Observations on the current state of the hobby from a show this weekend

[ScooterD]

Originally Posted by fabiani12333

There weren't MLB-licensed cards of 16-year-olds back then.

What am I missing - this kid was 16 at release




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[fabiani12333]

Originally Posted by ScooterD

What am I missing - this kid was 16 at release

Great -- and there were rookie cards of 36-year-olds as well:



I was referring to what was typical -- not extremely rare. Nowadays, it's common to have Bowman 1st cards of teenagers who are under 18. Back then, it rarely happened.

[Twalk1975]

Some stuff that I look for that I would not consider to be a target for investors (not a Bowman 1st or RC, not auto'd, not a PSA 10) can be pretty pricey or difficult to find. Perhaps investors are expanding what they target, or maybe there is still a strong collector base.

[ScooterD]

Originally Posted by fabiani12333

Great -- and there were rookie cards of 36-year-olds as well:



I was referring to what was typical -- not extremely rare. Nowadays, it's common to have Bowman 1st cards of teenagers who are under 18. Back then, it rarely happened.

All good, and not a big deal. I know you’re a numbers guy and very exacting, so I thought I would help you educate others by sharing that, while atypical and rare, the statement “This didn’t happen” was untrue.

[gwgecko]

Originally Posted by premium1981

I'm aware it was a thing. I was there. But it was exactly as I said. Less than 50% of homes had internet in 1998. The first article I found with these statistics said the number did not cross over the 50% mark until 2001. Just because you were able to stream on Whatnot in 1998 on your AOL disk, doesn't mean everyone else was. Per usual, you think in terms of what you personally see and like, not what actual reality is/was.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...-subscription/

The initiative by Sir William Clinton was because, as I have already stated, the internet was not available wide spread. Thats why he did it. He didn't snap his fingers and magically put the internet in everyones homes. That takes time.

Yeah, back then you needed a $2,000 computer and then pay another $20 a month for dialup internet. The internet was a lot more exclusive then

[fabiani12333]

Originally Posted by gwgecko

Yeah, back then you needed a $2,000 computer and then pay another $20 a month for dialup internet. The internet was a lot more exclusive then

Half of US households had a PC by 1999 -- PCs had dropped in price to below $1,000:

Half of all US homes had at least one personal computer at the end of 1998, largely in part because of a big drop in prices, a market researcher said Tuesday.

PC ownership rose across all income levels, according to the survey of about 3,000 households, but much of the growth came from households with lower incomes or people without college degrees. A big drop in PC prices made them more affordable last year, Baker said.

https://www.wired.com/1999/02/half-o...omes-own-a-pc/

In the world of computer prices today, PC means pretty cheap _ with cheaper still to come. The average price of a personal computer using Windows and an Intel microprocessor is $890 (without a monitor that can add another $100 or more) _ and is expected to drop to less than $800 by December, according to PC Data, a market research firm. That is down from $1,123 about a year ago.

Seven of every 10 computers sold cost less than $1,000, up from 13 percent of the market in January 1997. Computers that cost less than $600 make up about a quarter of PC sales.

https://www.tampabay.com/archive/1999/08/30/cheap-pcs/


Half of US adults were using the internet by 1999:

The number of adults using the Internet in the United States has surpassed 100 million, a market research report said this week, with surfers becoming increasingly savvy about ways to use the Web.

https://www.nytimes.com/1999/11/12/b...0-million.html

[premium1981]

Originally Posted by fabiani12333

Half of US adults were using the internet by 1999:


https://www.nytimes.com/1999/11/12/b...0-million.html

I always enjoy when people start tweaking the argument after they realized they were wrong. I like the wording here about "using the internet" instead of what I was actually talking about. A computer and internet access in the home. I'm not paying for some random NY Times article, but I would venture a guess that if I was able to view it they would be stuff in there about using the internet at the library or some other silly stuff. Don't change the argument. Just admit you were wrong.

[MiamiMarlinsFan]

Originally Posted by ScooterD

All good, and not a big deal. I know you’re a numbers guy and very exacting, so I thought I would help you educate others by sharing that, while atypical and rare, the statement “This didn’t happen” was untrue.

Don’t listen to what Fabiani says, magically interpret what he actually means!

[jkampis]

Originally Posted by Big35Hurt

Lol....sarcasm? How does $60 in 1990 dollars compare to $60 today?

I mean, if you’d left $60 in a non-interest bearing account for 35 years, you’d still have $60.

[jkampis]

Originally Posted by premium1981

I'm aware it was a thing. I was there. But it was exactly as I said. Less than 50% of homes had internet in 1998. The first article I found with these statistics said the number did not cross over the 50% mark until 2001. Just because you were able to stream on Whatnot in 1998 on your AOL disk, doesn't mean everyone else was. Per usual, you think in terms of what you personally see and like, not what actual reality is/was.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...-subscription/

The initiative by Sir William Clinton was because, as I have already stated, the internet was not available wide spread. Thats why he did it. He didn't snap his fingers and magically put the internet in everyones homes. That takes time.

Quite the super team: Al Gore invented the internet and Bill Clinton pushed its adoption.

[KhalDrogo]

Originally Posted by Above the Rim

Local show, was expecting maybe 50/50 Sports/Pokemon, was like 80 plus % Pokemon.

Absolutely amazing this Pokemon craze! My kid literally cannot find anywhere with Pokemon in stock with original retail prices. Apparently, everyplace gets immediately cleared out, most likely by scalpers. There are now Pokemon vending machines we have looked at in the major stores - ALL SOLD OUT.

My little box I brought to the show for trades with assorted Curry, Derrick Henry, Jokic, Skubal, Crochet, Skenes, few others, didn't even come out of my backpack - ugh !

Dealers have to go where the money is.

Popular Pokemon promos with likely 500k+ printed copies are consistently fetching $200-$300 for PSA 10s. These are cards I was paying $50-$75 for just a year ago. The entire market has done 3-4x in the last 6 months. It is insane.

Demand will wane for those types of cards. Demand won’t wane for the ~20 years of low print run, condition scarce goodness. There’s still plenty of opportunity if people want in.

[Slvnumber2]

Went to the Midwest Monster show in Indy this weekend, and we were planning on going Saturday and Sunday but left after about 4 hours. Had never been to this one, and we go to the National every year since mid to late 90’s and have done Nashville, Dallas, Sun Times in Chicago, and we set up at our local show every month which is 100+ tables. Got through this show in 4 hours and was not impressed unfortunately.

Went through the first 3rd of the tables in about 1.5 hours and every table was the same thing - bunch of Jayden Daniel’s and Caleb Williams cards, low end baseball, bunch of Caitlin Clark cards, lots of Uptown’s and Downtowns, and very little nice stuff or high end cards. A few tables had some Jordan rookies, very little high end vintage except for Ash’s table which has awesome stuff as always, and 1/3 of the room was Pokémon cards. If they had this show a month later with Topps basketball out and Donruss football 2025 on the street it would have helped. Every table had pretty much the same stuff.

Knew several dealers there and they all said they were having strong sales at the show, so have to factor that in to the equation to be fair. Just not a show for strong vintage stuff or lots of high end items except for a few tables. Some dealers said the show earlier this year was much better.

[PuddleMonkey]

Not a show but went to a local shop to pick up more top leaders and the Pokemon side of the shop had at least a dozen or more people going through Pokes, Magic, etc. On the sports side it was just me and one other dude. Now I know why the shop expanded to carry Pokeys.

[jduds]

We had a local show for the first time in a while. The last one I went to was probably in 2004 at our mall. The show was pretty much all locals selling off their unwanted hits from the last few years along with slabs that they were disappointed with their grades. Still, it was fun to actually have a show I guess even if I left empty handed after twenty minutes.

The better news is we got an awesome new LCS
that was the exact opposite of the show. Wax was priced reasonably (or at least around going market price), but it was their wonderful single selection that will make it a place I go to often. Their inventory was obviously carefully curated by someone who really knows cards. On-card autos greatly outnumbered stickers, more true color refractors than waves, popular case hits, a very good vintage selection for the area, and a focus on the most popular players. I left there with a card I’ve wanted for a while, but figured I’d definitely be buying off eBay. 1951 Bowman in south Mississippi? Yes, please. I’d say having shoes in the area and a great new LCS are both great signs for the card world.



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[Sluggerrr]

Great card, jduds!

[Mattsurewood]

Originally Posted by jduds

We had a local show for the first time in a while. The last one I went to was probably in 2004 at our mall. The show was pretty much all locals selling off their unwanted hits from the last few years along with slabs that they were disappointed with their grades. Still, it was fun to actually have a show I guess even if I left empty handed after twenty minutes.

The better news is we got an awesome new LCS
that was the exact opposite of the show. Wax was priced reasonably (or at least around going market price), but it was their wonderful single selection that will make it a place I go to often. Their inventory was obviously carefully curated by someone who really knows cards. On-card autos greatly outnumbered stickers, more true color refractors than waves, popular case hits, a very good vintage selection for the area, and a focus on the most popular players. I left there with a card I’ve wanted for a while, but figured I’d definitely be buying off eBay. 1951 Bowman in south Mississippi? Yes, please. I’d say having shoes in the area and a great new LCS are both great signs for the card world.



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Jduds--While you were shopping around..was Jackson, MS native Konnor Griffin a hot commodity down there? He had a great year in the minors...

[Raleigh504]

Always curious, I see a lot of people saying "table had the same old stuff as every other table" which to me the popular names tend to move at shows.


So, when you go to a show, what are you typically looking for?

[Big35Hurt]

Originally Posted by Raleigh504

Always curious, I see a lot of people saying "table had the same old stuff as every other table" which to me the popular names tend to move at shows.


So, when you go to a show, what are you typically looking for?

1) an experience without body odor
2) Frank Thomas cards

[LVDan]

Originally Posted by Raleigh504

Always curious, I see a lot of people saying "table had the same old stuff as every other table" which to me the popular names tend to move at shows.


So, when you go to a show, what are you typically looking for?

I think for most it means dealers who make an effort to turn over stale inventory and bring at least some new items show over show.
After 6 shows in 2 years if no one is showing interest in your better stuff smart sellers will move it(even at cost or less) to freshen up your cases and catch some new eyes or new interest from the old eyes.

[NYBBFAN]

Originally Posted by Raleigh504

Always curious, I see a lot of people saying "table had the same old stuff as every other table" which to me the popular names tend to move at shows.


So, when you go to a show, what are you typically looking for?

I fully realize that I am in the minority here. I only collect baseball, I don’t do prospects and I only have my eye on a select few vintage cards.

The showcases full of orange speckle lava autos of a 22 year old AA player just don’t do it for me.

Similarly, the cases of VG-grade 1950s and 60s players don’t cut it either.

I love 90s/2000s, I like some newer stuff of some select players. That’s the stuff people don’t need to bring to shows because it sells itself.

[DR Murph]

Originally Posted by Raleigh504

Always curious, I see a lot of people saying "table had the same old stuff as every other table" which to me the popular names tend to move at shows.


So, when you go to a show, what are you typically looking for?

I look for the hard to find stuff of players that I collect. For example, I wanted a Phoenix Blue Luka Rc /99 at the National, but never saw one. Instead I bought a rare Contenders Optic Preview Luka Rc in a 9 (total pop 14).

[Twalk1975]

Originally Posted by Raleigh504

Always curious, I see a lot of people saying "table had the same old stuff as every other table" which to me the popular names tend to move at shows.


So, when you go to a show, what are you typically looking for?

Last few that I've been to I've been looking for deals on prior year hobby boxes to open. Flagship, Heritage, Stadium Club type stuff. Have one coming up in a few weeks and I'm hoping to find some 2024 stuff, Heritage High Number would be awesome.

[ironfireman]

Originally Posted by Raleigh504

Always curious, I see a lot of people saying "table had the same old stuff as every other table" which to me the popular names tend to move at shows.


So, when you go to a show, what are you typically looking for?

I went to the big two-day Charlotte show today - busy, but only about two-thirds full, with some empty tables. Maybe half Pokémon, and around 10–15 vendors with any real vintage (a few of those were way overpriced). I walked the whole floor asking who had raw — only ended up spending real time at four tables and was done in about three hours.

It used to be you couldn’t get through all the vintage tables in a single day. Now, it feels like the smaller, interesting sellers are getting priced out. One vendor told me his table was $380 for the weekend - not insane for 2-day 8', but enough to keep out the oddball guys with the random cool stuff. What’s left are the big business banners, the graded ultra-mint showcases, Pokemon, and the traveling overpriced vintage museums. Thankfully, a few dealers actually sell and still bring new vintage stuff each show, and that’s what keeps it worth going. But it's getting less and less and I'm less and less inclined to go to these "bigger" shows.

[bblair_2002]

Originally Posted by Raleigh504

Always curious, I see a lot of people saying "table had the same old stuff as every other table" which to me the popular names tend to move at shows.


So, when you go to a show, what are you typically looking for?

Set needs
Albert Pujols needs
Bargain box singles

Tables at my local shows do have the same things every month and it's getting difficult to find cards I'm looking for.

[youseekyoda421]

Originally Posted by Raleigh504

Always curious, I see a lot of people saying "table had the same old stuff as every other table" which to me the popular names tend to move at shows.


So, when you go to a show, what are you typically looking for?

This is a great question! I went to a small show today. There was a good balance of vintage and modern (very little Pokemon). I was looking for...

1) Vintage Twins especially HoF. Looking to fill complete runs of Topps cards for Killebrew, Oliva, and Carew. Mostly interested in raw, but graded at the right price (paying for the condition, not the slab).

2) Any Kirby Puckett cards I don't have. Didn't find any today.

3) Any interesting Joe Mauer or other early notable 2000's Twins cards. Nothing today, but had a good time digging through bargain boxes.

4) Just having fun looking. There are always unique, interesting cards and the unexpected find makes it worth going. Found three unmarked '95 Leaf Promo cards for $1 each. My useless baseball card knowledge came in handy!