After the loss of Panini trust, do we really believe that autographs are from who the - Page 2

k13 · 11-19-2014, 12:27 AM

Would you really want to sign 5000 cards ???

I sign my cc a few time a day and get tired of it...lol

Who #@#@#@#@en knows...everything about money and no integrity.

ejs23 · 11-19-2014, 12:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lennox.p

i think you have no clue how hard it is to get the player to sign these card or stickers!

some of you guys are just to selfish to understand that these players have other things to do instead to sign cards/stickers for "big kids"!!!

you only think it's hard to get players to sign because Panini always blames the athletes.

who cares if the players have other things to do... no one is forcing them to sign. if they don't want to sign cards, then don't do it. pretty simple.

ManInTheMirror · 11-19-2014, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by k13

Would you really want to sign 5000 cards ???

If I am being paid to do it? Yes.

mnvikingstwins · 11-19-2014, 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ManInTheMirror

If I am being paid to do it? Yes.

Even for fun, sure. Especially considering if I'm bored and am working with notebook paper I'll fill up the margin like it's 25 sticker autos.

Stat Monsters · 11-19-2014, 01:30 AM

The card companies should limit the number of cards signed by each player and do "on card" only.

If you look at athletes like Brandin Cooks, his signature evolved from when he signed for Press Pass with a long signature, to what essentially is a "B C" initial on cards he's signed probably due to the high demand of having to sign thousands of stickers, which it's so easy to get lazy to autograph.

So, is what the fans really getting a true autograph, or a quick initial (much like how on some documents they say initial each page and sign it in full at the end), which actually isn't an autograph, it's an initial.

The stickers are horrible and the companies have poor quality control, allowing stickers where the signature isn't centered and trails off the sticker, so it's an incomplete signature. Again, is that a real autograph in the eyes of a collector if it's cut off?

If Joe Montana were sign a few stickers and give them to you, and you decided to stick it on a Football, a Jersey or a BMW, do you now have an autographed football, jersey and car? So, why does signing a sticker and putting it on a card make it an autographed card?

I'd hope the hobby evolves to recognize the prestige of an autograph. Even the card companies grade based on the card company's authentication, but don't really scrutinize the autograph as a good example or a bad one of the athlete's signature. Sure, Beckett (BGS) grades autographs based on ink density and completeness, but it's rather subjective, 'tho kudos to them for trying, and to me, any autograph less than a BGS 10 grade is flawed in a major way.

chipmaster · 11-19-2014, 08:02 AM

Babe Ruth has "Clubhouse" signed baseballs and that was close to 100 years ago......It is rumored that Michael Jordan has used an Autopen at times.

It's always happened, and always will. Remember Dez Bryant's rookie autos as someone mentioned? Unless Panini is onsite giving Blumpkins, there's no ironclad (Panini's word choice) guarantee.

Sooner · 11-19-2014, 09:00 AM

Cam Newton's hand signed cards which he autographs at events have one signature while all his sticker autos have a different signature.

Same guy signs his name differently in public and on card than he does on sticker and in his house? Don't think so. Cam Newton's sticker autos are signed by his agent.

lionsfan20 · 11-19-2014, 09:12 AM

Maybe we should start tweeting or asking players themselves to get some answers since panini will never come clean?? I know most players will just ignore or deflect but I could see one or two players being honest about this kind of thing. Someone like Arian Foster maybe?? He seems to not really care what the NFL or someone like Panini would like him to be saying so he may answer his fans questions honestly. Just a thought I may be completely wrong.

chipmaster · 11-19-2014, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lionsfan20

Maybe we should start tweeting or asking players themselves to get some answers since panini will never come clean?? I know most players will just ignore or deflect but I could see one or two players being honest about this kind of thing. Someone like Arian Foster maybe?? He seems to not really care what the NFL or someone like Panini would like him to be saying so he may answer his fans questions honestly. Just a thought I may be completely wrong.

Ask RG3 why he has 3 different autographs on his Contenders RC's

Tell him I said Big Ups while you're at it

ernieren · 11-19-2014, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lennox.p

i think you have no clue how hard it is to get the player to sign these card or stickers!

some of you guys are just to selfish to understand that these players have other things to do instead to sign cards/stickers for "big kids"!!!

You are right players do have other things to do. But they are also getting paid for this. Plus cards are part of the game one with companies promoting teams and players. Plus all the money these companies pay to get these rights goes into players pockets.

Clarka3 · 11-19-2014, 12:11 PM

if Panini wanted to pay me to run around the country to personally witness players signing, I would totally do it...

deltapi1049 · 11-19-2014, 12:18 PM

I HAVE SAID THIS FOR A LONG TIME - Panini does most of their signings through the agents of the players instead of live. This means there is no interested third party who they can trust. They literally just have to trust the agent. You really think the agent is going to throw his guy under the bus? Cmon.

Check out Cordarrelle Patterson's autographs from Topps and everyone else vs the ones in Treasures and many of the later Panini products. We can tell he signed a few legit in Spectra and contenders, but gave up halfway through.

I talked to a few guys from the authenticators and none of them though the autos matched.

xavieronly1 · 11-19-2014, 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ManInTheMirror

If I am being paid to do it? Yes.

You would do it because you have a crap job right now. Those players earn so much that even a $3/auto for 5000 stickers is nothing for them. They can easily pay some family members to do it with $5000 for one sitting, and that player still keeps $10k in the pocket.

Most importantly, you don't get caught by having someone else to sign the auto.

rmw10 · 11-19-2014, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deltapi1049

I HAVE SAID THIS FOR A LONG TIME - Panini does most of their signings through the agents of the players instead of live. This means there is no interested third party who they can trust. They literally just have to trust the agent. You really think the agent is going to throw his guy under the bus? Cmon.

Check out Cordarrelle Patterson's autographs from Topps and everyone else vs the ones in Treasures and many of the later Panini products. We can tell he signed a few legit in Spectra and contenders, but gave up halfway through.

I talked to a few guys from the authenticators and none of them though the autos matched.

I know you're one of the biggest Panini haters around, but let's not pretend that Topps is 100% innocent either. Check out Bernard Pierce's Inception autos. You'll find a stark difference there.

deltapi1049 · 11-19-2014, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rmw10

I know you're one of the biggest Panini haters around, but let's not pretend that Topps is 100% innocent either. Check out Bernard Pierce's Inception autos. You'll find a stark difference there.

They got hit on Cam Newton stickers too, but then they stopped going to him.

Im not aware of any inception issues, especially because those are all signed in person at the rookie premiere.

rmw10 · 11-19-2014, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deltapi1049

They got hit on Cam Newton stickers too, but then they stopped going to him.

Im not aware of any inception issues, especially because those are all signed in person at the rookie premiere.

Not Pierce. They were redemptions for the longest time. Panini has some very questionable Pierce as well. I'm just saying that Topps isn't in the clear either.

callou2131 · 11-19-2014, 01:54 PM

Wow looks like cam newton has his agent, brother in law, ex wifes cousin, and high scool history teacher signing. Alot of different versions and none of them are even close.

callou2131 · 11-19-2014, 02:11 PM

Not even close

deltapi1049 · 11-19-2014, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rmw10

Not Pierce. They were redemptions for the longest time. Panini has some very questionable Pierce as well. I'm just saying that Topps isn't in the clear either.

DEFINITELY NOT. UD has problems, everyone has problems. Didnt realize Pierce was a redemption.

The difference is both UD and Topps stop requesting autographs from that player, Panini keeps going back.

oldgoldy97 · 11-19-2014, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xavieronly1

You would do it because you have a crap job right now. Those players earn so much that even a $3/auto for 5000 stickers is nothing for them. They can easily pay some family members to do it with $5000 for one sitting, and that player still keeps $10k in the pocket.

Most importantly, you don't get caught by having someone else to sign the auto.

Lol.

You think he has a job.

Kollectornet · 11-19-2014, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sooner

Cam Newton's hand signed cards which he autographs at events have one signature while all his sticker autos have a different signature.

Same guy signs his name differently in public and on card than he does on sticker and in his house? Don't think so. Cam Newton's sticker autos are signed by his agent.

Some guys do change up their public signatures compared to sigs for companies. I know Kobe does for sure and I wouldn't doubt that Cam wouldn't. I personally would have to see both (Cam) but some players do because they know a lot of people sell them and not keep the autograph so the change it.

LsujoeyLsu · 11-19-2014, 04:29 PM

Serious question....aren't most of the topps chrome rookies signed at the premiere?

Lockdown32 · 11-19-2014, 05:23 PM

Why in the world would a player incriminate themselves. They sign a contract. They would be sued if they don't sign their cards and admit to it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lionsfan20

Maybe we should start tweeting or asking players themselves to get some answers since panini will never come clean?? I know most players will just ignore or deflect but I could see one or two players being honest about this kind of thing. Someone like Arian Foster maybe?? He seems to not really care what the NFL or someone like Panini would like him to be saying so he may answer his fans questions honestly. Just a thought I may be completely wrong.

xavieronly1 · 11-19-2014, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lockdown32

Why in the world would a player incriminate themselves. They sign a contract. They would be sued if they don't sign their cards and admit to it.

The world must be so perfect that no one will break any contract or commit a crime.

In all serious, it takes much more research for Panini to spot fake autos than putting them on the card which people will buy them anyway.

mattfastiggi · 11-19-2014, 09:55 PM

This is why I'm refraining from autographs of this era.....and sticking to the rare inserts. I think the short print ones will end up more valuable than the supersaturated autograph and jersey market, and to me they're more wholesome - no concern of legitimacy

11-19-2014, 08:02 AM	#31
chipmaster Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: puppies n kittie cats Posts: 10,049	Babe Ruth has "Clubhouse" signed baseballs and that was close to 100 years ago......It is rumored that Michael Jordan has used an Autopen at times. It's always happened, and always will. Remember Dez Bryant's rookie autos as someone mentioned? Unless Panini is onsite giving Blumpkins, there's no ironclad (Panini's word choice) guarantee. __________________ rainbows n butterflies

11-19-2014, 09:12 AM	#33
lionsfan20 Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Nebraska Posts: 7,610 frankieheimann frankieheimann	Maybe we should start tweeting or asking players themselves to get some answers since panini will never come clean?? I know most players will just ignore or deflect but I could see one or two players being honest about this kind of thing. Someone like Arian Foster maybe?? He seems to not really care what the NFL or someone like Panini would like him to be saying so he may answer his fans questions honestly. Just a thought I may be completely wrong. __________________ I collect Exquisite, Triple Threads, National Treasures, Five star and SP Barry Sanders stuff.

11-19-2014, 12:11 PM	#36
Clarka3 Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 17,874 Clarka3 Clarka3	if Panini wanted to pay me to run around the country to personally witness players signing, I would totally do it... __________________ Luke Kuechly Collector pending: w8lifter28 (custom), Don't ask me how much I want to offer. Come with a price in mind. If I don't want it or think it's worth that, I will let you know.

11-19-2014, 01:54 PM	#42
callou2131 Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Centreville, Md Posts: 8,504	Wow looks like cam newton has his agent, brother in law, ex wifes cousin, and high scool history teacher signing. Alot of different versions and none of them are even close. __________________ Sent using US Airways Wifi

11-19-2014, 02:11 PM	#43
callou2131 Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Centreville, Md Posts: 8,504	Not even close __________________ Sent using US Airways Wifi Last edited by callou2131; 07-01-2018 at 10:17 AM.

11-19-2014, 12:27 AM	#26
k13 Banned Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 12,617	Would you really want to sign 5000 cards ??? I sign my cc a few time a day and get tired of it...lol Who #@#@#@#@en knows...everything about money and no integrity.

11-19-2014, 01:30 AM	#30
Stat Monsters Member Join Date: Nov 2012 Posts: 2,504	The card companies should limit the number of cards signed by each player and do "on card" only. If you look at athletes like Brandin Cooks, his signature evolved from when he signed for Press Pass with a long signature, to what essentially is a "B C" initial on cards he's signed probably due to the high demand of having to sign thousands of stickers, which it's so easy to get lazy to autograph. So, is what the fans really getting a true autograph, or a quick initial (much like how on some documents they say initial each page and sign it in full at the end), which actually isn't an autograph, it's an initial. The stickers are horrible and the companies have poor quality control, allowing stickers where the signature isn't centered and trails off the sticker, so it's an incomplete signature. Again, is that a real autograph in the eyes of a collector if it's cut off? If Joe Montana were sign a few stickers and give them to you, and you decided to stick it on a Football, a Jersey or a BMW, do you now have an autographed football, jersey and car? So, why does signing a sticker and putting it on a card make it an autographed card? I'd hope the hobby evolves to recognize the prestige of an autograph. Even the card companies grade based on the card company's authentication, but don't really scrutinize the autograph as a good example or a bad one of the athlete's signature. Sure, Beckett (BGS) grades autographs based on ink density and completeness, but it's rather subjective, 'tho kudos to them for trying, and to me, any autograph less than a BGS 10 grade is flawed in a major way.

11-19-2014, 09:00 AM	#32
Sooner Member Join Date: Jul 2014 Posts: 227	Cam Newton's hand signed cards which he autographs at events have one signature while all his sticker autos have a different signature. Same guy signs his name differently in public and on card than he does on sticker and in his house? Don't think so. Cam Newton's sticker autos are signed by his agent.

11-19-2014, 12:18 PM	#37
deltapi1049 Banned Join Date: May 2008 Location: Minnesota Posts: 4,801 deltapi1049	I HAVE SAID THIS FOR A LONG TIME - Panini does most of their signings through the agents of the players instead of live. This means there is no interested third party who they can trust. They literally just have to trust the agent. You really think the agent is going to throw his guy under the bus? Cmon. Check out Cordarrelle Patterson's autographs from Topps and everyone else vs the ones in Treasures and many of the later Panini products. We can tell he signed a few legit in Spectra and contenders, but gave up halfway through. I talked to a few guys from the authenticators and none of them though the autos matched.

11-19-2014, 04:29 PM	#47
LsujoeyLsu Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: New Orleans Posts: 2,304	Serious question....aren't most of the topps chrome rookies signed at the premiere?

11-19-2014, 09:55 PM	#50
mattfastiggi Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 276	This is why I'm refraining from autographs of this era.....and sticking to the rare inserts. I think the short print ones will end up more valuable than the supersaturated autograph and jersey market, and to me they're more wholesome - no concern of legitimacy