WWE Discussion thread- Raw/SD/PPV

[rcgdodge]

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

Bayley/Sasha from Takeover is in my top 5 matches of all-time. Ember Moon/Asuka was also terrific from one Takeover.

They just don't give them the platform on the main roster.

Wasn't the Women's Rumble just the main event?

I think they get more than their share of camera time.

[gorillaz]

Originally Posted by Jaypers

He'd make a good ring announcer for them; clear, concise voice.

He's the man that made the Broken gimmick work so well in TNA.

[ThaReal1]

Originally Posted by rcgdodge

Wasn't the Women's Rumble just the main event?

I think they get more than their share of camera time.

Let's not be silly. It was the main event because WWE dropped the ball again and thinks Rousey is actually still worth something

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[JustinVerlander07]

Originally Posted by rcgdodge

Wasn't the Women's Rumble just the main event?

I think they get more than their share of camera time.

They literally buried Bayley because they stripped her of everything people cheered her for in NXT, they've made Sasha almost irrelevant doing the same thing. Every woman except maybe Bliss and Carmella are less over now than they were when they came up from NXT, that's a problem.

[scfa1975]

I love how some rip on The Miz for his skills. Im not saying he's the best but he is there pretty much every week defending the title or showing it off and actually competing. Where's Brock....he only makes his face known in the ring about 3 weeks before an event. At least guys like Miz, AJ Styles, Roode actually come to work.

As for the Kane & Braun match. I wish it would end already. Even my 5 yr old son thinks its a joke. He watched the table flipped then laughed as he saw Kane's leg sticking out.

[Bob Loblaw]

Originally Posted by Jaypers

He'd make a good ring announcer for them; clear, concise voice.

He does a lot more than ring announcing.

[Jericho]

Originally Posted by Wolves4Life

WWE needs to tell Sasha to tone it down. If she doesn't, Cut her. No loss. Emma was a bigger loss than Sasha would be.

I actually agree with this. I thought Emma vs Asuka > Sasha vs Asuka.

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

They literally buried Bayley because they stripped her of everything people cheered her for in NXT, they've made Sasha almost irrelevant doing the same thing. Every woman except maybe Bliss and Carmella are less over now than they were when they came up from NXT, that's a problem.

Well honestly though alot of gimmicks in NXT just dont work on the main roster. Its a different fan than NXT. Many who watch WWE dont watch NXT at all so they dont get some of the people. Bayley was doomed on the main roster, I knew that before she ever got brought up.

[ThaReal1]

Originally Posted by Jericho

I actually agree with this. I thought Emma vs Asuka > Sasha vs Asuka.

It should have been...it was on a PPV.

Sasha is still the best women character they have if they let her work heel.

She has never been given a shot to work heel. Ever since she came up, she was stuck to team BAD and her whole singles run has been face. Ruined everything about her.

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[JustinVerlander07]

Originally Posted by Jericho

I actually agree with this. I thought Emma vs Asuka > Sasha vs Asuka.





Well honestly though alot of gimmicks in NXT just dont work on the main roster. Its a different fan than NXT. Many who watch WWE dont watch NXT at all so they dont get some of the people. Bayley was doomed on the main roster, I knew that before she ever got brought up.

Look at the pop Bayley got when she made her PPV debut, look at her now.

Look at Sasha's pop at her first Mania, look at her now.

They've both lost all their steam.

[mikecamp99]

Originally Posted by Jericho

Well honestly though alot of gimmicks in NXT just dont work on the main roster. Its a different fan than NXT. Many who watch WWE dont watch NXT at all so they dont get some of the people. Bayley was doomed on the main roster, I knew that before she ever got brought up.

She was doomed because they don't know how to book her. They don't know how to book any of these guys. Even the guys who are doing well and getting over get ridiculous booking ideas. AJ Styles having to cut just atrocious promos on "Kami," Ugh. If some of these guys could be themselves instead of having every word and move scripted for them, then maybe they could get over a little bit more.

People need to stop bitching about Nakamura and Asuka winning. Honestly, is there a single person that could have won either rumble everyone would of been happy with? Who cares if they can't speak English, cutting promos isn't the end all be all leading to big time matches, especially at WM.

Styles and Nakamura will steal the show. Sure, Nakamura has been lazy or not as good, but when they are booking him in crap feuds of Baron Corbin and Dolph Ziggler and he's just going no where, of course he was probably getting bored. I think we see the best of Nakamura leading up to and through WM and they will put on a HELL of a match. Styles doesn't need to carry him during this.

Asuka is being booked the way she should be, and it's leading to an intriguing match at Mania. Honestly, keep it up. People get bored because she keeps winning, and think she's a generic, stale Japanese wrestler. She's a wrecking machine and they're booking her that way! They finally are booking someone correctly. And if they want to continue booking her correctly, have her beat whoever it's going to be at Mania and keep the streak going. Have her continue beating the women for a while until she goes up against a viable opponent that's worth beating her and ending the streak. Whether it be Rousey, or maybe when Ember Moon gets called up and finally beats her. And have Asuka go heel, it would make the loss that much more sweeter and get even more over with the fans.

[jrg1128]

Ember should have beaten Asuka at Takeover. Hopefully they use Ember to end her streak at a big time PPV.

[CharlieHustle]

Originally Posted by jrg1128

Ember should have beaten Asuka at Takeover. Hopefully they use Ember to end her streak at a big time PPV.

At Wrestlemania 2019.
Asuka is holding the belt until then.

[CharlieHustle]

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

Look at the pop Bayley got when she made her PPV debut, look at her now.

Look at Sasha's pop at her first Mania, look at her now.

They've both lost all their steam.

The downfall of Bayley, IMO, was the kendo stick match.
Her whole character, is a scrappy underdog who gets beat down, but always gets back up, then pulls out the big win when it counts most. It was old-school babyface booking, to the T.
When she got to the main roster, all of a sudden WWE forgot about the "scrappy" part of her character. She pulled the kendo stick off the pole, then was so unwillingly to use it that (in storyline) she would rather take the loss, than hit someone with a kendo stick. She's been lost at sea, ever since.
It may take a full heel turn, to revive her character.

[duwal]

Originally Posted by Bob Loblaw

He does a lot more than ring announcing.

Yeah when I first read he signed with WWE my first thought was he could really be a good manager for someone

[duwal]

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

Look at the pop Bayley got when she made her PPV debut, look at her now.

Look at Sasha's pop at her first Mania, look at her now.

They've both lost all their steam.

But that is EVERY newcomer. Styles still gets some of the best reactions but today still pales compared to his Royal Rumble entrance pop so going by your rationale Styles has lost steam compared to his debut as well

[jrg1128]

Originally Posted by CharlieHustle

At Wrestlemania 2019.
Asuka is holding the belt until then.

I wouldn't doubt it.

[JustinVerlander07]

Originally Posted by duwal

But that is EVERY newcomer. Styles still gets some of the best reactions but today still pales compared to his Royal Rumble entrance pop so going by your rationale Styles has lost steam compared to his debut as well

NOBODY cares about Bayley anymore, Bayley was getting good pops for a while, now it's basically crickets. Sasha was super over even at the point of HiAC, but they kept having her drop the title after a week and it killed her.

Look at just about all the NXT people, they're worse off now except for a few (Bliss, Carmella, Elias to name some) than they were when they arrived to the main roster.

[mikecamp99]

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

NOBODY cares about Bayley anymore, Bayley was getting good pops for a while, now it's basically crickets. Sasha was super over even at the point of HiAC, but they kept having her drop the title after a week and it killed her.

Look at just about all the NXT people, they're worse off now except for a few (Bliss, Carmella, Elias to name some) than they were when they arrived to the main roster.

Wanna know the funny thing about that? HHH has said himself there basically isn't anybody that can come right in and go to the Main Roster (outside of Styles, Gallows and Anderson) that they have to go through NXT to "learn the business" basically to get ready for the main roster. And yet, none of these guys are more over and popular then when they spend their time in NXT. Honestly, send Roode, Balor, Nakamura, Sasha, Bayley, Zayn and Owens all back to NXT. They would be far off better down there and booked much better than they are on the overpopulated WWE roster.

[Jericho]

Originally Posted by ThaReal1

It should have been...it was on a PPV.

It got about the same amount of time though, so it being on PPV really doesn't matter. My point was I feel Emma is better in ring than Sasha.

Originally Posted by jrg1128

Ember should have beaten Asuka at Takeover. Hopefully they use Ember to end her streak at a big time PPV.

100% agree. Was ridiculous she got out of there without having to lose, but she's one of HHH's "golden" signees.

[JustinVerlander07]

Originally Posted by mikecamp99

Wanna know the funny thing about that? HHH has said himself there basically isn't anybody that can come right in and go to the Main Roster (outside of Styles, Gallows and Anderson) that they have to go through NXT to "learn the business" basically to get ready for the main roster. And yet, none of these guys are more over and popular then when they spend their time in NXT. Honestly, send Roode, Balor, Nakamura, Sasha, Bayley, Zayn and Owens all back to NXT. They would be far off better down there and booked much better than they are on the overpopulated WWE roster.

Triple H gets how to book to a persons strength clearly. Vince just does what he wants.

Originally Posted by Jericho

100% agree. Was ridiculous she got out of there without having to lose, but she's one of HHH's "golden" signees.

She's more over for having never lost, and also, she got hurt, I know they weren't expecting that. Come on

[ThaReal1]

Originally Posted by Jericho

It got about the same amount of time though, so it being on PPV really doesn't matter. My point was I feel Emma is better in ring than Sasha.

That's totally fair. I guess a bit of my response was in you agreeing Sasha wouldn't be a big loss and Emma was a bigger one. I think Emma was probably top 3 in ring of the women (Asuka, Charlotte.) I say Sasha sits somewhere near Top 5.

But Emma couldn't hold a flame to Sasha's character and marketability. Granted, they both peaked in NXT. I'm a big Emma fan, but both at the top of their game, better person to have on the roster is Sasha in my opinion.

Poor Emma had no shot both times they tried her on main roster. Watching that Rumble without her was sad

[mikecamp99]

Originally Posted by Jericho

100% agree. Was ridiculous she got out of there without having to lose, but she's one of HHH's "golden" signees.

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

She's more over for having never lost, and also, she got hurt, I know they weren't expecting that. Come on

Right? Anybody remember just how insanely over Goldberg was on his undefeated streak and how much it meant to people and the business at that time? It's ok to book someone as an insanely tough and unbeatable person. If done right, the moment they lose will be a BIG deal. Obviously, Goldber losing to Nash was NOT done right.

[mikecamp99]

Originally Posted by mikecamp99

Right? Anybody remember just how insanely over Goldberg was on his undefeated streak and how much it meant to people and the business at that time? It's ok to book someone as an insanely tough and unbeatable person. If done right, the moment they lose will be a BIG deal. Obviously, Goldber losing to Nash was NOT done right.

And please, I'm not trying to compare Goldberg to Asuka. I'm more saying it's ok to have an undefeated streak every once in a while, especially if done right. Asuka's now going on what, like 2 years? It will be a big deal when she loses.

[JustinVerlander07]

Originally Posted by mikecamp99

Right? Anybody remember just how insanely over Goldberg was on his undefeated streak and how much it meant to people and the business at that time? It's ok to book someone as an insanely tough and unbeatable person. If done right, the moment they lose will be a BIG deal. Obviously, Goldber losing to Nash was NOT done right.

Also, Goldberg couldn't Wrestle or talk, so there was nothing for him after that point really. Asuka can wrestle, she'll be fine whenever she gets her first loss, and they can make it a big deal when she does and put someone over in the process. (I have my doubts that actually happens though)

[Jericho]

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

She's more over for having never lost, and also, she got hurt, I know they weren't expecting that. Come on

That doesn't excuse the fact that they didn't have Moon win that last encounter when everything was set up for her to. Would have made Moon a bigger deal and the woman to beat on NXT. Instead they had Asuka go over AGAIN, and then Moon got the consolation of winning the held up title. I am just thankful they actually gave it to Moon, because she deserved it long ago. I feared they'd stick it on Sane.