Spectra FOTL 6/24

[Ra3]

After the relative success of the revamped spectra product and how hot spectra FOTL got, where does that leave the rankings of spectra vs. prizm, optic, select, and mosaic for 2019/2020?

Feels like it’s ahead of mosaic, which seems to be a bit of a disappointing product this year, and maybe even edging ahead of select? Or am I reading the general sense of market opinion incorrectly?

[mossoholic]

Originally Posted by tolrobb

Blowout has upped their offer yet again to $1400

I'll probably be 1 of the last people standing on these. For me, these are worth more than double 2018-19 Spectra FOTL. No way I can sell these for $1400 to BO when they are offering $1000 on 18-19.

[KidKards101]

I think this year's Spectra is ahead of Select and even Prizm.. there i said it lol. The new colorblast cards and logoman cards are game changers. And the FOTL box is practically loaded. I dunno if I've ever seen such a loaded FOTL box before for the price. NT FOTL is loaded as well, but doesn't have the up to 4 RPA's in a single box.

[bravesfan#1]

Originally Posted by Asian62150

Yeah. I sold to them over the wknd, too.

Kept a few though just in case something like this happened.

I think it's good to sell some to lock in a profit. Even with wax, I know the price keeps going up and up and up, but take some of that profit and re-invest it into more wax!

At least I'm not the only one! I don't let it bother me though, the way I see it I made nearly $2k profit in one week's time flipping five boxes of sports cards. I'll roll that over into the next FOTL release or singles for my PC.

Moving forward I like your idea of holding a couple and selling a couple!

[ChasingZion]

I have purchased just under half of the FOTL basketball products this year. Of those that I missed out on, most were by choice on my part and I don't regret passing on. I regret passing on Spectra. It is my #2 regret for not purchasing any (prizm FOTL #1) and I am crushed that I didn't buy at least one to bust open. Congrats to all that did, Panini did a phenomenal job with Spectra this year all the way around.

[eastbayak]

Last Zion /39 sold for $4050. This is actually where I expected them to sell (and makes most sense given what else is available, including Zions, for that price).

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2019-20-SPE...MAAOSwPT1e~mPj

Congrats to those who listed early and got 2-3x that amount. First to list get premium sales!

[SkipAway]

All,

Is there any reason to believe that Redemption Rookie Jersey Auto's will be sticker autos?

I've seen a few guys whose RPA's are Redemptions... and I'm not sure what to make of it. Panini simply couldn't get the cards completed on-time, or does Redemption sometimes mean something "worse" like sticker autos, or Panini might not have ever actually have the card?

[yiguiri2002]

Originally Posted by eastbayak

Last Zion /39 sold for $4050. This is actually where I expected them to sell (and makes most sense given what else is available, including Zions, for that price).

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2019-20-SPE...MAAOSwPT1e~mPj

Congrats to those who listed early and got 2-3x that amount. First to list get premium sales!

I don't know how happy they'll be. I'll be terrified if I sold for 2-3x on eBay. Hopefully the buyers are decent people and honor the sale.

[tolrobb]

Originally Posted by SkipAway

All,

Is there any reason to believe that Redemption Rookie Jersey Auto's will be sticker autos?

No, since none of the others are.

[Spacemanspif]

Originally Posted by eastbayak

Last Zion /39 sold for $4050. This is actually where I expected them to sell (and makes most sense given what else is available, including Zions, for that price).

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2019-20-SPE...MAAOSwPT1e~mPj

Congrats to those who listed early and got 2-3x that amount. First to list get premium sales!

Looking back at the previous sales, I am sort of doubting the legitimacy of them.

June 30:
https://www.ebay.com/bfl/viewbids/32...p2047675.l2565
winner *1768 @$7800
2nd *31 @$7700 (doesn't bid on any of the others that end... lower)
3rd *1577 @$7500

July 1:
https://www.ebay.com/bfl/viewbids/14...p2047675.l2565
winner *1768 @$6100
2nd *1577 @$6000 (willing to let it go for $1500 less than yesterday, ok...)
3rd *3 @$5200

July 4:
https://www.ebay.com/bfl/viewbids/19...p2047675.l2565
winner *1768 @$6400
2nd *1577 @$6300
3rd *185 @$6000

July 6:
https://www.ebay.com/bfl/viewbids/15...p2047675.l2565
winner *255 @$4050
2nd *96 @$4000
3rd *760 @$3850
Btw, this one had the best patch


class, can anyone tell me what they find interesting about the first 3 auctions?

extra credit if anyone knows the pumpmaster's feedback rating

[yiguiri2002]

The saddest thing for me is that it's extremely easy to manipulate the market. Because even when you get called out like this, it's already too late, prices have gone way up and they are not coming back.

[Spacemanspif]

Originally Posted by yiguiri2002

The saddest thing for me is that it's extremely easy to manipulate the market. Because even when you get called out like this, it's already too late, prices have gone way up and they are not coming back.

yeah, it really hasn't made sense why Spectra would outsell other comparable Zion autos by so much. Hell, I'm sure most here would rather have a sneaker auto than a plain looking patch auto for half the cost. Which btw, who knows what the free market would have paid for those cards if not for manipulation. There was one sold through Hoody's that had to be relisted multiple times, and at DCSports multiple times. same guys manipulating those too when you dig through the bid history

[SkipAway]

Originally Posted by tolrobb

No, since none of the others are.

Makes sense, thanks for the feedback!

[eastbayak]

Originally Posted by yiguiri2002

I don't know how happy they'll be. I'll be terrified if I sold for 2-3x on eBay. Hopefully the buyers are decent people and honor the sale.

Very true. I expressed the same concern earlier but one of the sellers (of the $11.5k sale) said that their buyer was legit and I left it at that. You're right though, previous buyers will be that much more motivated to file a return. I'm hoping that won't be the case though.

Originally Posted by Spacemanspif

Looking back at the previous sales, I am sort of doubting the legitimacy of them.

June 30:
https://www.ebay.com/bfl/viewbids/32...p2047675.l2565
winner *1768 @$7800
2nd *31 @$7700 (doesn't bid on any of the others that end... lower)
3rd *1577 @$7500

July 1:
https://www.ebay.com/bfl/viewbids/14...p2047675.l2565
winner *1768 @$6100
2nd *1577 @$6000 (willing to let it go for $1500 less than yesterday, ok...)
3rd *3 @$5200

July 4:
https://www.ebay.com/bfl/viewbids/19...p2047675.l2565
winner *1768 @$6400
2nd *1577 @$6300
3rd *185 @$6000

July 6:
https://www.ebay.com/bfl/viewbids/15...p2047675.l2565
winner *255 @$4050
2nd *96 @$4000
3rd *760 @$3850
Btw, this one had the best patch


class, can anyone tell me what they find interesting about the first 3 auctions?

extra credit if anyone knows the pumpmaster's feedback rating

Funny you mention this because I noticed the same thing too (on July 1st). I contemplated posting about it but held off. The 1577 bidder is the same person who bought the $11.5k one (if I'm remembering correctly) so the seller of that listing (who is a BO member) should know who they are and/or we can just follow their eBay account's feedback.

It's possible that the 1577 feedback user was willing to add more Zion FOTL RPAs. Interestingly though, he always came behind the 1768 feedback user (at least in the subsequent 3 auctions).

Do you think that the 1768 and 1577 feedback users are the same people or very close friends? I've seen people with multiple (fairly high feedback) eBay accounts so I wouldn't be shocked if that were the case. Or maybe the 1577 user bumped up the price to its max (retracting when going over 1768's bid). Who knows.

Originally Posted by yiguiri2002

The saddest thing for me is that it's extremely easy to manipulate the market. Because even when you get called out like this, it's already too late, prices have gone way up and they are not coming back.

Very true. Not to mention, people don't always care enough (or remember) about the investigative work.

Originally Posted by Spacemanspif

yeah, it really hasn't made sense why Spectra would outsell other comparable Zion autos by so much. Hell, I'm sure most here would rather have a sneaker auto than a plain looking patch auto for half the cost. Which btw, who knows what the free market would have paid for those cards if not for manipulation. There was one sold through Hoody's that had to be relisted multiple times, and at DCSports multiple times. same guys manipulating those too when you dig through the bid history

It's a damn shame.

[ninjacookies]

I have no doubts there was probably shady activity on the Zion RPA's.


But like...95% of the current market is manipulated. Everything under the sun is getting artificially pumped from blaster boxes to mid tier player rookie bass to high end. I don't think it's that people don't care in this particular instance, it's that there's so much fatigue trying to track down every shyster and cook group shill in the marketplace because they keep multiplying like roaches. Organic Ebay sales are now the exception, not the rule.


Buyers need to exercise extreme precaution in purchasing anything in today's market. And only pay what they're willing to lose.

[eastbayak]

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

I have no doubts there was probably shady activity on the Zion RPA's.


But like...95% of the current market is manipulated. Everything under the sun is getting artificially pumped from blaster boxes to mid tier player rookie bass to high end. I don't think it's that people don't care in this particular instance, it's that there's so much fatigue trying to track down every shyster and cook group shill in the marketplace because they keep multiplying like roaches. Organic Ebay sales are now the exception, not the rule.


Buyers need to exercise extreme precaution in purchasing anything in today's market. And only pay what they're willing to lose.

You're right, there's a lot of manipulating going on. There always has been and there will always continue to be.

In many instances, it's not so obvious. When prices get so high, we might naturally assume that a listing has been manipulated because the sold price doesn't "make sense". But sometimes, such sales are legitimate.

With Spectra FOTL Zion RPAs, it was a little more obvious for a number of reasons: (1) Spectra product, (2) FOTL exclusives don't get as much love, (3) 1577 feedback bidder (along with other bidder).

And you're right in that there's so much manipulating going on that it's hard (and tiresome) to track down every fake sale. Buyers definitely need to exercise extreme precaution in purchasing anything in today's market. With the way things are going, someone(s) will get burnt holding the hot potato(es) last.

[ninjacookies]

Originally Posted by eastbayak

You're right, there's a lot of manipulating going on. There always has been and there will always continue to be.

In many instances, it's not so obvious. When prices get so high, we might naturally assume that a listing has been manipulated because the sold price doesn't "make sense". But sometimes, such sales are legitimate.

With Spectra FOTL Zion RPAs, it was a little more obvious for a number of reasons: (1) Spectra product, (2) FOTL exclusives don't get as much love, (3) 1577 feedback bidder (along with other bidder).

And you're right in that there's so much manipulating going on that it's hard (and tiresome) to track down every fake sale. Buyers definitely need to exercise extreme precaution in purchasing anything in today's market. With the way things are going, someone(s) will get burnt holding the hot potato(es) last.

I believe someone chimed in earlier after that initial 11k sale saying they knew the buyer well and that they were 100% legit and a 'clector.' I believe he stated they were also the second highest bidder on a subsequent Zion that went for much less.


Not sure how much I buy that story, but as is the case with any new release, there's always gotta be that brave Neil Armstrong soul that pays the fomo premium and sets the market...typically paying a massive premium. I'll never understand why people do this...but there's always got to be a first for everything. Wondering if he was legit, and trying to cost average his buy in...or trying to protect his initial investment.

[eastbayak]

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

I believe someone chimed in earlier after that initial 11k sale saying they knew the buyer well and that they were 100% legit and a 'clector.' I believe he stated they were also the second highest bidder on a subsequent Zion that went for much less.


Not sure how much I buy that story, but as is the case with any new release, there's always gotta be that brave Neil Armstrong soul that pays the fomo premium and sets the market...typically paying a massive premium. I'll never understand why people do this...but there's always got to be a first for everything. Wondering if he was legit, and trying to cost average his buy in...or trying to protect his initial investment.

That's correct, ybomber (seller) did say that.

Due to the fact that he didn't win the subsequent 3 listings (but was the second highest bidder and has a number of retractions), makes me think he was only trying to protect his initial investments as much as he could without adding another Zion FOTL RPA.

Lame but it is what it is. If only he waited until the 5th one was listed (and subsequent ones), could've got 2-3 for the price of 1.

[yiguiri2002]

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

I believe someone chimed in earlier after that initial 11k sale saying they knew the buyer well and that they were 100% legit and a 'clector.' I believe he stated they were also the second highest bidder on a subsequent Zion that went for much less.


Not sure how much I buy that story, but as is the case with any new release, there's always gotta be that brave Neil Armstrong soul that pays the fomo premium and sets the market...typically paying a massive premium. I'll never understand why people do this...but there's always got to be a first for everything. Wondering if he was legit, and trying to cost average his buy in...or trying to protect his initial investment.

Ninja, there are tons of legit collectors who inflate prices. I don't think being "legit" means they are not doing it.

It could have been a coincidence. But it's definitively something when a person buys a card and less than a week later doesn't want to buy the same card for 60% of the price yet they are always near the max bid. At the very least, it's worth mentioning.

[ninjacookies]

Originally Posted by eastbayak

That's correct, ybomber (seller) did say that.

Due to the fact that he didn't win the subsequent 3 listings (but was the second highest bidder and has a number of retractions), makes me think he was only trying to protect his initial investments as much as he could without adding another Zion FOTL RPA.

Lame but it is what it is. If only he waited until the 5th one was listed (and subsequent ones), could've got 2-3 for the price of 1.

I will never understand the first to market mentality in my lifetime. But I guess there's always that component of having bragging rights and the newest, shiny toy. Shame if he had to go that route, but I really hope he at least honored his initial purchase and won't pull a low brow in the coming weeks. If so, he absolutely needs to be outed.

[GeechQuest]

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

But like...95% of the current market is manipulated.

Just canceled my trip to the Sechelleyes. Will be heading to Margaritaville in Biloxi instead, slumming it with the rest of the bass heads.

[ninjacookies]

Originally Posted by GeechQuest

slumming it with the rest of the bass heads.

Pretty sure you meant bass as in bass, so I won't initiate an intervention. #freebaseepidemic


That unnumbered paper stock just hit different.

[Spacemanspif]

I know you guys were mentioning the 1577 guy covering his initial investment, but what about the other guy who actually won all 3 of the others, and yet didn't bid on the 4th? If you've already dropped $20k on these, why not cost average down? It's just funny how both guys randomly decided to drop the act and all of a sudden the value plummets, albeit to probably higher than any of the high bidders would have originally imagined if this was the first or 2nd to market without the noise.

[eastbayak]

Originally Posted by yiguiri2002

Ninja, there are tons of legit collectors who inflate prices. I don't think being "legit" means they are not doing it.

It could have been a coincidence. But it's definitively something when a person buys a card and less than a week later doesn't want to buy the same card for 60% of the price yet they are always near the max bid. At the very least, it's worth mentioning.

Very true.

By the way, since our posts, another auction-based Zion Spectra FOTL RPA ended. Once again, the 1577 feedback person (now 1578) made the second-highest bid and lost to the other feedback user (now 1770). The card sold for $5425....

It's very suspect that in 4 of the 5 auction-based listings, the same two feedback users were numbers 1-2 in highest bids. I'm starting to think that they're either the same individual or work together, and they probably just missed the other listing for whatever reason. Because if the 1577 user wanted to bump up the floor, he would've likely bidded on the one that ended at $4050.

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

I will never understand the first to market mentality in my lifetime. But I guess there's always that component of having bragging rights and the newest, shiny toy. Shame if he had to go that route, but I really hope he at least honored his initial purchase and won't pull a low brow in the coming weeks. If so, he absolutely needs to be outed.

Likewise, I never understood why people want to pay premium price for something that'll be available. I'd understand if it was something rare (or perceived to be rare) like the Spectra color blast though. But for the FOTL RPAs, all you need to do is wait for the first 10 to sell and then jump in at a nice price.

Originally Posted by Spacemanspif

I know you guys were mentioning the 1577 guy covering his initial investment, but what about the other guy who actually won all 3 of the others, and yet didn't bid on the 4th? If you've already dropped $20k on these, why not cost average down? It's just funny how both guys randomly decided to drop the act and all of a sudden the value plummets, albeit to probably higher than any of the high bidders would have originally imagined if this was the first or 2nd to market without the noise.

I mentioned above but I'm starting to think the accounts belong to the same individual (multiple accounts, I've seen it before where one individual had multiple high feedback accounts) or it's a duo working together. In 4 of the 5 auction-based listings, they were the top 2 bidders (in the same order). I would've proposed they might be different individuals and/or have no connection had the 1577 feedback user also bidded on the one that ended at $4050 but that wasn't the case.

Here's the one that ended today: https://www.ebay.com/bfl/viewbids/15...p2047675.l2565

[Asian62150]

BO bounty down to $1250.

They must have gotten a lot of boxes at $1400.