Draymond Green

[drobfan8]

We wouldn't even know who Draymond was if it wasn't for Steph and Klay.

Multiple teams still wanted Klay after 2 signifcant injuries.

There is no market for Draymond. Exactly why he said he's going out when Steph does.

[Nomad]

Speaking of analyst's chair. I could never see him quite the same after he had his version of a therapy sesh with KD. Did they have a falling out or something that led to the trade from GS?

[Scottish Punk]

Originally Posted by drobfan8

We wouldn't even know who Draymond was if it wasn't for Steph and Klay.

Multiple teams still wanted Klay after 2 signifcant injuries.

There is no market for Draymond. Exactly why he said he's going out when Steph does.

Yes, Draymond has a unique skill set. Golden State's system maximizing that skill set. I think he would still be a really good player in any system. I don't see him being a HOFer on an everyday team. Of course, anybody playing with Curry is already going to be a ton better. Just based on how Curry spaces the floor out. Dubs don't win championships without Draymond. So it goes both ways. Klay, Curry, and KD are soft players. Draymond brings them grit and an enforcer when the shooters are getting mugged. Plus he is the defensive QB. Draymond is smart enough to know he is in the best spot for his career.

His cards will never have much value beyond lower tier HOFer. Think Ben Wallace. Dubs are at least a much more popular team than the Pistons.

[JustinVerlander07]

Originally Posted by drobfan8

We wouldn't even know who Draymond was if it wasn't for Steph and Klay.

Multiple teams still wanted Klay after 2 signifcant injuries.

There is no market for Draymond. Exactly why he said he's going out when Steph does.

You don't even believe any of this.

[blackvodka]

To me Draymond always felt like the right era, right team and right time big man. He was vital to the Warriors team make-up during their reign. That obviously goes both ways with the splash brothers.

Just like Dillon Brooks, he can be easy to dislike, so I get that aspect. I might be wrong, but I'll always have my doubts that Green would have had much success elsewhere.

Sent from my motorola razr 2024 using Tapatalk

[Asian62150]

Originally Posted by blackvodka

To me Draymond always felt like the right era, right team and right time big man. He was vital to the Warriors team make-up during their reign. That obviously goes both ways with the splash brothers.

Just like Dillon Brooks, he can be easy to dislike, so I get that aspect. I might be wrong, but I'll always have my doubts that Green would have had much success elsewhere.

Sent from my motorola razr 2024 using Tapatalk

Yup. Draymond is not one of those guys you start a team with but he's a guy who will make a good team great.

But a lot of guys went to the right team at the right time. They took advantage of the opportunity and had a great career. Do Joe Montana or Tom Brady have the same success if they were drafted higher to different teams? Popovich was about to get fired by the Spurs during TD's rookie year, but the team turned it around and he'll probably go down as a top 3 NBA coach of all time.

That's sports.

[JustinVerlander07]

Absolute blasphemy to think a HOF player is only good because of Curry. Does/did Curry make him better? Of course. His defense would've been special anywhere. While it's common place in 2025 for your PF/C to initiate offense or be a lead ball handler, that wasn't common at all in 2015. Teams were looking for a guy like Draymond, and that's not hyberbole. The Warriors changed the league based on Steph's insane 3 point ability and Draymond's ability for small ball.

[cnewby]

Originally Posted by drobfan8

We wouldn't even know who Draymond was if it wasn't for Steph and Klay.

Multiple teams still wanted Klay after 2 signifcant injuries.

There is no market for Draymond. Exactly why he said he's going out when Steph does.

Exactly this. Fell into the perfect storm to maximize his role player skillz.

[Nomad]

I often find myself wondering why I am not a huge Warriors fan. Vibe wise. I think it's Steph as much as anything. He is a good guy, but NBA puts its stars in such a bubble. The Bay Area is liberal, but hardly egalitarian. I relate more to the everyday gainers.

I guess if I collected anyone GS, it would be Hardaway or Draymond. Or maybe back in the day Mullen, Richmond, Garland, and Bol.

[JustinVerlander07]

Stealing this off reddit because it was a fantastic post

"The "Thinking Basketball" podcast recently released an episode discussing the greatest individual peaks of the 21st century, and it featured a controversial choice: Draymond Green. His inclusion often sparks debate because he's not a dominant scorer, and it's hard to picture him as a team's number one option. However, traditional statistics don't fully capture his immense impact on the court.

Here are some numbers that highlight his unique value:

During Stephen Curry's back-to-back MVP seasons (2014-15 and 2015-16), the Warriors averaged an incredible 70 wins per season. The on/off court numbers from that period:

Curry without Draymond: +8.6 net rating ( 700+ minutes)

Draymond without Curry: +8.2 net rating ( 700+ minutes)

This trend continues in the playoffs. Looking at all of the Warriors' NBA Finals runs between 2015 and 2022 (in games where both played), the team often performed better defensively and held its ground even when Curry was resting:

Curry without Draymond on court: +1.5 net rating (114.5 ORTG, 113.0 DRTG)

Draymond without Curry on court: +4.1 net rating (108.1 ORTG, 104.0 DRTG)

In fact, during the 2015 and 2018 championship playoff runs, the Warriors' defense, anchored by Green, was arguably more dominant than their offense, even during Curry's minutes on the court.
2015: +2.1 rORTG -10.1 rDRTG
2018: +6.6 rORTG -10.9 rDRTG

Advanced stats that account for the quality of opponents and teammates, like RAPM, consistently rate Draymond as one of the most impactful players in the league.

It's also worth remembering that Green was a respectable floor spacer during Curry's MVP years. Draymond shot 36% from 3 on 3.7 attempts per game.

Perhaps the most compelling argument is how he elevates Curry's own performance. In the playoffs from 2015 to 2022, Curry's scoring efficiency saw a remarkable jump with Green on the floor:

With Draymond (3,534 minutes): 27.4 points per 75 possessions on 62.7% True Shooting

Without Draymond (671 minutes): 26.8 points per 75 possessions on 55.4% True Shooting"

[NBAicons]

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

Stealing this off reddit because it was a fantastic post

"The "Thinking Basketball" podcast recently released an episode discussing the greatest individual peaks of the 21st century, and it featured a controversial choice: Draymond Green. His inclusion often sparks debate because he's not a dominant scorer, and it's hard to picture him as a team's number one option. However, traditional statistics don't fully capture his immense impact on the court.

Here are some numbers that highlight his unique value:

During Stephen Curry's back-to-back MVP seasons (2014-15 and 2015-16), the Warriors averaged an incredible 70 wins per season. The on/off court numbers from that period:

Curry without Draymond: +8.6 net rating ( 700+ minutes)

Draymond without Curry: +8.2 net rating ( 700+ minutes)

This trend continues in the playoffs. Looking at all of the Warriors' NBA Finals runs between 2015 and 2022 (in games where both played), the team often performed better defensively and held its ground even when Curry was resting:

Curry without Draymond on court: +1.5 net rating (114.5 ORTG, 113.0 DRTG)

Draymond without Curry on court: +4.1 net rating (108.1 ORTG, 104.0 DRTG)

In fact, during the 2015 and 2018 championship playoff runs, the Warriors' defense, anchored by Green, was arguably more dominant than their offense, even during Curry's minutes on the court.
2015: +2.1 rORTG -10.1 rDRTG
2018: +6.6 rORTG -10.9 rDRTG

Advanced stats that account for the quality of opponents and teammates, like RAPM, consistently rate Draymond as one of the most impactful players in the league.

It's also worth remembering that Green was a respectable floor spacer during Curry's MVP years. Draymond shot 36% from 3 on 3.7 attempts per game.

Perhaps the most compelling argument is how he elevates Curry's own performance. In the playoffs from 2015 to 2022, Curry's scoring efficiency saw a remarkable jump with Green on the floor:

With Draymond (3,534 minutes): 27.4 points per 75 possessions on 62.7% True Shooting

Without Draymond (671 minutes): 26.8 points per 75 possessions on 55.4% True Shooting"

If you are looking to increase collector interest in Draymond Green, it's going to be a very long and tough road. He's about as unlikable as they come.

[JustinVerlander07]

Originally Posted by NBAicons

If you are looking to increase collector interest in Draymond Green, it's going to be a very long and tough road. He's about as unlikable as they come.

I have zero care about what other people do with his cards. Look at this thread, he doesn't get respect for how good he is/has been, the post I saw on reddit I thought articulated it better than I could do. You don't have to look too far back to see people who don't understand Basketball talk about him poorly.

[Above the Rim]

I'll 2nd that ... Draymond always welcome on my team. Sorry if that irritates some, but dude is really good.

[drobfan8]

Draymond without Steph is 51 and 75.

Good for 11th or 12th in the West year in and out. Ha ha.

He'd be Bruce Bowen in Miami and Boston levels of relevance.

Dude basically shines Steph's boots.

Draymond is a really good 4th best player on teams though. 1st, 2nd and you're cooked.

[Nomad]

Draymond has passion. But he is also the only player I had to actually turn down the volume of a game on. My old self would have thrown a punch at him if we were in a room together.

[JustinVerlander07]

Originally Posted by drobfan8

Draymond without Steph is 51 and 75.

Good for 11th or 12th in the West year in and out. Ha ha.

He'd be Bruce Bowen in Miami and Boston levels of relevance.

Dude basically shines Steph's boots.

Draymond is a really good 4th best player on teams though. 1st, 2nd and you're cooked.

Don't let actual stats get in the way of your lack of knowledge about Basketball!

[NBAicons]

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

I have zero care about what other people do with his cards. Look at this thread, he doesn't get respect for how good he is/has been, the post I saw on reddit I thought articulated it better than I could do. You don't have to look too far back to see people who don't understand Basketball talk about him poorly.

A lot of the anti-Draymond comments you see here are simply a reflection of the fact that most people view him as a cancer to both the Warriors and the league. His ability and statistics may indeed be better than how he is viewed, but he brought the widespread hate upon himself. He will likely go into the Hall of Fame as a first ballot Hall of Famer. But only a few collectors will care. And not many basketball fans will care either.

[fabiani12333]

Originally Posted by NBAicons

A lot of the anti-Draymond comments you see here are simply a reflection of the fact that most people view him as a cancer to both the Warriors and the league. His ability and statistics may indeed be better than how he is viewed, but he brought the widespread hate upon himself. He will likely go into the Hall of Fame as a first ballot Hall of Famer. But only a few collectors will care. And not many basketball fans will care either.

He has most definitely not been a cancer to the Warriors -- he's been a team leader, in fact.

He has been a part of a long line of "enforcers" in NBA history, dating back to at least the Bad Boy Pistons in the late 80s and early 90s. He brings the toughness and physicality to his team, and is willing to tussle with other team's players.

He's had problems with his emotions on the court, which have gotten him in trouble on many occasions. But it's a part of who is as a player and competitor, and it's part of what has made him the success he's been.

[Scottish Punk]

Originally Posted by fabiani12333

He has most definitely not been a cancer to the Warriors -- he's been a team leader, in fact.

He has been a part of a long line of "enforcers" in NBA history, dating back to at least the Bad Boy Pistons in the late 80s and early 90s. He brings the toughness and physicality to his team, and is willing to tussle with other team's players.

He's had problems with his emotions on the court, which have gotten him in trouble on many occasions. But it's a part of who is as a player and competitor, and it's part of what has made him the success he's been.

Correct. Warriors don't win any of those titles without Draymond. I love the splash bros, Curry is on my Mt Rushmore of favorite players. Both Klay and Steph aren't gritty players. Draymond anchors the defense and does all the dirty work in the paint and keeps Curry/Klay clean. Even KD isn't much of grinder. I could see other teams really roughing up the spalsh bros if Draymond wasn't there to give some of it back. He also is the pivot point on offense with is passing/screen game.

He is in a unique spot where his skillsets are perfect for the Warriors team makeup. If he was on any other random team, he isn't likely to have the same success. He is too smart of a player not to be good, but maybe not DPOY type seasons.

[Above the Rim]

The Warriors management and coaches aren't stupid. With all the roster moves, they have kept Draymond - they know what they have.

[Nomad]

Originally Posted by drobfan8

Draymond without Steph is 51 and 75.

Good for 11th or 12th in the West year in and out. Ha ha.

He'd be Bruce Bowen in Miami and Boston levels of relevance.

Draymond is a really good 4th best player on teams though. 1st, 2nd and you're cooked.

The thing is, unlike with a player who has cycled through 3-4 teams over a career, we have no reference. Would Steph have been as great without Dray? And visa versa. Lacking that knowledge, at the end of the day, I value their cards basically equally.

[duwal]

for regular season play when Draymond plays the Warriors are 586-295, when he isn't in the game the Warriors record is 79-79. He's the defensive anchor that checks other teammates when they get relaxed on the defensive end. 5 times he's been voted in top 3 as defensive player of the year.

[JustinVerlander07]

Originally Posted by NBAicons

A lot of the anti-Draymond comments you see here are simply a reflection of the fact that most people view him as a cancer to both the Warriors and the league. His ability and statistics may indeed be better than how he is viewed, but he brought the widespread hate upon himself. He will likely go into the Hall of Fame as a first ballot Hall of Famer. But only a few collectors will care. And not many basketball fans will care either.

A cancer to his team wouldn't have 4 NBA championships. That is just silly a narrative from people who don't actually like him.

I am glad there is more people than normal on blowout recognizing how good Draymond is/has been. The 2nd best player on 2 title teams and 3rd best on the other two. Makes everyone around him better. Slam dunk no doubt first ballot HOF player.

[drobfan8]

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

Don't let actual stats get in the way of your lack of knowledge about Basketball!

Ba ha ha.

I'd reply, but your delusion is way too strong. Would love to hear where your amazing knowledge of basketball comes from??? Let me guess, sitting on the couch with a pack of potato chips?

Draymond has cost this squad titles, not won them any. They'd be just fine without him.

They can get 7/7/7 from anyone that knows how to pass the ball. It's just a shame he never got to team up with his LeBron, the dude who's balls he loves to play with the most.

Draymond is the guy that's always yapping and cocky while he's playing alongside one of the GOATs, I bet he wouldn't be saying much if he was the 1 or 2 option and they're getting destroyed which is exactly what happened when Steph was out all through 2019.

[Nomad]

Draymond is super smart. He reminds me a little of Nesmith. Always intuitively seeking where the ball will be.

I am confused, is Kuminga taking a pay drop to $7 mil to stay on Warriors? That's kind of cool.