Panini Mosaic NFTs

[monkeymcgee]

Originally Posted by Grid

Sports card NFT have been around for what, a year or 2? Sports cards have been around for what, 100-150 years?

Sure sounds like a tried and true tested market to me! And surely must be as good of an investment!

Wake me up, when physical cards have a code on them, to allow me to unlock THAT card into my account on the chain. I get the card, which is tangible, as well as the ability to show it off on the blockchain.

And when I sell/trade that card, I can then go online and transfer the digital asset as well to the new owner.

Right now, it is a Ponzi scheme. You are buying nothing and you are getting nothing. Nothing emotional and personal in my standpoint. Just my opinion. Once Fanatics takes over, and do what they plan to do, these Panini Digital cards will be as valuable as Topps Huddle is right now.

It's not a Ponzi scheme--it's a greater fool scheme, if you think these are a fraud.

I bet on NFTs because I don't think younger collectors are tied to cardboard like older collectors. Ironically, cardboard to me is riskier on the higher end due to manipulation, trimming and other "fixes", and advances in the ability to counterfeit which I believe will become a massive problem in the future.

Cardboard has a lot of problems and it's foolish to not recognize that NFTs solve some of them.

[jplarson]

Originally Posted by Grid

Wake me up, when physical cards have a code on them, to allow me to unlock THAT card into my account on the chain. I get the card, which is tangible, as well as the ability to show it off on the blockchain.

I take a similar position when I'm buying movies. I buy the Blu-Ray/4K and if it comes with a digital code, great! I'll use it but I'm under no illusions I'll always have it. Look a few summers ago when Ultra Violet shut down. If account holder didn't transfer their digital collections to another platform in time, POOF, all gone. I still have my unedited physical copies.

Originally Posted by Grid

Right now, it is a Ponzi scheme. You are buying nothing and you are getting nothing. Nothing emotional and personal in my standpoint. Just my opinion. Once Fanatics takes over, and do what they plan to do, these Panini Digital cards will be as valuable as Topps Huddle is right now.

100%. This is exactly Topps Huddle and Panini Blitz without the mythical blockchain. I'm glad I won't be holding the bag on these.

[Grid]

Originally Posted by monkeymcgee

It's not a Ponzi scheme--it's a greater fool scheme, if you think these are a fraud.

I bet on NFTs because I don't think younger collectors are tied to cardboard like older collectors. Ironically, cardboard to me is riskier on the higher end due to manipulation, trimming and other "fixes", and advances in the ability to counterfeit which I believe will become a massive problem in the future.

Cardboard has a lot of problems and it's foolish to not recognize that NFTs solve some of them.

Thats the thing. Old collectors are assuming young collectors will like this stuff. They aren't buying for themselves, they are buying because they think a different generation will want.

IMO, that is whats propping up the market.

In reality, how many signed Tom Brady rookie cards are there? Its done, it was a moment in time, its over. It happened that year, and cant happen again.

If you came into the sport in 2002, or 2022, or 2052 (if his feats still stand) that card is desirable.

How many different NFT's are out there for Brady now? How many different companies are offering something, with his likeness, on the chain? How many more, in a year, 3 years or 5 (if its still a thing)?

Investing in something, that you hope a proven finicky generation will covert, is pure risk. And not the same as investing in trading cards, that have been around for over a century.

Generation Z would rather spend their money on experiences, their own individuality, like buying a strange hat, or something that would make themselves more unique. Who is to say, they will flock to NFT's? All the money is, like you pointed out, based on speculation.

All just opinion, as I cant tell the future. But I collected cards, because I love sports as well as having a past collecting cards, like so many of us have in our youth.

There is nostalgia involved, which doesn't exist in NFT's. And Gen Z has proven not as avid of fans for the major leagues. But more so actively athletic themselves, or watching fringe sports. There is a reason Overwatch League is popular. That is more of what they watch.

[monkeymcgee]

Originally Posted by Grid

Thats the thing. Old collectors are assuming young collectors will like this stuff. They aren't buying for themselves, they are buying because they think a different generation will want.

IMO, that is whats propping up the market.

In reality, how many signed Tom Brady rookie cards are there? Its done, it was a moment in time, its over. It happened that year, and cant happen again.

If you came into the sport in 2002, or 2022, or 2052 (if his feats still stand) that card is desirable.

How many different NFT's are out there for Brady now? How many different companies are offering something, with his likeness, on the chain? How many more, in a year, 3 years or 5 (if its still a thing)?

Investing in something, that you hope a proven finicky generation will covert, is pure risk. And not the same as investing in trading cards, that have been around for over a century.

Generation Z would rather spend their money on experiences, their own individuality, like buying a strange hat, or something that would make themselves more unique. Who is to say, they will flock to NFT's? All the money is, like you pointed out, based on speculation.

All just opinion, as I cant tell the future. But I collected cards, because I love sports as well as having a past collecting cards, like so many of us have in our youth.

There is nostalgia involved, which doesn't exist in NFT's. And Gen Z has proven not as avid of fans for the major leagues. But more so actively athletic themselves, or watching fringe sports. There is a reason Overwatch League is popular. That is more of what they watch.

Those are all reasonable points, but that's just not my take or experience.

I actually enjoy NFTs. I like being able to look at my collections on my phone, make deals, not have to worry about condition issues or shipping problems. I like the inherent organization involved with the tokens. I like the variety of options.

There's not a lot of age talk in the discords, but I'm pretty sure based on references and such that I'm (mid-40s) a senior citizen in that group. They aren't the same as card collectors, but they are collectors. They understand market economics, crypto, and a bunch of other things key to the NFT world much better than I think they get credit for. Some are in it for the money, but some are in it for the community and tokens--just like cardboard.

NFTs aren't for everyone, but I do think a lot of you are dismissing it too easily.

[Jaysabz]

Originally Posted by monkeymcgee

Those are all reasonable points, but that's just not my take or experience.

I actually enjoy NFTs. I like being able to look at my collections on my phone, make deals, not have to worry about condition issues or shipping problems. I like the inherent organization involved with the tokens. I like the variety of options.

There's not a lot of age talk in the discords, but I'm pretty sure based on references and such that I'm (mid-40s) a senior citizen in that group. They aren't the same as card collectors, but they are collectors. They understand market economics, crypto, and a bunch of other things key to the NFT world much better than I think they get credit for. Some are in it for the money, but some are in it for the community and tokens--just like cardboard.

NFTs aren't for everyone, but I do think a lot of you are dismissing it too easily.

Super fair. But where's the guarantee that these blockchains won't just go away, that they will last forever? Not trying to attack, I just really would love to hear someone who is in that world's perspective.

[monkeymcgee]

Originally Posted by Jaysabz

Super fair. But where's the guarantee that these blockchains won't just go away, that they will last forever? Not trying to attack, I just really would love to hear someone who is in that world's perspective.

I'll admit that's an area of concern, especially with the more proprietary platforms like Panini and ToppsNFT (not the Wax Series 1 release). I've put some money into the Panini platform with the belief that Fanatics will eventually buy them out, but that's a gamble. I don't think anyone understands the implication of a license-less Panini and what happens with their licensed NFTs.

For the products using standard blockchains like Series 1, Candy, and others there's less of a risk, but the image/asset storage question is one we all have to have some concerns about years from now.

[Brobocop]

The thing with Panini, Topps, and Top Shot is, if I want to sell my card off the platform, can I? No, I cannot so it's tied directly to these platforms. Look at what Topps did, they just up and jumped platforms and basically made a lot of those first run NFTs worthless. These are nothing more than Topps Bunt, Star Wars trader, and other failed online card platforms. These will mothball eventually and you'll have nothing to show for it.

You can already start to see Panini mothballing their platform. The challenges are basically nonexistent. Packs aren't dropping like they used to, liquidity in the market is gone. If them losing the license means their NFT platform goes bye bye, then what's the point in sinking more money into it?

I'm sorry, I still standby my assertion that the three platforms are nothing more than a quick get rich scheme to capitalize on the craze. If a platform does succeed long term, it hasn't caught on yet or hasn't been invented.

[monkeymcgee]

Originally Posted by Brobocop

The thing with Panini, Topps, and Top Shot is, if I want to sell my card off the platform, can I? No, I cannot so it's tied directly to these platforms. Look at what Topps did, they just up and jumped platforms and basically made a lot of those first run NFTs worthless. These are nothing more than Topps Bunt, Star Wars trader, and other failed online card platforms. These will mothball eventually and you'll have nothing to show for it.

You can already start to see Panini mothballing their platform. The challenges are basically nonexistent. Packs aren't dropping like they used to, liquidity in the market is gone. If them losing the license means their NFT platform goes bye bye, then what's the point in sinking more money into it?

I'm sorry, I still standby my assertion that the three platforms are nothing more than a quick get rich scheme to capitalize on the craze. If a platform does succeed long term, it hasn't caught on yet or hasn't been invented.

Panini actually has a number of challenges coming--just announced a few today.

Topps is building a bridge between Wax and Avalanche so people will be able to unify collections.

Candy have plans to allow for you to move NFTs to other marketplaces. Hopefully, they will bring the same to the Topps releases.

I think the portability is becoming increasingly wanted in the sports NFT world since it's standard with other NFTs.

Edit: Forgot to mention that Panini is going to try a pack format similar to Topps where you can pull any of the parallels and inserts in a standard pack rather than going with parallel specific premium packs. I guess we'll see if that helps with volume, but I think it would.

[Grid]

Originally Posted by monkeymcgee

Those are all reasonable points, but that's just not my take or experience.

I actually enjoy NFTs. I like being able to look at my collections on my phone, make deals, not have to worry about condition issues or shipping problems. I like the inherent organization involved with the tokens. I like the variety of options.

There's not a lot of age talk in the discords, but I'm pretty sure based on references and such that I'm (mid-40s) a senior citizen in that group. They aren't the same as card collectors, but they are collectors. They understand market economics, crypto, and a bunch of other things key to the NFT world much better than I think they get credit for. Some are in it for the money, but some are in it for the community and tokens--just like cardboard.

NFTs aren't for everyone, but I do think a lot of you are dismissing it too easily.

And I completely understand that. I think the mobility of digital assets are great, and why things like Bitcoin took off. But Bitcoin was made to be an asset. And with Bitcoin, everything is Bitcoin.

In other words, Bitcoin is not allowing outside companies to create unlimited assets, and attach them to their platform. Bitcoin has always been controlled, and everyone knew the number of coins, mined and to be mined, was always a fixed point.

You just dont have that with NFTs. And that is why I think the market is so unstable. Anyone can make them, Gronk makes his own in fact. Anyone can produce them, how many different companies put out a Trevor Lawrence NFT this year? Head and Shoulders, Adidas and random companies did.

When anyone can make an NFT and anyone can pay to plug an NFT into any chain, nothing is being controlled. Unlike my Bitcoin example.

I may very well be wrong, and will totally miss out. But Bitcoin is worth so much now, because no one was buying Bitcoin then. No one wants to miss out, so everyone is rushing to NFTs now.

When everyone gets in line on day one, it creates a false floor. And when the flips are no longer there (or even the digital assets, who knows) there really is nothing to collect.

If it was just about collecting, and the fun of having digital cards in your digital albums, totally cool. But with the high cost of packs, and rushes for new drops, it is not just about collecting IMO. Its about wanting to make money.

Money to be made right now. But I am speculating, this will be like collecting Pogs 30 years ago. When only 1 company made Pogs, people wanted what they couldnt have. And that drove the price up. Once everyone and their uncle starting making Pogs, it got flooded, and was no longer fun.

Insert Beenie Babies or any other short lived craze. But even those, were actual "things". These are just 1 and 0's.

[oldgoldy97]

Pretty sure Wall-E took place after NFTs ruined the world.

[Grid]

[Paderborn1907]

Originally Posted by Jaysabz

And if the blockchain ceases to exist, you have what exactly?

I don't feel emotion either way.

Actually that is a valid concern that’s why the this space also has to continuously evolve!

Public Blockchains are usually decentralized and data can’t be lost (though I admit I’m not 100% sure how Panini’s Private Blockchain works in detail), but the ledger and the smart contract are safe.

As for the data storage of the NFTs (the actual JPEG etc.), Panini uses AWS so I’m not too concerned about lost data.
Though I also agree that Panini’s NFT way isn’t state of the art, you could potentially store NFTs with IPFS (InterPlanetary File System) or even with a Hardware Wallet to play it 100% safe.
There’re plenty of ways to address these concerns and I’m sure there’re more ways to come.

Early adopters have to take a risk, but the space is trying to mitigate these risks continuously …

[Paderborn1907]

Article about Panini NFTs on ESPN about the Senior Bowl 1/1s.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/...-wild-nft-idea

[blevins26]

Originally Posted by Paderborn1907

Article about Panini NFTs on ESPN about the Senior Bowl 1/1s.

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/...-wild-nft-idea

I think this is a really cool idea. It just stinks that Panini is doing it on their own closed blockchain. It really limits the utility of the NFT. And the thing is, there's no reason for it. Panini could easily code in a 10, 20, or even 50% rake for themselves on any resells (50% would be scummy but they could do it) and just launch the NFT on Ethereum.

So, I think it's a really cool idea but the players are being sold a bit of fool's gold because they probably don't realize that their NFT's won't be really the same as the Bored Ape NFT's they see on high profile athlete's Twitter profiles.

[altaeria]

I think they're called Commanders now.

[Paderborn1907]

Originally Posted by blevins26

I think this is a really cool idea. It just stinks that Panini is doing it on their own closed blockchain. It really limits the utility of the NFT. And the thing is, there's no reason for it. Panini could easily code in a 10, 20, or even 50% rake for themselves on any resells (50% would be scummy but they could do it) and just launch the NFT on Ethereum.

So, I think it's a really cool idea but the players are being sold a bit of fool's gold because they probably don't realize that their NFT's won't be really the same as the Bored Ape NFT's they see on high profile athlete's Twitter profiles.

While that will probably not happen anytime soon, the Hyperledger Sawtooth Blockchain Panini uses can have an Ethereum bridge so I hope this is on the roadmap.

[Mahomescards777]

Just bought a $99 pack got a lamelo ball 8/299

[Paderborn1907]

From NFL Twitter:

Introducing the Walter Payton NFL Man of the Year Trading Card NFTs in collaboration with @paniniamerica.

A 1-of-1 Walter Payton trading card will be minted and gifted to the Walter and Connie Payton Foundation.

A parallel base set will be made available for public auction at 11am ET on 2/11: paniniamerica.net/blockchain.html

All first-sale proceeds will benefit the Walter and Connie Payton Foundation.


https://twitter.com/nfl/status/1491840682054410241?s=21

[Paderborn1907]

Quick summary by someone regarding the Panini NFT AMA:

Crypto/Wallet coming very very soon. Different marketing strategies at play and beginning as well. (Social media marketing, influencers, events, using all platforms and taking advantages of the reach the partners/influencers have. Bringing these NFTs to a public blockchain (opensea for ex) is on the roadmap and work has begun on it. (Gotta get league/partner approvals, etc. will be later in the year at the earliest), API for 3rd parties. Staking cards/sets for rewards, burning, a complete and total overhaul of the website/UI for Panini NFTs, basically a standalone Panini NFT website with a whole new look, ease of access/use, collection features, completion bars for all sets, rewards, user profiles, etc. New leagues/sports coming to NFTs. UFC challenge next week. And probably a couple other things I'm missing.

And a "Thank you" to the community coming with release of Crypto.

[Paderborn1907]

Prizm NFL Packs will be live tomorrow for $20:

- 1 x Base Rookie
- 3 x Regular Base
- 1 x Insert or Parallel

Loot box style, so majority of the packs will be duds.
Not a great deal IMO when you consider the much higher mint count on the base.

I like the Panini road map, but this is pretty tone deaf in the current market.

[ohio_mba]

Bumpity bump..

I'm currently trying to finish up the base Prizm set and I have a bit of extra base. Let me know if you're interested in trading any.

Also, if you are looking to part with your collection on the cheap I might be interested in that too.

[beavers]

Originally Posted by ohio_mba

Bumpity bump..

I'm currently trying to finish up the base Prizm set and I have a bit of extra base. Let me know if you're interested in trading any.

Also, if you are looking to part with your collection on the cheap I might be interested in that too.

Sent you a pm

[ninjacookies]

Originally Posted by Paderborn1907

Quick summary by someone regarding the Panini NFT AMA:

Crypto/Wallet coming very very soon.

We still in beta phase or nah?

[Paderborn1907]

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

We still in beta phase or nah?

Wallet scheduled for end of the month, they mentioned implementation is done, but waiting for red tape approval stuff.

Not that Crypto is still a priority

Panini NFT does really well right now, pretty robust during the crypto crash.

[Paderborn1907]

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

We still in beta phase or nah?

Panini just published the Roadmap in the discord: