[QUOTE=rman112;17636373]I don't know how there needs to be threshold when a player is both hitting and pitching.[/QUOTE]

So, you're saying just because he's hitting and pitching, that makes him the league MVP?

I'll go back to the comment I made a couple pages ago. Does that mean for the next 5-7 years he'll win the MVP every single season because he hits and pitches?

What would it take for someone to knock him off that throne?

[QUOTE=rngrdanny22;17636364]I'm just trying to determine what makes Ohtani an "MVP".

What threshold did he cross that just made him an absolute lock?[/QUOTE]

He’s leading his team....to the golf course once the regular season is done.

Funny that MVPs in other leagues almost always lead their teams to winning records. Baseball is the “best” player regardless of team success. Funny thing is, they still have Silver Slugger awards to toot hitters’ horns, too!

[QUOTE=rngrdanny22;17636380]So, you're saying just because he's hitting and pitching, that makes him the league MVP?

I'll go back to the comment I made a couple pages ago. Does that mean for the next 5-7 years he'll win the MVP every single season because he hits and pitches?

What would it take for someone to knock him off that throne?[/QUOTE]

I'm saying because he has 43 homers, 93 RBI, and a 9-1 record with a 2.97 ERA, he's MVP.

[QUOTE=oldgoldy97;17636384]Baseball is the “best” player regardless of team success.[/QUOTE]


Actually, this is only a recent phenomenon. Making the playoffs use to be a HUGE parameter to win MVP in MLB.

[QUOTE=oldgoldy97;17636384]He’s leading his team....to the golf course once the regular season is done.

Funny that MVPs in other leagues almost always lead their teams to winning records. Baseball is the “best” player regardless of team success. Funny thing is, they still have Silver Slugger awards to toot hitters’ horns, too![/QUOTE]

The Jays are currently 3 games back of Boston for the second WC spot.

[QUOTE=rman112;17636385]I'm saying because he has 43 homers, 93 RBI, and a 9-1 record with a 2.97 ERA, he's MVP.[/QUOTE]


I guess what I'm saying is (outside of the HR's) he's been a mediocre hitter and an above-average (what I've been calling "decent") pitcher.

Is it simply the fact that he does both of these things that he gets the nod?

If he had a full season of just this hitting, he doesn't win an MVP.
If he had a full season of just this pitching, he MIGHT win a Cy Young, but definitely not an MVP.

It seems everyone is just enamored by the fact that he does both that he just gets the award regardless of what happens.

[QUOTE=rngrdanny22;17636328]I literally looked and on this page and the one before it, Guerrero was mentioned exactly once in comparison to Ohtani, and it was by rman112 who has been vying for Ohtani the whole time.

I think you just jumped in here to drop one of your patented BBase-isms and failed miserably.[/QUOTE]

Literally 3 posts above this response was someone making the case that Guerrero has a shot and it was not by "rman112"

[QUOTE=rman112;17636390]The Jays are currently 3 games back of Boston for the second WC spot.[/QUOTE]

Point?

[QUOTE=rngrdanny22;17636389]Actually, this is only a recent phenomenon. Making the playoffs use to be a HUGE parameter to win MVP in MLB.[/QUOTE]

Alex Rodriguez has entered the chat

[QUOTE=BBases31;17636399]Literally 3 posts above this response was someone making the case that Guerrero has a shot[/QUOTE]

Are you talking about this one?

[QUOTE=rman112;17636307]He's leading the league in homers, and is tied for 7th in RBI.[/QUOTE]


That's about Ohtani genius....

[QUOTE=ThoseBackPages;17636402]Trout has entered the chat[/QUOTE]
Fixed.

[QUOTE=ThoseBackPages;17636402]Alex Rodriguez has entered the chat[/QUOTE]

Correct. There have been some exceptions for sure, especially in down years or when someone just balls out completely.

[QUOTE=rngrdanny22;17636404]Are you talking about this one?[/QUOTE]

Nope. Try again! :D

[QUOTE=BBases31;17636417]Nope. Try again! :D[/QUOTE]

Please quote it, because that was three posts above my response.

[QUOTE=rngrdanny22;17636396]I guess what I'm saying is (outside of the HR's) he's been a mediocre hitter and an above-average (what I've been calling "decent") pitcher.

Is it simply the fact that he does both of these things that he gets the nod?

If he had a full season of just this hitting, he doesn't win an MVP.
If he had a full season of just this pitching, he MIGHT win a Cy Young, but definitely not an MVP.
[B]
It seems everyone is just enamored by the fact that he does both that he just gets the award regardless of what happens.[/B][/QUOTE]

What do you mean, "regardless of what happens"? He's struggled for a large portion of the second half, and he STILL has more homers than anyone else in baseball.

You're making it seem like he's just been getting by on the lone fact that he does two things.. No, he's thrived. The second half where he hasn't hit well has been a second half where he's pitched well.

Take two really good players, combine them into one, and that's what Ohtani's been this year.

He's got 22 fewer total bases than Guerrero (which doesn't count steals), and 112 innings on the mound for which there is no comparison for Guerrero. I don't know how else to state the totality of Ohtani's season.

[QUOTE=rman112;17636422]What do you mean, "regardless of what happens"? He's struggled for a large portion of the second half, and he STILL has more homers than anyone else in baseball.[/QUOTE]

Why are you so enamored by HR's? That's not the only offensive stat...

[QUOTE=oldgoldy97;17636400]Point?[/QUOTE]

The only two legitimate MVP candidates play for a team that right now, would not make the playoffs.

The Rays have, by far, the best record in baseball. Who ya got for MVP?

[QUOTE=rngrdanny22;17636423]Why are you so enamored by HR's? That's not the only offensive stat...[/QUOTE]

It's literally the best thing you can do in an at-bat.

[QUOTE=rman112;17636426]It's literally the best thing you can do in an at-bat.[/QUOTE]

The ultimate rally killer!

[QUOTE=rman112;17636390]The Jays are currently 3 games back of Boston for the second WC spot.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=rman112;17636424]The only two legitimate MVP candidates play for a team that right now, would not make the playoffs.

The Rays have, by far, the best record in baseball. Who ya got for MVP?[/QUOTE]

Are you making a point or am I supposed to?

[QUOTE=rman112;17636426]It's literally the best thing you can do in an at-bat.[/QUOTE]

That's true, but you don't care that he's hitting .255 with like 170 strikeouts (literally the worst thing you can do in an at-bat)?

Also, he's leading the league by like 2 homeruns. It's not like he's running away with the lead or anything.

[QUOTE=rngrdanny22;17636286]Where in the last two pages has anyone implied that Vlad should be the MVP?

The conversation has been why should Ohtani be the MVP.[/QUOTE]

Why are you debating the mvp merits of ohtani in the vlad thread then if not to do so to push your guy?

I know, let's talk about whether devers should win. Or wait, what about tatis in the NL? See how that makes no sense in the vlad thread? See how discussing ohtani's mvp chances here actually IS implying vlad for mvp? Get it now?

[QUOTE=oldgoldy97;17636429]Are you making a point or am I supposed to?[/QUOTE]

Lol..

[QUOTE=rngrdanny22;17636432]That's true, but you don't care that he's hitting .255 with like 170 strikeouts (literally the worst thing you can do in an at-bat)?[/QUOTE]

Of course it's a negative. You measure it at all. Hitting, pitching, baserunning.

[QUOTE=rngrdanny22;17636346]That is "MVP" in 100 out of the last 100 seasons (except Bonds).[/QUOTE]


What are the chances Vlad gets to 8+ fWAR?

I just eyeballed it back to 2010, and MVP was 8+ every year. With many 9-10+ WAR.

Vlad can get there, I just feel skeptical he’ll hurdle the MVP bar this year, given the distance he’d have to go to get anywhere near Ohtani’s WAR at this point.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk