Mars Attacks: Occupation - on Kickstarter May 5th

[ALevine - Topps]

I think i'm leaning towards 1 @ 40 (unlimited), 10 @ 350 (limit 1).

[finfangfan]

Originally Posted by ALevine - Topps

I think i'm leaning towards 1 @ 40 (unlimited), 10 @ 350 (limit 1).

That works! Is there a minimum tier to buy-in the add-on? Or can someone go nuts with a $10 digital buy in?

[ALevine - Topps]

What are the downsides to these options? I could go either way. Do you think a ton of people will just load up on hot packs? If so, how many and would it cause any problems?

Want to allow freedom and encourage buyers as long as it doesn't handcuff us.

[finfangfan]

The downside on the fans end are pretty close to nil I guess... unless the threshold needed for the KS success is not met? Then no set?

If people can only pledge one tier and the add-on hot packs become the draw, then I can see a lot of $10 buy-ins to get the hot pack add-ons (be it 1 or 100).

What is the dollar goal that will make this KS successful?

[scorcher]

Originally Posted by ALevine - Topps

Wow. Lots of great discussion while i was away. Need to sort through it all, but I will say a few things:

1) I'm not thrilled with the idea of raising any prices, for the same reasons Stryke mentioned. Fan perception is a concern, even if I thought fans would still purchase. I don't want to be seen as the guy who gets greedy, or baits and switches anyone

2) FinFang hit the nail on the head about quality. That's what this is all about.

3) I don't like the idea of requiring X purchase to qualify for an add-on. Makes it too confusing, and too easy to get messed up and hard to rectify if it does.

4) leaning towards a limit on individual purchases. But how many? Was thinking 10. If someone wanted more, they could always have a friend grab some for them.

5) If we kept the Hot Packs at $35 (or raised them even slightly to $40) would there still be a desire for a $350-400 "collector sketch pledge? Or would we change it to be $600 and you get 30? Limit the pledge to 50? I don't know, is that too much focus on the sketches with hot packs already available for such a great price?

I am into the sketches,
I like my suggestion It bares repeating again.

Offer sketches to the bundles, my suggestion is for the Prize Captive Plus pledge for people who were looking into this pledge but want more. Add 20 sketches bring it in at $900 again a nice middle pledge. I would be in on this one, for me sketches are the mail reason I was interested in following this thread.
30 sketches and a base set works too 600.00.
Offer both I like the 900 pledge better gives you a good mix and allows you to add metal and letter press hot packs if interested.

Adam what do you think? I like it any one else feeling it?

[Spider-Fan]

Dude, not everything can cost a nickel! $600/30= $20 a sketch. Yeah that sounds great to me as a collector, but things that sound toI good to be true usually are.

Agree with FFF... I think if you can buy unlimited $40 sketch packs with a minimum $10, the downside is that those sketch packs ate going to get gobbled up quickly for resale purposes.

[ashelton]

Originally Posted by scorcher

I am into the sketches,
I like my suggestion It bares repeating again.

Offer sketches to the bundles, my suggestion is for the Prize Captive Plus pledge for people who were looking into this pledge but want more. Add 20 sketches bring it in at $900 again a nice middle pledge. I would be in on this one, for me sketches are the mail reason I was interested in following this thread.
30 sketches and a base set works too 600.00.
Offer both I like the 900 pledge better gives you a good mix and allows you to add metal and letter press hot packs if interested.

Adam what do you think? I like it any one else feeling it?

Prize Captive Plus would be $1,000 with 20 sketches @$35 and 30 sketches and a base set would be $1,090. Once you give anything with the sketches less than $35ea you're once again opening up all the problems discussed in the last few pages.

As an artist, as well, I'm never excited for my work to be valued at the set's base cost for $40 sets... but it's my PSC price and so acceptable. I would be so much less than thrilled to have the minimum expected value be $19, which is what your $600 set would make it.

Also... when speaking of offering an unlimited supply of sketch cards, remember that the artists are relying on AP sales to pay for their involvement. Only people with very specific ideas of what they'd want commissioned will go directly to artists in that scenario... and I imagine only the top tier artists would get even that business.

[ALevine - Topps]

In your opinion-- what should the minimum buy-in be for an add-on-- of any type?

I will say that in most kickstarters that include add-ons, they always allow fans to JUST buy Add-ons if they want to. Typically it's not an issue, but typical this is not.

That said, if someone is really willing to drop a ton on 50 sketch packs, will a 300 requirement really deter them? Chances are they'll be able to recoup that 300 just by flipping it (if not make profit on that too!), so that requirement will actually just wind up hurting the real fans since the $300 pledge is limited.

I think the answer may be to let it ride and deal with the consequences: if we have to delay shipping to commission more high quality sketches, so be it. The profit will be there for us, and in the end everyone wins.

Remember the three factors of which you can only have two: fast, good and cheap.

One other thing we can do is make a rough calculation of how many are selling by totalling up the pledges that have sold and subtracting from the whole. Then if it looks like we're selling to many we can tell fans they are SOLD OUT and remove the add-on graphic for new pledgers.

Thoughts?

[ALevine - Topps]

Originally Posted by scorcher

Adam what do you think? I like it any one else feeling it?

I like the idea in principle, but it doesn't make a ton of sense in concert with everything else. It isn't much different than buying the 300 pledge and tacking on a bunch of add-ons, except that you get them a little cheaper, which will just result in higher orders for sketch cards that we'll have difficulty fulfilling.

At this point, i'm pretty set and locked on the pledge levels.

[ALevine - Topps]

Originally Posted by finfangfan

If people can only pledge one tier and the add-on hot packs become the draw, then I can see a lot of $10 buy-ins to get the hot pack add-ons (be it 1 or 100).

And what's the downside? As I said above, will a larger buy-in really deter dealers or flippers looking for a resale item? They can always re-sell the buy-in item! I figure that, as someone said before, if there's money to be made, there will be people willing to try to make a profit.

What is the dollar goal that will make this KS successful?

50K. Given the high value pledges and bundles, I think we can hit that very quickly. First stretch goals comes at 55K / 60K / 65K / 70K / 75K / 85K and 100K...

the first batch of stretch goals is really going to get people buzzing, too. You'll see them in 2 days!

[jstryjecki]

Super excited about this Kickstarter.
The Add-ons I saw in the email are awesome!

Although not sure how I'm going to afford all I have seen and want

[Spider-Fan]

Originally Posted by ALevine - Topps

In your opinion-- what should the minimum buy-in be for an add-on-- of any type?

Anything above digital rewards.

Originally Posted by ALevine - Topps

I think the answer may be to let it ride and deal with the consequences: if we have to delay shipping to commission more high quality sketches, so be it. The profit will be there for us, and in the end everyone wins.

Thoughts?

You said you were looking to ship Dec 2015... About 6 months from when I will be charged for my pledge. Delay 6 months? Delay 1 year? Delay 18 months? I do not *win* in any of these scenarios.

You've commissioned a certain number of sketches, and can perhaps commission a certain number more without sacrificing quality and collectors patience. You need to figure out what that total is and put in the proper limitations as to not exceed it.

In either case, reduced sketch quality or delayed timing, the people that are supporting this project lose to some extent.

[ALevine - Topps]

Originally Posted by jstryjecki

Super excited about this Kickstarter.
The Add-ons I saw in the email are awesome!

Although not sure how I'm going to afford all I have seen and want

Thanks! Comments like these make me feel like all the work is worth it

[ALevine - Topps]

Originally Posted by Spider-Fan

Anything above digital rewards.

Just dawned on me: one reason NOT to do this is that one of our early stretch goals is a new add-on that will appeal greatly to non MA fans, who may not want the core product at all.

[finfangfan]

Another variable to limit the run on sketches (which leads to the concerns mentionedabove in regard to watering down the quality, or delaying the time fans receive the cards) would be the following:

-- allow a 10 sketch hot pack add-on for $350 as mentioned upthread (limit 1).
-- allow unlimited additional hot pack sales for $35 each, but the hit will be either a sketch OR a metal with 50/50 odds to hit one or the other.

Basically, I don't think you want to flood the guaranteed sketch card packs beyond the initial 10 for $350. Any sketch in a hot pack beyond that will still be potentially available, but just not a guaranteed hit.

[monkeymcgee]

Whatever you go with, try not to make it too confusing

My head hurts trying to follow all the permutations...

[ALevine - Topps]

Originally Posted by finfangfan

-- allow a 10 sketch hot pack add-on for $350 as mentioned upthread (limit 1).
-- allow unlimited additional hot pack sales for $35 each, but the hit will be either a sketch OR a metal with 50/50 odds to hit one or the other.

I like this, and the motivation behind it. But do we risk throwing people off who saw the last email update, and if they don't read carefully, get confused?

As MMM said-- want to avoid confusion! Kickstarter is already new to a lot of people interested in this product...

[finfangfan]

I don't think anyone will get confused, because the terms of the Kickstarter will be clearly explained when its live. If the add-on they buy says a hot pack containing either a sketch OR a metal... Then I am pretty sure 100% of the people will understand what that means. You might get griping from the people that want a run on the sketches, but not misunderstanding.

[ashelton]

Originally Posted by ALevine - Topps

And what's the downside?

Just because you asked.
To be honest...The more excited everyone's getting, the more apprehensive I'm getting. I would not be interested in re-upping for more cards. I wouldn't even if my schedule was completely open just because I don't see any benefit to me as an artist in doing so.

If there are 10k sketches that people can get cheaply why would they want APs? Especially considering that there will be no slow trickle of having to wait for people to decide to break boxes later on. It'll just be a giant smorgasbord after release. And if you delay the set, do artists have to hold off that much longer on selling APs? I'm already sitting on a handful of delayed releases elsewhere that mean that even though I got commitments for APs early, I can't collect on almost 1k in sales that date back as far as a year.

I don't think my involvement is a big deal to anyone since I'm not a known MA artist and am no real kind of draw... but I do wonder how hard it would be to fill an artist quota a second time around. Because even if other artists aren't concerned about a deluge, it's entirely possible they'll be booked for other projects. And if the AP market becomes questionable for this project then more APs as payment makes no sense, which is another problem I already had with other companies.

So. There's my downside, anyway.

[ALevine - Topps]

All valid concerns...

[ALevine - Topps]

Originally Posted by finfangfan

I don't think anyone will get confused, because the terms of the Kickstarter will be clearly explained when its live. If the add-on they buy says a hot pack containing either a sketch OR a metal... Then I am pretty sure 100% of the people will understand what that means. You might get griping from the people that want a run on the sketches, but not misunderstanding.

This could be something. Also load it with the higher value parallels (concept and foil) and it feels like it's worth something, too.

[ALevine - Topps]

Originally Posted by ashelton

So. There's my downside, anyway.

Keep in mind though, that 8K-10K is not an unheard of number for sketches, especially for mass market sets like Star Wars. I don't keep up with how many go in each set, but I know it's been done. Last Invasion set I think was around 6K, so I want to keep it there at most, but improve the quality.

At the end of the day though, fans want great sketches, and they love AP's because they went straight from the artist to their hands. And they do love to support the artists directly.

So I do understand your concern-- and its a valid one-- but keep in mind the potential also for fans who missed the kickstarter pre-order window, and the fact that this will not be at retail so people can't just run back for more.

[Spider-Fan]

Originally Posted by ALevine - Topps

Keep in mind though, that 8K-10K is not an unheard of number for sketches, especially for mass market sets like Star Wars. I don't keep up with how many go in each set, but I know it's been done. Last Invasion set I think was around 6K, so I want to keep it there at most, but improve the quality.

At the end of the day though, fans want great sketches, and they love AP's because they went straight from the artist to their hands. And they do love to support the artists directly.

So I do understand your concern-- and its a valid one-- but keep in mind the potential also for fans who missed the kickstarter pre-order window, and the fact that this will not be at retail so people can't just run back for more.

1) Even at only 6000, there was a lot of contention from fans about the sketch quality in MA:I.

2) I love to support my favorite artists, but I get the impression that I'm not in the majority. I'm surprised more often than not to hear which blanks artists still have available, and more so after I hear the asking price. There really is a window of opportunity for artists to sell their APs. Once it passes, many artists either sit on them or unload them anyway they can.

3) The more sketches available, the more that will be available on the secondary market diminishing the need to buy APs.

I've said it many times. Keep them wanting more. In the long run, limited will always be better than unlimited.

[ALevine - Topps]

Originally Posted by Spider-Fan

1) Even at only 6000, there was a lot of contention from fans about the sketch quality in MA:I.

Absolutely, just pointing out that larger numbers are actually the norm.

I've said it many times. Keep them wanting more. In the long run, limited will always be better than unlimited.

Agree 1000%. Want to keep demand strong so we can do another set in 2 years.

[cardfan56]

Never done kickstarter before, when is the actual expense hitting our charge cards?

Have you gotten any feedback from distributers/middle men that will not be selling cases/boxes. Filppers can easily participate as they are usually case breakers.