2020 Politics Thread - Enter At Your Own Risk - RULES IN OP

[JeremyNick]

Originally Posted by Jgil316

This is some scary stuff - watch her 2017 video - holy hell!

I don't care who you are - to embrace this kind of nuttiness....... come on!

I’ve never delved into the QAnon world, not do I honestly intend to. To my knowledge it, centered around the deep state conspiracies, etc. Is the reporter accurately reflecting the base of QAnon or amplifying the fringes of QAnon? I find it hard to believe eating children is a core belief for the 3 million supposed members. It is however easy to believe that there are at least a few that believe that.

[SK40]

Originally Posted by jlzinck

TalcumX at his finest.

He did leave 1% wiggle room.

[TheHeel]

Originally Posted by Jgil316

Things never change - and Trump supporters will just try and deny it and attempt to spin this into fake news.......

Trump is always pointing fingers at everyone else but never looks in the mirror.

[Jgil316]

Originally Posted by JeremyNick

I’ve never delved into the QAnon world, not do I honestly intend to. To my knowledge it, centered around the deep state conspiracies, etc. Is the reporter accurately reflecting the base of QAnon or amplifying the fringes of QAnon? I find it hard to believe eating children is a core belief for the 3 million supposed members. It is however easy to believe that there are at least a few that believe that.

Q - is an anonymous person high up in the Trump circle who goes on internet message boards and posts "clues" as to what is going on and about to happen.

The belief is that Democrats are pedophiles and traffic in such - that the Rothchilds - Saudi Arabia - George Soros for the triangle of the Deep State.

The Pizza place (I forget where) was the hub of the child trafficking)

Also - the Democrat ties to Epstien and his island are a basis for the pedophile ring.

In the group - no one knows who Q is - but they say he loves the nation, is a patriot and they wait on every word his posts.

Additionally - Trump was elected because he was not part of this "circle" and he has been fighting to out all of these people.....

I had not heard about the child eating until that video above



I am sure I missed a lot in this brief synopses - but this is some disturbing stuff. The FBI has investigated them and issued a warning.

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by Zedlaw

I really should not talk about this anymore. I’m not the messenger this moment deserves. And it’s heartbreaking to turn lives into statistics. I’m just very surprised to find a group thats so opposed to wanting to do better and help. Why not error on the side of humanity. Goodnight all.

Statistics and data are important when trying to determine if a particular narrative can hold up to objective scrutiny.

No one is opposed to improvement. You made this up in your head. What everyone else is trying to get across to you is that they're opposed to the media playing a large role in public perception, and being disingenuous in the process.

George Floyd (black) killed by a white cop --> "Say his name" -- murals everywhere -- national hero -- used as a case example to drive the narrative that police are going around senselessly killing black people

Tony Timpa (white) killed by a white cop the same way Floyd was and was mocked by the cops as he died --> Who?

Your argument that this is all about cops getting away with stuff doesn't hold up. The charges against Dustin Dillard were dismissed. So why the difference in media coverage for George Floyd? Chauvin may or may not be prosecuted, but Dillard was already found not guilty.

For every incident where a black person is killed by the cops, there are multiple identical incidents of white people dying the same way. Why do you think that we never hear about this? I'm genuinely asking. Because what many of us have concluded is that the mainstream media selectively reports on certain incidents because they want to drive a particular narrative. No one is crying, "poor me... how come nobody cares about white people?" We're concerned that the media is perpetuating racial tension.

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by TheHeel

Trump is always pointing fingers at everyone else but never looks in the mirror.

I wonder if he looks in the mirror when he... ya know...

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by Jgil316

Q - is an anonymous person high up in the Trump circle who goes on internet message boards and posts "clues" as to what is going on and about to happen.

The belief is that Democrats are pedophiles and traffic in such - that the Rothchilds - Saudi Arabia - George Soros for the triangle of the Deep State.

The Pizza place (I forget where) was the hub of the child trafficking)

Also - the Democrat ties to Epstien and his island are a basis for the pedophile ring.

In the group - no one knows who Q is - but they say he loves the nation, is a patriot and they wait on every word his posts.

Additionally - Trump was elected because he was not part of this "circle" and he has been fighting to out all of these people.....

I had not heard about the child eating until that video above



I am sure I missed a lot in this brief synopses - but this is some disturbing stuff. The FBI has investigated them and issued a warning.

Sounds pretty wild. I can't even begin to pay attention to some of this stuff.

[Boo]

Originally Posted by ballhawkdawk

Sounds pretty wild. I can't even begin to pay attention to some of this stuff.

Yet you pay attention to TH and JJ in this thread.

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by Boo

Yet you pay attention to TH and JJ in this thread.

I'm afraid if I go down the conspiracy theory rabbit hole I may never be able to climb out of it. Next thing you know I got high and spent 11 hours trying to figure out if QAnon eats children.

[GeechQuest]

Originally Posted by ballhawkdawk

Statistics and data are important when trying to determine if a particular narrative can hold up to objective scrutiny.

No one is opposed to improvement. You made this up in your head. What everyone else is trying to get across to you is that they're opposed to the media playing a large role in public perception, and being disingenuous in the process.

George Floyd (black) killed by a white cop --> "Say his name" -- murals everywhere -- national hero -- used as a case example to drive the narrative that police are going around senselessly killing black people

Tony Timpa (white) killed by a white cop the same way Floyd was and was mocked by the cops as he died --> Who?

Your argument that this is all about cops getting away with stuff doesn't hold up. The charges against Dustin Dillard were dismissed. So why the difference in media coverage for George Floyd? Chauvin may or may not be prosecuted, but Dillard was already found not guilty.

For every incident where a black person is killed by the cops, there are multiple identical incidents of white people dying the same way. Why do you think that we never hear about this? I'm genuinely asking. Because what many of us have concluded is that the mainstream media selectively reports on certain incidents because they want to drive a particular narrative. No one is crying, "poor me... how come nobody cares about white people?" We're concerned that the media is perpetuating racial tension.

This is such a dumb take man. How do you know about Tony Timpa? Unless you knew him personally I’m going to guess it’s because media covered the story.

Here:

-Nathaniel Sanders
-Larry Eugene Jackson Jr
-David Joseph
-Michael Ramos

These are all police shootings in my city that nobody has heard of unless you live here. All unarmed black men shot and killed by the police. Nobody knows.

It’s such a myopic view that you and others present and it’s pretty sad that some people see the world this way.

Why does “the media” cover every commercial airline crash but hardly ever any prop plane crashes? Are they just biased against prop planes? No, and no reasonable person would come to that conclusion.

I only quoted you since you were the last with this take and I’m catching up on the thread. You’re not the only one with this horrid take.

[calculusdork]

I just watched a video of Tulsi Gabbard eviscerating Kamala Harris in debate.

That is my contribution to this thread for the month of August.

Carry on.

[tpeichel34]

Originally Posted by JeremyNick

I’ve never delved into the QAnon world, not do I honestly intend to. To my knowledge it, centered around the deep state conspiracies, etc. Is the reporter accurately reflecting the base of QAnon or amplifying the fringes of QAnon? I find it hard to believe eating children is a core belief for the 3 million supposed members. It is however easy to believe that there are at least a few that believe that.

Epstein trafficking kids to elites around the world to use as blackmail material is a big piece of what Qanon discussed. Ask yourself how much power and control some group has to have to kill someone on suicide watch without cameras documenting it?

The same people questioning Q still lap up the Charlottesville Fine People Hoax repeated by Biden yesterday, which is easily proven a lie and those people also believe the Russian Collusion Conspiracy that the MSM has fed them for years.

There is more truth to what Q has said about Epstein than either of those liberal beliefs.

[JeremyNick]

Originally Posted by GeechQuest

This is such a dumb take man. How do you know about Tony Timpa? Unless you knew him personally I’m going to guess it’s because media covered the story.

Here:

-Nathaniel Sanders
-Larry Eugene Jackson Jr
-David Joseph
-Michael Ramos

These are all police shootings in my city that nobody has heard of unless you live here. All unarmed black men shot and killed by the police. Nobody knows.

It’s such a myopic view that you and others present and it’s pretty sad that some people see the world this way.

Why does “the media” cover every commercial airline crash but hardly ever any prop plane crashes? Are they just biased against prop planes? No, and no reasonable person would come to that conclusion.

I only quoted you since you were the last with this take and I’m catching up on the thread. You’re not the only one with this horrid take.

Prop plane crashes and commercial airline plane crashes aren’t equivalent.

A police officer using excessive force and/or killing someone is an equivalent situation. I understand your feelings but disagree that it’s myopic. If you have similar situations and some are brought to the media and some aren’t, then it’s rational to look at the similarities and differences. To see the similarities in heightened media coverage and similarities in minimal media coverage is not myopic.

I don’t think it’s terribly beneficial to keep beating the table over it. It is reality. Once the lines got drawn that police brutality solely needs to be defined as a racial issue, it became divisive and will continue to be presented as such.

My feelings from the get to, both with media coverage and BLM was that if you were ultimately trying to build momentum and consensus that you embrace the reality that police brutality does affect everyone, likely not equally, but that doesn’t need to be an argument. Instead it was brought forward as a race specific issue and that’s why you will continue to get what you called myopic views.

It was all created myopically from the beginning.

[GeechQuest]

Originally Posted by JeremyNick

Prop plane crashes and commercial airline plane crashes aren’t equivalent.

A police officer using excessive force and/or killing someone is an equivalent situation. I understand your feelings but disagree that it’s myopic. If you have similar situations and some are brought to the media and some aren’t, then it’s rational to look at the similarities and differences. To see the similarities in heightened media coverage and similarities in minimal media coverage is not myopic.

I don’t think it’s terribly beneficial to keep beating the table over it. It is reality. Once the lines got drawn that police brutality solely needs to be defined as a racial issue, it became divisive and will continue to be presented as such.

My feelings from the get to, both with media coverage and BLM was that if you were ultimately trying to build momentum and consensus that you embrace the reality that police brutality does affect everyone, likely not equally, but that doesn’t need to be an argument. Instead it was brought forward as a race specific issue and that’s why you will continue to get what you called myopic views.

It was all created myopically from the beginning.

Tony Timpa keeps being brought up form different posters all over the country.

How could they all know about it if not covered by the media?

Why are the 4 unarmed black men killed by the police in my city not known on the same way George Floyd is if the media is “painting a narrative”. Seems like more evidence to paint said narrative with, no?

[Siberian13]

Originally Posted by calculusdork

I just watched a video of Tulsi Gabbard eviscerating Kamala Harris in debate.

That is my contribution to this thread for the month of August.

Carry on.

Yeah I watched one. Kamala doesn’t even deny what Tulsi said. Just does a Jojo/jdands

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by GeechQuest

This is such a dumb take man. How do you know about Tony Timpa? Unless you knew him personally I’m going to guess it’s because media covered the story.

Here:

-Nathaniel Sanders
-Larry Eugene Jackson Jr
-David Joseph
-Michael Ramos

These are all police shootings in my city that nobody has heard of unless you live here. All unarmed black men shot and killed by the police. Nobody knows.

It’s such a myopic view that you and others present and it’s pretty sad that some people see the world this way.

Why does “the media” cover every commercial airline crash but hardly ever any prop plane crashes? Are they just biased against prop planes? No, and no reasonable person would come to that conclusion.

I only quoted you since you were the last with this take and I’m catching up on the thread. You’re not the only one with this horrid take.

Solid guess, but wrong. I know about Tony Timpa because he was referenced in a Youtube discussion about BLM and police brutality by Coleman Hughes, a black intellectual who studies race issues. He cited Tony Timpa as an example of a white man who was killed the exact same way as George Floyd, but we never heard about it. My take is more or less a regurgitation of his take... because it makes sense, unlike a take that tries to compare media coverage of race to media coverage of plane crashes. Tony Timpa was killed in 2016. No one knew who he was until second half of 2020. I certainly didn't. And I know you didn't either.

I'd heard of Tony Timpa from a prior discussion, but here's the most recent video that I listened to where his incident was mentioned: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wt95ct2gISA -- One of the main focuses of the video is the racial disparity in media coverage. He cites dozens of other cases where there was no mainstream media coverage of an unarmed white person being killed by the police and the police officer was never prosecuted. "If black lives don't matter, then how come the only lives we hear about being killed by the police are black?" But yeah, I fabricated this dumb, myopic, sad, horrid take. More adjectives might help drive home the point.

You never addressed the question, so I'll frame it differently... Why is there such a largely held public perception that police are exclusively killing unarmed black men when the data doesn't support it?

[DegaBama]

Originally Posted by GeechQuest

This is such a dumb take man. How do you know about Tony Timpa? Unless you knew him personally I’m going to guess it’s because media covered the story.

Here:

-Nathaniel Sanders
-Larry Eugene Jackson Jr
-David Joseph
-Michael Ramos

These are all police shootings in my city that nobody has heard of unless you live here. All unarmed black men shot and killed by the police. Nobody knows.

It’s such a myopic view that you and others present and it’s pretty sad that some people see the world this way.

Why does “the media” cover every commercial airline crash but hardly ever any prop plane crashes? Are they just biased against prop planes? No, and no reasonable person would come to that conclusion.

I only quoted you since you were the last with this take and I’m catching up on the thread. You’re not the only one with this horrid take.

Can you prove these shootings were race related? Can you prove George Floyd was race related?

-Nathaniel Sanders: Tough situation here, probably didn't need to happen.
-Larry Eugene Jackson Jr: Don't run when police is talking to you
-David Joseph: No reason to shoot him.
-Michael Ramos: Don't drive away when the police is asking for instructions.

You need to take into account what the suspect is doing. As soon as someone doesn't comply, the police officers have to assume the worst. If someone is running from the police, they don't know if he has a gun or not.

[JeremyNick]

Originally Posted by GeechQuest

Tony Timpa keeps being brought up form different posters all over the country.

How could they all know about it if not covered by the media?

Why are the 4 unarmed black men killed by the police in my city not known on the same way George Floyd is if the media is “painting a narrative”. Seems like more evidence to paint said narrative with, no?

I think you missed the entire point of my post, but to answer yours. I think Tony Timpa is widely known because he is the standard care I’ve seen brought up over and over. So while I haven’t seen him mentioned in national media. I have on social media - which seems to be where most have learned about him.

I don’t have an answer to that. I’m a bit confused as to why names like Trayvon Martin (not killed by police) and Ahmad Asbury (not killer by a police officer) are brought up as examples of police violence. The whole thing, though good at it’s core, has become a conflated, jumbled enigma to me.

To clarify I never talked about painting a narrative, so quoting it back to me is a bit disingenuous.

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by JeremyNick

I don’t think it’s terribly beneficial to keep beating the table over it. It is reality. Once the lines got drawn that police brutality solely needs to be defined as a racial issue, it became divisive and will continue to be presented as such.

My feelings from the get to, both with media coverage and BLM was that if you were ultimately trying to build momentum and consensus that you embrace the reality that police brutality does affect everyone, likely not equally, but that doesn’t need to be an argument. Instead it was brought forward as a race specific issue and that’s why you will continue to get what you called myopic views.

It was all created myopically from the beginning.

I agree with this.

I think sometimes there's a misinterpretation of intent, at least for where I'm coming from with this. My goal isn't to go, "What about all these white people that got killed? What now?!?" My goal is to keep the conversation honest and keep the focus where it needs to be. Cops need to be held accountable and civilians need to commit less crime, across the board. I think the way the media selectively reports on police/race interactions is dangerous, and that's where my concern comes from. I'm not crying, "poor me, what about us white folks?" I want the divisiveness to go away.

On a somewhat related note, I'm down to one episode left of Serial Season 3, based on your recommendation. It's been a great listen so far. My intention is to summarize my thoughts once I finish. Hopefully I don't get lazy enough that I just end up talking about Trump's sexual fetishes with TheHeel.

[GeechQuest]

Originally Posted by ballhawkdawk

Solid guess, but wrong. I know about Tony Timpa because he was referenced in a Youtube discussion about BLM and police brutality by Coleman Hughes, a black intellectual who studies race issues. He cited Tony Timpa as an example of a white man who was killed the exact same way as George Floyd, but we never heard about it. My take is more or less a regurgitation of his take... because it makes sense, unlike a take that tries to compare media coverage of race to media coverage of plane crashes. Tony Timpa was killed in 2016. No one knew who he was until second half of 2020. I certainly didn't. And I know you didn't either.

I'd heard of Tony Timpa from a prior discussion, but here's the most recent video that I listened to where his incident was mentioned: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wt95ct2gISA -- One of the main focuses of the video is the racial disparity in media coverage. He cites dozens of other cases where there was no mainstream media coverage of an unarmed white person being killed by the police and the police officer was never prosecuted. "If black lives don't matter, then how come the only lives we hear about being killed by the police are black?" But yeah, I fabricated this dumb, myopic, sad, horrid take. More adjectives might help drive home the point.

You never addressed the question, so I'll frame it differently... Why is there such a largely held public perception that police are exclusively killing unarmed black men when the data doesn't support it?

I'm not sure if you're aware but YouTube is media.

I'm not getting into the secondary question because it's to expansive for me (I'm not as intelligent or verbose as Frenzy).

This started with Dege waxing poetically how the media wouldn't cover the shooting of the 5 year old because it doesn't "fit the narrative". He misses the fact that he heard about it through the media. It's just a silly take, that's all.

It's posited as if you only hear about black men being killed by the police on "the media" when that couldn't be further from the truth, as evidenced by the fact that you know about Tony Timpa, as evidenced by the fact that Dege brought us the horrendous story of the 5 year old.

The nuance is lost in this country. Critical thinking has gone out the window. There's layers to this stuff, and it's not simply "The media want's to create false narratives". That's an asinine take and it's not an intelligent one either.

[tpeichel34]

Originally Posted by GeechQuest

I'm not sure if you're aware but YouTube is media.

I'm not getting into the secondary question because it's to expansive for me (I'm not as intelligent or verbose as Frenzy).

This started with Dege waxing poetically how the media wouldn't cover the shooting of the 5 year old because it doesn't "fit the narrative". He misses the fact that he heard about it through the media. It's just a silly take, that's all.

It's posited as if you only hear about black men being killed by the police on "the media" when that couldn't be further from the truth, as evidenced by the fact that you know about Tony Timpa, as evidenced by the fact that Dege brought us the horrendous story of the 5 year old.

The nuance is lost in this country. Critical thinking has gone out the window. There's layers to this stuff, and it's not simply "The media want's to create false narratives". That's an asinine take and it's not an intelligent one either.

The MSM has been caught hiding or selectively editing news to shape a story to fit their preferred narrative so many times that any critical thinker questions everything presented by the MSM.

[GeechQuest]

Originally Posted by JeremyNick

I think you missed the entire point of my post, but to answer yours. I think Tony Timpa is widely known because he is the standard care I’ve seen brought up over and over. So while I haven’t seen him mentioned in national media. I have on social media - which seems to be where most have learned about him.

I don’t have an answer to that. I’m a bit confused as to why names like Trayvon Martin (not killed by police) and Ahmad Asbury (not killer by a police officer) are brought up as examples of police violence. The whole thing, though good at it’s core, has become a conflated, jumbled enigma to me.

To clarify I never talked about painting a narrative, so quoting it back to me is a bit disingenuous.

I got your point and agree with it.

"My feelings from the get to, both with media coverage and BLM was that if you were ultimately trying to build momentum and consensus that you embrace the reality that police brutality does affect everyone, likely not equally, but that doesn’t need to be an argument. Instead it was brought forward as a race specific issue and that’s why you will continue to get what you called myopic views."

I don't disagree with this.

What I do disagree with are when people pull out other news stories that have nothing to do anything (Dege's story) and drop the tired "The media would be all over this if the races were reversed" trope.

You can't complain that the media views things through a racial lens, then paint a narrative that uses the same lens just flipped. It's silly.

People want to be the victim in society and I don't get that mentality.

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by GeechQuest

I'm not sure if you're aware but YouTube is media.

I'm not getting into the secondary question because it's to expansive for me (I'm not as intelligent or verbose as Frenzy).

This started with Dege waxing poetically how the media wouldn't cover the shooting of the 5 year old because it doesn't "fit the narrative". He misses the fact that he heard about it through the media. It's just a silly take, that's all.

It's posited as if you only hear about black men being killed by the police on "the media" when that couldn't be further from the truth, as evidenced by the fact that you know about Tony Timpa, as evidenced by the fact that Dege brought us the horrendous story of the 5 year old.

The nuance is lost in this country. Critical thinking has gone out the window. There's layers to this stuff, and it's not simply "The media want's to create false narratives". That's an asinine take and it's not an intelligent one either.

"Media covered his story" was your line, as if I found out about it on FoxNews or CNN and not on a Youtube channel that regularly receives under 100k views per video. You're creating an impossible scenario... "How'd you hear about Tony Timpa? The media, right?" Of course, if you mean that the media covered the story first and then it made its way around from there. Unless I was standing there watching it go down, I wouldn't have known otherwise. Is that really your point... that one obscure Youtube channel is equivalent to every global mainstream media outlet? They know who George Floyd is all across the world at this point.

Tell you what... name drop Tony Timpa next time you're in a group of people and see how many people know who you're talking about. Ask them, "Do you know who George Floyd is?" (yes/no) "Do you know who Tony Timpa is?" (yes/no). I bet you a TJ McConnell Prizm base that the results aren't even close.

"There's layers to this stuff, and it's not simply "The media want's to create false narratives". That's an asinine take and it's not an intelligent one either."

NBC edited the George Zimmerman 911 call to make him sound racist. It happened. They even apologized. Concrete example of a legit mainstream player creating a false narrative. I 100% agree that nuance is lost... incidents like Z/Trayvon are entirely unfortunate incidents that I don't believe needed to happen, and a little bit of blame can be spread around. Sometimes situations escalate for no reason, but here we are, and Trayvon is part of the "say their names" club as an example of racial violence against blacks. "Not guilty," said the jury.

[trixstar]

https://twitter.com/therecount/statu...668782592?s=21

[DegaBama]

Originally Posted by GeechQuest

I got your point and agree with it.

"My feelings from the get to, both with media coverage and BLM was that if you were ultimately trying to build momentum and consensus that you embrace the reality that police brutality does affect everyone, likely not equally, but that doesn’t need to be an argument. Instead it was brought forward as a race specific issue and that’s why you will continue to get what you called myopic views."

I don't disagree with this.

What I do disagree with are when people pull out other news stories that have nothing to do anything (Dege's story) and drop the tired "The media would be all over this if the races were reversed" trope.

You can't complain that the media views things through a racial lens, then paint a narrative that uses the same lens just flipped. It's silly.

People want to be the victim in society and I don't get that mentality.

It's just a point that we are seeing more black people killed in these riots than killed by unarmed police officers, and these riots were really caused by the media. The George Floyd thing was an unfortunate death that should have never happened, but because the media chose to run with it and push agendas, we see what we are seeing. Whether it's the Tony Timpa situation, or the little boy situation, there is a reason we don't hear about those situations... white.

People need to see what the media is, and that's a devise to divide our country, moreso than anything else.