What will it take for Joker to be in top 10 conversation?

[6celtics33]

Originally Posted by jcardstore

IÂ’ll bring out the Kobe hate a little bit here but his teams were insanely stacked with and without Shaq. HeÂ’s got the rings, the accolades, the hype but still is borderline top 10

And gets credit for one averaging 15 on 35%

[wiper]

Originally Posted by yiguiri2002

He'll be lucky to stay in the Top 100

c’mon, yoguiri2002

i remember dwight howard being left off the nba75. same position so it’s a good comp, you’re saying he’s at least 20 spots higher than joker?

[6celtics33]

Saying top 10 carries with it a certain level. I’ve said before we need to raise the saying from top 10 to top 15 to have the same reverence with it. The order can be varied but people get so upset if their guy isn’t top tier. I think the tier needs more spots. Just like the nba at 50 is now the nba at 75.

Jokic is in the mix and has plenty of time left to add to it. His game should age well. But it should t be an insult to say he’s on the Moses tier. Which is someone who won 3 MVP’s and literally took it to Kareem in their matchups. Like why is that an insult.

Basketball fans have no sense of history. Everything in the past sucks if you like now. Thats just not true.

[mjekase]

Originally Posted by 6celtics33

But it should t be an insult to say he’s on the Moses tier. Which is someone who won 3 MVP’s and literally took it to Kareem in their matchups. Like why is that an insult.

Most likely because they're not familiar with Moses.

[boxbuster7]

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

Netenyahu-Hamas conflict making Yoker town hall debates look like the Battle of the Bulge.




Ya'll wildin.


Hotel shill's still currently the best player in the game, and the Nugs still aren't anywhere close to sniffing a dynasty.

As per the top 10 debate, we're a long ways off that right now. But he's got plenty of time to change that.


My concern is more focused on Daeve atm. If you have a humanitarian bone in your body, you'd be putting out the APB as well.

[mc1]

Originally Posted by 6celtics33

Jokic is in the mix and has plenty of time left to add to it. His game should age well. But it should t be an insult to say he’s on the Moses tier. Which is someone who won 3 MVP’s and literally took it to Kareem in their matchups. Like why is that an insult.

Basketball fans have no sense of history. Everything in the past sucks if you like now. Thats just not true.

Its an insult because Moses is what, top 25 or top 20. Moses is not in the top 10 and being barely top 20 isnt where Jokic lovers want him to be.

[jcardstore]

I’ll put it this way. Jokic with 3 titles, under any circumstances, is a no doubt top 10 at that point

[yiguiri2002]

Originally Posted by jcardstore

I’ll put it this way. Jokic with 3 titles, under any circumstances, is a no doubt top 10 at that point

I mentioned before that looking at who's on bottom on most relevant stats, Joker would need 1 more title and 4 more All-NBA teams to be the "worst" of the Top 10 guys (assuming Kobe/Hakeem/Curry are all tied for the 10th spot).

But one thing to consider is that all of them were the best player on the team in at least 2 title runs. If this version of Denver doesn't win and Joker gets traded to be someone's sidekick, will 3 titles be enough?

[jcardstore]

Originally Posted by yiguiri2002

I mentioned before that looking at who's on bottom on most relevant stats, Joker would need 1 more title and 4 more All-NBA teams to be the "worst" of the Top 10 guys (assuming Kobe/Hakeem/Curry are all tied for the 10th spot).

But one thing to consider is that all of them were the best player on the team in at least 2 title runs. If this version of Denver doesn't win and Joker gets traded to be someone's sidekick, will 3 titles be enough?

I was assuming he’s the best player. If he becomes like a 1b or a 2? Gonna need more than 3. Cause that’s Kobe range.

Curry was the best player for all 4 despite only having 1 FMVP.

Hakeem was the best for his 2

Kobe was the best for at least 2

[Qman316]

Originally Posted by jcardstore

I was assuming he’s the best player. If he becomes like a 1b or a 2? Gonna need more than 3. Cause that’s Kobe range.

Curry was the best player for all 4 despite only having 1 FMVP.

Hakeem was the best for his 2

Kobe was the best for at least 2

Curry was the best for 2 of the 4(the first and the last title) but Durant was the best for the other 2.

[yiguiri2002]

Originally Posted by Qman316

Curry was the best for 2 of the 4(the first and the last title) but Durant was the best for the other 2.

That one is arguable. But Curry was the best player in at least 2 of his 4 championships.

[jcardstore]

Originally Posted by Qman316

Curry was the best for 2 of the 4(the first and the last title) but Durant was the best for the other 2.

Yea best is arguable. But Curry was definitely not a sidekick to Durant.

Durant joined the best team and player in the league to get his titles

[rhigh2390]

Originally Posted by eastbayak

Ironically, this group doesn't even acknowledge the team-friendly contract that Pippen signed that gave the Bulls a significantly greater advantage than other 90s teams.

Basically had a Bulls super team, then "evenly distributed" talent among the remaining non-Bulls teams lol.

Do you ever get tired of posting the exact same argument every time? We get it. You believe Jordan was carried by a 16 ppg sidekick for his career.

[Kobefan]

Originally Posted by jcardstore

I was assuming he’s the best player. If he becomes like a 1b or a 2? Gonna need more than 3. Cause that’s Kobe range.

Curry was the best player for all 4 despite only having 1 FMVP.

Hakeem was the best for his 2

Kobe was the best for at least 2

So how many does Kareem have as the best player?

Originally Posted by jcardstore

Yea best is arguable. But Curry was definitely not a sidekick to Durant.

Durant joined the best team and player in the league to get his titles

Can we also say that Lebron joined Dwade to get his titles?

[Chris P]

Originally Posted by Kobefan

So how many does Kareem have as the best player?



Can we also say that Lebron joined Dwade to get his titles?

No because Dwade wasnt the best player in the league and the Heat weren't even close to being the best team at the time when Lebron joined

[hermanotarjeta]

Conversely, you could ask how often one was the best player in the finals and lost.

[pcptrade]

Originally Posted by hermanotarjeta

Conversely, you could ask how often one was the best player on their team and did not make it to the playoffs.

FTFY

[Kobefan]

Originally Posted by Chris P

No because Dwade wasnt the best player in the league and the Heat weren't even close to being the best team at the time when Lebron joined

Can you really claim that Curry was the best player when Durant won the Finals MVP? I'm not against that claim, if the same claim is made for other players as well. Also, Heat may not be the best team, but Lebron did bring another star with him to form a superteam, so not much different.

[hermanotarjeta]

Originally Posted by pcptrade

FTFY

But every team that misses the playoffs has a player like that every year.

Only two teams make the finals and if you are the best player on the court and lose, that says something more important.

[mc1]

Originally Posted by Kobefan

Can you really claim that Curry was the best player when Durant won the Finals MVP? I'm not against that claim, if the same claim is made for other players as well. Also, Heat may not be the best team, but Lebron did bring another star with him to form a superteam, so not much different.

Bosh and Wade were superstars? I wonder how many playoff series they won the 3-4 years they were leading their teams on their own?!

[jcardstore]

Originally Posted by Kobefan

Can you really claim that Curry was the best player when Durant won the Finals MVP

Yes you can.

[Chris P]

Originally Posted by Kobefan

Can you really claim that Curry was the best player when Durant won the Finals MVP? I'm not against that claim, if the same claim is made for other players as well. Also, Heat may not be the best team, but Lebron did bring another star with him to form a superteam, so not much different.

Durant was the Finals MVP because he was able to play with bar none the greatest shooter the league has ever seen not to mention a still in his prime Klay..because Durant is an amazing scorer himself it was THAT much easier when teams had to chose who to focus on stopping. Curry and Klay made KD's life easier which is why he was able to put up the numbers he did. I'm not taking anything away from KD's talent...it just is what it is..you don't agree ..that's fine..your opinion

[Kobefan]

Originally Posted by mc1

Bosh and Wade were superstars? I wonder how many playoff series they won the 3-4 years they were leading their teams on their own?!

I said stars, not superstars. I don't think Bosh is a superstar, as for wade, it depends on your definition of a superstar, but both are darn good players, hasn't there been many great players who haven't won a playoff series?

Originally Posted by Chris P

Durant was the Finals MVP because he was able to play with bar none the greatest shooter the league has ever seen not to mention a still in his prime Klay..because Durant is an amazing scorer himself it was THAT much easier when teams had to chose who to focus on stopping. Curry and Klay made KD's life easier which is why he was able to put up the numbers he did. I'm not taking anything away from KD's talent...it just is what it is..you don't agree ..that's fine..your opinion

Yes, Curry and Klay made it easier for KD, but can't the same be said about KD making it easier for Curry as well? I feel like the logic is going in circles, but ultimately one stepped up more than the other in the finals, if we are going to judge the best player by finals performances only.

[mc1]

Originally Posted by pcptrade

FTFY

From 2006-07 to 2009-10 Bosh and Wade didnt make the playoffs 3 of 8 seasons. The other 5 they lost in the 1st round. Lebron was doing a whole lot better than that.

[calmar]

"So how many does Kareem have as the best player?"

Answer: Two or three, depending on whether you think he or Magic was better in 1982. (Advanced stats suggest they were about equal.) But there's no question that Kareem was the best player on the 1971 and 1980 NBA Champions, Magic's great Game 6 in 1980 notwithstanding. People forget, but Kareem had six titles in the modern era, the only all-time great besides Jordan and Pippen who can say that. He also was the best player in the NBA for essentially the entire decade of the 1970s.