Help educate me on a Kobe grail - Page 2

mc1 · 04-19-2022, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOATMJ

The 1996-97 Flair Legacy Row 0 is absolutely a Grail. Especially Kobe's as its his RC.

So he has 6 RCs in flair?

Row 2
Row 1
Row 0

Row 2 Legacy
Row 1 Legacy
Row 0 Legacy

Gimmick

GOATMJ · 04-19-2022, 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mc1

So he has 6 RCs in flair?

Row 2
Row 1
Row 0

Row 2 Legacy
Row 1 Legacy
Row 0 Legacy

Gimmick

Correct, but the Row 0 Legacy is the best and most sought after Parallel out of the bunch.

mc1 · 04-19-2022, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOATMJ

Correct, but the Row 0 Legacy is the best and most sought after Parallel out of the bunch.

Row 0 is not a parallel. Its a short print variation. The Legacy is a parallel of a variation?!

rustywest · 04-19-2022, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mc1

Row 0 is not a parallel. Its a short print variation. The Legacy is a parallel of a variation?!

Stop bro. Your incessant stickling for what is basically semantics is as predictable and almost as painful as Hellcat's shameless TC postings. Its not helpful to OP's quest

mc1 · 04-19-2022, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rustywest

Stop bro. Your incessant stickling for what is basically semantics is as predictable and almost as painful as Hellcat's shameless TC postings. Its not helpful to OP's quest

Dont tell me what to do, pal.

rustywest · 04-19-2022, 02:10 PM

Taxi Driver behind a keyboard

Hellcat · 04-19-2022, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mc1

Those arent perfect. Theyve already started to green. See Cherokee Parks armpit and side of the leg.

Bro you’re color blind no greening. Just stop.

mc1 · 04-19-2022, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rustywest

Stop bro. Your incessant stickling for what is basically semantics is as predictable and almost as painful as Hellcat's shameless TC postings. Its not helpful to OP's quest

PSA and Beckett agree with me.

https://www.psacard.com/psasetregist...omposition/408

https://www.beckett.com/search/?term...6&sport=185226

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hellcat

Bro you’re color blind no greening. Just stop.

Nah, theyve already started to green. Give it 5-6 more years and theyll be even more green!

rustywest · 04-19-2022, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mc1

PSA and Beckett agree with me.

https://www.psacard.com/psasetregist...omposition/408

https://www.beckett.com/search/?term...6&sport=185226

Never said you were wrong. You just find a way to do this in every thread possible. Even predicted it in my first post with a friendly mention. But I didn't think you were a net tough guy. OP is not looking for the best true rookie card, he is looking for a grail from his rookie year. So that's going to be one of the parallels... all this other sh*t doesn't matter

pete2345 · 04-19-2022, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hellcat

https://ibb.co/ZHmHk71
https://ibb.co/xFD00GS

Those look terrible all sorts of greening going on.

Mattchanman · 04-19-2022, 03:12 PM

Personal favorite Kobe rookie card 1996 Topps Redemption. Reasonably priced and PSA pop count is in the 800s vs. Topps chrome ~6000+

mc1 · 04-19-2022, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rustywest

Even predicted it in my first post with a friendly mention. But I didn't think you were a net tough guy. OP is not looking for the best true rookie card, he is looking for a grail from his rookie year. So that's going to be one of the parallels... all this other sh*t doesn't matter

Im just giving my opinion. This is all friendly banter to me, guy. At no point did I ever become aggressive.

Jasonheff · 04-19-2022, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GOATMJ

The 1996-97 Flair Legacy Row 0 is absolutely a Grail. Especially Kobe's as its his RC.

Ok,

So from what I have discerned, I either need to find one of the 20 non-“hulk”

versions of the Topps Chrome Refactor OR go with my original idea of the Flair Legacy Row 0.

So…anyone got one they want to part with?

Thanks and this has been super helpful!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

AbraCalabro · 04-19-2022, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hellcat

Jean from Arena design has said several times the chromium cards are on a one to one basis. Just because others have greened it doesn’t mean the pristine color versions will green. It’s was all in how the mixture of chemicals were distributed in the process. Again the guys who discount the chrome refractors are the ones who can’t afford a superior copy. All these Legacy cards are laughable being considered a grail in the first place when there are 3 versions all numbered to 150 each. Again the most valuable Kobe rookie is his pristine color chrome refractor and it’s not even close like I said there are a handful in existence. We’re almost 30 years into this card if it hasn’t hulked yet the chances are it will never.

Nah, not at all. I let numerous refractors, Jordan and otherwise, go by because I knew they would become discolored.

I had no idea Jean Arena worked for Topps and was involved in the development of the Chromium technology to the extent of knowing about chemical mixtures, I thought Arena Design simply designed the cards. (Anyone have a link to Jean Arena making this statement?)

Once a card begins to green, it will get progressively worse.

You're too busy harping on how there are 'x' pristine color copies of this card you have a ton of money in and you're missing the outstanding and superior appeal of the Row 0 Legacy Collection. Better photography, better depth in design and a much nicer parallel...hell, the base Row 0 has the Chrome beat. Some things age like fine wine, others age like milk, Chromium is of the latter group up until the point Topps fixed the problem. Best of luck protecting your investment.

Tommy1380 · 04-19-2022, 04:56 PM

Kobe's rookie grails are these 3, in no particular order...

Flair Legacy Collection
E-X2000 Credentials
Topps Chrome Refractor

If you're going for true base RC's then they're probably in this order...

E-X2000 PSA 10
Flair Showcase Row 0 PSA 10
Topps Chrome PSA 10

Ignore anyone who says his Flair Legacy Collection isn't a grail. A Row 0 PSA 10 is currently a $100,000 card.

Hellcat · 04-19-2022, 05:16 PM

I don’t have to protect any investment I have $1500 into both of my cards I bought them in the 90s. What I said is true why are you trying to debate me? So many guys DM me wanting my refractor you’re out of touch bro.

AbraCalabro · 04-19-2022, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hellcat

I don’t have to protect any investment I have $1500 into both of my cards I bought them in the 90s. What I said is true why are you trying to debate me? So many guys DM me wanting my refractor you’re out of touch bro.

What's true is that this product (96/97 Topps Chrome) is prone to greening and the Chromium Reaper always gets his due. While I'm sure there are some people out there who genuinely like the 96/97 Topps design more than anything in the world, for the majority part, that Kobe Chrome is just an investment buggy pulled by hype donkeys.

It had its mentions in Beckett back in the day, generated some nice hype, lived up to the hype for a while, but, 96/97 Topps Chrome will eventually become 96/97 Topps Gonorrhea.

Look, I get it, your copies are beautiful in comparison to some of the examples I've seen before, truly outstanding...but time will catch up to them. No one looks at a discolored Chromium card and thinks it's beautiful.

Legacy Collection on the other hand, will be as a shining star from heaven until the heat death of the universe.

PLB9eight · 04-19-2022, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pete2345

Those look terrible all sorts of greening going on.

Hulk is on his way

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

AbraCalabro · 04-19-2022, 06:31 PM

Can you take a current picture of those Chrome Kobes? Just curious to see if they still look like that.

mc1 · 04-19-2022, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AbraCalabro

Can you take a current picture of those Chrome Kobes? Just curious to see if they still look like that.

Give me 5-6 minutes with them and I can accelerate the greening!

duron · 04-19-2022, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hellcat

Jean from Arena design has said several times the chromium cards are on a one to one basis. Just because others have greened it doesn’t mean the pristine color versions will green. It’s was all in how the mixture of chemicals were distributed in the process. Again the guys who discount the chrome refractors are the ones who can’t afford a superior copy. All these Legacy cards are laughable being considered a grail in the first place when there are 3 versions all numbered to 150 each. Again the most valuable Kobe rookie is his pristine color chrome refractor and it’s not even close like I said there are a handful in existence. We’re almost 30 years into this card if it hasn’t hulked yet the chances are it will never.

But wasn’t she only commenting on acetate cards that have discolored?

Jasonheff · 04-19-2022, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tommy1380

Kobe's rookie grails are these 3, in no particular order...

Flair Legacy Collection
E-X2000 Credentials
Topps Chrome Refractor

If you're going for true base RC's then they're probably in this order...

E-X2000 PSA 10
Flair Showcase Row 0 PSA 10
Topps Chrome PSA 10

Ignore anyone who says his Flair Legacy Collection isn't a grail. A Row 0 PSA 10 is currently a $100,000 card.

Thanks for the feedback man, really appreciated!

You made a comment that the Row 0 is a $100k card, have you seen any recent comps anywhere?

Thanks!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Hellcat · 04-19-2022, 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AbraCalabro

Can you take a current picture of those Chrome Kobes? Just curious to see if they still look like that.

The base Kobe chrome was just taken a month or so ago I just got it back from BGS. The refractor pic is the one I have used since I have been on the board but it’s still the same. I trade and sell all the time so I’m in and out of my safe deposit daily or at least multiple times a week. It’s crazy a BGS 10 just sold for 190k with greening! So much for buy the card not the grade. If it was cracked and graded today it’s a 8 tops. These guys are crazy spending that amount of coin on a 8 quality card at a pristine level.

Jasonheff · 04-19-2022, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jasonheff

Thanks for the feedback man, really appreciated!

You made a comment that the Row 0 is a $100k card, have you seen any recent comps anywhere?

Thanks!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Found it

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Jasonheff · 04-19-2022, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hellcat

The base Kobe chrome was just taken a month or so ago I just got it back from BGS. The refractor pic is the one I have used since I have been on the board but it’s still the same. I trade and sell all the time so I’m in and out of my safe deposit daily or at least multiple times a week. It’s crazy a BGS 10 just sold for 190k with greening! So much for buy the card not the grade. If it was cracked and graded today it’s a 8 tops. These guys are crazy spending that amount of coin on a 8 quality card at a pristine level.

You weren’t kidding, that card is really green

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

04-19-2022, 06:31 PM	#44
AbraCalabro Temporarily Suspended Join Date: May 2013 Location: Believe in Saint Abra. Posts: 10,748	Can you take a current picture of those Chrome Kobes? Just curious to see if they still look like that. __________________ -FREE TRISTAN- LeBron Exquisite /99 - altered & damaged - A master class in corruption. NEVER FORGET: https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1255123

04-19-2022, 02:10 PM	#31
rustywest Member Join Date: Jun 2018 Posts: 2,688	Taxi Driver behind a keyboard

04-19-2022, 03:12 PM	#36
Mattchanman Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 376	Personal favorite Kobe rookie card 1996 Topps Redemption. Reasonably priced and PSA pop count is in the 800s vs. Topps chrome ~6000+

04-19-2022, 04:56 PM	#40
Tommy1380 Member Join Date: Mar 2019 Posts: 403	Kobe's rookie grails are these 3, in no particular order... Flair Legacy Collection E-X2000 Credentials Topps Chrome Refractor If you're going for true base RC's then they're probably in this order... E-X2000 PSA 10 Flair Showcase Row 0 PSA 10 Topps Chrome PSA 10 Ignore anyone who says his Flair Legacy Collection isn't a grail. A Row 0 PSA 10 is currently a $100,000 card.

04-19-2022, 05:16 PM	#41
Hellcat Member Join Date: Aug 2020 Posts: 2,356	I don’t have to protect any investment I have $1500 into both of my cards I bought them in the 90s. What I said is true why are you trying to debate me? So many guys DM me wanting my refractor you’re out of touch bro.