Another Day, Another Trimmed Card—Avoid this PSA 10 Peyton Manning Auto

[bojesphob]

So here's the devil's advocate question:
If you can't tell it's trimmed, and the grading companies can't tell it's trimmed, and the only way we know it's trimmed is by comparing it to the original card (if we can), does it matter at that point? Yes, yes, I know it's altered, but if you can't tell it's altered, does it really matter then? I mean, if you can tell it's altered (because it's way too small for the type of card/corners that aren't square/etc), I get that. I can understand to a degree trying to get cards in the best condition possible, especially in vintage, but modern stuff has never made sense to me why you'd grade.

[MFaulkCollector]

Originally Posted by bojesphob

So here's the devil's advocate question:
If you can't tell it's trimmed, and the grading companies can't tell it's trimmed, and the only way we know it's trimmed is by comparing it to the original card (if we can), does it matter at that point? Yes, yes, I know it's altered, but if you can't tell it's altered, does it really matter then? I mean, if you can tell it's altered (because it's way too small for the type of card/corners that aren't square/etc), I get that. I can understand to a degree trying to get cards in the best condition possible, especially in vintage, but modern stuff has never made sense to me why you'd grade.

For me it will just be a matter of placing an unaltered base card on top of a card in a graded holder. If the size is legit then it’s fine and I’m satisfied. If it’s short I’ll pass. If someone was lucky enough to trim a slightly oversized card to normal dimensions then so be it. They got lucky and I’ll live not caring in that instance

I like graded cards in my collection, and they offer a legit peace of mind to a buyer if I need to sell. I like submitting, the process is fun with honest anticipation.

I will be excessively aware of buying graded items now and in the future and these thread types have offered invaluable information..... but I’m not going to let it ruin my joy for the hobby and the specific niche areas I try to collect. Everyone will react differently

[altaeria]

Originally Posted by bojesphob

So here's the devil's advocate question:
If you can't tell it's trimmed, and the grading companies can't tell it's trimmed, and the only way we know it's trimmed is by comparing it to the original card (if we can), does it matter at that point?

Trimming is the steroids of sports cards.

Some people hide it really well.
Everybody else hits less home runs.

[Bowman1951]

Originally Posted by goodole13

I don't know, I see where it can be a red flag. But I will be submitting some of my older cards to be reholdered into the new lighthouse holder.

I think the question then becomes, are they already 10's?

If so, are they serial numbered?

And if they are, do they come from a set prone to having issues?

[Bowman1951]

Originally Posted by altaeria

Trimming is the steroids of sports cards.

Some people hide it really well.
Everybody else hits less home runs.

Many forums I've been on always allowed quoting people in their signatures. I tried to take yours and add it because it was so damn good but no dice, doh!

I loved it though, so you should know that.

[altaeria]

Originally Posted by Bowman1951

Many forums I've been on always allowed quoting people in their signatures. I tried to take yours and add it because it was so damn good but no dice, doh!

I loved it though, so you should know that.

Glad you enjoyed it.

This shady mystery trimmer should figure out how to discreetly offer his services (assuming he doesn't already).
I wonder how much people would pay to have their 8s become 10s.

[bewareof94]

What gets me is how does PSA not realize during/after encapsulation when the card has so much space on the left/right sides when placed in the holder. It's easy to tell that there's too much space in the scans, let alone having it in-hand. The card has to be noticeably loose once its encapsulated and probably is freely moving back and forth in the holder when it's moved by human hands

[superdan49]

Originally Posted by bewareof94

What gets me is how does PSA not realize during/after encapsulation when the card has so much space on the left/right sides when placed in the holder. It's easy to tell that there's too much space in the scans, let alone having it in-hand. The card has to be noticeably loose once its encapsulated and probably is freely moving back and forth in the holder when it's moved by human hands

Trust me, I am not making excuses for PSA, but the person who grades the card is not the person who supervises its encapsulation. I assume the graders are higher in the PSA hierarchy, so I imagine the folks who do the actual slabbing wouldn't question something like this.

And yes that steroids quote is spot-on. Like steroids, we will never catch all the cheaters. But the more who are outed the better.

[Scottish Punk]

Originally Posted by bewareof94

What gets me is how does PSA not realize during/after encapsulation when the card has so much space on the left/right sides when placed in the holder. It's easy to tell that there's too much space in the scans, let alone having it in-hand. The card has to be noticeably loose once its encapsulated and probably is freely moving back and forth in the holder when it's moved by human hands

I am guessing, by the time it gets to the encapsulation portion of the process it has passed the card guys. It is only handled by the shippers at that point. They won't know or care about the cards, just get the orders out the door.

[Bowman1951]

Originally Posted by altaeria

Glad you enjoyed it.

This shady mystery trimmer should figure out how to discreetly offer his services (assuming he doesn't already).
I wonder how much people would pay to have their 8s become 10s.

Let's try this out...since I can't use code I can still use plain ol' text!

[altaeria]

If anybody on here works for Beckett, they should run with these examples and plaster them everywhere online- to try and purposely discredit the legitimacy of PSA grading (and bolster their own services).

Of course, I personally don't collect graded stuff or use either services- so I don't know if Beckett is any better.

[3124508 on COMC]

Originally Posted by altaeria

If anybody on here works for Beckett, they should run with these examples and plaster them everywhere online- to try and purposely discredit the legitimacy of PSA grading (and bolster their own services).

Of course, I personally don't collect graded stuff or use either services- so I don't know if Beckett is any better.

LMAO. You're funny.

[superdan49]

I found another trimmed PSA card from the same eBay seller:


https://www.ebay.com/itm/DEREK-JETER...-/293010291879
https://www.worthpoint.com/worthoped...eet-1867513735





Is seller 9999rbush, also known as API Sportscards, a member on BO? With a second trimmed card found, I think it is fair now to demand answers.

[MFaulkCollector]

Originally Posted by superdan49

I found another trimmed PSA card from the same eBay seller:


https://www.ebay.com/itm/DEREK-JETER...-/293010291879
https://www.worthpoint.com/worthoped...eet-1867513735





Is seller 9999rbush, also known as API Sportscards, a member on BO? With a second trimmed card found, I think it is fair now to demand answers.

how inthehell would it be possible to trim all 4 edges on a super thick card like this?....... and then have it pass through grading

it's pretty clear at this point that PSA knows or doesn't measure size for a few select submitters.. pretty wild

[corndog]

The right edge on that Jeter card provides a great reference point to spot the trimming.

The grading companies must implement and actually measure for a minimum size with no allowance for anything under it. In the absolutely rare chance that you pull a card that is under it, well it's under it and that's that - it's called a printing error. Anything that is submitted and fails the minimum is recorded and slabbed as Authentic Undersized only.

Only thing is... they don't have the balls to do it as it would be an admission that their current system is an epic disaster.

Both PSA and Beckett have been proven out to be a cash cow joke.

I would take that glued up Unitas RC in that recent thread any day over a graded copy.

[superdan49]

Originally Posted by corndog

The right edge on that Jeter card provides a great reference point to spot the trimming.

The grading companies must implement and actually measure for a minimum size with no allowance for anything under it. In the absolutely rare chance that you pull a card that is under it, well it's under it and that's that - it's called a printing error. Anything that is submitted and fails the minimum is recorded and slabbed as Authentic Undersized only.

Only thing is... they don't have the balls to do it as it would be an admission that their current system is an epic disaster.

Both PSA and Beckett have been proven out to be a cash cow joke.

I would take that glued up Unitas RC in that recent thread any day over a graded copy.

I believe I've said it before, but a company like SGC has a chance to really use this opportunity to make an impact in the grading market. I think a true premium service with measuring of cards would change the marketplace. Many BO members (myself included) would be willing to consult on this project as well.

[cardmole]

Originally Posted by corndog

The right edge on that Jeter card provides a great reference point to spot the trimming.

The grading companies must implement and actually measure for a minimum size with no allowance for anything under it. In the absolutely rare chance that you pull a card that is under it, well it's under it and that's that - it's called a printing error. Anything that is submitted and fails the minimum is recorded and slabbed as Authentic Undersized only.

Only thing is... they don't have the balls to do it as it would be an admission that their current system is an epic disaster.

Both PSA and Beckett have been proven out to be a cash cow joke.

I would take that glued up Unitas RC in that recent thread any day over a graded copy.

So true...

[palmetto7]

Sad thing is a buddy of mine sent in a few Jeter sps that he bought very early in his career that were never graded. Cards are in great shape and all were deemed unfit for grading by psa because of the size. Factory cut smaller by a hair....but psa is on the lookout for this jssue it seems.

[favre3mvp]

Originally Posted by imbluestreak23

14 year old card in a new lighthouse holder.

Red flag

When I read 14 years...
That hit me pretty hard.

[BAInvestments]

Can you actually block sellers so their cards won't show up in results?

[3124508 on COMC]

Originally Posted by BAInvestments

Can you actually block sellers so their cards won't show up in results?

Yes but it must be done in advanced search settings every time you search. So it really isn’t worth it unless you have specific saved searches. In that case, you can add in the block and resave each search.

[BAInvestments]

Originally Posted by 3124508 on COMC

Yes but it must be done in advanced search settings every time you search. So it really isn’t worth it unless you have specific saved searches. In that case, you can add in the block and resave each search.

Seems like to much work. Creating a system like blocked bidders would be so much easier but I see Ebay's view in not doing that. They want you to see all the auctions so they get their cut when one sells. It would just cause less issues if you could do this.

[jataman2612]

Originally Posted by altaeria

Trimming is the steroids of sports cards.

Some people hide it really well.
Everybody else hits less home runs.

Very true. I like to say grading is the plastic surgery of sports cards. I never invested in grading and never will. I don't see the point of giving a card a "boob job". All this trimming gives me another reason not to get into grading. It's a shame that people go to these extremes to cheat just so they can get a better grade and sell it for more. How do these people sleep at night?

If I ever encased a card, it would be to authenticate and protect vintage cards or IP autos. Otherwise, I have no interest in this. Too much of a chance of being scammed and having cards that are tainted. Give me the actual card in it's original condition all day.

[Scottish Punk]

Until collectors devalue a PSA 10, this will only increase going forward. Too much money on the table otherwise. The condition of a card between a PSA 9 or 10 is negligible at best. The difference in price can be pretty stark.

[jasonm2121]

Interesting that this is a PSA issue a lot, when you look at a Brady Contenders, they reject them when they are not even trimmed, yet actual trimmed cards are getting 10s?