The Zion 'Fatboi' Williamson Career LDL/HDL Tracker | BBW Appreciation Megathread.

[jcardstore]

Originally Posted by TSonn

Ha! Fair enough. Though, Luka's issues are mostly related to the current season (you could put FT% to be fair) while Zion's have been clear and ongoing since YouTube. And Trae/Ja narratives are reaching - especially the sports market thing - have you seen Giannis? He plays for the Milwaukee Bucks. And if you include sports market then you have to add that to Zion too.

I'm really not trying to rag on Zion - he's fun to watch, is a freak athlete, and seems like a genuinely good dude. He's still got the highest ceiling out of all the recent draft studs but also has the most to improve/prove. The main one for me is that he has to rely on someone else to get him the ball in the half court. Which other superstar relies on someone else? LeBron, Giannis, Kawhi, Durant, Luka, Trae, Ja, Tatum, Mitchell, Harden, Curry, Jokic, Lillard - all these dudes are primary or secondary ball-handlers for their team. During crunch time they are all running the offense.

This is what separates true super stars from the rest. If you can't create your own shot you're limited like the other top guys aren't. Hard to be the alpha if you're not able to go create a shot when you need to.

[Akphillips86]

People are too obsessed with comparisons. You are talking about a 6’6 kid who is built like a Mack truck who jumps out of the building. He’s got a first step quick enough to blow by most guards and the physical strength to bully almost any forward.

Are there flaws in his game? Heck yes there are.

Is he 20? Indeed he is.

You honestly think this kid’s potential is maxed out? This is the point where I’m in disbelief at some of the hot takes on him.


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[Spacemanspif]

He's this generation's Shaq. He needs the teammates and infrastructure around him to be successful, but that's true of any player. The media and advertising companies love him, and he's going to average 25+ while giving you a couple SC top 10 plays every week. That's more than enough to keep him at the top of the Hobby for the next few years

[Donkaylove]

Originally Posted by jcardstore

Turns out that not everyone can be a generational talent. Is he a generational athlete? Sure.

When we're talking the full package though he's not close. He's terrible defensively, doesn't have a great handle, doesn't really have a consistent jumpshot. So he's somewhat limited offensively.

I wasn't impressed with Zion last year and I'm not impressed this year. He can be a 23-12 guy and put up great offensive stats but the expectations were set so high it's unlikely for him to live up to them.

I've never bought 1 Zion card and won't be buying any because I don't think he's going to be more than a multi-year all-star. He's priced as if he's going to be perennial 1st team all-nba MVP contender.

He is priced as the mvp already-yet will not be in any top ten discussion.

[suknives]

it's quite evident that some of you don't watch basketball, or at least don't understand it, and are somehow forgetting that Zion is 20. Years. Old. With a new coach, and a super young team, and a PG that doesn't quite understand his role yet (and another one that's equally useless on offense).

And still putting up 22/10, with relative ease.

Can he improve on defense? Absolutely. Can he improve from the line? Absolutely. Can he improve his handling? Absolutely. Why do some of you expect him to run an offense that already starts 2 PG's (they shouldn't) that can't shoot lol? That roster needs work, and it isn't constructed very well around Zion right now.

[suknives]

Originally Posted by Donkaylove

He is priced as the mvp already-yet will not be in any top ten discussion.

He's priced as a hyped up rookie who was drafted while the hobby started booming. There's a difference.

[Wade Mulroy]

I think Zion's shortcomings are well known by everyone at this point, regardless of whether you're a fan, investor, casual viewer, doubter, or somewhere in between.

Having watched all of Zion's games, I can certainly see an improvement in his ball handling from last season, even though it's still shaky, at-best. Last year, it was almost a guarantee that he would lose the handle, get his pocket picked, or fall down (or a combination of those three things). Even though he's not scaring anyone with his handles this season, you can tell its a part of his game that is coming along and he's getting confidence having the ball on the perimeter and generating for himself. Yes, it's still ugly at times, but I'm encouraged by the progress.

The other big gripe is his lack of a jumper. It was mentioned on the broadcast last night (and in this thread) that a focal point of his practice is 12-15 ft jumpers.

My point is that there are a number of directions Zion's career could potentially go. Despite his very obvious shortcomings in certain aspects of his game, he 'seems' to be a personality that has a desire to be great. We've seen numerous raw talents over the years come into the league with all the potential that never do anything with it. One thing most everyone in this thread can agree on is the potential with Zion, and it's encouraging to me that he seems to have a workhorse attitude to get better as opposed to a Dewayne Haskins attitude. I'm sure his shortcomings are most obvious to himself and I'm excited to see if he stays hungry and truly takes it to the next level.

I really enjoy his anti-diva persona and have a desire for someone like him to succeed.

[gomiamigo]

I hope he succeeds but he will likely never reach Barkley's level, much less Lebrons.

[thenashcollecto]

Originally Posted by gomiamigo

I hope he succeeds but he will likely never reach Barkley's level, much less Lebrons.

I admit I haven’t seen a lot but I predict he won’t reach Amares impact on the game let alone Barkley or better. Will be interesting to come back someday and look at how right or stupid this was.

[dcarado]

Originally Posted by thenashcollecto

I admit I haven’t seen a lot but I predict he won’t reach Amares impact on the game let alone Barkley or better. Will be interesting to come back someday and look at how right or stupid this was.

This sums up the majority of these threads

[suknives]

Originally Posted by dcarado

This sums up the majority of these threads

Right? A bunch of guys who don't watch games, making uninformed predictions after a guy plays 25 games lol

[ShaneFalco]

Its almost too embarrassing to reply to some of you old heads comparing Zion to ZACK RANDOLPH and ELTON BRAND LOL. Do some of ya'll even watch the games or just the stat line? At the very least watch the condensed game/highlights. Pure comedy. Let the young man play ball first

[Jopeal]

Anyone who thinks Zion can’t create his own shot either doesn’t know basketball and/or isn’t paying attention.

[suknives]

Originally Posted by Jopeal

Anyone who thinks Zion can’t create his own shot either doesn’t know basketball and/or isn’t paying attention.

He has the quickest 1st step of anyone I've ever watched. And he's the size of a linebacker lol

[TSonn]

Originally Posted by suknives

Right? A bunch of guys who don't watch games, making uninformed predictions after a guy plays 25 games lol

I mean, I've watched over half of his games. Please tell me why we shouldn't be concerned that he's not even a secondary ball handler for his team?

I've got a stash of Zion (my #3 collected guy), so I've got some stake in his game which is why I watch. I just can't see how he'll surpass Anthony Davis (both in hobby love and NBA accolades) without becoming a point-forward.

I'm with you all that his shot will get better and his body will get better - and I hope he stays as injury free as possible - but I just don't see a path for him to be a top 5 player without developing the ability to run the offense.

[TSonn]

Originally Posted by Jopeal

Anyone who thinks Zion can’t create his own shot either doesn’t know basketball and/or isn’t paying attention.

I think he can create his own shot just fine - but he's not going to be running the offense anytime soon which means he has to rely on someone else to get him the ball - no other superstar has to rely on someone else (maybe AD?).

[Jopeal]

Originally Posted by suknives

He has the quickest 1st step of anyone I've ever watched. And he's the size of a linebacker lol

Yeah, 30 games into his career and he’s already abusing the entire league from the triple threat on the elbow.

Also, Shaq is garbage by some of the arbitrary standards set in this threads.

[jcardstore]

Originally Posted by Jopeal

Anyone who thinks Zion can’t create his own shot either doesn’t know basketball and/or isn’t paying attention.

Yea sorry, you're not giving Zion the ball in the half court at the end of the game and telling him to go get himself a shot. He doesn't have a good handle and that's a prerequisite to being able to create a shot in the half court.

Giving him the ball in the paint or getting a switch onto a smaller guy he can bully isn't creating a shot.

[Jopeal]

Originally Posted by jcardstore

Yea sorry, you're not giving Zion the ball in the half court at the end of the game and telling him to go get himself a shot. He doesn't have a good handle and that's a prerequisite to being able to create a shot in the half court.

Giving him the ball in the paint or getting a switch onto a smaller guy he can bully isn't creating a shot.

Watch a few basketball games then come holler.

[jcardstore]

Originally Posted by Jopeal

Watch a few basketball games then come holler.

It's really hard for me to take this seriously.

[Jopeal]

For context I have no Zion PC beyond a few base cards. I just think he’s a stud from a talent perspective and that anyone comparing him to Lebron or Luka is completely out of their depth in analyzing Zions game.

[jcardstore]

You're acting like I'm making the wildest hot take ever by saying Zion doesn't have a proficient half court handle when that's a super obvious flaw of his that pretty much anyone agrees on

[Jopeal]

Originally Posted by jcardstore

You're acting like I'm making the wildest hot take ever by saying Zion doesn't have a proficient half court handle when that's a super obvious flaw of his that pretty much anyone agrees on

Are you aware that Zion is a Big?
He takes people off the dribble often but you’re caught up comparing him to prototypical point guards.

[TSonn]

Originally Posted by Jopeal

Are you aware that Zion is a Big?
He takes people off the dribble often but you’re caught up comparing him to prototypical point guards.

You seem to keep dodging this question:

Which of the top 10 guys in the league have to rely on someone else getting them the ball?

Once you realize that number is 0 - then you have to ask 2 questions: Will Zion develop that? If not, will Zion be so much better on the block than anyone else that he can completely transcend modern basketball?

I think the answer to both of those is maybe, but it's silly to think it's a given.

[Spacemanspif]

Originally Posted by TSonn

You seem to keep dodging this question:

Which of the top 10 guys in the league have to rely on someone else getting them the ball?

Once you realize that number is 0 - then you have to ask 2 questions: Will Zion develop that? If not, will Zion be so much better on the block than anyone else that he can completely transcend modern basketball?

I think the answer to both of those is maybe, but it's silly to think it's a given.

Giannis and AD come to mind.