Evan Mathis Trimming Anything and Everything to Sell via Probstein, PWCC, & COMC

[scottagibson]

Originally Posted by dizzydolse

He's just saying you're a clown and people think you're a joke. Pennywise was the clown in the movie "IT" if I'm not mistaken. It was a horror movie. So maybe he's not saying you're a joke, but a horrible scary person that nobody likes or has any desire to be around. Not sure though.

Oh. Geez ok... I really want to understand what the law is in regards to something like this. I can understand if I was the one being deceived, I wouldn't really be happy either but at the end of the day, I personally would never buy something for the money that has such a varying degree of value for something seemingly so simple. A PSA 7 and a PSA 9 to me look about the same and I can't understand the vast difference in price. Same with a 9 and a 10.

I've sorta read these posts for months now with one constant complex thought/ question... how does any one particular person get pegged and for what crime exactly and how will it be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that this particular person did exactly what the law states they shouldn't do in regards to ball cards?

Edit: They aren't forcing PSA / BGS / SGC to slap a "new grade" or any grade at all. So is it theft by deception? But therefore is PSA an accomplice?

[scottagibson]

Originally Posted by metsandweezer

I’m just saying he’s a clown and thought pennywise would be a good example

Not trying to be... for once taking the time to truly understand. The OP explained why he does what he does a few weeks back and he has my respect. I just want to understand the full gamut here.

[dizzydolse]

Originally Posted by scottagibson

Oh. Geez ok... I really want to understand what the law is in regards to something like this. I can understand if I was the one being deceived, I wouldn't really be happy either but at the end of the day, I personally would never buy something for the money that has such a varying degree of value for something seemingly so simple. A PSA 7 and a PSA 9 to me look about the same and I can't understand the vast difference in price. Same with a 9 and a 10.

I've sorta read these posts for months now with one constant complex thought/ question... how does any one particular person get pegged and for what crime exactly and how will it be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that this particular person did exactly what the law states they shouldn't do in regards to ball cards?

Edit: They aren't forcing PSA / BGS / SGC to slap a "new grade" or any grade at all. So is it theft by deception? But therefore is PSA an accomplice?

Well, you've got a lot going on here. Let me try to help to the best of my ability. First let me say, I am not a lawyer and do not know the law in regards to a situation like this but I believe the main criminal act would be fraud in these cases. They are intentionally deceiving prospective and actual buyers for financial gain. It's a very common criminal activity as I'm sure you're aware.

Whether or not PSA is an accomplice or not remains to be seen. I think the FBI is involved and will ultimately be the ones to decide that and whether or not to try and prosecute them? Again, I'm not a law expert. If you have read many of these threads as you say, you can determine on your own if you think they are willfully involved in the scam.

You are also backtracking quite a bit within a very short amount of time. A few posts back you were making very light of the situation because of the fact that they're just baseball cards and because you would never pay that much, or whatever the hell you said, that it's not a big deal. Hence the comparison to a clown.

Just because you wouldn't do something does not make it a joke or any less serious. Fraud is fraud, and we're not just talking about "baseball cards". This is thousand and thousands and thousands of dollars at stake.

[Vladdy Jr]

Originally Posted by scottagibson

Couldn't care less. I think its all comical. Folks thinking the sky is falling and that something is actually going to happen to, change anything about or influence what is already being done is just funny to me. I laughed out loud to the response. I am legit an Evan Mathis fan. Was at Alabama (funny, but I'm a bama fan living in Auburn)... and when he won a Super Bowl with my boy Demarcus Ware in Denver. This doesn't change that whether he did or did not do it. If graded companies certified the items and people paid for them I really can't understand how he is personally going to get any kind of punishment here. Does anyone have hard proof of EXACTLY what happened and who did what?

Would I personally do it? Absolutely not. I do find it unethical... but we are talking about cardboard here... not cancer treatments. I would also never spend the money some folks do on another man's opinion either.

Let’s go forge some checks together. It’s funny and it’s only paper. Unethical but at least it’s thinner than cardboard.

[Vladdy Jr]

Originally Posted by gmoney328

A mess which, unfortunately, seems to have no end in sight. The poster who brought up the point about just how prosecutable ANY of this may be says it well. Hard to prove who and what to prosecute.

I’ll believe something is actually being done, and it’s not just speculation by an angry mob, as well as lip service by law enforcement, when we start seeing indictments fly.

Until then, I wouldn’t expect much. This may ultimately end up being a case where we are all forced to police ourselves.

I am expecting MUCH. The hobby will be on life support if indictments do not fly in the next 1-2 years. I personally know 7 high end collectors and all 7, including myself, are out if these CRIMINALS are not prosecuted. I do have faith in the FBI, they just need some time.

[KingInTheNorth]

Originally Posted by Vladdy Jr

I am expecting MUCH. The hobby will be on life support if indictments do not fly in the next 1-2 years. I personally know 7 high end collectors and all 7, including myself, are out if these CRIMINALS are not prosecuted. I do have faith in the FBI, they just need some time.

7!?

Oh my

[Pink Pussycat]

Originally Posted by scottagibson

Oh. Geez ok... I really want to understand what the law is in regards to something like this. I can understand if I was the one being deceived, I wouldn't really be happy either but at the end of the day, I personally would never buy something for the money that has such a varying degree of value for something seemingly so simple. A PSA 7 and a PSA 9 to me look about the same and I can't understand the vast difference in price. Same with a 9 and a 10.

I've sorta read these posts for months now with one constant complex thought/ question... how does any one particular person get pegged and for what crime exactly and how will it be proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that this particular person did exactly what the law states they shouldn't do in regards to ball cards?

Edit: They aren't forcing PSA / BGS / SGC to slap a "new grade" or any grade at all. So is it theft by deception? But therefore is PSA an accomplice?

If the altered cards in question are sold on-line, then it is a case of Internet Fraud.

If these cards are sent out via the US Post Office, then Mail Fraud has been committed.

These are indeed serious crimes that warrant jail time. Even though they are "just baseball cards", big money has been spent on them under corrupt and fraudulent circumstances.

As to whether PSA is an accomplice... we will see what the FBI determines. It is quite evident that they've established a pattern of catering to "favored submitters". And the evidence has become overwhelming that they are incapable of identifying altered cards. Either that, or they are complicit in the thousands of altered examples that have already been exposed.

And still... this is all just the tip of the iceberg. So it will be interesting to see what happens. Personally I hope the FBI cleans house, so we can completely start over from scratch. The current system is beyond broken.

[auburn35]

Originally Posted by scottagibson

Nahhh if he truly is "defrauding" people that's his business. He'll have to meet his creator and answer for his actions one day... I'm not his judge.

Remember... I said doing such things is unethical. Not sure how that "cheers him on".

We are still talking about baseball cards though. And please explain... Based on "the Law"... honestly... what has he done illegally?

For starters, when these altered baseball (sports) cards are sent in for grading, sent to a consignor (PWCC, Probstein123...) and/or the eventual buyer (mailed), without disclosing the alterations, you're dealing with Mail fraud.

https://www.justice.gov/jm/criminal-...nts-mail-fraud
Department of Justice - Elements of Mail Fraud

"There are two elements in mail fraud: (1) having devised or intending to devise a scheme to defraud (or to perform specified fraudulent acts), and (2) use of the mail for the purpose of executing, or attempting to execute, the scheme (or specified fraudulent acts)."

When these altered items are sold, without disclosure, you're adding in Wire fraud (receiving money).

There are more legality issues but these are some of "the Law" that you're looking for.

War Damn Eagle!

[tonedef2oo8]

This loser is pulling the ever so popular “anonymous” defense, same exact one the other scammers use. Do these morons all huddle together and tell each other to say this?

How about this instead of saying lies like “so much bad information in that topic” how about you tell us what’s wrong? Prove the op wrong and make them look stupid....

Or you can just lie and say there’s ton of bad information and not back it up...

[Rogue]

How are the feds going to get involved? Do sports cards have a legal definition or anything?

[wharfrat7624]

Originally Posted by pspa123

He posted buy ads recently.

Yes. I tried to work out a deal to sell several cards to him until he tried to tell me my price was 25% over retail. I subsequently sold all cards for my offer price.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[palmetto7]

geez...guess the birthday party starts in....1...2....3....for Cardology. And those that say they feel ok with psa 5,6,7s,. Why wouldnt these trimmers mess with 3s and 4s etc etc

[mjohnatgt]

Originally Posted by Rogue

How are the feds going to get involved? Do sports cards have a legal definition or anything?

The FBI has been investigating for months and even were hanging out at PWCC's booth at the National this summer making sure that refunds were being processed for cards sold through Brent's scamming company. Brent seems to be following the advice of his lawyer to refund as many scammed people as possible to reduce the likelihood of jail time once this has all been put through the courts.
There are a hundred different threads on these topics. Take some time and read them.

[pip]

Originally Posted by KingInTheNorth

7!?

Oh my

7 is not insignificant. The industry is rather thinly capitalized.

[KhalDrogo]

Evan seems like a nice FBI target. A name people actually recognize. I'm sure if 312 has the dirt on him, it's been passed on to the FBI already.

Evan has some high-end wax I've been interested in. Glad this thread happened before I made a mistake.

[pip]

One wonders if this has anything to do with Evan's criminal hobby activity.

[pip]

As pointed out here already, Evan did NOT trim or alter the 1952 Topps Mickey Mantle in a PSA 9 that he sold through Heritage for $2.88 million. But he may have sold off a lot of altered cards to acquire it.

[pip]

It's too bad we can't see some of the serial numbers more clearly. I wonder how many of these high-end cards displayed by Evan are altered:

[pip]

Always classy:

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2013/...udit-this.html

[skurtis]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

Evan seems like a nice FBI target. A name people actually recognize. I'm sure if 312 has the dirt on him, it's been passed on to the FBI already.

Evan has some high-end wax I've been interested in. Glad this thread happened before I made a mistake.

i tried to search the ebay names at the beginning as well as his COMC username, which I admit I've never used that site before, as well as his company name.....so please be gentle:

Where is he selling those, just to make sure it's not something I've been looking at on ebay or other places?

Thank you.

[KhalDrogo]

Originally Posted by skurtis

i tried to search the ebay names at the beginning as well as his COMC username, which I admit I've never used that site before, as well as his company name.....so please be gentle:

Where is he selling those, just to make sure it's not something I've been looking at on ebay or other places?

Thank you.

He sells high-end older cases on eBay, like Exquisite BKB, 2003 TC BKB, and 2011 Bowman Chrome.

[skurtis]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

He sells high-end older cases on eBay, like Exquisite BKB, 2003 TC BKB, and 2011 Bowman Chrome.

thank you -- but nothing listed at the moment, correct? I've sort of held out ***hope*** that maybe some of the unopened boxes of yore are ok.....but that's really a STUPID, STUPID assumption at this stage in the industry, I'm sure.

[Frankp2311]

Originally Posted by scottagibson

Nahhh if he truly is "defrauding" people that's his business. He'll have to meet his creator and answer for his actions one day... I'm not his judge.

Remember... I said doing such things is unethical. Not sure how that "cheers him on".

We are still talking about baseball cards though. And please explain... Based on "the Law"... honestly... what has he done illegally?

Back in 2011 or 2012 the guy who trimmed the T206 Wagner was facing 5 years in prison and sentenced to a few years.....so yes there are legal ramifications.

[pspa123]

Without repeating my prior posts -- sorry don't have the energy -- selling an altered card without disclosure, or participating in a scheme to sell such a card, in interstate commerce would implicate the federal mail and wire fraud statutes.

[Soxfanguy]

He must have had his brain turn to mush(like most football players)if he thought he could get away with this