90-91 OPC Premier: bubble or undervalued set finally catching on?

[valleynuckfan]

Originally Posted by dantheman514

O-Pee-Chee would have happily included Lindros in the set; however, Score had an exclusive card deal with him at the time that precluded other companies from producing Lindros cards. Upper Deck found a loophole based on their rights with WJC and included him on the Canada's Captains cards.

I know he was exclusive to Score.
If OPC had the chance he would have been in the regular 528 card set maybe.
But OPC ONLY captured players that suited up in an NHL game for the Premier set. The big miss was The Eagle.

[Dr kicker]

First year Prizm , first year Lebron Lakers jersey. People probably think they can retire on first year UD hockey. For the last 25 years you could pick up these box for 5-20$. I have a Premier set i bought thinking to submit the rc`s 12 years ago but they add the Prizm bent and i taught it would affect grading. Havent checked sales recently but heard Jagr was on fire.

[uncuthockey]

Originally Posted by k13

Premier is missing lot of good rookies like Bure and Belfour

Belfour is the only key miss that Premier could have included. The Topps/OPC license would not allow them to include Bure, who was not in the NHL. Same goes for Brodeur and Lindros.

The NHL has since put an end to the pre-NHL RC through two actions: giving Upper Deck the sole license for cards as of 2005-06, then not allowing them to include players not in NHL uniforms. That’s why every modern RC is a Young Guns in an NHL jersey rather than everyone being featured in their IIHF world junior jersey!

[uncuthockey]

Originally Posted by valleynuckfan

Lindros and Brodeur- and Bure for that matter- did not play in 1990-91 so they were purposely not included in the set.
All the players in the set are shown in game action. That was one of the precepts that OPC Premier set about. All cards were the same design- rookies and stars alike. No RC subsets or RC designations.
It is one of the most redeeming features of the issue and is what makes it stand apart from all the other sets of the time IMO.

You are 100% right about the lack of silly subsets in Premier allowing to hold up better over time. I included this very statement in a blog post earlier this year.

Modern or Vintage?

“Despite its now accepted overproduction, Premier still holds up far better than any other set from 1990-91. I believe this is partly due to a couple of simple but important factors. First, there were no draft day photos or junior hockey photos used in the set. Players were only featured in action shots with their NHL teams, something likely dictated by the Topps license at the time. Second, Premier did not try to draw attention to rookie cards. No subsets here. Instead, rookie cards have the same design as every other card in the set, giving the set a consistent look, similar to vintage (pre-1990) O-Pee-Chee releases. The result is a clean and simple 132-card set that is free from the gimmicky subsets or inserts that plagued sets from this era. For folks that get caught up in defining the modern era of hockey cards as 1990-91 and after, Premier is technically a modern set. But everything about Premier screams vintage.”

https://uncuthockey.wixsite.com/uncu...iconic-premier

[uncuthockey]

Originally Posted by rohara99

Holding raw copies of this set (or any 90's junk wax) is not a wise investment IMO. The only long term value is in graded Gem Mint form.

And you can extrapolate the Gem Mint rate of these cards, as the sample size is large enough. Most are graded Mint condition.

The pop reports will go up but everyone thinking their 'mint' copies will grade as PSA 10's are mistaken.

Correct!
When the sale price of a Jagr Premier RC in PSA 10 was $100, people were very selective, even conservative, about the cards submitted. They would only submit cards they thought would grade a 10. The majority, anyway. Yes, some collectors probably just wanted their roughed-up Jagrs slabbed, but they would be in the minority. That’s why the current conversion ratio is still relatively high at 32.7% (2,735 PSA 10s of 8,359 submissions).

As people submit more, I believe that percentage will continue to drop. At current sales prices ($500 US), people will be more willing to submit what they think is a PSA 9, which will likely just drive up the population of PSA 7s and 8s!

[odjickfan]

I got a raw Jagr in a trade a couple of years ago. Not for investment, but for nostalgia and fun. That's enough for me.

[valleynuckfan]

Originally Posted by uncuthockey

You are 100% right about the lack of silly subsets in Premier allowing to hold up better over time. I included this very statement in a blog post earlier this year.

Modern or Vintage?

“Despite its now accepted overproduction, Premier still holds up far better than any other set from 1990-91. I believe this is partly due to a couple of simple but important factors. First, there were no draft day photos or junior hockey photos used in the set. Players were only featured in action shots with their NHL teams, something likely dictated by the Topps license at the time. Second, Premier did not try to draw attention to rookie cards. No subsets here. Instead, rookie cards have the same design as every other card in the set, giving the set a consistent look, similar to vintage (pre-1990) O-Pee-Chee releases. The result is a clean and simple 132-card set that is free from the gimmicky subsets or inserts that plagued sets from this era. For folks that get caught up in defining the modern era of hockey cards as 1990-91 and after, Premier is technically a modern set. But everything about Premier screams vintage.”

https://uncuthockey.wixsite.com/uncu...iconic-premier

I must give credit where it is due my friend.
I read your blog when you posted up several months ago. Your research and insight is spot on as far as I'm concerned.
Thanks again!

[uncuthockey]

Originally Posted by valleynuckfan

I must give credit where it is due my friend.
I read your blog when you posted up several months ago. Your research and insight is spot on as far as I'm concerned.
Thanks again!

Thanks! I had no idea at the time that the prices of Premier would take off like they have over the pasy year. I’m not sure anyone could have seen this coming.

[uncuthockey]

Originally Posted by valleynuckfan

I must give credit where it is due my friend.
I read your blog when you posted up several months ago. Your research and insight is spot on as far as I'm concerned.
Thanks again!

Thanks! I had no idea at the time that the prices of Premier would take off like they have over the pasy year. I’m not sure anyone could have seen this coming.

[Willikn]

It appears that the 1990 UD and Score in a 10 slab have realized a near 100% bump in the last two months as well. Brodeur RC from less than $75 to over $150.

Jagr UD nearly identical. In January 4SQ has sold 14 PSA 10 Jagr RCs on Ebay. Who knows how many on their site directly. The last for $160. Was what, a $75 card in November?

This is what someone on the outside looking in sees (40 year collector who has only dabbled in hockey, so "me"). The McDavid Young Guns "10" pop is 1,967 and has a gem rate of a whopping 70%. This is able to sustain a $2,000+ card. Jagr isn't McDavid, I know, but the UD "10" pop is 654 (gem rate of 25%) and it isn't found in any factory sets where the 10s are usually mined. Brodeur 10 pop is 1,623 (combining both versions) and he just has the one RC.

Junk wax junk wax junk wax, I know, but a 1989 Fleer Michael Jordan is a junk wax card, high PSA 10 pop, and those things are sustaining some crazy numbers. 1989 Score Barry Sanders. 1989 UD Griffey. What do a lot of these cards have in common? A whole lot of 1990 kids have really fond memories of these.

I don't think this is a 1990 OPC Premier bubble. Either a hobby as a whole bubble or hockey is just playing a little catch up.

[rohara99]

Originally Posted by Willikn

Jagr isn't McDavid, I know

Your right Jagr isn't McDavid.... he's actually won a bunch of stuff and sits 2nd in all time points in NHL history. McDavid wishes to have a career like Jagr haha.

Edit: I agree 100% with the rest of your post as well. Gem rates aren't that high and the rookie class in 90-91 should be a staple in every hockey card collection (in high graded).

[Willikn]

Originally Posted by rohara99

Your right Jagr isn't McDavid.... he's actually won a bunch of stuff and sits 2nd in all time points in NHL history. McDavid wishes to have a career like Jagr haha.

Edit: I agree 100% with the rest of your post as well. Gem rates aren't that high and the rookie class in 90-91 should be a staple in every hockey card collection (in high graded).

You wanna see some really low pop, check those UD hologram inserts from 1990. Cross reference to what a 1991 PSA 10 Jordan UD hologram pulls right now. Gretzky isn't Jordan but he's about as close as it gets.

[OhioPlayer]

Funny stuff- this summer I picked up several 1990 hockey boxes at a garage sale- the guy was a big time collector and threw the upper deck boxes for free

[k13]

Jagr should be worth more than McDavid and with the lower pop one has to go down or the other up in theory.

Either $5000 Jagr or McDavid going down to $400 long term.

It will take some time.

It took idiots 15 years to appreciate Ovie and finally pay up.

McDavid never pass Jagr in anything anyway.

[Willikn]

Originally Posted by k13

Jagr should be worth more than McDavid and with the lower pop one has to go down or the other up in theory.

Either $5000 Jagr or McDavid going down to $400 long term.

It will take some time.

It took idiots 15 years to appreciate Ovie and finally pay up.

McDavid never pass Jagr in anything anyway.

Probably more a a reflection of the product, not the player. Anything crafted in 1990 is viewed as trash. This thread proves it. In reality, high grade 1990 UD is no easy mark. The lack of factory sets plays a big role. Yes the image on the 90 UD Jagr is poor, but any worse than a 2003 Topps LeBron RC? Add, UD is the face of hockey.

Not meant to derail from OPC Premier. I don't see a world where that one doesn't stick as THE Jagr RC to own.

[k13]

Originally Posted by Willikn

Probably more a a reflection of the product, not the player. Anything crafted in 1990 is viewed as trash. This thread proves it. In reality, high grade 1990 UD is no easy mark. The lack of factory sets plays a big role. Yes the image on the 90 UD Jagr is poor, but any worse than a 2003 Topps LeBron RC? Add, UD is the face of hockey.

Not meant to derail from OPC Premier. I don't see a world where that one doesn't stick as THE Jagr RC to own.

YG's are a trash product too.
People view it too highly.

1990 UD is probably better quality.

If not for perception of premier being more rare.
The UD card would be just like UD Griffey rc.

The french one will turnout just like 1987 opc Bonds rc.

[Willikn]

Originally Posted by k13

The french one will turnout just like 1987 opc Bonds rc.

Wheels turning...

..on 2nd thought, no one should buy that junk. JUNK WAX!

[k13]

New record for UD Jagr. Almost $200 usd.

[rohara99]

I still think Jagr OPCP > UD but screw it, I love both!

[sportzking]

I was lucky enough to get back into hockey and picked up a Jagr for my PC. At the price now, there is no way I'd be happy paying those prices. But I am surprised at how the prices went up pretty quickly. To think too, I was contemplating buying a sealed box for $100 just for fun. Probably not going to now.

[McGuillicuddy]

Originally Posted by sportzking

I was lucky enough to get back into hockey and picked up a Jagr for my PC. At the price now, there is no way I'd be happy paying those prices. But I am surprised at how the prices went up pretty quickly. To think too, I was contemplating buying a sealed box for $100 just for fun. Probably not going to now.

I've had this set since I was 15 years old, but I can't tell you how many times a factory set or unopened box came up on Kijiji for $15 and I thought it would be fun to grab one. Kicking myself now for not doing it!

[valleynuckfan]

$1000 ???
Something not quite right here.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1990-91-O-P...IAAOSwVWBfuuy2

[Willikn]

Originally Posted by valleynuckfan

$1000 ???
Something not quite right here.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1990-91-O-P...IAAOSwVWBfuuy2

The exact same set is still for sale as well. Neat trick. Make it look like someone is buying at that price.

[Orangejello727]

Originally Posted by k13

The pop reports are low compared Zion/Luka prizm 25k psa 10s garbage...lol

Prices have more to do with demand than they with supply. All of 30 people in the world create the demands for hockey cards vs hundreds of millions for basketball. Thats what sets apart a pop 25k card getting crazy prices vs hockey cards getting no love. Plus a majority of hockey card collectors are Canadians. Canadians in general dont pay premiums for hockey cards.

[valleynuckfan]

Originally Posted by Willikn

The exact same set is still for sale as well. Neat trick. Make it look like someone is buying at that price.

Yeah market manipulation.
Shill bidder/fake account buys it with BIN then cancels so no money exchanged or fees accrued.
Market artificially inflates.
But $1K? Seems a little too obvious. Why not just go $500 +/- and incrementally build it up?
Or take the listing down, snap a couple of new pics and relist it in a week?