Marvel Fleer Retro 2015 Gold PMG 1/1 Census of Cards That Have Been Pulled

[finfangfan]

Similar to http://www.blowoutcards.com/forums/non-sports/843418-marvel-premier-2014-red-spectrum-1-1-census-cards-have-been-pulled.html I thought it would be good to track the Gold 1/1 PMG's that are pulled from the Marvel Fleer Retro 2015 set.

Please post any/all Gold PMG sightings in the thread below and I will update the census. Feel free to post pics too!

BOLD = Pulled

1 Ant-Man
2 Black Panther
3 Apocalypse
4 Black Widow eBay
5 Captain America
6 Bullseye ebay
7 Captain Marvel
8 Cyclops breakers
9 Dark Phoenix eBay
10 Daredevil
11 Deadpool
12 Doctor Octopus eBay
13 Doctor Strange
14 Elektra eBay
15 Green Goblin
16 Falcon Blowout box break thread
17 Gambit
18 Juggernaut
19 Ghost Rider eBay
20 Hulk
21 Loki breakers
22 Iceman
23 Iron Man eBay
24 Magneto pulled by Blowout member Sharard
25 Luke Cage
26 Namor
27 Mystique
28 Nova eBay
29 Punisher eBay
30 Red Skull
31 Scarlet Witch
32 She-Hulk
33 Sabretooth pulled at card shop
34 Spider-Man ebay
35 Star-Lord
36 Thanos
37 Storm
38 Thor
39 Ultron
40 Vision
41 Wolverine
42 Venom eBay

Number Reported as Pulled 16/42... 38%

[finfangfan]

Doc Ock Gold PMG is up on eBay

[Carrbeaz]

Doc Ock Gold PMG is up on eBay

dont see it, unless they have poor listing language.

[Cujobyte]

It's possible it's been sold already? Ebay has that 1-2 hours inbetween showing in "for sale" vs "sold" at least I think it's 1-2 hrs, it was much worse for awhile there being 12 hrs but they've since fixed that a bit.

[Sharard]

It's there. Asking seven bills for it. Can't say if it's a good price but depends on the card. Doc is known but not high on my must have list. But was a sweet pull regardless

[daviswr7]

not my auction..cool looking card though,

http://www.ebay.com/itm/2015-FLEER-RETRO-MARVEL-SUPER-RARE-GOLD-DOCTOR-OCTOPUS-PRECIOUS-METAL-GEMS-1-1-/111713760433?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1a02a8b4b1

[finfangfan]

I think for the lesser characters the green price will equal the gold price. My rationale is multiple collectors are chasing green sets, but no one will get a set of golds. So golds will be priced by the people collecting character rainbows... With the big guns nabbing the highest prices.

Many 1/1 Marvel Premier red spectrum cards (granted not as nice as PMG) of lesser characters are struggling to sell for $200.

Doc Ock at $700 is nuts... Probably a $250 card.

[jdhaugh11]

For a starting point, I think the seller should aim high, especially when they may have no idea what it could sell for. I personally would of had a Best Offer to get a better gauge, but maybe he is getting messages with offers offline.

[edhou1]

For a starting point, I think the seller should aim high, especially when they may have no idea what it could sell for. I personally would of had a Best Offer to get a better gauge, but maybe he is getting messages with offers offline.

This. If I was the seller , I would think the market is somewhere in the $250-400 range but all it takes is one person who needs it.
And that one person who needs it, probably would inquire offline about it.

[BHotz]

Think it's going to be a Gold rush. "Color" is one of the few inserts (mostly Bowman) still doing well in the printed-to-death sports card hobby. Greens were all the rage last time and Gold will be all the rage this time. It's going to and probably is driving the sealed sales significantly until they've all been found which is what happens in the sports products every year. I'm curious just how well Greens do this round though I think the "Gold rush" will help all the PMGs to an extent.

[Spider-Fan]

If the Buscema sketches are decent, I'd expect them to outsell most of the golds.

I think Doc Ock is an epic baddie if you are a Spider-Man collector. Being the first one up, I would have tried to set the market high also.

[Carrbeaz]

I think for the lesser characters the green price will equal the gold price. My rationale is multiple collectors are chasing green sets, but no one will get a set of golds. So golds will be priced by the people collecting character rainbows... With the big guns nabbing the highest prices.

Many 1/1 Marvel Premier red spectrum cards (granted not as nice as PMG) of lesser characters are struggling to sell for $200.

Doc Ock at $700 is nuts... Probably a $250 card.

That card will sell at the $700 price.

[AmzingSpiderFan]

I agree with finfangfan's take. I just don't think the gold's will command an incredibly high price. They are cool and some of the really awesome characters might get a huge fan to go for the full rainbow but Doc Ock won't go for $700. There are definitely bigger Doc Ock fans than me, but I'm up there and I am not going near it for that price...

It's not original art. It's not even unique art different than the Green, Blue, Red. It's nice to have to say you own it but not for $700. $250 - sure for someone but again, it's just a reprint in a different color. 1/1 isn't that exciting when it's just a colored reprint.

Anyway... a tribute to the Doc since we're all talking about him briefly :)

https://scontent-lga1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xtp1/t31.0-8/11703321_479306498904550_3885529271372780778_o.jpg

[finfangfan]

Nice Doc Ock collection! I had you in mind as a potential buyer of the Gold PMG Doc Ock, but didn't think you'd bite anywhere near $700. I don't think a buyer of that card at that price exists in this world.

I picked up the below 1/1 Skottie Young Doc Ock for a fraction of the current gold PMG price. My guess is my card will hold it's value much longer than the doc Ock gold. I still think the gold goes for $250ish.

http://www.sketchcollectors.com/gallery/finfangfan/1376093733.jpg

[AmzingSpiderFan]

Love that Skottie Young. Think I first saw you post in UNO. Awesome.

[deksterous2012]

...and there you have it.

If "AmzingSpiderFan", who also has 1 million awesome doc ock sketches says its in the 250 range then that's what is probably is.

Don't agree with aiming high on lesser cards that are obviously not going to pull $700 (!!) even if you are the first, second or last. All you're doing is rising the bar so everybody else thinks its okay to list their gold pmgs in that range or even higher, and therefore screwing all the character collectors trying to put the rainbow together out of getting their favorite characters 1/1 card for a reasonable price.

Also, don't understand listing the red, blue and green pmgs for ridiculous amounts either. I think, and hope, most collectors take a wait and see approach and realize that the current 2013 marvel fleer retro pmgs (red, blue, and green) will ultimately be the price for the 2015 ones....if not less...since they're not as good as those.

[DannyHultzenFan]

...and there you have it.

If "AmzingSpiderFan", who also has 1 million awesome doc ock sketches says its in the 250 range then that's what is probably is.

Don't agree with aiming high on lesser cards that are obviously not going to pull $700 (!!) even if you are the first, second or last. All you're doing is rising the bar so everybody else thinks its okay to list their gold pmgs in that range or even higher, and therefore screwing all the character collectors trying to put the rainbow together out of getting their favorite characters 1/1 card for a reasonable price.

Also, don't understand listing the red, blue and green pmgs for ridiculous amounts either. I think, and hope, most collectors take a wait and see approach and realize that the current 2013 marvel fleer retro pmgs (red, blue, and green) will ultimately be the price for the 2015 ones....if not less...since they're not as good as those.
Gotta remember..the sports guys open stuff cause it has "pmg's" and it gets em in territories they have no clue about just cause a sports guy sells for hundreds they figure a marvel one does. When people get out of there comfort zone is when prices get dumb lol. I like ripping everything but I know not to be to ridiculous when it comes to prices unless its an insane sketch or a sketch of a top artist.

[Banshee]

Iron Man Gold just posted to EBay . . . ready for it? . . .

$2,499.99 BiN!

If Doc Ock is overpriced, um . . . what say you all to this development?

[deksterous2012]

Yup, I agree about what you said for the sports collectors.

Btw Iron Man Gold PMG on ebay for $2,499.99! Doc Ock at $700 is starting to look more reasonable now. Lol.

Let's see if Iron Man's number 1 fan sets up to the plate....

[BHotz]

The $$ the Greens from last year pulled down blew my mind. When you look back at those during the first ~month of release, it seems like $700 isn't crazy (though maybe a little high) for the Doc so in that aspect I agree with Carrbeaz. With that said, can this set catch that lighting in the bottle again... a new tier of PMG can help. But, no, this isn't the sports market where you have real rookie cards (that peeps LOVE to chase "colors" for). This is non-sport collectibles where you get series after series which is why sketches were such a fantastic idea though they sure could taper down the supply some and focus on quality, lol. #long.live.sketch.collectors

[deksterous2012]

Iron Man Gold just posted to EBay . . . ready for it? . . .

$2,499.99 BiN!

If Doc Ock is overpriced, um . . . what say you all to this development?

I feel bad for anybody that wants to sell their pack-fresh gold pmg right about now.

:D

First 700 is too high...but now 2500 is there...so 700 is too low...who knows?? I just want to see the spidey gold pmg on eBay for $25,000 + $3.50 shipping ;)

[Sushiyoshi]

I feel bad for anybody that wants to sell their pack-fresh gold pmg right about now.

:D

First 700 is too high...but now 2500 is there...so 700 is too low...who knows?? I just want to see the spidey gold pmg on eBay for $25,000 + $3.50 shipping ;)

I'll have it listed tomorrow.......



(don't wake me up from this dream)

[Cujobyte]

The only thing I'd collect of Doc Ock's is Amazing Spider-Man #3 (His first appearance). lol

[AmzingSpiderFan]

It's tough to gauge value based on ebay listing. Anyone can set the market price by listing it for a BIN. The only way to figure out the real market price is for one of these ballers to put it up in auction and let all of us fight it out. I don't know how crazy Iron Man could get because he is a marquee name and has big movie fandom, but for Doc Ock, I bet you I'd win that at $200. And honestly, a flipper would be the underbidder probably thinking they could sell it for more down the road and here's where I think finfangfan was right - i don't think there will be a market later because no one can build a set.

Anyway, these prices are all ridiculous. Iron Man might get $500 as a couple of true fans duke it out. But 10 years from now, no one will care about it for that price once the market is flooded with 25 more UD and RA sets that have the same art on Diamond 1/1, more Gold PMG, Red Spectrums, Jambalaya, Laser Etched, Holocrap, Bippidy Bops, and whatever else they dream up to sucker all of us.

I would love to meet the guy who buys the Doc Ock for his collection at $700 and not flipping. I feel like I have a lot of stuff he might be interested in ha ha.

[Spider-Fan]

Don't agree with aiming high on lesser cards that are obviously not going to pull $700 (!!) even if you are the first, second or last. All you're doing is rising the bar so everybody else thinks its okay to list their gold pmgs in that range or even higher, and therefore screwing all the character collectors trying to put the rainbow together out of getting their favorite characters 1/1 card for a reasonable price.

Sellers will always want the most they can get, and buyers will always want the cheapest price. I don't fault either for attempting to achieve their goal.

At the end of the day, sales will set the price not listings. Sellers can aim high but buyers still have to buy. Those prices will drop quickly if the buyers don't bite. Its up to buyers to be smart with their purchases. No seller wants to be the fool that sells his card for 50% less than the next guy who lists one.

Go back and read the pricing ridiculousness of PMGs from the first set in its thread on this site. Plenty of people here were picking up red and blue PMGs during the first few days and tripling their money selling them.

[Jackg1980]

It's tough to gauge value based on ebay listing. Anyone can set the market price by listing it for a BIN. The only way to figure out the real market price is for one of these ballers to put it up in auction and let all of us fight it out. I don't know how crazy Iron Man could get because he is a marquee name and has big movie fandom, but for Doc Ock, I bet you I'd win that at $200. And honestly, a flipper would be the underbidder probably thinking they could sell it for more down the road and here's where I think finfangfan was right - i don't think there will be a market later because no one can build a set.

Anyway, these prices are all ridiculous. Iron Man might get $500 as a couple of true fans duke it out. But 10 years from now, no one will care about it for that price once the market is flooded with 25 more UD and RA sets that have the same art on Diamond 1/1, more Gold PMG, Red Spectrums, Jambalaya, Laser Etched, Holocrap, Bippidy Bops, and whatever else they dream up to sucker all of us.

I would love to meet the guy who buys the Doc Ock for his collection at $700 and not flipping. I feel like I have a lot of stuff he might be interested in ha ha.

With 1/1s its never been about making a set. You are right, that in the future there may be alot more supply then demand. I am not sure how these gold 1/1s PMG will turn out or who is willing to pay the most for them. It could appeal to 1/1 collectors, PMG collectors or character collectors. If these catch the eye of PMG collectors they will sale highest. But so far, it doesnt look that way. The PMG gold 1/1 in football sell low, but that may be because the players are in the college uniforms. If I were the seller, I would of 99 cents this card off, because being the first PMG out there, it would get the attention of PMG collectors, 1/1 collectors and Doc Ock collectors. Once more PMG 1/1s surface, the PMG collectors and 1/1 collectors will have more choices to bid on or choose to wait on other characters.

[finfangfan]

Nova gold pmg up on eBay

[starwars808]

I heard from a few guys here that the Sabertooth gold 1/1 was pulled at a shop by a guy buying loose packs at a popular local shop.

[PrinceVegeta]

Elektra gold is on ebay

[PrinceVegeta]

Also did someone pay 2500 on that iron man gold..

[kyle1707]

Also did someone pay 2500 on that iron man gold..

yes................

[Jackg1980]

The spidey is gonna be expensive

[PrinceVegeta]

Venom and black widow are up

[AmzingSpiderFan]

BWWWAAAAA HAAAAAA HAAA. That Venom gold is on ebay for a $3,194.95 BIN. It's almost an insult to the hobby. Even the biggest fan shouldn't have to pay that much. I can't imagine a 1/1 sketch by any current sketchcard artist that is worth that much, let alone a reprint of a card on a different colored background.

Online is funny because it's faceless. I can't imagine walking into a shop and seeing that. I would have no credibility that anything else sold by the proprietor of that store was fair.

[Crazybella8]

BWWWAAAAA HAAAAAA HAAA. That Venom gold is on ebay for a $3,194.95 BIN. It's almost an insult to the hobby. Even the biggest fan shouldn't have to pay that much. I can't imagine a 1/1 sketch by any current sketchcard artist that is worth that much, let alone a reprint of a card on a different colored background.

Online is funny because it's faceless. I can't imagine walking into a shop and seeing that. I would have no credibility that anything else sold by the proprietor of that store was fair.

Here's a question for you and I'm just trying to see your opinion. I am by know means any sort of expert in the marvel/comic hobby but I enjoy tremendously opening retro. So my question, if the Iron Man legitimately sold for a $2499 buy it now, could that seller possibly left money on the table? And because of that the seller of the venom is listing higher to gage offers and interest. It's just a hypothetical and I am not trying to offend the marvel community or trying to sound naive. I do realize iron man is more popular then venom.

[Carrbeaz]

Here's a question for you and I'm just trying to see your opinion. I am by know means any sort of expert in the marvel/comic hobby but I enjoy tremendously opening retro. So my question, if the Iron Man legitimately sold for a $2499 buy it now, could that seller possibly left money on the table? And because of that the seller of the venom is listing higher to gage offers and interest. It's just a hypothetical and I am not trying to offend the marvel community or trying to sound naive. I do realize iron man is more popular then venom.

His post was more a troll post showing his own jealously that he didn't pull it himself. Any time you see all caps and that kind of hyperbole it just shows the puerile nature of the post. The serious collectors of this product will pay good money for the rare cards as evidenced by the Iron Man 1/1 sale.

[daviswr7]

His post was more a troll post showing his own jealously that he didn't pull it himself. Any time you see all caps and that kind of hyperbole it just shows the puerile nature of the post. The serious collectors of this product will pay good money for the rare cards as evidenced by the Iron Man 1/1 sale.

Lol. +1 to this.

[deksterous2012]

His post was more a troll post showing his own jealously that he didn't pull it himself. Any time you see all caps and that kind of hyperbole it just shows the puerile nature of the post. The serious collectors of this product will pay good money for the rare cards as evidenced by the Iron Man 1/1 sale.

lol. "puerile nature". :)!

[edhou1]

The spidey is gonna be expensive

yup, and it's probably going to infuriate the 'true' hobbyists who think that no should have to pay more than a few hundred bucks for a 'sports card gimmick'...:p

[Spider-Fan]

Call names all you want... I can't believe any buyer is foolish enough to pay $2,500 (or even $1,000) for a printed trading card that doesn't contain some rare relic, superstar or historical figure autograph, or truly amazing artwork. Frankly, most of those are a stretch.

Pretty much guarantee the owner of the original comic book page that image come from paid much less... the only true 1/1 featuring that image.

My guess is that the buyer of this card is just stupid rich to the point where they don't have to practice patience at all in their life like a normal adult does. Props to the seller for the monstrous sale. I doubt that will set the price on these moving forward. After all, Iron Man had 2x 1/1s in MP14 and will have another 1/1 next year and yet another 1/1 PMG some time after that

[finfangfan]

I updated the first post, and please refrain from the namecalling... it's tacky. Also it is misguided. I can't believe someone applied the jealous label to AmzingSpiderFan. Might I remind you that he is the supercollector that put together this: http://www.blowoutcards.com/forums/sketch-card-collections-artist-galleries/817585-amazing-spider-man-chronology-sketch-card-collection.html (Yup, he commissioned 36 Nars, 36 Acar, 36 Tans, etc)

And that is just a sliver of his overall collection. He has proven time and again that he can afford to acquire any card he wants for his collection. When he says a card is overpriced, I think it is wise to listen and not ridicule.

At any rate, first post updated. Please keep reporting 1/1 Gold PMG sightings! Thanks!

[deksterous2012]

Call names all you want... I can't believe any buyer is foolish enough to pay $2,500 (or even $1,000) for a printed trading card that doesn't contain some rare relic, superstar or historical figure autograph, or truly amazing artwork. Frankly, most of those are a stretch.

Pretty much guarantee the owner of the original comic book page that image come from paid much less... the only true 1/1 featuring that image.

My guess is that the buyer of this card is just stupid rich to the point where they don't have to practice patience at all in their life like a normal adult does. Props to the seller for the monstrous sale. I doubt that will set the price on these moving forward. After all, Iron Man had 2x 1/1s in MP14 and will have another 1/1 next year and yet another 1/1 PMG some time after that

I agree that 2500 is ridiculous for the Iron Man Gold PMG. No question about that from me, and it sucks that it might drive the price on the Gold PMGs overall at least for the time being. However, historically speaking from the sports card world perspective 2500 range (and more) for a top player PMG is not irregular, so I'm not surprised. I think we as non-sports collectors are just not used to those super high prices unless its tied to an amazing sketch. Are times a-changing? Again, I still think 2500 is ridiculous.

But we gotta live in the now imo. Who knows what will happen with future releases? Do you think UD is going to do 10 Marvel Premier/Marvel Fleer Retros in a row, year after year? Who knows what will happen. You gotta make moves now, and then deal with what comes in the future - if you're in the market for 2500 Iron Man Gold PMGS...

[Fboothiii]

I updated the first post, and please refrain from the namecalling... it's tacky. Also it is misguided. I can't believe someone applied the jealous label to AmzingSpiderFan. Might I remind you that he is the supercollector that put together this: http://www.blowoutcards.com/forums/sketch-card-collections-artist-galleries/817585-amazing-spider-man-chronology-sketch-card-collection.html (Yup, he commissioned 36 Nars, 36 Acar, 36 Tans, etc)

And that is just a sliver of his overall collection. He has proven time and again that he can afford to acquire any card he wants for his collection. When he says a card is overpriced, I think it is wise to listen and not ridicule.

At any rate, first post updated. Please keep reporting 1/1 Gold PMG sightings! Thanks!

This...... But, the higher PMGS go, the likelihood of more product being cracked.
More product cracked, more sketches found........ More sketches found, happier me.

I can't comment on the asking price for the golds....... What may seem like a lot for some may be reasonable for others.:D

[AmzingSpiderFan]

Here's a question for you and I'm just trying to see your opinion. I am by know means any sort of expert in the marvel/comic hobby but I enjoy tremendously opening retro. So my question, if the Iron Man legitimately sold for a $2499 buy it now, could that seller possibly left money on the table? And because of that the seller of the venom is listing higher to gage offers and interest. It's just a hypothetical and I am not trying to offend the marvel community or trying to sound naive. I do realize iron man is more popular then venom.

Great question Crazybella8. Unfortunately I went to sleep and spent time with my kid so I have to address some other comments first...

<sigh> I did try to tone down my rhetoric to avoid sounding like a troll and don't think I came across as jealous. I'll take a step back and say my post was aimed at the collectors to help them see a fellow passionate collector is not going to pay these prices and it's a shame that we are seeing those listing because it is damaging the credibility of the industry as a whole. I avoided these forums for a long time because I don't like how some people prefer name calling over a good intellectual conversation. I feel Crazybella8's response was a great one. Attacking me with names just to rally more aliases to +1 you really doesn't seem productive but hey, maybe if 150 people +1ing is the fastest way to shoot down my opinion, so be it.

I also want to say I greatly appreciate Spider-Fan and finfangfan trying to move the conversation back to something productive. If it wasn't for them I would have ignored this post and let everyone have their fun. I don't get any joy in commenting to hear myself speak (or see myself type). I engage in these forums only to provoke others to engage in great conversation.

To answer Crazybella8's question, absolutely. I'm not going to hide that, I know economics very well and I don't know the circumstances of how the Iron Man was sold but let's assume it was an auction. In that case $2500 is dictated by one thing and one thing only: the underbidder. There is usually only one other person who sets the market price for the winner and that is the underbidder. So if another person entered the market and recently spent $3200 on a Venom, but now wanted an Iron Man to complete his 'collection' however he/she defines collection, that person might now be interested in paying up to $3200 for Iron Man and would bid driving the price up. If it was a BIN then the buyer would in theory be afraid someone else is going to buy it before the seller decides to lower it's price because it is sitting there too long and they need the cash flow. My post wasn't about economics or what sellers should be listing the cards for - every seller should drive as high of a price for their card as they possible can. Every buyer should drive as low of a price. My post did have the agenda of trying to lower prices because as a collector, I don't want to see anyone feel they have to pay that ridiculous price to collect the rainbow of that character or a mini-set of golds. That's stupid and while I might be wrong, I believe that person might impulsively spend that money this year and regret it 5 years from now because I truly believe that the long term value of the Gold PMG and MP14 Red Spectrum are going to be insanely low. I made a joke in another post about how I might keep a set of metal, red, blue, green, and gold PMGs on my shelf next my Killing Joke red, blue, green, and yellow reprints as a reminder of stupid. My dad warned me overpaying for those reprints would be a waste of money and I didn't listen back then. I collected them all. Now the Gold PMG is 1/1 so that's different, but my point is I don't think it will maintain its value. The value is what you can sell it for and I don't think anyone cares that much.

Is there any current sketch card artist who you wish was on this set that if UD commissioned from them 1 official card and 1 only, you would pay $2500 for? Nar? Acar? Adams? No one paid $2500 for an Adams sketch on MP14 that I saw. I bet cards that rare from a top artist would sell for $1000-$1500 in auction. Why? Because Nar is a top artist and he only did 6 cards for the last Retro series and his went for I think $600-$1500 in auctions when they were pulled. *I think*. So why should a reprint with gold background go for $2500 or $3200? Finfangfan said it best about Green PMGs - those at least can be collected for a set of 42 cards. Golds are a different beast. I don't think they should go for more than $500 on top characters. Less popular characters maybe $200. I know it's low - remember I am biased as a collector, not a seller. If I was going to collect PMGs, I'd pay$250 for Venom. $500 for spidey. But I'm saving my money for commissions because I personally appreciate the art better. So no, I am not jealous. I hope one of you get the Spidey for $500. I hope no one has to spend more for 2.5" x 3.5" of a reprinted picture on cardboard.

Carrbeaz - I should have trolled all day long on MP14, I had a lot of jealousy for pulling awful cards and seeing everyone else get nice stuff. You didn't see me trolling then and you don't now. On this set I chose not to buy boxes so there was no jealousy. And I don't flip cards so I wouldn't sell one for $3200, if I got one. I vehemently disagree with you that serious collectors will pay good money for the rare PMG cards on this set. Honestly I am surprised you would write that - I feel like only a seller would write that comment to try and make collectors think that they should pay those ludicrous prices. Serious collectors, will avoid the Gold PMG prices like the plague because collecting PMG doesn't show appreciation of art or the hobby because you can't collect a set.

deksterous2012 - I think UD probably made a lot of money on this set but are going to get a lot of backlash from distributors because MP14 and FR15 were both lower quality than their predecessors. So because they probably made good money on this set, they will do a MP16 and FR17. But because distributors might get stuck holding a ton of bad sketches and base sets and don't flip as many of the PMGs for the prices they can during the first week hype, they will not buy into future sets as much. Again (from a different post) look at how there are 400 sketches posted on ebay now and about 25 sold. MP12 and FR13 did not have that awful ratio. But let's see - i'm just giving an opinion and hypothesizing with stats. Every purchase whether it is from us the collector or a distributor to UD is a vote. We are voting that we accept these prices. If I bought Venom for $3200 then I am voting that I want more Gold PMGs for those prices. The distributor will make a massive profit and UD will produce more crap reprints instead of paying Nar, Acar, Glebe, Kincaid, etc to take their time and do more cards or more detail in the sketches I think we all truly want. If that Venom SITS and SITS for months and sells for $400, that might not make up the cost of all the cases that had to be broken. I don't know. Let's hear from some of the big sellers/distributors who bought cases. I am curious how many Gold PMGs they pulled and how many cases they had to break. We know the stats on Jambalayas (1:200) but we don't know the true stats on Gold PMG. My guess is they are not 1:3000, which would be the proper ratio to command something like a $3200 price.

By the way, deksterous2012 and Carrbeaz, my hyperbolic BWA HA caps was not puerile, it was an equal and opposite reaction to that price. $700 for Doc Ock was funny. $2500 for Iron Man is laugh out loud funny. $3200 for Venom is, well, bwa ha ha :rolleyes: Your point was made though - I'll refrain from the silly long spelled out caps going forward. It clearly just provoked the wrong response.

Lastly, thank you again to Spider-Fan and finfangfan :)

[Crazybella8]

Well I will say this, being in the hobby of collecting for quite a while I know for a fact if I pulled a gold 1/1 im trying to sell high of course! Not knowing the market all that well, if I pulled the iron man I would have had a real hard time trying to figure out a starting price (I'm not a fan of auctions)! So that being said I understand the sellers side of it!
As a buyer, I disagree that true collectors wouldn't pay big money for these pmgs! And if it stays in there PC then it will always be valued at what they paid especially if it's a 1/1. The greens /10 is a different story because in 5-10 years someone may try to sell a 2013 or 2015 and get way less then what they paid for because another had sold cheap prior too. But back to being a seller I don't believe you need to sell cheap just because another sold cheap! Someone tried telling me that a green I have is a $120 card because in 5 years it will be cheaper? What? Ok so I should sell you mine for $120 because it would be that in 5 years?
Anyway, I enjoy reading the responses because it helps me in growing my knowledge in this ever growing hobby! And it's fun.

[Spider-Fan]

I agree that 2500 is ridiculous for the Iron Man Gold PMG. No question about that from me, and it sucks that it might drive the price on the Gold PMGs overall at least for the time being. However, historically speaking from the sports card world perspective 2500 range (and more) for a top player PMG is not irregular, so I'm not surprised. I think we as non-sports collectors are just not used to those super high prices unless its tied to an amazing sketch. Are times a-changing? Again, I still think 2500 is ridiculous.

But we gotta live in the now imo. Who knows what will happen with future releases? Do you think UD is going to do 10 Marvel Premier/Marvel Fleer Retros in a row, year after year? Who knows what will happen. You gotta make moves now, and then deal with what comes in the future - if you're in the market for 2500 Iron Man Gold PMGS...

First, I think it is equally foolhardy to spend such a high amount on a card manufactured specifically to be rare if it has an image of an athlete on it.

However... Sports cards will naturally garner higher prices due to higher demand. For every 1 person trying to be an Iron Man super collector, there are probably 100x for the equivalent sports star. The increase in demand and therefor competition will naturally drive the price higher, regardless of what I think the value is. I think a large factor in the high prices on these Premier/Retro inserts is sports guys entering the waters, not realizing how few people they are competing with and how that impacts the economics of the situation.

Another thing sports has that these cards don't is prospecting. Comic books, yes, but not in the cards yet. It's the same big names set after set. There is little, "Who will be the next Michael Jordan / LeBron James / Tiger Woods / Jimmy Johnson / Tom Brady / whatever?" There was Spider-Man in the 60s, Wolverine in the 70s, and Deadpool in the 90s. They didn't print any 1/1s of Spider-Gwen or Silk or any other 'new' characters to prospect, and they wouldn't have been autographed if they had.

Regardless... people can spend what they want and congrats again to the seller.

To answer your other question... Premier, Reto, I don't know. But these premium priced insert driven sets aren't going away in the foreseeable future and with each new one released is the potential for new 1/1 manufactured rare printed cards.

[Jackg1980]

If it's a good sale, then that's an indicator the market is healthy and big spenders are collecting. Which is good for everybody. There is no reason to laugh at someone, whether that's a buyer, seller or just someone's opinion. If it's a good sale, then a lot of people here were wrong about the value of the 1/1s and they just have to accept it. The future is always uncertain but I think the PMG 1/1s will continue to be some of the biggest and most valuable hits.

[edhou1]

If it's a good sale, then that's an indicator the market is healthy and big spenders are collecting. Which is good for everybody. There is no reason to laugh at someone, whether that's a buyer, seller or just someone's opinion. If it's a good sale, then a lot of people here were wrong about the value of the 1/1s and they just have to accept it. The future is always uncertain but I think the PMG 1/1s will continue to be some of the biggest and most valuable hits.

Thank you for saying this in a diplomatic and eloquent way. Having reflected on this, I apologize profusely if I offended anyone with any of my prior posts.

[alphaone]

I feel that everyone has there own opinion when it comes to collecting and spending, we all have our own standard on what we want in our pc. The 2012 MP sketch card is what got me into non sport and its been a great chase ever since. I've seen some pretty crazy sketch collection over the years and yes, there are people out there that have spent over $3k on a single Nar puzzle.

At the same time, I'm just glad to see how the hobby has evolved within these past few years, being able to bring something fresh and exciting with each new release rather than just relying on the artist's sketch card to sell or push a product which I think have been the case for years. We are seeing much more patches, auto's, costumes etc.
However, the 2013 Retro comes to mind because it was probably the first true numbered set and while many thought it would be a bust right out of the gate. It was able to carried itself and turned it into a very successful product. It was so new that many people didn't know how to price the PMG's, Jambalaya, and other inserts. Some of the Precious Metal Gems and later Jambalaya sold for an insane amount but looking back I wish that I would have grabbed a few. They just never show up anymore! Many people I know including myself have been looking for a few cards for over a year with no luck.
If history does repeat itself then in 10-15 years this set will be worth quite the chase!

In short, there's nothing too high or too low just collect what you like and spend what your comfortable with. I'm just thankful to be able to collect these amazing looking cards now. :)
<---------

[sketchopolix]

Ghost Rider pulled.

[Spider-Fan]

If history does repeat itself then in 10-15 years this set will be worth quite the chase!


Did I miss something? What 10-15 year old set are you comparing this to?

[edhou1]

Did I miss something? What 10-15 year old set are you comparing this to?

reference to 1997 - 1998 Precious Metal Gems in basketball

Comprehensive Precious Metal Gems PMG Guide (http://www.cardboardconnection.com/comprehensive-precious-metal-gems-card-guide)

[finfangfan]

We are about 1/5 spotted nearly a week after release now.

[Spider-Fan]

reference to 1997 - 1998 Precious Metal Gems in basketball

Comprehensive Precious Metal Gems PMG Guide (http://www.cardboardconnection.com/comprehensive-precious-metal-gems-card-guide)

Gotcha. Oh how it would have tickled me so if they had used the colored 92 MU holograms as a serial numbered parallel set instead of a sports insert... the adaptation of the sports inserts into the retro comic set may be what helped pull in the new collectors fromy the sports world, but as a kid who collected comic cards in the 90s I was mighty disappointed.

We are about 1/5 spotted nearly a week after release now.

For those that sell on ebay, can we capture the sale price also?

[finfangfan]

Sure on eBay prices. So far I think just one has sold... Iron Man. Can we confirm that sold for $2,500? If so, I will list it at that price if confirmed. I know recently eBay has been hiding OBO prices (ie the "print trick" no longer works).

[edhou1]

Sure on eBay prices. So far I think just one has sold... Iron Man. Can we confirm that sold for $2,500? If so, I will list it at that price if confirmed. I know recently eBay has been hiding OBO prices (ie the "print trick" no longer works).

Sale amount is confirmed at $2499.99
2015 Upper Deck Marvel Fleer Retro Iron Man Precious Metal Gems Gold 1 1 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=321803021452&rmvSB=true)

feedback has yet to be left by either party however

[Spider-Fan]

It can always be fixed, or updated, if it gets relished or whatever

EDIT: absolutely makes sense to wait until the seller leaves feedback to the buyer, as confirmation that the card was actually paid for

[Sharard]

Sure on eBay prices. So far I think just one has sold... Iron Man. Can we confirm that sold for $2,500? If so, I will list it at that price if confirmed. I know recently eBay has been hiding OBO prices (ie the "print trick" no longer works).


Hmm, I have had no problems using watch count to see what best offers been. Don't know about the print trick you speak if though.

[jdhaugh11]

So far only 19% of the Golds have been accounted for, however don't you think more than 19% has been opened by now? Of course I am sure there are a few Golds that have pulled that we may not know of.

[edhou1]

So far only 19% of the Golds have been accounted for, however don't you think more than 19% has been opened by now? Of course I am sure there are a few Golds that have pulled that we may not know of.

we don't have full confidence in print run right? Even though many of the early breaks had 8-9 PMGs per 6-box case, I have seen many loose master boxes with just 1 PMG.

Each of the 42 PMGS subjects x 151 total PMGs per (includes 100 red, 50 blue, 1 gold) = max of 6342 cases, right?


(19% of 6342 cases = equivalent of 1205 cases. )

[jdhaugh11]

we don't have full confidence in print run right? Even though many of the early breaks had 8-9 PMGs per 6-box case, I have seen many loose master boxes with just 1 PMG.

Each of the 42 PMGS subjects x 151 total PMGs per (includes 100 red, 50 blue, 1 gold) = max of 6342 cases, right?


(19% of 6342 cases = equivalent of 1205 cases. )



Yeah I agree that the 1.5 PMG's per box only seemed to happen early on and all the recent boxes only have 1 per box.

You forgot the Greens out of 10, but also some boxes do have a 2nd PMG. Also your math is based on 1 PMG per case rather than 1 per box.

So guessing you get about 1.2 per box, they made about 5,635 boxes or 939 cases, rather than 751 cases if you account for 1.5 PMG's per box.

Either way based on the Golds that have been pulled, only 200 cases have been opened, but that sounds low.

My guess is that 25 to 30% of all the cases have been opened and there are a handful of Gold 1/1's that have been pulled but not ID'ed to date.

[finfangfan]

I would guess we are getting close to 40% cracked. A ton of boxes go directly to collectors who don't post breaks on the Internet. Additionally there are card dealers that only sell through their own stores and/or local shows. Not everything pulled ends up on eBay, so our list will never reach 100% even if 100% gets cracked (and since people collect sealed product, there will always be 1/1 stuff that never surfaces).

I think one thing working against this set early on is that the entry price was so high, and the return on investment is not at the levels of Retro 2013. When that set was a week old, it really took off. This set suffers a bit from the sophomore slump, and from collector fatigue alluded to above (I.e. when every set has 1/1 parallels, then they lose some of the luster needed for a collector to pay big bucks for them).

[edhou1]

Yeah I agree that the 1.5 PMG's per box only seemed to happen early on and all the recent boxes only have 1 per box.

You forgot the Greens out of 10, but also some boxes do have a 2nd PMG. Also your math is based on 1 PMG per case rather than 1 per box.

So guessing you get about 1.2 per box, they made about 5,635 boxes or 939 cases, rather than 751 cases if you account for 1.5 PMG's per box.

Either way based on the Golds that have been pulled, only 200 cases have been opened, but that sounds low.

My guess is that 25 to 30% of all the cases have been opened and there are a handful of Gold 1/1's that have been pulled but not ID'ed to date.

Thanks...doh I forgot the greens. I agree with your assessment...

[Sharard]

Heres a gold to add to the list Just pulled it from my case at home.

[finfangfan]

Congrats! I updated first post... we are at 21%.

[jdhaugh11]

Heres a gold to add to the list Just pulled it from my case at home.

As Chris Justice would say nice Ma gen toe you pulled! LOL I kid, because it's funny!

[FlashKV0785]

These are being pulled alot faster than marvel premier 1/1's. You can tell the difference in the amount of cases produced.

[houseofpokemon]

Heres a gold to add to the list Just pulled it from my case at home.

Just curious if you got a PMG Green or Jambalaya also in your case with the gold PMG.

[finfangfan]

He posted the case break here>> http://www.blowoutcards.com/forums/non-sport-box-breaks/895558-1-case-marvel-fleer-retro-1-1-sighting.html

He also got a jamba.

[kyle1707]

What is best guess on Jambalaya print run? 20 each.....

[edhou1]

What is best guess on Jambalaya print run? 20 each.....

Let's operate under the assumption that there are ~6000 boxes, 1000 cases as discussed above. If we assume that each case has either a green PMG or a jambalaya (although we know that some cases have both), then there should be 1000 - (420 green PMGs) = 580 cases with a jambalaya.

There are 21 different jambalayas so 580 / 21 = approx 27.6 per jambalaya.

I'm sure our assumptions are a bit off, but I think it makes sense that there are probably 25-30 of each jambalaya.

[kyle1707]

Let's operate under the assumption that there are ~6000 boxes, 1000 cases as discussed above. If we assume that each case has either a green PMG or a jambalaya (although we know that some cases have both), then there should be 1000 - (420 green PMGs) = 580 cases with a jambalaya.

There are 21 different jambalayas so 580 / 21 = approx 27.6 per jambalaya.

I'm sure our assumptions are a bit off, but I think it makes sense that there are probably 25-30 of each jambalaya.

I think that is real close... 25 was my thought....

thanks

[Spider-Fan]

I think you are a little high on the print run and a that enough cases have a green and Jamba that it is 20 or less per

[humpdz]

I think you are a little high on the print run and a that enough cases have a green and Jamba that it is 20 or less per

I agree......I don't think it's as clean cut with the math. I would say the Jambas are slightly higher than the Greens. This was true in the first retro set and it's what I am seeing now with this set.

[jdhaugh11]

Still between a print run of 20 and 30 is pretty limited, especially since they are one of the best looking cards ever made IMO and there are no parallel versions of this card.
There are some cards with low print runs, but have 10 parallels, so they devalue each other.
I wonder if anyone is going for the set? That would be awesome.

[Bryanjs14]

Going to pick up 3 boxes from my LCS now...hopefully I can make the list in the op.

Wishful thinking lol

[edhou1]

Going to pick up 3 boxes from my LCS now...hopefully I can make the list in the op.

Wishful thinking lol

Good luck. All I get are red PMGs of Doctor Strange and poor quality sketches. Ugh. Wish they added in some E-X Essential Credentials or similar

[deksterous2012]

Good luck. All I get are red PMGs of Doctor Strange and poor quality sketches. Ugh. Wish they added in some E-X Essential Credentials or similar

E-X Essential Credentials. YES. :)!

[jdhaugh11]

I wish they would have made parallels of the E-X cards like they did with Basketball, that would have added a little value.

[finfangfan]

Iron man has been relisted at $1,100 by seller.

So that means NONE of these have sold on eBay so far.

[deksterous2012]

Iron Man 1/1 gold pmg on eBay again for 1,100 or best offer. lol. lol. :D . so I think its pretty safe to say it didn't go for 2,500.

[Sharard]

Ya. I'm waiting on selling mine, if I even do sell its. But was never under the delusion I would get 2k plus for it. I'm guessing in the 850 range

[FlashKV0785]

But was never under the delusion I would get 2k plus for it. I'm guessing in the 850 range

no comment.

[finfangfan]

2015 Upper Deck Marvel Fleer Retro Iron Man Precious Metal Gems Gold 1 1 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/221830954483)

The $1,100 BIN Iron Man 1/1 Gold PMG eBay listing ended early "This listing was ended by the seller because the item is no longer available." So looks like he must have sold it off of eBay.

People asked me to include prices on the first post, but I am not sure how to do so accurately when these cards are not being sold on eBay (unless seller or buyer chime in).

At any rate, it looks like the card likely sold for < or = to $1,100 in private transaction off of eBay.

Has anyone heard of any other Gold PMG sales that have hit?

[Spider-Fan]

My opinion, since I was the one that suggested added sold prices for ones that sold on ebay. I think either of these would be okay...

(1) It didn't sell on ebay, so don't put anything
(2) Make a note that it was listed at $2500, relisted at $1100, ended early by seller

[jdhaugh11]

Still only 9 pulled? I wonder if prices will go up with so many unaccounted for?

[humpdz]

Still only 9 pulled? I wonder if prices will go up with so many unaccounted for?

It won't matter how many have been pulled or not only on what characters have been pulled. Doc Oct is still up on ebay for $600 which would be more reasonable on a more popular character like Thor or Venom.

[Sharard]

Looks like punisher was pulled. See it on eBay at 2k.

[daviswr7]

I am usually not the debbie downer guy, but the demand for PMG's just seems way down this go around. I guess no one wants to take it on the cheek for their greens and golds but I am starting to think the only way these golds are going to sell is if someone just takes the plunge and starts it at 99 cents...

[Spider-Fan]

I am usually not the debbie downer guy, but the demand for PMG's just seems way down this go around.

That should not be a surprise. Typical "sequel" performance.

[finfangfan]

Looks like punisher was pulled. See it on eBay at 2k.

Bullseye is up on eBay now too... 26% now reported as pulled (11/42).

[kyle1707]

I just pulled Falcon....

Break is in NS box breaks...

[BHotz]

That should not be a surprise. Typical "sequel" performance.

Bingo. Which is why Upper Deck is confusing me some with barely any product improvement and decreased sketch card quality (for vast majority) BUT are increasing price points across the board. :confused:

Hopefully better/more cool stuff down the line. I know the Jusko set can't come soon enough :flex:

[humpdz]

Bingo. Which is why Upper Deck is confusing me some with barely any product improvement and decreased sketch card quality (for vast majority) BUT are increasing price points across the board. :confused:

Hopefully better/more cool stuff down the line. I know the Jusko set can't come soon enough :flex:

I am enjoying all the Retro Inserts (Prints, 60s, 82s, Flair, Impel, Powerblasts) because I have all the old sets even from the 60s & 80s, but that's the only improvement in my opinion. The Sketches went way down hill and the one artist that I was excited about, Buscema, is AWOL so far...

I also don't care for the 1/1 Gold PMGs. I like the 10/10 Green PMGs, but when you limit the Golds to 1/1 then it's impossible to do a complete set and with that logic, why would a collector bother with getting all the other colors??? And I have yet to see one sold!

[Spider-Fan]

:eatit:Bingo. Which is why Upper Deck is confusing me some with barely any product improvement and decreased sketch card quality (for vast majority) BUT are increasing price points across the board. :confused:

Hopefully better/more cool stuff down the line. I know the Jusko set can't come soon enough :flex:

I don't know for sure, but I don't believe upper deck direct pricing is increasing much. Seems to be mostly retailer pricing going up, and I expect that to drop just like it did for mp14

[finfangfan]

:eatit:

I don't know for sure, but I don't believe upper deck direct pricing is increasing much. Seems to be mostly retailer pricing going up, and I expect that to drop just like it did for mp14

I think this set will continue to languish until we get beynod UD's 90 day period before dealers can sell boxes below MSRP. It doesn't really seem that as many are breaking compared to the same time in Retro 2013's lifecycle... Probably because a lot of dealers who tied a lot of money into this "can't miss" product are struggling to make their $ back.

I also think the golds were a miscalculation on UD's part. Their bread and butter is OCD collectors who try to complete master sets. When UD introduces a 1/1 parallel that makes a master set impossible, these OCD collectors just sit on their wallets. I don't even think greens are coming anywhere near their 2013 counterparts.

I still think there is good stuff here, it just needs to come down in price for a healthy amount to be opened. Hopefully the Jusko set rights the ship for UD. MP2014 and Retro 2015 have both definitely underperformed their predecessors.

[finfangfan]

Falcon gold was pulled in the Blowout box break section.

[deksterous2012]

I think this set will continue to languish until we get beynod UD's 90 day period before dealers can sell boxes below MSRP. It doesn't really seem that as many are breaking compared to the same time in Retro 2013's lifecycle... Probably because a lot of dealers who tied a lot of money into this "can't miss" product are struggling to make their $ back.

I also think the golds were a miscalculation on UD's part. Their bread and butter is OCD collectors who try to complete master sets. When UD introduces a 1/1 parallel that makes a master set impossible, these OCD collectors just sit on their wallets. I don't even think greens are coming anywhere near their 2013 counterparts.

I still think there is good stuff here, it just needs to come down in price for a healthy amount to be opened. Hopefully the Jusko set rights the ship for UD. MP2014 and Retro 2015 have both definitely underperformed their predecessors.

I love Joe Jusko as much as anyone else, but what's the Jusko set going to offer besides the base set? How would it right the ship? From the standpoint of the overall success of the set, it'll still be the same group of us buying up the cards. I don't think the Jusko set will bring in many new collectors (sports guys).

The first Marvel Fleer Retro was cool because it brought back all the old school designs, and introduced PMGs to non-sports cards which was the key. All those things attracted everybody (non-sports and especially the non-sports collectors). It was exciting. This new set is doing the same thing again with minimal upgrades (e.g. 1/1 Gold PMGs). Don't get me wrong though, I really like Marvel Fleer Retro 2015 and I'm actively collecting it.

I also think a lot of collectors (especially those picking up singles on eBay) are getting smarter. I already know what green PMGs sold for in the beginning, middle and end of the first Marvel Retro set, so I know what their average value is and will be for this new set. I'll hold until I get the right price due to my experience with the first set.

I'm glad the master collectors are staying away. That will keep the prices reasonable for the character collectors (such as myself). :)!

[humpdz]

I love Joe Jusko as much as anyone else, but what's the Jusko set going to offer besides the base set? How would it right the ship? From the standpoint of the overall success of the set, it'll still be the same group of us buying up the cards. I don't think the Jusko set will bring in many new collectors (sports guys).

The first Marvel Fleer Retro was cool because it brought back all the old school designs, and introduced PMGs to non-sports cards which was the key. All those things attracted everybody (non-sports and especially the non-sports collectors). It was exciting. This new set is doing the same thing again with minimal upgrades (e.g. 1/1 Gold PMGs). Don't get me wrong though, I really like Marvel Fleer Retro 2015 and I'm actively collecting it.

I also think a lot of collectors (especially those picking up singles on eBay) are getting smarter. I already know what green PMGs sold for in the beginning, middle and end of the first Marvel Retro set, so I know what their average value is and will be for this new set. I'll hold until I get the right price due to my experience with the first set.

I'm glad the master collectors are staying away. That will keep the prices reasonable for the character collectors (such as myself). :)!

Any fan of the old Marvel Masterpieces sets could tell you what UD should do, but who the Hell knows what they will do. They nailed fixing the biggest problem which have been no original art for the base set.

I am hoping since they are doing original art for this set that they will do a few other things that the '90s MM brought to the table like Holofoils, Holoflashes, Mirage Cards and even more Power Blast Cards. A few redemption cards for Original Artwork from the base set like they did in '96 wouldn't hurt either.

[Spider-Fan]

I think this set will continue to languish until we get beynod UD's 90 day period before dealers can sell boxes below MSRP. It doesn't really seem that as many are breaking compared to the same time in Retro 2013's lifecycle... Probably because a lot of dealers who tied a lot of money into this "can't miss" product are struggling to make their $ back.


The flavor of my comment was that retailers are selling above "MSRP" and therefore can drop the price significantly. Look at Avengers:AOU for example... That product went on sale less than a month after release by authorized internet retailers. They weren't breaking the rules, they just were selling about MSRP from the get go. Same as MP14, same as Retro 14. All sequels to very successful sets, but they all suffered from the same lack of initial success. In part because of the trumped up prices right out of the gate and in part to the lack of innovation compared to the introductory release.

Just my opinion, but people buying this stuff at shops are paying much less than the online retailers are asking (and have been from the get go).

[marvelcollector]

Loki Gold pulled last night on breakers

[kakarot12]

Who's room?

[marvelcollector]

Who's room?

It was in Danscardz

[marvelcollector]

Cyclops Gold pulled today

[finfangfan]

Thanks for the headsup! I have updated post #1... we are at 33% spotted!

[IamGroot]

I have one box on the way. So this is just placeholder for when I pull the Gold Spider-Man :)

[hychang5]

I have one box on the way. So this is just placeholder for when I pull the Gold Spider-Man :)

Amazing after all this time the spider has not been pulled (that we know of). That and the Wolverine have to be the biggest golds left, no?

[Spider-Fan]

Conspiracy theory... held back the big ones to try and keep the product hot?

I don't necessarily believe that. After all, it's totally possible that it was pulled and just not posted online anywhere. If I pulled it, I would want it for my PC and wouldn't want to deal with the unsolicited demands to sell it.

[marvelcollector]

Conspiracy theory... held back the big ones to try and keep the product hot?

I don't necessarily believe that. After all, it's totally possible that it was pulled and just not posted online anywhere. If I pulled it, I would want it for my PC and wouldn't want to deal with the unsolicited demands to sell it.

This is my theory and I fully believe it. It would only make sense for them to do that. Once Spider-Man gold is pulled sales will drop, I know I will stop buying cases. Look at Marvel Premier 2014, As far as what people know Spider-Man Red 1/1 is still out there and people are looking for it. Just my opinion and I have been scalded by card dealers and collectors for expressing it but to me it would be stupid for them not to do it.

And whomever pulls it BETTER TELL PEOPLE!!!

[Spider-Fan]

This is my theory and I fully believe it. It would only make sense for them to do that. Once Spider-Man gold is pulled sales will drop, I know I will stop buying cases. Look at Marvel Premier 2014, As far as what people know Spider-Man Red 1/1 is still out there and people are looking for it. Just my opinion and I have been scalded by card dealers and collectors for expressing it but to me it would be stupid for them not to do it.

And whomever pulls it BETTER TELL PEOPLE!!!

Well... In this modern collecting environment where people are entitled to replacements for damaged card, I just assume 1/1 cards are held back (or a second copy of the 1/1 cards...). Its a damn shady hobby. Nothing surprises me.

[daviswr7]

This is my theory and I fully believe it. It would only make sense for them to do that. Once Spider-Man gold is pulled sales will drop, I know I will stop buying cases. Look at Marvel Premier 2014, As far as what people know Spider-Man Red 1/1 is still out there and people are looking for it. Just my opinion and I have been scalded by card dealers and collectors for expressing it but to me it would be stupid for them not to do it.

And whomever pulls it BETTER TELL PEOPLE!!!

There is SOO much sealed product of this stuff still out there. I work with a bunch of different distributors and all 3 have this stuff still sitting on there shelves. Many sites still have this available too..not sure if I am quite buying that Spiderman specifically was held back...but an interesting theory.

[finfangfan]

There is SOO much sealed product of this stuff still out there. I work with a bunch of different distributors and all 3 have this stuff still sitting on there shelves. Many sites still have this available too..not sure if I am quite buying that Spiderman specifically was held back...but an interesting theory.

Yeah... I don't buy that Spidey not being pulled yet means he was held back either. Basically, ... and I hate to say it... this product was a flop sales-wise (although there is cool stuff to be found here!), so the simple fact is that breakers aren't going to pay a premium box/case price if the cards pulled aren't achieving the resale value required to make back box/case price.

This will be a fun set to watch for on Black Friday, but for right now the amount of further product being broken is going to be tiny until box/cases come waaay down to warrant the purchase of the product.

This has been a brutal year for breakers. Fun for collectors (due to insanely low prices for sketches and chase cards).... for now... but I think a bunch of the dudes we rely on to open the bulk of this product are stepping back on the amount of stuff they order which will mean a ton of this stuff remains sealed for months/years.

[Spider-Fan]

I'm not certain I even believe it hasn't been pulled yet... Again, why advertise? If you are selling, the value will never go down. If you are not, why deal with the annoyance of everybody that wants to buy it?

[marvelcollector]

Yeah... I don't buy that Spidey not being pulled yet means he was held back either. Basically, ... and I hate to say it... this product was a flop sales-wise (although there is cool stuff to be found here!), so the simple fact is that breakers aren't going to pay a premium box/case price if the cards pulled aren't achieving the resale value required to make back box/case price.

This will be a fun set to watch for on Black Friday, but for right now the amount of further product being broken is going to be tiny until box/cases come waaay down to warrant the purchase of the product.

This has been a brutal year for breakers. Fun for collectors (due to insanely low prices for sketches and chase cards).... for now... but I think a bunch of the dudes we rely on to open the bulk of this product are stepping back on the amount of stuff they order which will mean a ton of this stuff remains sealed for months/years.

It has been a big flop although I do love it. Resell is just so horrible it makes it hard to keep buying more and more. I feel like it is the same thing with MP14 at first the price was so high ($1800 a case if I'm not mistaken) then after 6 months it came down to $1200-$1300 which is reasonable for resell and I've seen MP14 getting destroyed on breakers, no one can keep it in stock. I think the same thing will happen here. My last case was $200 cheaper than my first, so that's a good sign :)

[daviswr7]

Yea what are those autos going for? Like 3-$4 apiece? Crazy low sales..

[Spider-Fan]

Yea what are those autos going for? Like 3-$4 apiece? Crazy low sales..

Sure because who cares? They might appeal to a set builder or rainbow collector, but as a single hit they offer little desirability compared to something like a printing plate, sketch card, comic panel, etc. Sure there are exceptions, but as a general rule the creator autograph is worthless and the market is beyond flooded with them since they are even cheaper hits than sketch cards from the manufacturing perspective.

If the autograph doesn't have value, the autographed card doesn't have value.

[finfangfan]

If the autograph doesn't have value, the autographed card doesn't have value.

Exactly. If they can insert a Stan Lee or a Kirby cut auto (or some other classic creator near that level) then that would be a worthwhile hit, but the rest of the auto stuff they churn out is a waste of time.

[kakarot12]

It has been a big flop although I do love it. Resell is just so horrible it makes it hard to keep buying more and more. I feel like it is the same thing with MP14 at first the price was so high ($1800 a case if I'm not mistaken) then after 6 months it came down to $1200-$1300 which is reasonable for resell and I've seen MP14 getting destroyed on breakers, no one can keep it in stock. I think the same thing will happen here. My last case was $200 cheaper than my first, so that's a good sign :)


Could not agree with you more. I cannot believe the prices some of the blue and green pmg's are going for. Even the jambalaya cards aren't selling that high. I too have gotten my cases cheaper and cheaper each time.

[finfangfan]

Could not agree with you more. I cannot believe the prices some of the blue and green pmg's are going for. Even the jambalaya cards aren't selling that high. I too have gotten my cases cheaper and cheaper each time.

I think in some ways it is good for the hobby that sports dealers are more heavily buying the Marvel and Star Wars stuff. If you think about it, it kind of breaks the monopoly (potential price fixing) that non-sports breakers somewhat enjoyed when there weren't too many sellers out there. With the product spread out more evenly among a wider network of sellers, prices come down. Capitalism at work I guess.

[marvelcollector]

Dark Phoenix Gold on eBay

[slayve]

Spider-Man just showed up on eBay.

[finfangfan]

Thanks for the heads-up. I updated post #1.

[PrinceVegeta]

And it sold for 2k a day later.

[Spider-Fan]

And it sold for 2k a day later.

Anything else sell decently?

[Sharard]

The punisher and black widow I think sold in the 600-700 area. I'm getting ready to list magneto. But I won't be in a hurry to sell. Last time I listed it I kept getting offers from 0 feedback and lowball.

Guess I'll just need patience. Just wish you could block new accounts.

[nnwill]

I just got a gold PMG of Namor #26. Any suggestions on pricing? Should I bother getting it graded?