Target Online Sales Thread

[ATeamHasNoName]

I think it’s been started before but it doesn’t sounds like online pickup for cards can/will be a thing unless there’s a dramatic change in how/who handles them since it’s currently 3rd-party. Not sure target is willing to invest in restructuring all that for us lol

Did notice that some buttons say “Add for shipping” vs “Add to cart” but i think that’s just a consistency issue and doesn’t serve a purpose…

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[actionbryan]

When are we getting more online drops ? I don’t even care / accept that I won’t get the in demand stuff

Heritage and hockey are fine

[wxguy44]

Originally Posted by actionbryan

When are we getting more online drops ? I don’t even care / accept that I won’t get the in demand stuff

Heritage and hockey are fine

Guess we'll have to wait until 3pm and see if Walmart can do a surprise drop we can miraculously score manually.

[Charmcity81]

Without a bot/ or being member of discord group. You have less then 5% to score. Why, those members our pinged 5min before the product is released live online. The person or team who created the software application, has the url, where it’s live and only they can see it.

Good luck if Walmart does a surprise 3pm drop.

This info is very basic, articles you read online, how bots destroy retail. Editor or the interview is only gushing about how they can beat the system. Buying proxies, VPN servers, creating code to phish the website means nothing. Any True cyber security expert only has to look at the orders. AIO, and other cook Groups can’t beat that. It’s a cat and mouse game.


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[wxguy44]

Originally Posted by Charmcity81

Without a bot/ or being member of discord group. You have less then 5% to score. Why, those members our pinged 5min before the product is released live online. The person or team who created the software application, has the url, where it’s live and only they can see it.

Good luck if Walmart does a surprise 3pm drop.

This info is very basic, articles you read online, how bots destroy retail. Editor or the interview is only gushing about how they can beat the system. Buying proxies, VPN servers, creating code to phish the website means nothing. Any True cyber security expert only has to look at the orders. AIO, and other cook Groups can’t beat that. It’s a cat and mouse game.


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IDK why you keep coming in here. What else can anyone on the BO forums do? AFAIK, none of us are in elected positions that can push legislation to expand the BOTS Act. Do we send messages of concern to our local leaders? The congresspeople that put together the BOTS Act? Federal Trade Commission? I can imagine most of these folks have other primary issues of concern, and not non-essential items. Though certainly you can argue that botting could easily move to essential items, or items that could cause disruption. Do we try and find a reporter or media representative to do a detailed story that *may* drum up interest in the subject?

I'm all for actually putting in a real coordinated effort to help curb retail bots. But to come on here spouting off broken English and typo garbled mumbo jumbo isn't helping anyone.

[salthill]

Originally Posted by wxguy44

IDK why you keep coming in here.
…
I'm all for actually putting in a real coordinated effort to help curb retail bots. But to come on here spouting off broken English and typo garbled mumbo jumbo isn't helping anyone.

They’re the BO manifestation of a little knowledge being a dangerous thing. Or a PBM trolling. Likely both.

[Charmcity81]

I’m going to explain it the other way. Before last month, Target and Walmart new for the past 8 months resellers would sit all day waiting for the vendors, stalk vendors, back door and buy out the entire inventory. Both retailers could care less about the safety of there employees, customers, excel and Anderson merchandiser’s. They could of made a change months ago, limiting product onsite. Only reason these retailers stop selling product at there location. Something dramatic happened, and it finally blew up in there face. Bottom line, this is the truth. Doesn’t matter if your background is in cyber security working in public or Federal sector. There all lazy ! Trust me, there smart, they know there’s a problem.


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[Onepocketj]

Originally Posted by Charmcity81

I’m going to explain it the other way. Before last month, Target and Walmart new for the past 8 months resellers would sit all day waiting for the vendors, stalk vendors, back door and buy out the entire inventory. Both retailers could care less about the safety of there employees, customers, excel and Anderson merchandiser’s. They could of made a change months ago, limiting product onsite. Only reason these retailers stop selling product at there location. Something dramatic happened, and it finally blew up in there face. Bottom line, this is the truth. Doesn’t matter if your background is in cyber security working in public or Federal sector. There all lazy ! Trust me, there smart, they know there’s a problem.


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This grammar/spelling hurts to read. Wow

[cspaced25]

Originally Posted by Charmcity81

I’m going to explain it the other way.

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Please don't.

[Doc Awesome]

We need a Bbases31 vs CharmCity debate ASAP.

[ATeamHasNoName]

Originally Posted by Doc Awesome

We need a Bbases31 vs CharmCity debate ASAP.

But take it elsewhere (different thread)


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[BBases31]

Originally Posted by Doc Awesome

We need a Bbases31 vs CharmCity debate ASAP.

What's there to debate? All he's doing is explaining how they do it and how easily it could be stopped.

Originally Posted by AstrosFan17

It ABSOLUTELY IS if the reason you're not able to is because others are cheating the system. This is something my parents taught me from the time I could understand language and I'm afraid for society if adults out in the world don't see that.

I asked this question to one of the other people and didn't get answer: Where is the line drawn on what's an acceptable site or store rule to not follow? Every single line of Terms of Service must be followed to the T or you're being unethical? I have no idea what's in there but considering most are the length of a book I'd imagine there's some silly rules in there that no one would consider unethical if broken

[jduds]

Originally Posted by BBases31

What's there to debate? All he's doing is explaining how they do it and how easily it could be stopped.



I asked this question to one of the other people and didn't get answer: Where is the line drawn on what's an acceptable site or store rule to not follow? Every single line of Terms of Service must be followed to the T or you're being unethical? I have no idea what's in there but considering most are the length of a book I'd imagine there's some silly rules in there that no one would consider unethical if broken

Bot users are not ignorant of the fact that they are violating the rules as set forth in the TOS. The length of the TOS or the fact that no one reads them is irrelevant for well publicized known rules. I don’t have much issue with the concept of bots, but I have major issues with the spamming of bots to buy out stock in seconds. The only salve for their consciences should be the fact that at least they aren’t acting illegally (yet). As it is, they wantonly break (not skirt or bend) the rules and adapt when rules are changed to target them. I could even get behind that if they were fixing some market inefficiency or producing some good for the hobby, but they don’t.


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[BBases31]

Originally Posted by jduds

I could even get behind that if they were fixing some market inefficiency

Is it not fixing an inefficiency to buy a stack of under market product and quickly turnaround to offer all that product back to the public at market price?

But same question to you, where's the line on store rules that aren't ok to break?

[AstrosFan17]

Originally Posted by BBases31

Is it not fixing an inefficiency to buy a stack of under market product and quickly turnaround to offer all that product back to the public at market price?

But same question to you, where's the line on store rules that aren't ok to break?

no... that's the definition of profiteering, which IS illegal in some segments of the market. They are SETTING the market by buying up everything and only selling it for the higher price.

[AstrosFan17]

Originally Posted by BBases31

What's there to debate? All he's doing is explaining how they do it and how easily it could be stopped.



I asked this question to one of the other people and didn't get answer: Where is the line drawn on what's an acceptable site or store rule to not follow? Every single line of Terms of Service must be followed to the T or you're being unethical? I have no idea what's in there but considering most are the length of a book I'd imagine there's some silly rules in there that no one would consider unethical if broken

That's an easy question to answer. It is unethical to break a rule if it gives you an unfair advantage over another person. Easy as that.

[txrngr34]

Originally Posted by AstrosFan17

That's an easy question to answer. It is unethical to break a rule if it gives you an unfair advantage over another person. Easy as that.

I'm not a bot user...hell, I can barely get my router to function properly.

But I think I get his point.

Who determines what is considered unfair? Is it unfair just because most people don't know how to build a bot or have means to buy one?

Personally, I hate that I can't find Mega boxes at retail because it's one of my favorites. But I also simply refuse to pay 3-5x retail to acquire them aftermarket.

What's the root of the problem? Is it that we can't buy direct from Target, or is that if we want it we have to pay ridiculous prices?

I'd venture to say it's the latter. I would pay +25% markup on something aftermarket if I like it - like Mega boxes. Sell me one for $38 and I'll buy it - I'll buy at least 6. And I don't care if it's from Target, where I tend to shop regularly already, or SneakerJoeONeBay.

So the real problem, as I see it, is price gouging - which I know has been mentioned. Price gouging is unethical by virtually all general sales standards and illegal in many cases when it comes to necessities - which, baseball cards are obviously not.

I don't care that you found a competitive advantage to acquire. I care that you're exploiting that advantage in an unfair manner (price gouging).

And for the bot users/defenders: the reason your pricing is unfair is because by using a competitive advantage, you have now virtually cornered the market - aka monopolizing - so you're artificially dictating market value. The market itself is no longer dictating prices.

This is why I simply don't buy at ridiculous markups. But as long as there are deep pockets out there, this will continue.

[BBases31]

Originally Posted by txrngr34

And for the bot users/defenders: the reason your pricing is unfair is because by using a competitive advantage, you have now virtually cornered the market - aka monopolizing - so you're artificially dictating market value. The market itself is no longer dictating prices.

They don't control the market though, not even close. For what you're saying to be true, there'd have to be a handful of people or entities(say 3 or 4) that control the ENTIRE of supply for a product(hundreds of thousands of boxes) and then those people would all have to price at the same price, never deviate from each other, never auction their goods, and not lower their price.

That's just not reality at all. EBay is the market. Have you ever seen the day after something like Sapphire goes on sale? There's a bunch of absurd BINs posted and then within an hour starts an immediate undercutting race to the bottom on pricing and settles around wherever price boxes are moving regularly.

That's an unmonopolized as it gets.

[AstrosFan17]

Anyway... back on topic. I still have not seen anything drop on Target.com since the May 14th announcement. I know they used to push some products out at 5PM Eastern back before COVID, did that change to only 8AM?

[theshowandme]

This thread has me questioning the United States education system.

[Archimedes]

Wow, reading this is really something. I've never used a bot and wish there were no bots, but I don't understand the ethical arguments at all. Rules don't define ethics by virtue of the fact that they're rules. Just because a store makes a rule doesn't mean that it's somehow knitted moral fabric. If Target were to say that everyone who enters needs to wear a red hat, and you enter without a red hat, are you being unethical? What if a store mandated that you engage in an unethical act upon entry? Are you being unethical if you don't do that unethical act because that's what the store told you to do?

[AstrosFan17]

Originally Posted by Archimedes

Wow, reading this is really something. I've never used a bot and wish there were no bots, but I don't understand the ethical arguments at all. Rules don't define ethics by virtue of the fact that they're rules. Just because a store makes a rule doesn't mean that it's somehow knitted moral fabric. If Target were to say that everyone who enters needs to wear a red hat, and you enter without a red hat, are you being unethical? What if a store mandated that you engage in an unethical act upon entry? Are you being unethical if you don't do that unethical act because that's what the store told you to do?

It is unethical to break a rule if it gives you an unfair advantage over another person. Easy as that.

[jkampis]

Originally Posted by Archimedes

Wow, reading this is really something. I've never used a bot and wish there were no bots, but I don't understand the ethical arguments at all. Rules don't define ethics by virtue of the fact that they're rules. Just because a store makes a rule doesn't mean that it's somehow knitted moral fabric. If Target were to say that everyone who enters needs to wear a red hat, and you enter without a red hat, are you being unethical? What if a store mandated that you engage in an unethical act upon entry? Are you being unethical if you don't do that unethical act because that's what the store told you to do?

I feel dumber after having just read that. Maybe if I put on a red hat I’ll feel smarter.

[Archimedes]

Originally Posted by jkampis

I feel dumber after having just read that. Maybe if I put on a red hat I’ll feel smarter.

Sorry it's over your head.

[jkampis]

Originally Posted by Archimedes

Sorry it's over your head.

Heh, yeah, that’s surely the reason.