price should be 600 not 1100-1200

Not going to argue that.

But look at some of early bin sales completed

Some of this stuff will shock people early in the flawless game

[chondaville]

Price should be 600 not 1100-1200

Not going to argue that.

But look at some of early bin sales completed

Some of this stuff will shock people early in the flawless game

I can't see completed sales. Are they shocking good or shocking bad??

[Pat3ntP3nd1ng]

Price should be 600 not 1100-1200

Not going to argue that.

But look at some of early bin sales completed

Some of this stuff will shock people early in the flawless game


I think you can probably ring some great deals now, if your objective is to flip or collect longer term, but in the same regard some people will be grossly overpaying for certain cards. Thats what the initial release is all about.

[no10pin]

But dont you agree that this is what killing the hobbies value?? I mean its happening in basketball too...

I don't agree that it's the sellers killing the value. Luck signs in pretty much every product that's put out. At what point are there too many Andrew Luck autos out there?

Guys like Luck and Trout who started their careers during the era of the ultra-high end product will be signing everything for the next 15 years. What will they be worth then?

[Cubs_rock21]

Jerry Rice 1/1 Patch Auto up at $1500/BO

Jerry Rice 2014 Panini Flawless Patch Auto 1 1 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Jerry-Rice-2014-Panini-Flawless-PATCH-AUTO-1-1-/221591526741?pt=US_Football&hash=item3397e25d55)

hmmm Buy this for 700 or take my chance on a box....I feel this could have gotten more though

[kyle1707]

Shocking good.

Cecil shorts 75 auto
Paul Richardson 75 auto
Jan stenaurd patch auto 149
Bettis patch auto. 499
Richard Sherman auto 199
Watkins auto 199
J Gordon auto 85
Garappllo auto 199
Logan Thomas 1/1 patch 300

[studioU]

I don't agree that it's the sellers killing the value. Luck signs in pretty much every product that's put out. At what point are there too many Andrew Luck autos out there?

Guys like Luck and Trout who started their careers during the era of the ultra-high end product will be signing everything for the next 15 years. What will they be worth then?

Your second point is true. But why undersell yourself right out of the gate on the top tier high-end release to date? Why not at least try to get top dollar for 3-5 days and adjust accordingly if it doesn't work out?

[Pat3ntP3nd1ng]

hmmm Buy this for 700 or take my chance on a box....I feel this could have gotten more though

I think the seller left at least $300 on the table there.

[wju2004]

hmmm Buy this for 700 or take my chance on a box....I feel this could have gotten more though

Got a feeling that it will probably be back up for sale at a higher price...if not, then must have just been a Rice collector.

[BoxBreaker72]

I think the seller left at least $300 on the table there.

If that card can't cover the cost of a box.. I don't know what will.

[tke1600]

Shocking good.

Cecil shorts 75 auto
Paul Richardson 75 auto
Jan stenaurd patch auto 149
Bettis patch auto. 499
Richard Sherman auto 199
Watkins auto 199
J Gordon auto 85
Garappllo auto 199
Logan Thomas 1/1 patch 300

Are these good prices for the buyers or sellers?

[Pat3ntP3nd1ng]

I that card can't cover the cost of a box.. I don't know what will.


Sad, but true in a way, although I think we will see several sales of $1000+ cards.

I do think some of these sales right now are undervalued. As someone said I expect this Rice to be resold in a week. I mean for christ sake, I would have bought it for $700 had I known they would have accepted the offer. I was assuming that someone would conceivably pay full price for that.

The market will be settling out for the next few weeks, additionally the value of some rookies could go up considerably through the rest of this year, depending on production, potential, and hype.

[no10pin]

Your second point is true. But why undersell yourself right out of the gate on the top tier high-end release to date? Why not at least try to get top dollar for 3-5 days and adjust accordingly if it doesn't work out?

That is true, he probably did leave plenty of money on the table considering the product just released.

[Pat3ntP3nd1ng]

Shocking good.

Cecil shorts 75 auto
Paul Richardson 75 auto
Jan stenaurd patch auto 149
Bettis patch auto. 499
Richard Sherman auto 199
Watkins auto 199
J Gordon auto 85
Garappllo auto 199
Logan Thomas 1/1 patch 300


Those are all the list prices, doesn't mean they sold for that amount.

[blevins26]

Haters can hate but, for me, the build up to & release of Flawless has me more engaged in collecting than I've been in over a year.

If you are someone who wants to buy, you should be happy because it's almost impossible to get ON CARD autos for some of these guys.

If you are a seller, no matter what you are selling this will help you do it. There will be more eyeballs on Ebay & more chances for you to sell.

Can't see why anyone would be negative about this :confused:

[kguye]

hmmm Buy this for 700 or take my chance on a box....I feel this could have gotten more though

I think the seller left at least $300 on the table there.

Got a feeling that it will probably be back up for sale at a higher price...if not, then must have just been a Rice collector.

I would be the one who put in the 699.99 offer

Trust me, Its staying tucked away for a long long time

[kguye]

And I put in an offer for the Emerald Rice /5 auto. Still havent heard back yet

[Pat3ntP3nd1ng]

I would be the one who put in the 699.99 offer

Trust me, Its staying tucked away for a long long time


Great buy I must say. Nothing like getting a card for a solid price and knowing it won't depreciate in value. Especially if you collect him.

[Viking6]

I would be the one who put in the 699.99 offer

Trust me, Its staying tucked away for a long long time

Congrats on the purchase sir. Great card at a great price.

[studioU]

I would be the one who put in the 699.99 offer

Trust me, Its staying tucked away for a long long time

Wow, great deal you got there. I'm surprised the seller didn't counteroffer you. If there was a Warren Moon or Earl Campbell like that I would pay that and maybe more.

[adamsbetter]

I would be the one who put in the 699.99 offer

Trust me, Its staying tucked away for a long long time

you stole that one sir, congrats.

[kguye]

Wow, great deal you got there. I'm surprised the seller didn't counteroffer you. If there was a Warren Moon or Earl Campbell like that I would pay that and maybe more.

Im a Jewish....so the first thing to do is start low :devil:

[nibrugnerotto]

Im a Jewish....so the first thing to do is start low :devil:

Can't argue with that....:)!

[matt roberson]

I would be the one who put in the 699.99 offer

Trust me, Its staying tucked away for a long long time

Im so jelly! I would have dropped that in a heartbeat if I was watching for this stuff to hit ebay.

Runs to ebay to search "Rice flawless"

The emerald is nice but I hate the green foil with the niners colors..... I'll let you have that one :)... want me to lowball him so he's more apt to accept your offer?

[kguye]

Im so jelly! I would have dropped that in a heartbeat if I was watching for this stuff to hit ebay.

Runs to ebay to search "Rice flawless"

The emerald is nice but I hate the green foil with the niners colors..... I'll let you have that one :)... want me to lowball him so he's more apt to accept your offer?

$50 should do the trick :)!

[d2j2834]

I like how Justin Blackmon is in this product. :rolleyes:

2014 Panini Flawless Justin Blackmon Gold Jumbo Patch Auto Autograph Ed 05 10 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-Panini-Flawless-Justin-Blackmon-Gold-Jumbo-Patch-Auto-Autograph-ed-05-10-/151460447639?pt=US_Football&hash=item2343bf0597)

[panther252]

I like how Justin Blackmon is in this product. :rolleyes:

2014 Panini Flawless Justin Blackmon Gold Jumbo Patch Auto Autograph Ed 05 10 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-Panini-Flawless-Justin-Blackmon-Gold-Jumbo-Patch-Auto-Autograph-ed-05-10-/151460447639?pt=US_Football&hash=item2343bf0597)

You gotta target that high end bust market too. Panini taking care of everyone. :D

[d2j2834]

You gotta target that high end bust market too. Panini taking care of everyone. :D

Haha, at least with Gordon he's on his way back. Blackmon just got busted again I heard so its a long shot he's reinstated.

[wingah]

Jerry Rice 1/1 Patch Auto up at $1500/BO

Jerry Rice 2014 Panini Flawless Patch Auto 1 1 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Jerry-Rice-2014-Panini-Flawless-PATCH-AUTO-1-1-/221591526741?pt=US_Football&hash=item3397e25d55)

Sold for $699

[Cubfan86]

Sold for $699

No, it sold for $1500

[wingah]

No, it sold for $1500

No. .

[Cubfan86]

No. .

On sortsof it shows $1500

[matt roberson]

The guy that bought it is in this thread and said he paid 700......and if you go to original listing and hit print it will show you the 699 sale price.

[anusinha]

On sortsof it shows $1500

click see original losting, then print. 699 doesnt seem terrible for a unique patch like that.

[matt roberson]

$50 should do the trick :)!

For a fellow jerry collector.....done :D

[eaglescubs555]

Sad when people accept offers just to get their money and have people think that would be the true value of the card ($699 for the Jerry Rice? "SMH").

[panther252]

Haha it's cute he doesn't know the trick. An even easier trick is clicking the link from your phone via your Web browser mobile page. It'll show up with the actual sold price.

[matt roberson]

Haha it's cute he doesn't know the trick. An even easier trick is clicking the link from your phone via your Web browser mobile page. It'll show up with the actual sold price.

Interesting, I'll have to try that out.

[wingah]

Haha it's cute he doesn't know the trick. An even easier trick is clicking the link from your phone via your Web browser mobile page. It'll show up with the actual sold price.

Thats what I did.

[matt060488]

Couldn't pass it up
2014 Panini Flawless Brandin Cooks Gold RC Patch Auto Autograph Ed 03 10 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-Panini-Flawless-Brandin-Cooks-Gold-RC-Patch-Auto-Autograph-ed-03-10-/121474846636?pt=US_Football&hash=item1c48770fac)

[jbrandonw]

I bought the cardinals for 40 bucks for a break this evening. Was Hoping for a larry Fitzgerald or logan thomas diamond base. There's already a fitz on eBay for 199 Obo. How do you guys see the star base cards selling?

[kguye]

I bought the cardinals for 40 bucks for a break this evening. Was Hoping for a larry Fitzgerald or logan thomas diamond base. There's already a fitz on eBay for 199 Obo. How do you guys see the star base cards selling?


About $50 for mid end. $200 for high end (Manning, Rodgers, Brady, etc) Just my guess

[kguye]

For a fellow jerry collector.....done :D

He countered me with $425.

$325 is the absolute highest I am going. I love my boy Jerry Rice...but I dont wanna over pay is all

[kguye]

You gotta target that high end bust market too. Panini taking care of everyone. :D

Any Ryan Leaf, Kijana Carter or Jamarcus Russell autos in Flawless???

[ejs23]

Luck #/10 auto just went BIN for 300.00 are you kidding... its that stuff that is ruining value on these cards...

yep. now the next guy will list his at $275 or maybe a $0.99 auction because no one will pay over $300... the market has been set.


Jerry Rice 1/1 Patch Auto up at $1500/BO

Jerry Rice 2014 Panini Flawless Patch Auto 1 1 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Jerry-Rice-2014-Panini-Flawless-PATCH-AUTO-1-1-/221591526741?pt=US_Football&hash=item3397e25d55)

$1,400 per box and a 1/1 Jerry Rice Patch Auto only gets you half your money back? wow... that's bad.

i'm looking forward to picking up a few cheap singles. and i'm thankful for those willing to take the loss, to satisfy that gambling rush they have, in order to provide those singles.

[freethrowtommy]

Any Ryan Leaf, Kijana Carter or Jamarcus Russell autos in Flawless???

He said high end bust... not all time great bust. :)!

They would need to charge double to get these guys in there.

[Frankp2311]

$1,400 per box and a 1/1 Jerry Rice Patch Auto only gets you half your money back? wow... that's bad.

I would agree. I don't think there are going to be many cards that have a potential for huge value, like $1200+, but with the right buyer this could have gone much higher IMO.

[estebahn73]

hmmm Buy this for 700 or take my chance on a box....I feel this could have gotten more though


I seriously would have paid more for that card. That card is BEAUTIFUL

[packman80]

Guy on Ebay asking $3K for Brett Favre's auto patch because it's 4/25. LOL good luck with that.

[trixstar]

guy on ebay asking $3k for brett favre's auto patch because it's 4/25. Lol good luck with that.

but its has stains and its ripped

[Rule]

earl thomas /10 went for 150 BIN .. i hate you big texas spenders. -.-

[ncluett]

earl thomas /10 went for 150 BIN .. i hate you big texas spenders. -.-

sweet card, but that patch window looks damaged...bummer.

[Braswell10]

What do you guys think the Keenan Allen Diamond base /20 will go for?

[packman80]

What do you guys think the Keenan Allen Diamond base /20 will go for?

.99 cents plus shipping.

[Braswell10]

.99 cents plus shipping.

It's already above that:p

[ninjacookies]

The only complaint I have is Panini not spreading the hits around. Just watched a casebreak on Mojobreaks and Emmitt Smith was the case hit on both boxes. Great for the guy who bought the Cowboys but pretty crappy for the rest of us.

Flawless has never been a team based break. You'll get murdered if you do this. ALWAYS do a spot based break when you're dealing with a handful of cards.


People are complaining, and some of it is warranted. But as far as ROI, it's probably better than 95% of products panini puts out. Compare it to chrome or contenders on an average basis and I bet more people come back with 50% of their investment than the previously mentioned. People expecting consistent %60+ returns are out of their minds. It wasn't even like that when Exquisite had their license, but as always...people tend to forget. Exquisite did have more 'high dollar' hits though...which is why I do wish they'd include logo shields for flawless, but I guess they don't want to muddy the lines between immaculate and NT.

All in all, it's a singles buyers' dream.

[gonygo]

Flawless has never been a team based break. You'll get murdered if you do this. ALWAYS do a spot based break when you're dealing with a handful of cards.


People are complaining, and some of it is warranted. But as far as ROI, it's probably better than 95% of products panini puts out. Compare it to chrome or contenders on an average basis and I bet more people come back with 50% of their investment than the previously mentioned. People expecting consistent %60+ returns are out of their minds. It wasn't even like that when Exquisite had their license, but as always...people tend to forget. Exquisite did have more 'high dollar' hits though...which is why I do wish they'd include logo shields for flawless, but I guess they don't want to muddy the lines between immaculate and NT.

All in all, it's a singles buyers' dream.

just thinking the same thing...

[ninjacookies]

Wow, whoever sold that 1/1 Rice completely sold themselves short. Should have put that sucker up 7 days no reserve and watch the 4 digit bids roll in...

[trixstar]

This was just hit in chad's room

http://i.imgur.com/udugsRh.jpg

No I don't know who hit it and no I wont track them down for you

[kguye]

Wow, whoever sold that 1/1 Rice completely sold themselves short. Should have put that sucker up 7 days no reserve and watch the 4 digit bids roll in...

I feel like a winner then.

Prob gonna send it out for grading when I get it in.

[trixstar]

and wow same box

http://i.imgur.com/ZGjq5q5.jpg

[ninjacookies]

This was just hit in chad's room

http://i.imgur.com/udugsRh.jpg

No I don't know who hit it and no I wont track them down for you

Cha-ching.

edit: 2 juan of juans in one case? Tinfoilhat.jpeg

[ejs23]

I like that Panini continued their proud tradition of Inscription cards without any inscriptions on them.

[Braswell10]

What do you guys think the Keenan Allen Diamond base /20 will go for?

Anyone^^^^^^^^^^

[trixstar]

Anyone^^^^^^^^^^

its at 51 right now with 2 days, probably around 100.00 I'd wait on the next ones to show up, first ones always sell high.

[BoxBreaker72]

Anyone^^^^^^^^^^

80-100ish IMO.

[Rule]

sweet card, but that patch window looks damaged...bummer.
i thought so too, looks like it could be a piece of the patch overlaying though..?

[Braswell10]

its at 51 right now with 2 days, probably around 100.00 I'd wait on the next ones to show up, first ones always sell high.

80-100ish IMO.

Ok, thanks.

[Carrbeaz]

Man, Chad takes forever to break now.. he used to be good about doing fast breaks. He just sits there and yaps before breaking.

[ninjacookies]

its at 51 right now with 2 days, probably around 100.00 I'd wait on the next ones to show up, first ones always sell high.

That was actually the opposite case on basketball last year, the base cards really took off days if not weeks after release as the market dried up and set collectors chased. It wasn't until after a year later where they kind of came down.


Generally, I think the 'low teir' base players will settle around 60-75 bucks, though. Just my guess.

[Whodey14]

I feel like a winner then.

Prob gonna send it out for grading when I get it in.

For 700 I would have bought it in seconds.

[solt0131]

The singles sales from this product are amazing. Completed sales are thru the roof!

[Rule]

so the 1/10 Andrew Luck goes for 300.

and a /15 just sells for 297.


....lol -.-

[trixstar]

Man, Chad takes forever to break now.. he used to be good about doing fast breaks. He just sits there and yaps before breaking.

He only does it for team breaks and he's always given time for people to make sales of teams or trade their teams. I think it's courteous and it's not like you're doing anything but sitting on your couch anyway.

[packman80]

So how much will prices fall by time Chrome comes out? Right now you will have the people who are going to overpay to buy the singles for the new product. I think by Thanksgiving you will see a lot of under $50 cards being sold on Ebay of the lesser name vets and rookies.

[kguye]

So how much will prices fall by time Chrome comes out? Right now you will have the people who are going to overpay to buy the singles for the new product. I think by Thanksgiving you will see a lot of under $50 cards being sold on Ebay of the lesser name vets and rookies.

I'm curious to know myself. I got 6 cases coming of chrome coming in

[kroy11]

so the 1/10 Andrew Luck goes for 300.

and a /15 just sells for 297.


....lol -.-

I bought the /15:) it's a pc item so idc if I overpaid I felt like it was a good deal for me!:D

[DUCKanay]

Welp, went 0 for 7 in Raider group breaks. Should've saved my money for singles. The exclusion of Raider rookies absolutely destroyed me. Never defending Panini again...

[kguye]

Welp, went 0 for 7 in Raider group breaks. Should've saved my money for singles. The exclusion of Raider rookies absolutely destroyed me. Never defending Panini again...

Sorry to hear about that man

Hell, I got a Bo Jackson 1/1 auto from Gold Standard coming in the mail tomorrow. I wouldn't mind making a good deal for you to help ease the pain. For all that, I will take the loss with you

Lmk

[hairyangryfella]

Welp, went 0 for 7 in Raider group breaks. Should've saved my money for singles. The exclusion of Raider rookies absolutely destroyed me. Never defending Panini again...

While I feel bad for you, a lot of that is your own fault too. Buying into a break before you know the checklist AND doing team breaks are two of the most risky things you can do!

[Rule]

I bought the /15:) it's a pc item so idc if I overpaid I felt like it was a good deal for me!:D
good buy regardless man! i was just commenting on the prices moreso than anything else. just funny how they're selling right now!

[lagalaxyfan23]

Am I the only one who is actually kind of surprised by some of these prices? In that I thought some of these prices would be higher than what they are. IMO, this product is FAR superior to NT and Five Star, but some of this stuff is not selling as well as I thought they would. But hey, better for us singles buyers! :D

[DUCKanay]

While I feel bad for you, a lot of that is your own fault too. Buying into a break before you know the checklist AND doing team breaks are two of the most risky things you can do!

I know, I absolutely know, and that's why it sucks. I tweeted and posted on their blogs about a dozen times pre release and asked where are the Raiders? Comments were approved but no response.

Panini promised the top 20 rookies and they sold me on at least having Carr. Unfortunately they played me like a fiddle.

[DUCKanay]

Sorry to hear about that man

Hell, I got a Bo Jackson 1/1 auto from Gold Standard coming in the mail tomorrow. I wouldn't mind making a good deal for you to help ease the pain. For all that, I will take the loss with you

Lmk

Greatly appreciate it bro, but this was my doing. At least I have Halloween off and the Giants won the WS! Luckily I don't have leases or rent. Upside!

[Jackg1980]

Greatly appreciate it bro, but this was my doing. At least I have Halloween off and the Giants won the WS! Luckily I don't have leases or rent. Upside!

Carr not being in the top is dumb. So far he is the best QB

[hairyangryfella]

Why do people keep putting "game worn" in the title when the card clearly says "event worn" on the front.... :mad:

[jubei777]

Wow, Brady patch auto went for less than $500. I for sure thought that was going to be much higher.

[matt roberson]

Sad when people accept offers just to get their money and have people think that would be the true value of the card ($699 for the Jerry Rice? "SMH").

I feel like a winner then.

Prob gonna send it out for grading when I get it in.

Yeah that was a steal, lock it away in your PC.... For realz.

[kyle1707]

Wow, Brady patch auto went for less than $500. I for sure thought that was going to be much higher.

he took 485..

People just in rush to get some money back...

probably could of got an extra 100-150 imo

[gonygo]

The peyton manning jersey #'d diamond 18/20 just sold for 900.00 best offer accepted. A base /diamond sold earlier for 4 hundred. Was 9 hundred a fair price, overpay or steal? Curious on thoughts and no I didn't buy it. Was thinking about though. lol Not sure how to value any of this stuff yet. Cool looking cards .

[kguye]

The peyton manning jersey #'d diamond 18/20 just sold for 900.00 best offer accepted. A base /diamond sold earlier for 4 hundred. Was 9 hundred a fair price, overpay or steal? Curious on thoughts and no I didn't buy it. Was thinking about though. lol not sure how to vaue any of this stuff yet. Cool looking cards .

$900 was an overpay. Price doubled because it was his jersey number

A lot of sellers think there is a price multiplier if the serial # is the jersey #. Whelp, there isnt

If someone pays 900 for a diamond card, it better be a 1/1

[trixstar]

The peyton manning jersey #'d diamond 18/20 just sold for 900.00 best offer accepted. A base /diamond sold earlier for 4 hundred. Was 9 hundred a fair price, overpay or steal? Curious on thoughts and no I didn't buy it. Was thinking about though. lol Not sure how to value any of this stuff yet. Cool looking cards .

Wayyyyyy overpay

[gonygo]

$900 was an overpay. Price doubled because it was his jersey number

A lot of sellers think there is a price multiplier if the serial # is the jersey #. Whelp, there isnt

If someone pays 900 for a diamond card, it better be a 1/1

I kind of agree. It can be a huge card, but like everything, you need the right buyer who puts a premium on that.. Also, 9 hundred is an overpay IF you think 4 hundred was fair for a non jersey #'d base/20. I remember when the flawless basketball diamonds first came out, people said they were priced to high and all they did was go up n up n up. That was why i almost bit, but football does not sell close to as feel as basketball. So i passed.

[DalliLlama11]

$900 was an overpay. Price doubled because it was his jersey number

A lot of sellers think there is a price multiplier if the serial # is the jersey #. Whelp, there isnt

If someone pays 900 for a diamond card, it better be a 1/1


yea im a huge julio guy and i wouldnt even pay that for the 1/1 diamond thats on ebay right now.

[gonygo]

Wayyyyyy overpay

I offered 5 hundred and said that was my max. Good for the seller.

[trixstar]

Why is the Brady selling for 485 a shock? His Virtuoso which sold for 500.00 or so there were only 10 of and that was a redemption people waited a year or more for. He has 3 times that many autos in this.

[gonygo]

I wonder what the Luck 12/20 diamond and the luck 1/1 diamond will get?

[BoxBreaker72]

Does anyone know what just the diamond itself in these cards would sell for?

[kguye]

I wonder what the Luck 12/20 diamond and the luck 1/1 diamond will get?

$1,000,000 and $1,000,001 Respectively

[kguye]

Does anyone know what just the diamond itself in these cards would sell for?

no more than a pack of chewing gum. no lie

[Coventry6546]

I kind of agree. It can be a huge card, but like everything, you need the right buyer who puts a premium on that.. Also, 9 hundred is an overpay IF you think 4 hundred was fair for a non jersey #'d base/20. I remember when the flawless basketball diamonds first came out, people said they were priced to high and all they did was go up n up n up. That was why i almost bit, but football does not sell close to as feel as basketball. So i passed.

It all depends on how many set chasers there are out there. Think if e***e wants to get a base set #/20, we all know he has deep pockets. That only leaves 19 other true base sets available.

I think we all see that $1,300+ a box is absolutely ridiculous when a Wes Welker is an encapsulated card, however this should drive the price of the true base cards and even the parallels (possibly more so even though we are talking #/5 vs. #/20) up even more. Remember, its one "gem" card per box, so they are not going to be easy to come by.

[wagoss122]

Why is the Brady selling for 485 a shock? His Virtuoso which sold for 500.00 or so there were only 10 of and that was a redemption people waited a year or more for. He has 3 times that many autos in this.

Does the Virtuoso have a large game used 4 color patch?

[ejs23]

Am I the only one who is actually kind of surprised by some of these prices? In that I thought some of these prices would be higher than what they are. IMO, this product is FAR superior to NT and Five Star, but some of this stuff is not selling as well as I thought they would. But hey, better for us singles buyers! :D

I doubt you're the only one, but anyone who is surprised hasn't been paying attention. when does a product ever live up to the hype? weak sellers will destroy value on anything within a day or two.


Why do people keep putting "game worn" in the title when the card clearly says "event worn" on the front.... :mad:

same reason they put "ebay 1/1" or "non-auto" or "Luck" (when it's a Dwayne Allen card) in the title... cause they're frauds.


A lot of sellers think there is a price multiplier if the serial # is the jersey #. Whelp, there isnt

the fact that someone just paid $900 for the jersey number kind of disproves your theory.

[cniel2924]

I am really sad that I didn't get that Brady patch auto or get a chance to make him an offer.

I made an offer of 700 on a similar one to 15 earlier.

So yeah the guy who sold that left money on the table for sure.

[cniel2924]

Although I think 485 for the Brady is a more realistic price.

Those patch autos are not outrageous looking or unbelievable cards.

[kguye]

the fact that someone just paid $900 for the jersey number kind of disproves your theory.

I said sellers, not buyers

I cant control how much buyers spend. This buyer wanted to make sure he got this card. Disproves nothing

[trixstar]

Does the Virtuoso have a large game used 4 color patch?

No but there's not fifty Virtuoso autos

[wagoss122]

No but there's not fifty Virtuoso autos

It's not all about the short print...that Virtuoso is plain/boring as hell and goes for $400+. On card Brady auto with a game used 4 color patch? Yes please.

Edit: Virtuoso is /25 and last sold for $613

[armyatc22]

Why is the Brady selling for 485 a shock? His Virtuoso which sold for 500.00 or so there were only 10 of and that was a redemption people waited a year or more for. He has 3 times that many autos in this.

Because it's an on card patch auto

When was the last time he had one of those? If ever....I don't know

[solt0131]

The Manning Diamond #18/20 sold for $1200, correct?

[kguye]

The Manning Diamond #18/20 sold for $1200, correct?

$900ish area

[FINS4LIFE]

Been looking at breaks and Ebay so far. And the one thing I have noticed in Flawless. Not one "NFL" Shield. You figure with all the ones they put in almost every product they release. They would do it in this. Go figure?

[arott23]

The Manning diamond 16/20 sold or 999.95 as well. I don't think we've seen much to determine the actual market. People are selling way to cheap on some and buying way to high on others. The joys of a new product.

[arott23]

Been looking at breaks and Ebay so far. And the one thing I have noticed in Flawless. Not one "NFL" Shield. You figure with all the ones they put in almost every product they release. They would do it in this. Go figure?

I don't think they were supposed to be on here....probably saving them for NT

[Carrbeaz]

weak sellers will destroy value on anything within a day or two.






+ Infinity

The most succinct statement that describes the current state of the hobby.

[freethrowtommy]

Am I the only one who is actually kind of surprised by some of these prices? In that I thought some of these prices would be higher than what they are. IMO, this product is FAR superior to NT and Five Star, but some of this stuff is not selling as well as I thought they would. But hey, better for us singles buyers! :D

I don't really think it is.

I mean, the only thing it has going for it is some larger game used patches.

Five Star has on-card for everything and veteran game used patches (just smaller windows). Five Star is a beautiful product in its own right.

I really think that Panini overshot it here. I don't feel like there is anything in this product that deserves a nearly $900 box price premium over Five Star or NT.

Don't get me wrong, it is a beautiful product, but the price premium is WAY too much for what it is. Most people aren't going to pay extra for an on-card auto (no patches) of a player they can get in, say, Topps Museum.

The only thing they are going above and beyond with is the vet GU patches. That isn't going to justify this price.

[Lionsman81]

A $1500 box has a Tim Wright on card auto? LOL a nice $15 card out of a box that expensive no reason why he should be included.

[armyatc22]

Am I the only one who is actually kind of surprised by some of these prices? In that I thought some of these prices would be higher than what they are. IMO, this product is FAR superior to NT and Five Star, but some of this stuff is not selling as well as I thought they would. But hey, better for us singles buyers! :D

Please explain why?

Because all autos are on card? Five Star is the same and will have majority of the same players in it too for a fraction of the price

Because they habe Cool looking base cards? This is probably the best part of the whole product. The base set is huge and only 2 base cards per case on top of only being out of /20 already the supply and demand for those set collectors will drive these prices higher and higher

The rookies all still have event worn stuff so what's the difference between the RPA for this, Five Star, and NT?

The only thing that is technically "new" is this is the first ever Brady on card patch auto unless I'm mistaken all his others are sticker autos

[adamsbetter]

Please explain why?

Because all autos are on card? Five Star is the same and will have majority of the same players in it too for a fraction of the price

Because they habe Cool looking base cards? This is probably the best part of the whole product. The base set is huge and only 2 base cards per case on top of only being out of /20 already the supply and demand for those set collectors will drive these prices higher and higher

The rookies all still have event worn stuff so what's the difference between the RPA for this, Five Star, and NT?

The only thing that is technically "new" is this is the first ever Brady on card patch auto unless I'm mistaken all his others are sticker autos

To be fair Five Star only has 4 autos, 1 relic and 3 base cards per box. NT only has 3 autos, 3 relics, and 2 base cards.

Flawless has 7 autos, 2 jumbo relics, and one Jewel base card. They are lower numbered, and 3 of them are encased. The checklist is also better overall and they look better.

[gorillaz]

This is sad of panini to put in something like this in: 2014 Panini Flawless Cecil Shorts III Auto Gold 1 10 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-Panini-Flawless-Cecil-Shorts-III-Auto-Gold-1-10-/301375816971?pt=US_Football&hash=item462b66050b)

[gorillaz]

To be fair Five Star only has 4 autos, 1 relic and 3 base cards per box. NT only has 3 autos, 3 relics, and 2 base cards.

Flawless has 7 autos, 2 jumbo relics, and one Jewel base card. They are lower numbered, and 3 of them are encased. The checklist is also better overall and they look better.

Also it's almost the price of 3 boxes of flawless...

[trixstar]

To be fair Five Star only has 4 autos, 1 relic and 3 base cards per box. NT only has 3 autos, 3 relics, and 2 base cards.



Flawless has 7 autos, 2 jumbo relics, and one Jewel base card. They are lower numbered, and 3 of them are encased. The checklist is also better overall and they look better.


I agree with all that for the most part one thing is that NT and five-star are the traditional high end products. Panini is putting the most expensive product we've ever seen out and they're still putting crap players in it. I think the bigger issue is that they are trying to add another high-end product but they're using a not spectacular check list. It's also like they don't really know their football fan base. This isn't basketball football cards don't sell for this much to even make up the price of the case unless you hit something super rare

[freethrowtommy]

To be fair Five Star only has 4 autos, 1 relic and 3 base cards per box. NT only has 3 autos, 3 relics, and 2 base cards.

Flawless has 7 autos, 2 jumbo relics, and one Jewel base card. They are lower numbered, and 3 of them are encased. The checklist is also better overall and they look better.

If you doubled the product in Five Star and NT and charged twice as much, it still doesn't touch the price of Flawless.

[trixstar]

So many overpriced BIN's on Ebay lol. Bout 800 items will end in the next 2-6 days unsold

[packman80]

So many overpriced BIN's on Ebay lol. Bout 800 items will end in the next 2-6 days unsold

As I said before. Give it 3 weeks. When chrome is ready to come out and everyone is ready to hope on that wagon you will see Flawless prices come way down as people will want to sell before chrome is out and people start buying that.

[drumstyx89]

So many overpriced BIN's on Ebay lol. Bout 800 items will end in the next 2-6 days unsold

Amen to this :)!

[mutigers77]

So many overpriced BIN's on Ebay lol. Bout 800 items will end in the next 2-6 days unsold

I'd MUCH rather see this than 800 1cent auctions sitting out there.

[wingah]

I'd MUCH rather see this than 800 1cent auctions sitting out there.

Spoken like a true flipper.

[wheeler281]

Spoken like a true flipper.

hahahahahahha

[suggs4mvp55]

paid $37 for a Suggs patch #'d/15....pretty fair IMO. BIN for a similar one #'d/15 is $149. I wouldn't even pay half that for the card.

[ninjacookies]

Johnny Manziel 2014 Panini Flawless Auto Game Worn Jersey 1 1 Browns Rookie | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/JOHNNY-MANZIEL-2014-PANINI-FLAWLESS-AUTO-GAME-WORN-JERSEY-1-1-BROWNS-ROOKIE-/121476364611?pt=US_Football&hash=item1c488e3943)

So who's gonna be the one to commit financial suicide?

[panther252]

Johnny Manziel 2014 Panini Flawless Auto Game Worn Jersey 1 1 Browns Rookie | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/JOHNNY-MANZIEL-2014-PANINI-FLAWLESS-AUTO-GAME-WORN-JERSEY-1-1-BROWNS-ROOKIE-/121476364611?pt=US_Football&hash=item1c488e3943)

So who's gonna be the one to commit financial suicide?

e***e (private): *rolls up sleeves* "I got dis :cool:"

[ninjacookies]

e***e (private): *rolls up sleeves* "I got dis :cool:"

lol, if my memory serves me correctly that guy also hoards high end basketball stuff. Deep pockets tho'

[Tones]

lol, if my memory serves me correctly that guy also hoards high end basketball stuff. Deep pockets tho'
he won quiet a lot of chrome superfractors in football last year

[ninjacookies]

he won quiet a lot of chrome superfractors in football last year

Yep, that's the guy. Apparently he goes gaga for certain numbers as well, like the first in the print run.

[lionsfan20]

This one made me LMAO!! This is probably a $100 card to me on a great day. The one listed yesterday for $499 OBO has not even sold LOL.

2014 Panini Flawless Diamond Barry Sanders 11 20 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-Panini-Flawless-Diamond-BARRY-SANDERS-11-20-/261647432188?pt=US_Football&hash=item3ceb66f9fc)

[kguye]

This one made me LMAO!! This is probably a $100 card to me on a great day. The one listed yesterday for $499 OBO has not even sold LOL.

2014 Panini Flawless Diamond Barry Sanders 11 20 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-Panini-Flawless-Diamond-BARRY-SANDERS-11-20-/261647432188?pt=US_Football&hash=item3ceb66f9fc)

Its cuz he used the 10000x multiplier since the print run is his jersey #. ddduuhhhh :)!

[panther252]

Its cuz he used the 10000x multiplier since the print run is his jersey #. ddduuhhhh :)!

Lol "diamond encrypted". Imagine if it was numbered 20/20!?!?!?! :eek:

[packman80]

Johnny Manziel 2014 Panini Flawless Auto Game Worn Jersey 1 1 Browns Rookie | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/JOHNNY-MANZIEL-2014-PANINI-FLAWLESS-AUTO-GAME-WORN-JERSEY-1-1-BROWNS-ROOKIE-/121476364611?pt=US_Football&hash=item1c488e3943)

So who's gonna be the one to commit financial suicide?

Don't think someone will but it for 6 but see it later relisted it with a BO and it going for $3-4K.

[trixstar]

Johnny Manziel 2014 Panini Flawless Auto Game Worn Jersey 1 1 Browns Rookie | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/JOHNNY-MANZIEL-2014-PANINI-FLAWLESS-AUTO-GAME-WORN-JERSEY-1-1-BROWNS-ROOKIE-/121476364611?pt=US_Football&hash=item1c488e3943)

So who's gonna be the one to commit financial suicide?

We should all message him asking him why the card says event worn and his listing is screaming game worn.

[k13]

Luck #/10 auto just went BIN for 300.00 are you kidding... its that stuff that is ruining value on these cards...

Just another Luck auto...should really be $30...

Eventually all autos will be $20 except for short lived deceased .

[k13]

As I said before. Give it 3 weeks. When chrome is ready to come out and everyone is ready to hope on that wagon you will see Flawless prices come way down as people will want to sell before chrome is out and people start buying that.

You can't really compare low end to high end...
This is more about veterans. .

Chrome is just rookie parallels.
Rest is toilet paper.

[k13]

Immaculate will be better for the price...plus shields I'm sure

[armyatc22]

Immaculate will be better for the price...plus shields I'm sure

Please show me where they said Immaculate is going to be made this year

[valleyofsun]

Just another Luck auto...should really be $30...

Eventually all autos will be $20 except for short lived deceased .

And Mr. Positivity strikes again! :rolleyes:

[Coventry6546]

And Mr. Positivity strikes again! :rolleyes:

I actually enjoy his posts...whatever he says, I know the opposite to be true

[ChasescardCave]

Please show me where they said Immaculate is going to be made this year
It's going to release early next year. In the emmitt smith thread for flawless, there was a pic of him signing immaculate cards.

[Tones]

Please show me where they said Immaculate is going to be made this year
They announced it at the Vegas summit I believe, same time they announced Flawless coming to football. You know Panini is going to make it this year with this rookie class, can't wait :)!

[Carrbeaz]

2014 Panini Flawless Football Auto Johnny Manziel 19 25 Uncirc 1 Day Auction | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-PANINI-FLAWLESS-football-AUTO-JOHNNY-MANZIEL-19-25-UNCIRC-1-day-auction-/371178760182?pt=US_Football&hash=item566bfa67f6)

There is your representation of a 99 cent 1 day auction.

Here is a Bowman Chrome on card auto to /25 to compare.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/JOHNNY-MANZIEL-2014-Bowman-Chrome-RED-Auto-Rookie-12-25-9-5-10-Gem-mint-Rare-/271633405668?pt=US_Football&hash=item3f3e9cd6e4

[HBMC]

2014 Panini Flawless Football Auto Johnny Manziel 19 25 Uncirc 1 Day Auction | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-PANINI-FLAWLESS-football-AUTO-JOHNNY-MANZIEL-19-25-UNCIRC-1-day-auction-/371178760182?pt=US_Football&hash=item566bfa67f6)

There is your representation of a 99 cent 1 day auction.

Fools, complete fools.

[rcearley]

Please show me where they said Immaculate is going to be made this year

Pretty sure that's an immaculate card he is signing.

http://paniniamerica.wordpress.com/2014/10/27/catch-22-legendary-emmitt-smith-spends-a-few-flawless-moments-with-panini-america/#jp-carousel-92381

[NickM]

While I feel bad for you, a lot of that is your own fault too. Buying into a break before you know the checklist AND doing team breaks are two of the most risky things you can do!

Panini put Tom Savage and A.J. McCarron, but not Derek Carr, into the subsets of 20 rookies.

I blame them, not Raider collectors.

[hatcher]

That e. smith card was actually a redemption issued in immaculate basketball. I remember Griffey, Bo Jackson, Ripken, some Hockey guy, plus others.

[lionsfan20]

Man this stuff seems to be picking up steam instead of dying down. I have watched the Barry Sanders base cards sell for $285 and then 2 days later $749. The greats patch autos have gone from $367 to $399 and now the only one listed is $599 obo and will likely sell for more than $399. I think buyers are really liking this stuff and realizing how rare some of these cards actually are and are scrambling a bit and making some rash decisions. If this keeps up the values on this stuff could end up justifying the selling price. Anybody else seeing this with other players? I have not watched much but Barry so far.

[HBMC]

Panini put Tom Savage and A.J. McCarron, but not Derek Carr, into the subsets of 20 rookies.

I blame them, not Raider collectors.

Derek Carr isn't a Top 20 rookie from their perspective (which exclusively includes guys who went to the Photoshoot).

Derek Carr not being in Flawless is bad luck and not intentional.

[panther252]

Man this stuff seems to be picking up steam instead of dying down. I have watched the Barry Sanders base cards sell for $285 and then 2 days later $749. The greats patch autos have gone from $367 to $399 and now the only one listed is $599 obo and will likely sell for more than $399. I think buyers are really liking this stuff and realizing how rare some of these cards actually are and are scrambling a bit and making some rash decisions. If this keeps up the values on this stuff could end up justifying the selling price. Anybody else seeing this with other players? I have not watched much but Barry so far.

Not sure about Barry, but I've actually noticed the opposite for other players. It seems like once the heavy hitter bidders get their hands on the initial ones, the flood of the others causes the prices to come down quite a bit. Maybe it's just the HoFers that are retaining the value?

[NickM]

Derek Carr isn't a Top 20 rookie from their perspective (which exclusively includes guys who went to the Photoshoot).

Derek Carr not being in Flawless is bad luck and not intentional.

Carr was scheduled to be at the rookie premiere, but cancelled a couple days before due to a death in the family. If the cards were being signed at the RP, they would have already been produced when he cancelled. If the cards were being signed later, no reason to drop him from the auto checklist (obviously the patch cards are out) if you considered him a top 20 rookie.

[NickM]

Flawless has broken through the $10 delivered floor (auto /25 that went off on ebay last night). The player didn't deserve to be in the set and has been cut (picked up by another team), but this is quite early in the sale cycle for that to happen.

[mutigers77]

Flawless has broken through the $10 delivered floor (auto /25 that went off on ebay last night). The player didn't deserve to be in the set and has been cut (picked up by another team), but this is quite early in the sale cycle for that to happen.

Nah, nothing new here. Flawless wasn't released for those crappy players to retain value.

[studioU]

2014 Panini Flawless Football Auto Johnny Manziel 19 25 Uncirc 1 Day Auction | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-PANINI-FLAWLESS-football-AUTO-JOHNNY-MANZIEL-19-25-UNCIRC-1-day-auction-/371178760182?pt=US_Football&hash=item566bfa67f6)

There is your representation of a 99 cent 1 day auction.

Here is a Bowman Chrome on card auto to /25 to compare.

Johnny Manziel 2014 Bowman Chrome Red Auto Rookie 12 25 9 5 10 Gem Mint RARE | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/JOHNNY-MANZIEL-2014-Bowman-Chrome-RED-Auto-Rookie-12-25-9-5-10-Gem-mint-Rare-/271633405668?pt=US_Football&hash=item3f3e9cd6e4)

I'm on my phone, when did the Bowman sell and was it a 1-day auction? I know the Bowman is graded but the price difference is really surprising. I ask about the ending date because the Manziel hype has cooled quit a bit.

[zonacats8]

I'm on my phone, when did the Bowman sell and was it a 1-day auction? I know the Bowman is graded but the price difference is really surprising. I ask about the ending date because the Manziel hype has cooled quit a bit.

Only about 2 weeks ago, and it was a 10 day auction

[studioU]

Only about 2 weeks ago, and it was a 10 day auction

Hmmmmm? I don't get it then. Why would a no-logo, Photoshopped card from a low-end set outsell a high-end card in team uniform? I could somewhat understand if the Bowman sold soon after release when the Manziel hype was peaking.

[freethrowtommy]

Hmmmmm? I don't get it then. Why would a no-logo, Photoshopped card from a low-end set outsell a high-end card in team uniform? I could somewhat understand if the Bowman sold soon after release when the Manziel hype was peaking.

Three words... Chrome is king.

[studioU]

Three words... Chrome is king.

If it was a TC red auto I could see that.

[lisu]

That e. smith card was actually a redemption issued in immaculate basketball. I remember Griffey, Bo Jackson, Ripken, some Hockey guy, plus others.

yup, I got my redemption of Emmitt Smith back from Panini. I have heard from a distributor that Immaculate will be made though in Q1 of 2015.

[Morgoth]

Ok, been a few more weeks. I have been picking up singles here and there. It looks like the green /5 parallel is gaining some steam in all the various sets but sales are still pretty reasonable.

I have noticed crazy shilling going on.

Overall without monster logo or shield hits for most players it gets boring looking at two color patches or one color that is on eBay. Panini really should have added more content

[freethrowtommy]

I have got to be honest... the prices that I am buying singles I want must mean that resellers, for the most part, are taking a bath on a lot of these boxes.

I guess if you hit a Luck, Manning, or Brady, you are probably okay, but these prices are MUCH lower than I expected.

[Mikegioseffi]

already my favorite football product of all time.
i dont bust wax, only buy singles but i love these cards.
best thing IMO is the number of high end veteran hits.
i hate when products are almost exclusively rookie based and then the class is a bust.

LOVE THIS STUFF, even if i have been overpaying for every card so far

[wju2004]

I am loving Flawless...to a degree. Love all the HOF autographs (of course) and all the nice patches. I have a very nice one coming in tomorrow. (Probably overpaid a bit compared to what they will go for down the road, but less than what the last 2 went for with lesser patches.)

All that being said...there is one thing that is driving me up a wall with Flawless...The streaky/spotty autos. Streaking happens...I can understand that. Usually has to do with the pen or just how the person signs. The spotting, though, that falls 100% on Panini. They'd had this problem before and yet still aren't able to figure out a way to prevent it?

Thankfully most of the ones I've bought aren't spotty (mostly because I've passed on some nasty looking cards because of the auto.) I did finally get hit with one though. Didn't see it until I had it in hand...and of course could see it in the picture after I had it, but didn't notice in the picture. It's not horrible, but I know it's there. I think with how much this came out at, this should have been a non-issue, but yet here we are, having to sort through the bad autos with nasty patches.

I'm sure it doesn't bug some people as much as it does me, but when I'm buying for the HOF PC, I want to try and have as clean of an auto as I can.

This is just my thoughts...I will continue to buy as I still need quite a few upgrades and would love to move even at a parallel level on patches to have on card, but certainly not while sacrificing the autograph quality. Just having to be careful with what I buy.

[sjim8660]

The Flawless Football market is interesting. I have only been getting Staubachs but I have been keeping my eye on some other guys. Emmitt Smith is doing well, I just wish Aikman would of had an auto in this set. I picked up Staubachs 1/1 auto for $350 and the next day one of his /15 autos sells for $330. I am keeping in mind that the 1/1 i got ended at 2AM in the morning so i might of literally caught everyone sleeping. Anyways I have a feeling these cards will hold their value for the most part and in some cases the really SP patch autos will climb in value, Deion Sanders and Fred Biletnikoff are both SSP for patch autos. Only 1 Biletnikoff has popped up.

[Morgoth]

Odell Beckham Jrs autos are very streaky for sure. I hate that a lot of steeler patches are white or white with a little black.

[lisu]

I am loving Flawless...to a degree. Love all the HOF autographs (of course) and all the nice patches. I have a very nice one coming in tomorrow. (Probably overpaid a bit compared to what they will go for down the road, but less than what the last 2 went for with lesser patches.)

All that being said...there is one thing that is driving me up a wall with Flawless...The streaky/spotty autos. Streaking happens...I can understand that. Usually has to do with the pen or just how the person signs. The spotting, though, that falls 100% on Panini. They'd had this problem before and yet still aren't able to figure out a way to prevent it?

Thankfully most of the ones I've bought aren't spotty (mostly because I've passed on some nasty looking cards because of the auto.) I did finally get hit with one though. Didn't see it until I had it in hand...and of course could see it in the picture after I had it, but didn't notice in the picture. It's not horrible, but I know it's there. I think with how much this came out at, this should have been a non-issue, but yet here we are, having to sort through the bad autos with nasty patches.

I'm sure it doesn't bug some people as much as it does me, but when I'm buying for the HOF PC, I want to try and have as clean of an auto as I can.

This is just my thoughts...I will continue to buy as I still need quite a few upgrades and would love to move even at a parallel level on patches to have on card, but certainly not while sacrificing the autograph quality. Just having to be careful with what I buy.

I hate it too. I think it's also the player's fault when some of the autographs are streaky or smeared - if you notice, most of the HOF players (no streaks in Bettis, Favre, Manning, Brady, Rice or Montana that I've seen) are very well versed in how to take care of the cards after signing them, but it seems like the younger players and rookies don't know how to handle the cards - i.e. Russell Wilson, Beckham, DeSean Jackson come to mind).

[hairyangryfella]

I would like to get a Luck patch.
They have sold for:
$85
$61
$62
$96 (Probstein).

Blackrose listed one for $1000... now $650.

I bought several Durants in basketball, and they peaked in the high $200s, since then you can get them for $120-150 if they show up. I expect similar with these, but they're starting lower so won't fall as much.