Are we in the early 90s again!

[palmetto7]

You cant buy cards of any type anywhere.......its crazy. 2018 Topps Chrome Update Mega will be 1k by the end of the season easily. Zion rookie cards are bonkers.

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk

[SupermanBrandon]

Ugh!!!

[nowiamsad]

One day it's "we're in a bubble"

Next day it's "I'm priced out of the hobby"

Can we come to some consensus here?

[Technochocolate]

Originally Posted by smanzari

the '90s pump popped from the strike- where would we be now if that never happened? Base cards losing most their value is absolutely nothing new and rare variations have also pretty much always held their value relative to the market.

Yeah, but don't worry. It's not like we have labor strife upcoming in the next year or so in the sport or anyt-

hey wait a second

[pewe]

Originally Posted by nowiamsad

One day it's "we're in a bubble"

Next day it's "I'm priced out of the hobby"

Can we come to some consensus here?

Aren’t those two signs of consensus???


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Skeely]

Originally Posted by Uwfootball1

I think there's a market for it right now but yea I think it will bubble and go down. Graded cards will keep their value better.

A thought that comes to me is that topps keeps increasing the prices of boxes meaning more people are turning just to buying single cards. When the bubble bursts cant wait to see prices go down again for products. 3 packs of heritage retail cost me like 50 CAD yesterday ridiculous!

This is probably the most inccorect statment in this entire thread imo. Grading companies will sink along with the rest if we really are on a bubble that bursts. TPG's currently cant catch an altered card if there life depended on it and at some point everybody will come to that conclusion if they arent stilll able to line there pockets through those companies. The hobby's upswing right now is the only thing keeping tpg's in business with there current problems. The majority of the people supporting tpg's right now will turn on them in second when they cant get a 3-5x return on investment in every card they submit. Money is blinding.

[Skeely]

Originally Posted by nowiamsad

One day it's "we're in a bubble"

Next day it's "I'm priced out of the hobby"

Can we come to some consensus here?

Those are extremely similiar statments.

[Uwfootball1]

Originally Posted by Skeely

This is probably the most inccorect statment in this entire thread imo. Grading companies will sink along with the rest if we really are on a bubble that bursts. TPG's currently cant catch an altered card if there life depended on it and at some point everybody will come to that conclusion if they arent stilll able to line there pockets through those companies. The hobby's upswing right now is the only thing keeping tpg's in business with there current problems. The majority of the people supporting tpg's right now will turn on them in second when they cant get a 3-5x return on investment in every card they submit. Money is blinding.

An interesting take on what I said, theres some truth to your response but all I was attempting to say was that with the overprinting that Graded cards such as rookies and stuff will still maintain better value than just the out of the box base that people are selling for ridiculous prices.

I do agree that they will also drop but I think they will recover better, just look at the graded cards from the junk era much higher prices

[oldgoldy97]

You’re wrong.

[dashcol]

Originally Posted by Uwfootball1

so true! its always fun to pick up some cool items that just look good. Even if they are cheap online its no fun to do that pay 4$ shipping for the 2$ item.

And on the other hand not knowing if it will look as good to you in person on higher value items

True. It’s also why I like the LCS better. Prices may be a little higher, but no shipping, no waiting and I get to see it before I buy. It’s worth the extra 5% to have that.

[Uwfootball1]

Originally Posted by dashcol

True. It’s also why I like the LCS better. Prices may be a little higher, but no shipping, no waiting and I get to see it before I buy. It’s worth the extra 5% to have that.

My old LCS closed a few years ago, so now I have no where to go except shows and online. Closed due to fire not lack of business I might add! Then again due to that my wallets always heavier at shows l0l

[pewe]

Originally Posted by Uwfootball1

I think there's a market for it right now but yea I think it will bubble and go down. Graded cards will keep their value better.

A thought that comes to me is that topps keeps increasing the prices of boxes meaning more people are turning just to buying single cards. When the bubble bursts cant wait to see prices go down again for products. 3 packs of heritage retail cost me like 50 CAD yesterday ridiculous!

I think this is more likely true for base cards in series that are hard to gem

But for things like chrome and SP / #d cards my bet is that raw retains more value given graded offerings seem to have become unhitched from traditional raw -> graded ratios


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[cardsin47]

I hope so! Will buy up everything that’s awesome, that I can’t afford now ...... and when the storm passes, awesome is still, and always will be .... awesome

[dashcol]

Originally Posted by palmetto7

You cant buy cards of any type anywhere.......its crazy. 2018 Topps Chrome Update Mega will be 1k by the end of the season easily. Zion rookie cards are bonkers.

Sent from my SM-G950U1 using Tapatalk

Maybe I’m lucky, but my LCS has wax, not much basketball or football, but baseball is pretty available. Then again though, he must have a magic connection as he still has top loaders and penny sleeves, and not even at markup! Actually he gave them to me free yesterday because I bought some boxes from him for UNDER COMP. I believe I am the rarity though.

As far as Zion prices, you can still get a lot of good deals, stay away from Prizm and Optic and deals are abound.

Originally Posted by SupermanBrandon

Ugh!!!

At least this one, the conversation has been able to be taken in a direction different from normal bubble talk!

Originally Posted by nowiamsad

One day it's "we're in a bubble"

Next day it's "I'm priced out of the hobby"

Can we come to some consensus here?

The bubble is why most say they can’t afford the hobby. Why is this hard to understand?

Originally Posted by Skeely

This is probably the most inccorect statment in this entire thread imo. Grading companies will sink along with the rest if we really are on a bubble that bursts. TPG's currently cant catch an altered card if there life depended on it and at some point everybody will come to that conclusion if they arent stilll able to line there pockets through those companies. The hobby's upswing right now is the only thing keeping tpg's in business with there current problems. The majority of the people supporting tpg's right now will turn on them in second when they cant get a 3-5x return on investment in every card they submit. Money is blinding.

While you speak a lot of truths, I have to disagree.

**Disclaimer** As of today, I own exactly 1 graded card, and I bought it yesterday because the LCS gave me a good deal.

I think TPG will stay in the hobby. Even with all the issues they are having right now, when you look at it, it is maybe 1% of their graded cards that are trimmed/fake/altered. Is that too much? To collectors, yes. Is it terrible? No. If you look at a lot of other companies, a 1% failure rate is actually pretty good. It’s why actuarys exist. When a company sees it will cost us $1MM to fix the problem and make that 1% .1%, but the cost of keeping the failures out there is under then it’s acceptable.

Also, a lot of the other communities I belong to beside BO, don’t actually keep up with all the altered and fake cards that have been graded. They still trust PSA because it is such a low amount. To most this is acceptable, which means they will still be popular.

It also does not look like much is coming from the FBI investigation, so when they can say that they have been found not legally responsible by the FBI, then people will trust them even more.

If nothing else, the protection that the cases provide is enough for people to buy them.

[Retired hobbist]

Originally Posted by Uwfootball1

Jeeze I always have a good time at shows but yea the social distancing and stuff is why im still staying away for now.

+I never find anything I really need as my collection is eclectic at best lol. I remember walking around the national in 2019 and having people think i was joking when id inquire l0l.

But man miss that fun of just being there!

Indoor gatherings are severely limited in Canada so unless you live in a province with a low case count then shows won't be happening until fall of 2021.

As for the guys who talk about freedom and rights, do you have the right to unknowingly spread the virus to other people who didn't ask to be in your space ie the baseball card show or memorabilia expo?

This is why I am against shows being open unless the case counts are low in you region.

I can't recall any shows ever having much space, except when the hobby was retrenching in the late 90's.

[Uwfootball1]

Originally Posted by dashcol

Maybe I’m lucky, but my LCS has wax, not much basketball or football, but baseball is pretty available. Then again though, he must have a magic connection as he still has top loaders and penny sleeves, and not even at markup! Actually he gave them to me free yesterday because I bought some boxes from him for UNDER COMP. I believe I am the rarity though.

As far as Zion prices, you can still get a lot of good deals, stay away from Prizm and Optic and deals are abound.



At least this one, the conversation has been able to be taken in a direction different from normal bubble talk!



The bubble is why most say they can’t afford the hobby. Why is this hard to understand?



While you speak a lot of truths, I have to disagree.

**Disclaimer** As of today, I own exactly 1 graded card, and I bought it yesterday because the LCS gave me a good deal.

I think TPG will stay in the hobby. Even with all the issues they are having right now, when you look at it, it is maybe 1% of their graded cards that are trimmed/fake/altered. Is that too much? To collectors, yes. Is it terrible? No. If you look at a lot of other companies, a 1% failure rate is actually pretty good. It’s why actuarys exist. When a company sees it will cost us $1MM to fix the problem and make that 1% .1%, but the cost of keeping the failures out there is under then it’s acceptable.

Also, a lot of the other communities I belong to beside BO, don’t actually keep up with all the altered and fake cards that have been graded. They still trust PSA because it is such a low amount. To most this is acceptable, which means they will still be popular.

It also does not look like much is coming from the FBI investigation, so when they can say that they have been found not legally responsible by the FBI, then people will trust them even more.

If nothing else, the protection that the cases provide is enough for people to buy them.

Good post but now i really desire to know what your graded card is!

[dashcol]

Originally Posted by Uwfootball1

My old LCS closed a few years ago, so now I have no where to go except shows and online. Closed due to fire not lack of business I might add! Then again due to that my wallets always heavier at shows l0l

That stinks. Maybe this boom will bring one back for you.

[Skeely]

Originally Posted by Uwfootball1

An interesting take on what I said, theres some truth to your response but all I was attempting to say was that with the overprinting that Graded cards such as rookies and stuff will still maintain better value than just the out of the box base that people are selling for ridiculous prices.

I do agree that they will also drop but I think they will recover better, just look at the graded cards from the junk era much higher prices

I see your point of view but i am off the opinion that everything graded in the past five to ten years at least of graded stuff will essentially drop to the point of being worth the same of a raw card if we see a market crash. PSA and bgs's opinions right now are as trustworthy as if i had my card graded by my neighborhoods local crackhead at the current moment. Thats not to say that those cards cant be cracked out and resubmitted to an improved more turstworthy psa or bgs or a diffrent tpg tha could take over and regain that worth though.

[dashcol]

Originally Posted by Retired hobbist

Indoor gatherings are severely limited in Canada so unless you live in a province with a low case count then shows won't be happening until fall of 2021.

As for the guys who talk about freedom and rights, do you have the right to unknowingly spread the virus to other people who didn't ask to be in your space ie the baseball card show or memorabilia expo?

This is why I am against shows being open unless the case counts are low in you region.

I can't recall any shows ever having much space, except when the hobby was retrenching in the late 90's.

Please let’s not make this a political discussion. Yes COVID is horrible, yes we all have our opinions on it. Let’s please just leave it at that and talk about the shows that are happening, not whether we agree with or disagree with whatever laws and events are going on. We are civil right now, let’s keep it that way.

[Uwfootball1]

Originally Posted by Retired hobbist

Indoor gatherings are severely limited in Canada so unless you live in a province with a low case count then shows won't be happening until fall of 2021.

As for the guys who talk about freedom and rights, do you have the right to unknowingly spread the virus to other people who didn't ask to be in your space ie the baseball card show or memorabilia expo?

This is why I am against shows being open unless the case counts are low in you region.

I can't recall any shows ever having much space, except when the hobby was retrenching in the late 90's.

All true, however due to work I am in the USA so I might attempt to attend a show this summer once I have been vacinated!

[Uwfootball1]

Originally Posted by Skeely

I see your point of view but i am off the opinion that everything graded in the past five to ten years at least of graded stuff will essentially drop to the point of being worth the same of a raw card if we see a market crash. PSA and bgs's opinions right now are as trustworthy as if i had my card graded by my neighborhoods local crackhead at the current moment. Thats not to say that those cards cant be cracked out and resubmitted to an improved more turstworthy psa or bgs or a diffrent tpg tha could take over and regain that worth though.

You made me spit out my water with the crackhead line, pretty sure those already exist l0l and pretty sure PSA is more valued then them and trusted then the ones that float around!

[Skeely]

While you speak a lot of truths, I have to disagree.

**Disclaimer** As of today, I own exactly 1 graded card, and I bought it yesterday because the LCS gave me a good deal.

I think TPG will stay in the hobby. Even with all the issues they are having right now, when you look at it, it is maybe 1% of their graded cards that are trimmed/fake/altered. Is that too much? To collectors, yes. Is it terrible? No. If you look at a lot of other companies, a 1% failure rate is actually pretty good. It’s why actuarys exist. When a company sees it will cost us $1MM to fix the problem and make that 1% .1%, but the cost of keeping the failures out there is under then it’s acceptable.

Also, a lot of the other communities I belong to beside BO, don’t actually keep up with all the altered and fake cards that have been graded. They still trust PSA because it is such a low amount. To most this is acceptable, which means they will still be popular.

It also does not look like much is coming from the FBI investigation, so when they can say that they have been found not legally responsible by the FBI, then people will trust them even more.

If nothing else, the protection that the cases provide is enough for people to buy them.[/QUOTE]

I would say that there number is higher than 1 percent at this point. Also comparing psa to other companies is a dangerous game because most other companies errors dont have the type of possible repercutions that psa's does. PSA's errors can cost people major money if they find out they have a psa card thats slabbed and altered and has already passed through multiple peoples hands since grading. God forbid a massive card comes back as altered after a million dollar sale. PSA's errors also take a lot longer to resolve than most others. If i need to get a psa card reslabbed due to there error it can take a month plus just to get it back when it is psas error to begin with. If a restraunt messes up my food i can get it changed in twenty mins, if my insurance company messes up a form i can get ahold of them and have it changed within a day or two at most. You cant look at just error rate. You need to take into account the consequences of said errors.

To your point of people buying the cards for protection. I can see that happening but its hard to see people consistently paying 25 dollars minimum for a case. Also at that point psa would no longer be a grading company it would be a case company. Im still suprised that a company hasnt come in with no grading but just a clean case with a nice looking label. People would pay a reasonable price for that i would think.

[Skeely]

Originally Posted by Uwfootball1

You made me spit out my water with the crackhead line, pretty sure those already exist l0l and pretty sure PSA is more valued then them and trusted then the ones that float around!

PSA's opinion is only worth a darn to anyone right now cause its making people money. If the market crashes there opinion will become worthless in a second.

[Skeely]

Originally Posted by dashcol

Please let’s not make this a political discussion. Yes COVID is horrible, yes we all have our opinions on it. Let’s please just leave it at that and talk about the shows that are happening, not whether we agree with or disagree with whatever laws and events are going on. We are civil right now, let’s keep it that way.

Agreed. I hate it when there is a good conversation going and it gets swooped away by a couple people wanting to argue non baseball/ baseball card stuff.

[rcmb3220]

I just checked. My ‘83 Monte Carlo is not in the driveway and I can’t dunk a basketball anymore. I got excited for a minute but now I’m depressed.