**Official Luka Doncic Thread**

[mvp]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

Nah, I’m good. Team deserves every bit of it.

Serious question: What does this team need to achieve this year for you to consider it a successful season?

[Luka]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[gameissued]

Ah man just missed out on that one.. agree that was a super steal price right there. The title was missing some key words like "auto" and "patch" I'm guessing that might have been a factor.

Originally Posted by triks

Immaculate /77 just went for $11.9k. Jeez these have dropped so far.

[cypher]

Panini knows over half of Luka's rookie autographs were forged. That's why they were rewarded with an exclusive deal to keep quiet. Sad state of this hobby and the skyrocketing prices.

[KhalDrogo]

Originally Posted by mvp

Serious question: What does this team need to achieve this year for you to consider it a successful season?

How about not massively underachieving? How can anyone have watched this season up to now and consider it a success? It's a worse group of players than last year, with just a little more experience. The roster is bad, and you could see that again last night.

This offseason they need to add at least one true big who can defend the paint, plus at least two shooters. THJ is the only shooter on this team, and that is terrible.

[Spacemanspif]

Originally Posted by gameissued

Ah man just missed out on that one.. agree that was a super steal price right there. The title was missing some key words like "auto" and "patch" I'm guessing that might have been a factor.

yeah, missing some key words, plus graded 8.5 (better to crack out and let the buyer imagine they'll get a 9 or better), plus one color white patch, plus a weird/bad auto. Still, shoulda been over $15k. grats to the winner

[mvp]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

How about not massively underachieving? How can anyone have watched this season up to now and consider it a success? It's a worse group of players than last year, with just a little more experience. The roster is bad, and you could see that again last night.

This offseason they need to add at least one true big who can defend the paint, plus at least two shooters. THJ is the only shooter on this team, and that is terrible.

Ok, so let me start where I agree with you.

We're in alignment in what Dallas need to bring in next season - especially a true big. To me, this is the Mavs biggest weakness.

Where I disagree is on this whole underachieving thing. Underachieving on what scale?

Post COVID decimation, the Mavs have a 0.659 win percentage over 41 games - That's pretty good. It's as good as most any other team in the competition. Yes, there have been some disappointing losses (games against Sacramento and Houston particularly hurt), but pick any team from any league in any year and there are going to be games where for whatever reason, they just don't just show up.

And if your argument is that the roster sucks and is worse than last season, then how is 0.659 over the last 41 games underachieving? I'd say that's even more impressive for a roster that sucks.

And if your argument that Rick sucks, then are the players succeeding in spite of him? If Rick is dragging the team down but they're still managing 0.659 over the last 41 games, does that mean the roster is good?

Ultimately, I know we can't take the last 41 games and judge the team just on that. I won't, you won't, and history won't. This season will be defined by how far they go in the post season. I also think nobody on God's green earth, including me, expects Dallas to go anywhere near a championship this season. So I ask you again:

What does this team need to achieve for you to consider it a successful season? You've made it clear you think the team and the coach are terrible. So where do they need to finish in the West and how far do they need to go in the playoffs for the Mavs to achieve in accordance to your expectations?

[ballhawkdawk]

Prices on Luka are appetizing at the moment. In a couple years he’ll be the consensus best player in the league. Time to start scoopin’. Got my first one on the way.

[JoeAdam]

Originally Posted by ballhawkdawk

Prices on Luka are appetizing at the moment. In a couple years he’ll be the consensus best player in the league. Time to start scoopin’. Got my first one on the way.

Not even sure it’s going to take a couple years. I could see him being the #1 player going into next season.

[ballhawkdawk]

Originally Posted by JoeAdam

Not even sure it’s going to take a couple years. I could see him being the #1 player going into next season.

Maybe. Either way, I think he's the heir to Lebron as the most prominent face of the NBA, regardless of where we rank them (1, 2, 3, 4, etc.) as players. What kind of supporting cast the Mavericks are able to put around him will have a lot to do with how he's viewed in the short term. I think they gotta move on from KP. Oft injured and just lacks the kind of punch you want out of a #2 guy playing alongside an elite floor general. I'm curious what some of the more frequent posters in here think the Mavs should do in terms of constructing a team around Luka.

[dkcardman]

Originally Posted by ballhawkdawk

Prices on Luka are appetizing at the moment. In a couple years he’ll be the consensus best player in the league. Time to start scoopin’. Got my first one on the way.

Prices on Luka are poised to skyrocket. They have fallen to where they are now because he is out of the MVP race and the Mavs look like they have no shot this year.

But here is why there is so much upside
1. Prices are going up when the playoffs start. This always happens s and will happen this year.
2. If Luka has good games or the Mavs happen to win a series, hold on tight.
3. If the Mavs lose in the first round there will be buy cycle but all pricing will then head toward next years expectations. Which will be back to MVP. And all they to do is make 1 or 2 significant offseason moves and it's back to high playoff expectations.

[ClipsandVols]

This is my friend Jordan's card. Hoping it does well!

https://goldinauctions.com/2018_19_P...-LOT87939.aspx

[adam711]

Originally Posted by mvp

Ok, so let me start where I agree with you.

We're in alignment in what Dallas need to bring in next season - especially a true big. To me, this is the Mavs biggest weakness.

Where I disagree is on this whole underachieving thing. Underachieving on what scale?

Post COVID decimation, the Mavs have a 0.659 win percentage over 41 games - That's pretty good. It's as good as most any other team in the competition. Yes, there have been some disappointing losses (games against Sacramento and Houston particularly hurt), but pick any team from any league in any year and there are going to be games where for whatever reason, they just don't just show up.

And if your argument is that the roster sucks and is worse than last season, then how is 0.659 over the last 41 games is underachieving? I'd say that's even more impressive for a roster that sucks.

And if your argument that Rick sucks, then are the players succeeding in spite of him? If Rick is dragging the team down but they're still managing 0.659 over the last 41 games, does that mean the roster is good?

Ultimately, I know we can't take the last 41 games and judge the team just on that. I won't, you won't, and history won't. This season will be defined by how far they go in the post season. I also think nobody on God's green earth, including me, expects Dallas to go anywhere near a championship this season. So I ask you again:

What does this team need to achieve for you to consider it a successful season? You've made it clear you think the team and the coach are terrible. So where do they need to finish in the West and how far do they need to go in the playoffs for the Mavs to achieve in accordance to your expectations?

This post is spot on. Most of the posters in this thread are Luka fans (or Luka card fans), not Mavericks fans. Hence the title of the thread. I consider myself one as well. I think that makes it tough for some to look at the team objectively due to their financial interest in one player. The Mavericks started the season underachieving for sure: out of shape, Covid, whatever, but have definitely turned it around regardless of a few bad losses here and there.

I would say if they make it out of round 1 then it is a successful season.

[KhalDrogo]

Originally Posted by mvp

Ok, so let me start where I agree with you.

We're in alignment in what Dallas need to bring in next season - especially a true big. To me, this is the Mavs biggest weakness.

Where I disagree is on this whole underachieving thing. Underachieving on what scale?

Post COVID decimation, the Mavs have a 0.659 win percentage over 41 games - That's pretty good. It's as good as most any other team in the competition. Yes, there have been some disappointing losses (games against Sacramento and Houston particularly hurt), but pick any team from any league in any year and there are going to be games where for whatever reason, they just don't just show up.

And if your argument is that the roster sucks and is worse than last season, then how is 0.659 over the last 41 games is underachieving? I'd say that's even more impressive for a roster that sucks.

And if your argument that Rick sucks, then are the players succeeding in spite of him? If Rick is dragging the team down but they're still managing 0.659 over the last 41 games, does that mean the roster is good?

Ultimately, I know we can't take the last 41 games and judge the team just on that. I won't, you won't, and history won't. This season will be defined by how far they go in the post season. I also think nobody on God's green earth, including me, expects Dallas to go anywhere near a championship this season. So I ask you again:

What does this team need to achieve for you to consider it a successful season? You've made it clear you think the team and the coach are terrible. So where do they need to finish in the West and how far do they need to go in the playoffs for the Mavs to achieve in accordance to your expectations?

If the Mavs can’t make it out of the first round, it is a failure of a season. I’m not sure how anybody could disagree with that.

If they don’t win a playoff series, that will be 10 years with no playoff series wins for Rick. What is Cuban waiting for? Or are we supposed to believe he just hasn’t had a good enough roster for the last 10 years?

[mvp]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

If the Mavs can’t make it out of the first round, it is a failure of a season. I’m not sure how anybody could disagree with that.

If they don’t win a playoff series, that will be 10 years with no playoff series wins for Rick. What is Cuban waiting for? Or are we supposed to believe he just hasn’t had a good enough roster for the last 10 years?

I agree with you that the Mavs need to make it out of the first round for this season to be considered a success. That is completely fair.

As I only moved to the USA in 2016 and did not follow American sport prior, I have no opinion on your second point. I will say that stability and continuity are hard to find in modern sport, so I lean conservative when uprooting coaching positions unless things are pretty bad - but I will concede that 10 years without a finals series win is getting a bit long in the tooth.

I think the salient point here is that until all is said and done for 2020/21, it's premature to say that this Mavs team is "massively underachieving" and it still remains to be seen whether or not the season was a success.

[Matt24]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

Or are we supposed to believe he just hasn’t had a good enough roster for the last 10 years?

Yes that is mostly it.

[imbluestreak23]

Yeah, Mavs need to be aggressive this year in FA.

No idea how the math works if at all, my targets would be:
-Kawhi (PO)
-Ibaka (PO)
-Gary Trent Jr.
-Jeff Green
-Jarret Allen
-Kanter for boards
-Javale for boards - only need one of the two, this is preferred. Also need a stretch big to compliment, assuming that's KP if he stays

Need more shooters but that's a good list to fit needs for rebounding, defense, and some scoring sprinkled in depending on how things go.

[RedMike]

the card market (overall) has fallen hard - i personally love it.. just going to keep buying but it for sure fell like a rock across the board.

[imbluestreak23]

Originally Posted by RedMike

the card market has fell hard - i personally love it.. just going to keep buying but it for sure fell like a rock.

Patty cards have not fallen.

High print run cards have fallen. It was predicted.

[Matt24]

Originally Posted by imbluestreak23

Yeah, Mavs need to be aggressive this year in FA.

No idea how the math works if at all, my targets would be:
-Kawhi (PO)
-Ibaka (PO)
-Gary Trent Jr.
-Jeff Green
-Jarret Allen
-Kanter for boards
-Javale for boards - only need one of the two, this is preferred. Also need a stretch big to compliment, assuming that's KP if he stays

Need more shooters but that's a good list to fit needs for rebounding, defense, and some scoring sprinkled in depending on how things go.

Kanter can't guard anyone

Lowry, Lonzo Ball(restricted), Norman Powell could be targets

[RedMike]

Originally Posted by imbluestreak23

Patty cards have not fallen.

High print run cards have fallen. It was predicted.

I don't know man.. I look at card prices pretty often and I see a drop off everywhere - obviously the super highly desirable card will drop less... but there are plenty of "iconic" cards that can be had at 2020 prices.

maybe its just what I'm looking at.

[dkcardman]

Originally Posted by RedMike

I don't know man.. I look at card prices pretty often and I see a drop off everywhere - obviously the super highly desirable card will drop less... but there are plenty of "iconic" cards that can be had at 2020 prices.

maybe its just what I'm looking at.

What is a real trend?

Guys that are playing well or above expectations and cards are up...Jokic, Embiid, Curry, Trent Jr. MPJ KPJ

Guys that have slowly faded away from preseason expectations on underachieving teams and cards are down...Luka, Trae, Zion, Ja, Shai. many more.

Other players are running pretty stagnant too.

I see a correlation to prices vs performance vs what their immediate playoff success looks like its projected to be.
If prices are down across anything, it's on the court related. Otherwise, we wouldn't have any players that have actually increased in value over the past 3 to 6 months.

[imbluestreak23]

Originally Posted by RedMike

I don't know man.. I look at card prices pretty often and I see a drop off everywhere - obviously the super highly desirable card will drop less... but there are plenty of "iconic" cards that can be had at 2020 prices.

maybe its just what I'm looking at.

It's hit or miss for sure. MJ Fleer is down, but MJ autos/inserts are way up. Luka/Giannis are down due to performance/lack of MVP talk, but Steph is way up (despite not being in the MVP talk but exceeding expectations lol), and Joker/Embiid are way up. Patty is way up despite the superbowl. Herbert is way up. Tatis/Vlad/Acuna are way up.

It's a good mix of a few things contributing to low prices for those going down (not all going down):
-Oversupply of cards for post 2017 guys going against any increased demand due to performance (Zion and Luka have bigger hills to climb because of this)
-Lack of performance or playing a backseat to finals contenders --> Giannis, as we expect him to get to the Finals now, which is a bit crazy since he is the only superstar contender that doesn't have a super team, but whatever
-Increased relative supply introduced to the market - different from oversupply from printing. Relative supply comes from too many cashing in at once (see MJ Fleer)

Otherwise, lots of guys going up, even blowing away the strong forces that are trying to push down prices most notably being higher print runs (Tatis, Vlad, Soto, Ronny)

[dkcardman]

Originally Posted by imbluestreak23

It's hit or miss for sure. MJ Fleer is down, but MJ autos/inserts are way up. Luka/Giannis are down due to performance/lack of MVP talk, but Steph is way up (despite not being in the MVP talk but exceeding expectations lol), and Joker/Embiid are way up. Patty is way up despite the superbowl. Herbert is way up. Tatis/Vlad/Acuna are way up.

It's a good mix of a few things contributing to low prices for those going down (not all going down):
-Oversupply of cards for post 2017 guys going against any increased demand due to performance (Zion and Luka have bigger hills to climb because of this)
-Lack of performance or playing a backseat to finals contenders --> Giannis, as we expect him to get to the Finals now, which is a bit crazy since he is the only superstar contender that doesn't have a super team, but whatever
-Increased relative supply introduced to the market - different from oversupply from printing. Relative supply comes from too many cashing in at once (see MJ Fleer)

Otherwise, lots of guys going up, even blowing away the strong forces that are trying to push down prices most notably being higher print runs (Tatis, Vlad, Soto, Ronny)

1000% all true. This is the reality of what is going on. Still impossible to get wax in stores, still huge money being spend, guys playing hot are way up in value.

The adage buy low sell high is always relevant. Someone is till buying a ton of Luka stuff and I'd guess it's the really smart buyers who realize NOW is the 'Lowe's in that cycle.

[Chris P]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

If the Mavs can’t make it out of the first round, it is a failure of a season. I’m not sure how anybody could disagree with that.

If they don’t win a playoff series, that will be 10 years with no playoff series wins for Rick. What is Cuban waiting for? Or are we supposed to believe he just hasn’t had a good enough roster for the last 10 years?

I feel like the rosters the Mavs would build post championship, were basically always geared towards having cap space for future free agents. They quickly dismantled the championship squad and would just sign guys to keep financial flexibility. The problem is..nobody would ever sign there and they'd keep a competitive enough team around Dirk that would keep them in the playoffs but with a ceiling of a tough competitive first-round exit. The only way they've ever been able to build is through trades..even in the early Dirk days (Juwan Howard trade, trades for Antawn Jamison and Antonie Walke..reaquiring Kidd..Porzingis etc). I really don't know what Cuban can do more to make Dallas more of an attractive situation for Free Agents. Until then..you get stuck with trying to make the best out of guys like Porzinigis as your #2