2024 SkyBox Marvel Masterpieces XL

[Tim]

Originally Posted by DynaEtch

Saw a comment posted on a vid about this set along the lines of “UD, stop reprinting my rare cards!”. I do think there is a bit of a legitimate gripe there. It’s like you as a collector get, say a Wolvie vs Sabretooth BSG, limited and rare and numbered /99, then years later UD comes along and is like “Psych! It’s not actually that limited, we’re doubling up the run of that card”. Yes, it’s a big card and not the same, but still it’ll complicate the picture of Wolvie vs Sabretooth BSGs now with more flooding the market (in whatever the version).

UD is kinda making a statement doing this- when you get any limited serial numbered card in marvel now, you have to wonder if it’ll be rehashed years down the road, perhaps in a different form. It sure weakens the concept of limited. In this sense I have mixed feelings about it. But I do think it will be a visually stunning set.

I see this side of it but I think 5x7 is significantly different. More different than, say, the purple parallels (extra 199 copies) of the tier 4 in the original 2016 release. There were extras of gold, purple, orange already in addition to the limited /99 tier 4. Granted this is years later, but again the 5x7 component of this makes it a lot different in my opinion. (Also, look at the baseball reprints Topps does - those don't take away from the originals.)

[fabiani12333]

Originally Posted by DynaEtch

Saw a comment posted on a vid about this set along the lines of “UD, stop reprinting my rare cards!”. I do think there is a bit of a legitimate gripe there. It’s like you as a collector get, say a Wolvie vs Sabretooth BSG, limited and rare and numbered /99, then years later UD comes along and is like “Psych! It’s not actually that limited, we’re doubling up the run of that card”. Yes, it’s a big card and not the same, but still it’ll complicate the picture of Wolvie vs Sabretooth BSGs now with more flooding the market (in whatever the version).

UD is kinda making a statement doing this- when you get any limited serial numbered card in marvel now, you have to wonder if it’ll be rehashed years down the road, perhaps in a different form. It sure weakens the concept of limited. In this sense I have mixed feelings about it. But I do think it will be a visually stunning set.

There can only be a handful of collectors with rarer, more valuable MM16 cards than mine, and I have no problem with UD producing jumbo versions of them. I see them as distinctly different. Collectors will know the difference between standard size and oversize.

I'm interested in seeing how the inserts look. Hopefully, prices aren't ridiculous, because I'd like to buy plenty of them.

[DynaEtch]

Originally Posted by Tim

I see this side of it but I think 5x7 is significantly different. More different than, say, the purple parallels (extra 199 copies) of the tier 4 in the original 2016 release. There were extras of gold, purple, orange already in addition to the limited /99 tier 4. Granted this is years later, but again the 5x7 component of this makes it a lot different in my opinion. (Also, look at the baseball reprints Topps does - those don't take away from the originals.)

I agree, the 5x7 is such a different thing. That’s a good point also about the parallels already in MM16…granted in the same set. I think if UD did what Purplerex above was saying in a straight up standard size reprint set there would be an uproar from the community. This I guess isn’t that bad. But we’ll have to see exactly what it does to prices of MM16’s, only time will tell. I could maybe even see the new revisit spark renewed interest in the ‘originals’ and maybe even boost them price wise…I am not sure how it’s going to play out. But I don’t blame collectors for having a gripe about this.

I’m picturing…what if UD did this again for MM16 even more years down the road? There gets to be a point it brings the limited collectibility of the set into question. Then again, there are reprints of 52 Mantles and 86 Fleer Jordan’s all over the place which are even standard trading card size and don’t take anything way from the originals.

[DynaEtch]

Originally Posted by fabiani12333

There can only be a handful of collectors with rarer, more valuable MM16 cards than mine, and I have no problem with UD producing jumbo versions of them. I see them as distinctly different. Collectors will know the difference between standard size and oversize.

I'm interested in seeing how the inserts look. Hopefully, prices aren't ridiculous, because I'd like to buy plenty of them.

Man you have me interested in what all gems you’re hoarding If I’m not mistaken you posted a Hulk 92 buyback auto in the other thread.

I think I’m in the same boat in terms of your mindset. Actually even besides the 5x7 thing, the Tier 4 base etc likely not impacted at all if these new ones aren’t even numbered. Jusko autos not affected if they aren’t even in this release. The BSG’s /99 (which I recently completed a full set of) could be the ones having a larger impact. Will have to see.

5x7 sketch wise, I already have a few of the good ol hardball34 5x7 holders ready to go that will fit them perfectly, should be awesome. I wonder the rate the sketches will fall, assuming not 1 per box like MM16.

For regular cards, BCW and Ultra Pro do make 5x7 toploaders.

[sfgiants4life]

I agree that this weakens the MM line. I collect MM for the art. If they are saying now that the limited cards that are /99 or less can be reprinted in a larger format for a much cheaper price it will definitely hurt the line. I felt the book hurt the set a little but I think this will hurt the set even more. All those variant /50 tier 4 cards are now going to be reprinted at a more affordable price in a large format with possibly no serial numbers? I may buy some to pickup some of the cards I missed previously but this isn't a good thing.

[fabiani12333]

Originally Posted by sfgiants4life

I agree that this weakens the MM line. I collect MM for the art. If they are saying now that the limited cards that are /99 or less can be reprinted in a larger format for a much cheaper price it will definitely hurt the line. I felt the book hurt the set a little but I think this will hurt the set even more. All those variant /50 tier 4 cards are now going to be reprinted at a more affordable price in a large format with possibly no serial numbers? I may buy some to pickup some of the cards I missed previously but this isn't a good thing.

But don't you think this shows the enduring popularity of 2016 MM? Oversized reprint cards are often done for iconic and popular cards -- like MTG's Black Lotus or Pokemon's Pikachu. Even though it's a gimmick release -- and likely a cash grab -- it allows people to collect unique versions of the cards they love and celebrate them all over again.

[sfgiants4life]

Originally Posted by fabiani12333

But don't you think this shows the enduring popularity of 2016 MM? Oversized reprint cards are often done for iconic and popular cards -- like MTG's Black Lotus or Pokemon's Pikachu. Even though it's a gimmick release -- and likely a cash grab -- it allows people to collect unique versions of the cards they love and celebrate them all over again.

It is popular and iconic but if anyone needs the art we have the book for that. I think this sets a bad precedence that "modern" marvel cards can be reprinted at whim...especially popular limited edition cards. I don't think this set will help or give a bump to the original 2016 set.

They are reprints of art cards. Also it could have a much higher print run than other larger format runs. I haven't bought sports cards in a while but the larger format cards from topps were usually very limited. If this was a print run of 50-100 for each card I would be more accepting of it. But with very few numbered cards this set could flood the market. That makes me uneasy with this set.

I guess...think about it. If they do not keep the tier's and release a bunch of the tier 4 cards do you think it may affect the value of the original 2016 tier 4's? Just like with Pokemon or Magic....release a large Shadowless or Alpha set in large format with a print run that matched a normal release and I think over time it will reduce the value of those sets...and Marvel's base is much smaller than Pokemon or Magic and 2016 MM is only 8 years old. I guess that is why Pokemon and Magic never attempted it before...since everyone likes cash.

[Rictor]

Ultra Pro makes 5x7 Top Loaders.

Oversized cards were all the rage for a while in the nineties. There was no standard size though.

Seems like a good set to just buy your favorite characters and frame them. 5x7 is a standard photo size, so there are lots of frames out there, including multi-frames for 2, 3, or 4 of these in one frame.

[DynaEtch]

I ask myself, what if they did this for 1996 Marvel Masterpieces. A sudden flood of newer versions of that base set just in bigger size. What would I think about that. I don’t know. But one thing is for sure, it does no favors to the collectibility /specialness of that original set. I’m leaning more towards what sfgiants is saying, and a little uneasy about it.

It’s good for buyers/collectors who want more options and possibly cheaper way to collect the set. Not good for sellers.

[PurplesaurusRex]

It's an obvious cash grab, but it's kinda cool and I don't think it's going to hurt values. These are more like prints, not cards. Did the Hardcover book hurt values?

[glorbgorb]

Originally Posted by PurplesaurusRex

It's an obvious cash grab, but it's kinda cool and I don't think it's going to hurt values. These are more like prints, not cards. Did the Hardcover book hurt values?

I agree 100% with this. Plus the vast majority of collectors collect 2.5x3.5 cards not 5x7 cards.

People will buy this because it is a reprint of a great set, but it's not going to do anything to prices of the original release.

[sfgiants4life]

Originally Posted by glorbgorb

I agree 100% with this. Plus the vast majority of collectors collect 2.5x3.5 cards not 5x7 cards.

People will buy this because it is a reprint of a great set, but it's not going to do anything to prices of the original release.

If a tier 4 card is $2k and the reprint is $100 you don’t think this will affect the price of the $2k card? It’s not like there are that many marvel card collectors dropping that kind of money.

Also when the book came out some collectors decided to sell their sets. When I want to look at art I look at the book. The book affected the collectibility of the set. If Marvel released a book and a card set at the same time…when card sets are in the thousands and I guess boxes in the hundreds you don’t think people would ignore the set and focus on the book? At least some of the collectors? Honestly, there is a reason other card companies do not release a full release of large cards of iconic sets. Anyway I guess time will tell but this is not a good look for upper deck. If it was only a handful of cards much less of an issue but a full run including epack? Also they may reissue this set again in the future in another large size or different card stock. With no rules they can do anything.

[Tim]

Originally Posted by sfgiants4life

If a tier 4 card is $2k and the reprint is $100 you don’t think this will affect the price of the $2k card? .

No.....

[HiltonL]

Originally Posted by sfgiants4life

If it was only a handful of cards much less of an issue but a full run including epack?

what does this mean? epacks don't have additional cards excepting achievements and notoriously, certain artists' sketches. Is the XL set also including achievements now?

[PurplesaurusRex]

How many times has AF #15 been reprinted? Or X-men #1? Does it take away from the value of the original?

[glorbgorb]

Originally Posted by sfgiants4life

If a tier 4 card is $2k and the reprint is $100 you don’t think this will affect the price of the $2k card? It’s not like there are that many marvel card collectors dropping that kind of money.

No, because those few Marvel collectors who can drop that kind of money don't want reprints. They want the original.

[sfgiants4life]

Originally Posted by glorbgorb

No, because those few Marvel collectors who can drop that kind of money don't want reprints. They want the original.

Well this marvel collector will take reprints. Maybe they will reprint the mirages and double impact cards. If they do I will definitely be picking those up. Also if they do it for 22 mm then bring it on. I will gladly pick up a set of this if it is mass produced and dumped on the market. I collect it for the art and currently 22 mm is insanely priced.

Also remember…lots of mm cards from that 2016 mm set…in the 1k plus range. How many mm collectors are there that collect in that range? 50? 100? I can’t really see that many since we still have a bunch of base tier 4 cards floating around and cmon…most big collectors should have a set or two of mm base cards right? I think this won’t affect the ones with the best sets but those with a few cards here and there…definitely.

I think this set will affect or make people trade down on their wants. I can’t believe though that so many of you fail to see the possibility that this will negatively affect the 16 mm market or even that it sets a bad precedence for marvel cards going forward. Again if it was a good thing wouldn’t all the other brands/sets be doing this? Anyway at this point only time will tell.

[sfgiants4life]

Originally Posted by PurplesaurusRex

How many times has AF #15 been reprinted? Or X-men #1? Does it take away from the value of the original?

This isn’t one reprint…this is the entire set. If this is printed in the same quantity as a normal mm set run plus epack then I think it affects the market. If it was a random group of cards from each mm set then it wouldn’t be so bad in my view. Like the best 10 cards from each year set or something. But this is 1-100 of the entire 16 mm set plus inserts. Has that happened before anywhere during modern collecting? A iconic set that isn’t that old reprinted in a different format and resold as packs/boxes/cases? Plus it is reprinting it bigger but with the exact same format. If it had some ugly border or something differentiating the card that detracted from it then again it wouldn’t be so bad but this is just bigger but the exact same design as a base card. I got my opinion and you guys all have yours but this is not a good thing for people who already have these mm cards. For those getting into it now it’s good and fun. For the rest not good from a value standpoint. Also with them reprinting cards it makes me pause on picking up anything really high end for me anyway. But enjoy guys let’s meet back in a couple years and see if prices are still great.

[DynaEtch]

I can see both sides of this argument, and I’m mixed on it myself.

Some MM16 have been downtrending with the market anyway, so even if prices for MM16 are deflated a bit over the course of the year, it might be hard to narrow down the exact cause…whether because of these or just the market.

I do think Marvel cards is very much “what is the hottest latest thing”, so there is little question for me that at least temporarily a huge percentage of interest will be geared toward these vs MM16 cards which have been out for 8 years. That’s where the money will be going…this new hot set. Unless there really is that large of an amount of people who will refuse to collect oversized cards.

I’ll likely be collecting it, and happy for a MM related set in big size…but I also don’t think it’ll be doing any favors for my MM16 PC.

[Marvel Card]

As for whether it’ll affect values for 2016, I’m one case but yes it will.

I was thinking of buying a 2016 complete base set for thousands of dollars. I’ve been hesitant to pull trigger because I normally wouldn’t pay that for a base set of any brand. Was planning to do so after the release of 22MM on epack where I thought 2016 values could decline a little more.

Now, I absolutely won’t be paying those thousands of dollars, as I’ll likely be able to pay for a complete base of these reprints for $1.5k at the most. But then again, I’m not nor ever was a buyback collector. I’ll take the original card at a fraction of the price every single time.

[fabiani12333]

I appreciate the discussion in this thread, but I don't see how oversized reprints are going to diminish the values of the originals. If they were identical to the originals or an improvent in some way, I could see that. But it's just a gimmick product primarily tailored to collectors who love and appreciate the original set and Joe Jusko's artwork.

[fabiani12333]

Upper Deck could have inserted oversized cards as box toppers in the original product, and they wouldn't have diminished the value of the standard-sized cards -- they would have complemented them.

The fact that this will be a mass-produced reprint product means they shouldn't hold very high values. I could see a limited release doing that, where they could supplant the originals in value due to rarity.

[fabiani12333]

When these cards hit the secondary market, I could see them causing grief for buyers and sellers alike. Sellers are going to need to make it very clear that these are oversized reprints, because buyers aren't going to be happy if they find out when they get them in hand.

[DynaEtch]

Thought experiment: if UD released the same MM16 set again, in the same 2.5x3.5 size (just with a date of 2024 on the back this time), same tech and all that, what would the thoughts be on that? I think a lot of people would not be a fan of that, obviously cheapening the MM16 set and essentially doubling the ‘limited’ serial number print run. But to those saying reprints don’t impact originals….they shouldn’t care about that and would be fine with UD re-releasing that same set every year for the next 10 years. After all, they look the same but they are NOT the originals. I don’t really agree with that, I think that would collapse the market for MM16, and that’s is why it is not as simple as saying ‘it’s a reprint’. The oversize thing is the much bigger thing here for differentiation, not the reprint aspect.

At the very least, this can and probably will split the buyer pool of MM16. Take a random person looking to get into MM16 and set collect it. They now have 2 options, and will likely stay mainly to one. For those choosing this new oversize set, they could be taken out of the demand equation for MM16 cards. What if you have many people in a similar boat as Marvel Card above like this? Any time you split a buyer pool, and lose demand, prices should come down. The money in this hobby is finite, and some of the MM16 money will now be going towards this. The one thing that might counteract it is if the new set “invigorates interest” back into the MM16s, that could be a wild card.

[BJohns015]

Originally Posted by DynaEtch

I’ll likely be collecting it, and happy for a MM related set in big size…but I also don’t think it’ll be doing any favors for my MM16 PC.

Veering the topic a bit momentarily - Do you have any idea how you plan to store/display this set? I feel like a binder showing 4 cards per page would have to be way too large, but going with a smaller binder that shows 1 card per page would end up quite thick (even though these are normal stock, we'd be talking 90 pages at least just for base).

Is there a product out there for displaying this size?