Patrick Mahomes Prices

[Onepocketj]

If Flores was getting 100k to lose a game, maybe Patty got a few million to lose a half.

[arod305]

Originally Posted by rman112

I think a lot of it is how bad he played. If it was a shootout like in Buffalo and they lost 38-34 and the D couldn't stop Burrow, it'd probably be a lot more tame.

This x10000000. That’s the hardest part to understand. I never dreamed he would allow the chiefs to lose a game like that especially at home in the playoffs.

Hell, never had a doubt even in OT. Figured it was over. Superman bleeds too sometimes I guess

[arod305]

Was a good day to add a Patty or at least I’m telling myself it was.

[Onepocketj]

Originally Posted by arod305

Was a good day to add a Patty or at least I’m telling myself it was.
Attachment 517995

Damn it feels good to be a gangsta

[boxbuster7]

Originally Posted by arod305

Was a good day to add a Patty or at least I’m telling myself it was.
Attachment 517995

Great card. He will come back strong.

[daveyc1]

Originally Posted by Rabs

Dude goes to 4 straight AFC Championship games and everyone calls him a failure.

The start to his career is arguably better than any QB ever. But it seems it isn't good enough for most people. Pretty sad.

that is very debatable. perhaps even a stretch. Otto Graham, Unitas, Staubach and Brady all probably had better starts to their careers.

Mahomes lost 2 AFCCG on his home field, won one SB and got destroyed in the other SB.

Statistically, he saw quite a decline this season. Decision making was suspect at times. Kelce declining also probably hurt him.

[TSonn]

The more I watch the last possession in regulation the more it doesn't make sense. On 2nd down, Mahomes has Hardman open at the left pylon for his first read - a throw he has made dozens of times for TDs/first downs - but Mahomes just looks at him and decides against it. On 3rd down he's got Kelce open first and then Pringle - both are throws he's made dozens of times with success - but he decides against them. Granted, on the 3rd down play his first read is Hill which takes a bit to see it's covered all the way since it's a slant then fade, but still super frustrating. Both of these plays had normal "open" NFL windows - not wide open, not super tight coverage - a normal window with an above average chance at completion.

I don't think Mahomes had the yips at all because that sort of thing would've shown up in any of his epic comebacks and wins over the course of the last 4 years (and specifically would've showed up vs BUF) - but maybe there is something to be said about CIN letting KC get whatever they wanted all first half and then tightening up in the second half.

I'm not sure it was planned by CIN but basically they gave him huge windows in the first half which made for easy picking - then in the second half after CIN adjusted the normal NFL windows that Mahomes is used to seeing and throwing started to look a lot smaller compared to what he saw in the first half. So even though they were still normal open windows, the perception of them was different because of how easy and open things were in the first half. Basically, Mahomes then held onto the ball because he thought huge windows would open up like they did in the first half - but it never happened.

If it was planned that way it's some crazy Belichick-like magic.

[jswest18]

Originally Posted by TSonn

The more I watch the last possession in regulation the more it doesn't make sense. On 2nd down, Mahomes has Hardman open at the left pylon for his first read - a throw he has made dozens of times for TDs/first downs - but Mahomes just looks at him and decides against it. On 3rd down he's got Kelce open first and then Pringle - both are throws he's made dozens of times with success - but he decides against them. Granted, on the 3rd down play his first read is Hill which takes a bit to see it's covered all the way since it's a slant then fade, but still super frustrating. Both of these plays had normal "open" NFL windows - not wide open, not super tight coverage - a normal window with an above average chance at completion.

I don't think Mahomes had the yips at all because that sort of thing would've shown up in any of his epic comebacks and wins over the course of the last 4 years (and specifically would've showed up vs BUF) - but maybe there is something to be said about CIN letting KC get whatever they wanted all first half and then tightening up in the second half.

I'm not sure it was planned by CIN but basically they gave him huge windows in the first half which made for easy picking - then in the second half after CIN adjusted the normal NFL windows that Mahomes is used to seeing and throwing started to look a lot smaller compared to what he saw in the first half. So even though they were still normal open windows, the perception of them was different because of how easy and open things were in the first half. Basically, Mahomes then held onto the ball because he thought huge windows would open up like they did in the first half - but it never happened.

If it was planned that way it's some crazy Belichick-like magic.

Are you talking about the last drive where they kicked the FG to tie it up? Did the Chiefs not run the ball the first 2 plays? Maybe I'm not remembering correctly.

I doubt it was planned. They got into a pretty big hole honestly at 21-3 and at the very least it should have been 24-10 going into half time. That, combined with a FG on the Chiefs' last possession would have been enough to win the game so even though I'm sure they had confidence in their offense to come back, they couldn't have been confident enough to give Mahomes that much in the 1H on purpose. They just made adjustments at halftime to their coverage.

Not to mention, the first drive of the 2H was a game changer in my opinion. Mahomes threw Hill and Kelce two very catchable balls on 2nd and 3rd down, both of which would have been enough for a 1st, and they dropped them. Granted, it was tight coverage but they were balls that should have been caught. If they catch one of those balls and get a 1st down and the Chiefs move the ball on their 1st drive then I think its game over. This was a problem all year and I think led to some of Mahomes' throwing issues. Not only were several of his interceptions from balls that hit receivers in their hands and they couldn't make the catch but once the drop issues started being a regular occurrence, I think Mahomes started tightening up on throws and overthrowing them in an effort to be perfect. That did the opposite though and he was less accurate in several games than he's normally been. Both of those factors probably played a part in his/their collapse in the 2H. I'm not putting all the blame on the receivers by any means. It was on Mahomes not to let that change his game and to stay patient and it's not easy for a receiver to make catches in tight windows.

I think they got a little complacent after the incredible 1H they had and they just assumed they'd be able to drive whenever they wanted. Even though they should have learned differently from their first game against the Bengals. I think when the coverage and plan changed for the Bengals and the windows tightened up and the Chiefs failed to move the ball the first couple of possessions they tightened up. They also seemed to move away from running the ball. In the 1H it seemed that almost every 1st down play was a running play and it allowed the passing game a little more breathing room. In the 2H it seemed nearly every 1st down they were passing the ball. I haven't looked back at the play by play though so this might be incorrect.

[blackbears86]

Originally Posted by TSonn

The more I watch the last possession in regulation the more it doesn't make sense. On 2nd down, Mahomes has Hardman open at the left pylon for his first read - a throw he has made dozens of times for TDs/first downs - but Mahomes just looks at him and decides against it. On 3rd down he's got Kelce open first and then Pringle - both are throws he's made dozens of times with success - but he decides against them. Granted, on the 3rd down play his first read is Hill which takes a bit to see it's covered all the way since it's a slant then fade, but still super frustrating. Both of these plays had normal "open" NFL windows - not wide open, not super tight coverage - a normal window with an above average chance at completion.

I don't think Mahomes had the yips at all because that sort of thing would've shown up in any of his epic comebacks and wins over the course of the last 4 years (and specifically would've showed up vs BUF) - but maybe there is something to be said about CIN letting KC get whatever they wanted all first half and then tightening up in the second half.

I'm not sure it was planned by CIN but basically they gave him huge windows in the first half which made for easy picking - then in the second half after CIN adjusted the normal NFL windows that Mahomes is used to seeing and throwing started to look a lot smaller compared to what he saw in the first half. So even though they were still normal open windows, the perception of them was different because of how easy and open things were in the first half. Basically, Mahomes then held onto the ball because he thought huge windows would open up like they did in the first half - but it never happened.

If it was planned that way it's some crazy Belichick-like magic.

I really don't think this was any magic Belichick thing and honestly his TD's in the first half were all pretty spectacular.

The first TD to hill was epic---he was in a full sprint through the back of the endzone and Patty hit him perfectly in stride and Hill made a fantastic catch

second touchdown was a nice bullet to Kelce

third TD was on a nice scramble rollout and was a difficult outside throw.





second half Patty just tightened up and made some poor throws.

[growdoe]

Originally Posted by blackbears86

I really don't think this was any magic Belichick thing and honestly his TD's in the first half were all pretty spectacular.

The first TD to hill was epic---he was in a full sprint through the back of the endzone and Patty hit him perfectly in stride and Hill made a fantastic catch

second touchdown was a nice bullet to Kelce

third TD was on a nice scramble rollout and was a difficult outside throw.





second half Patty just tightened up and made some poor throws.

Only Mahomes and Hill could of pulled off that specific catch with all the physics involved.

[growdoe]

Brady's retirement annoucement during two-week quiet period leading up to SB was a perfect time to announce. Media has enough time to give Brady the proper attention he deserves, then everyone can turn their attention to the SB and kick off the next NFL era with big-game, elite QB play by Mahomes, Burrow, Jackson, Allen and Herbert, and likely others. Mahomes leads the pack. His leadership and professional poise serves as a role model for the others. They all want to be like him.

I believe its good for long-term growth that Mahomes not become another Brady that dominates the league. The hobby can prosper and grow if fanbases for Bengels, Bills, Chargers and Chiefs all get a SB during the coming years. Yeah, that means Mahomes may not win another SB for 2-3 years, but I'm fine with that.

I was solely focusing on Mahomes, but Burrow's triumph has me seeing the value in multiple young QBs winning SBs which grows the rivalries and hobby. The tide is rising in the NFL and we all can float higher if we spread the glory around.

[blackbears86]

Originally Posted by growdoe

Only Mahomes and Hill could of pulled off that specific catch with all the physics involved.

Agree. For anyone who hasn't seen it, they should watch that play. Patty at his absolute best ---that throw and catch was money.

[blackbears86]

Originally Posted by growdoe

Brady's retirement annoucement during two-week quiet period leading up to SB was a perfect time to announce. Media has enough time to give Brady the proper attention he deserves, then everyone can turn their attention to the SB and kick off the next NFL era with big-game, elite QB play by Mahomes, Burrow, Jackson, Allen and Herbert, and likely others. Mahomes leads the pack. His leadership and professional poise serves as a role model for the others. They all want to be like him.

I believe its good for long-term growth that Mahomes not become another Brady that dominates the league. The hobby can prosper and grow if fanbases for Bengels, Bills, Chargers and Chiefs all get a SB during the coming years. Yeah, that means Mahomes may not win another SB for 2-3 years, but I'm fine with that.

I was solely focusing on Mahomes, but Burrow's triumph has me seeing the value in multiple young QBs winning SBs which grows the rivalries and hobby. The tide is rising in the NFL and we all can float higher if we spread the glory around.

I also look at it bringing out the competitive fire in Patty. Hopefully, he will elevate his game even more.

[JoeAdam]

Picked up a couple lower end Red's recently. Love the look of them and all of these were less than $175 each. Cheap/Fun way to collect Mahomes.

[growdoe]

Originally Posted by blackbears86

[/B]





Agree. For anyone who hasn't seen it, they should watch that play. Patty at his absolute best ---that throw and catch was money.

The view from directly behind the QB is the best. Same for that 10-yard side-arm pass CURVING pass to Hill during Colts game, 2nd quarter with 7 min to go. You have to see it from camera view behind Mahomes to see what I believe is a slider pass.

[21stguy]

Originally Posted by Rabs

Dude goes to 4 straight AFC Championship games and everyone calls him a failure.

The start to his career is arguably better than any QB ever. But it seems it isn't good enough for most people. Pretty sad.

He can go to as many championship games as he wants, his cards are priced like he won several rings already. He certainly has all the talent in the world, yet nobody cares until results confirm that (except hyped, inflated prices having 3-4 rings priced in already).

2nd half was simply horrible, especially on decisions he made, the INT, the almost INT, the fumble (although recovered it was 100% on him) - I guess that‘s what scares people a bit or at least let them think twice.

If you play like a god in first half and mess up in 2nd like he did, it‘s not exactly worth much :-(

[blackbears86]

Originally Posted by 21stguy

He can go to as many championship games as he wants, his cards are priced like he won several rings already. He certainly has all the talent in the world, yet nobody cares until results confirm that (except hyped, inflated prices having 3-4 rings priced in already).

2nd half was simply horrible, especially on decisions he made, the INT, the almost INT, the fumble (although recovered it was 100% on him) - I guess that‘s what scares people a bit or at least let them think twice.

If you play like a god in first half and mess up in 2nd like he did, it‘s not exactly worth much :-(

I agree with you, he was terrible in the second half, but let me ask you this: You are a GM, you have one QB to pick for the next ten years. Who are you going to pick?



Even with all the talent in the NFL these days, it's Patty 24/7. He can make any throw you want: deep, shallow, scrambling. It's always Patrick Mahomes.

[Rabs]

Originally Posted by 21stguy

He can go to as many championship games as he wants, his cards are priced like he won several rings already. He certainly has all the talent in the world, yet nobody cares until results confirm that (except hyped, inflated prices having 3-4 rings priced in already).

2nd half was simply horrible, especially on decisions he made, the INT, the almost INT, the fumble (although recovered it was 100% on him) - I guess that‘s what scares people a bit or at least let them think twice.

If you play like a god in first half and mess up in 2nd like he did, it‘s not exactly worth much :-(

Everyone knows he had a terrible 2nd half. But his resume since actually starting in the NFL is pretty spectacular.

Forget what card prices are. I understand this is a card forum but not everything is about cards on here.

[TSonn]

2017 Optic Base PSA 10 is up above some sales after the BUF game now.

[imbluestreak23]

I just had two triple patty In-and-Out protein style for my Mahomes. Feeling fat and sad that football is 7 months away

[cardguy14]

Originally Posted by TSonn

2017 Optic Base PSA 10 is up above some sales after the BUF game now.

Getting shilled. Just looked and 3/4 buyers have been 0 feedback. Manipulation.

[2010GBPackers]

Originally Posted by blackbears86

I agree with you, he was terrible in the second half, but let me ask you this: You are a GM, you have one QB to pick for the next ten years. Who are you going to pick?


Even with all the talent in the NFL these days, it's Patty 24/7. He can make any throw you want: deep, shallow, scrambling. It's always Patrick Mahomes.

I don't think anyone would disagree with your post, but that's not what 21stguy's point was. Mahomes is priced at 3+ SB rings. You and everyone here knows this. And that is where things get tricky.

Kansas City is coming off 4 straight years of going to the AFC Championship - I think we can all agree this is this team's (as currently constituted) peak. Whether or not you believe they're still in that window and have another 1 year left is debatable. However, who in their right mind thinks that KC will be able to replicate this 4-year stretch two more times? Three more times? - because that is what it'll take. They just had one of the most incredible runs in NFL history and have one ring to show for it. That's how difficult winning is in the NFL. Oh, and it's only going to get more difficult. We really need to stop with the, "yeah, but the Patriots...." That ain't happening again, folks. Best case scenario, Mahomes gets two more SB rings, but the odds are that he'll get one more or none at all. That's the reality. Buy accordingly.

Originally Posted by Rabs

Everyone knows he had a terrible 2nd half. But his resume since actually starting in the NFL is pretty spectacular.

Forget what card prices are. I understand this is a card forum but not everything is about cards on here.

Yes, however, this is literally the "Mahomes Prices" thread.

[pcptrade]

Originally Posted by 2010GBPackers

I don't think anyone would disagree with your post, but that's not what 21stguy's point was. Mahomes is priced at 3+ SB rings.

I am not disagreeing but let me play devil's advocate. Joe Burrow NT RPA BGS 9 is currently at 62K with BP at Goldin with 4 days left. He has not won a SB yet. Perhaps the whole market dynamics has changed with lot of new money coming in. Perhaps people willing to pay six figures for someone's RC who has not won a ring yet is the new norm.

[Zauron]

Originally Posted by jswest18

Are you talking about the last drive where they kicked the FG to tie it up? Did the Chiefs not run the ball the first 2 plays? Maybe I'm not remembering correctly.

They ran on 1st down to about the 5 yard line, then 2 passes. Mahomes got sacked on 2nd down to the 9, then the infamous 3rd down sack.

Mahomes prices in the summer of 2019 spiked to prices like he won a couple Super Bowls already and a couple MVP's. Many people knew it, but that is the new market. His base Optic jumped from $200 to $1200+ in a matter of 6ish months. It honestly doesn't look like he will drop in value at all though unless I guess he has a major disastrous season or major injury.

I also don't get the notion that Kelce declined, he had 90 catches, 1100 yards and 9 TD's out of the TE position. What is going to be interesting is what the Chiefs do with Hardman after next season as he will be a free agent. Orlando Brown is a free agent, and the Cheifs have cap space of about $5million right now.

I guess Frank Clark could be cut to save $14 million and be able to resign Brown, and some other moves to free up space, but that is going to hurt. Mathiue is a free agent as well, Ward is a free agent, McKinnon is a free agent, Ingram is a free agent. Ward and McKinnon are not studs but solid role players IMO.

[2010GBPackers]

Originally Posted by pcptrade

I am not disagreeing but let me play devil's advocate. Joe Burrow NT RPA BGS 9 is currently at 62K with BP at Goldin with 4 days left. He has not won a SB yet. Perhaps the whole market dynamics has changed with lot of new money coming in. Perhaps people willing to pay six figures for someone's RC who has not won a ring yet is the new norm.

Oh, I absolutely agree. All of these new, young QB's are overpriced. It's insanity, really.