2020 Politics Thread - Enter At Your Own Risk - RULES IN OP

[babyfaceposey]

Originally Posted by JeremyNick

I would challenge you to think differently. That is, does my workforce represent the diversity of the community it/we serve. It’s an easy cop out to just say, “we hire the best candidates”. Best candidate is just a silly term regardless. The best candidate is the one you are specifically setting out to hire, if you change the parameters of what you are looking for, you’ll find other candidates.

Maybe no one applies at a firm of all white lawyers because that firm doesn’t attract anyone of color. That becomes a liability to the firm because it only represents one part of the community it is looking to serve.

That isn’t to say, “we need to hire a black lawyer” should be the mission from the onset, but if you recognize a lack of diversity in your staff, it’s only going to be a detriment to you if you don’t evaluate why and try to address it.

Changing parameters = lowering standards. You hire the best person possible for the job no matter the race.
Edit: The whole theory of lack of diversity in a work place is crazy to me. Hire the best candidate for the job. Student A had a 4.0 in college and is white vs student B who is African American and had a 3.0. You hire the person with the better grades. Not someone based on the color of their skin.

[NeedChapmans]

Originally Posted by GeechQuest

Does the United States Sentencing Commision's report from 2017 not count?

I don't want to dig because I'm lazy.

FWIW, men also receive longer sentences than women. It's as if the system doesn't operate fairly and justly. Imagine that?

Rather than take a one-off case, I'd rather just look at ALL cases.

Did you happen to read this report? Set aside that the two commissioners were appointed by Obama and Clinton; the extremely long and detailed report shows no data of any kind. I have 60 footnotes, regression models and an section titled "methodology".

It's WAR for prison sentences!

https://www.ussc.gov/sites/default/f...mographics.pdf

[TheFrenzy]

Am I alone in thinking that today has been uniquely productive in this thread?

[JeremyNick]

Originally Posted by babyfaceposey

Changing parameters = lowering standards. You hire the best person possible for the job no matter the race.

That’s a terrible false equivalency. However you are entitled to it.

Hiring practices start with recruitment. If I open a position in an area with a 30% minority demographic and get zero minority applicants, there is an issue.

Getting a diverse and wide array of candidates ensures you have the opportunity to hire the best one.

[NeedChapmans]

Originally Posted by JeremyNick

That’s a terrible false equivalency. However you are entitled to it.

Hiring practices start with recruitment. If I open a position in an area with a 30% minority demographic and get zero minority applicants, there is an issue.

Getting a diverse and wide array of candidates ensures you have the opportunity to hire the best one.

I agree, but we probably don't agree on said issue.

[JeremyNick]

Originally Posted by NeedChapmans

How about rather than generalizing it, you show me an example of two people that you believe were treated differently in the judicial system because of their skin color.

Give the Podcast Serial season 3 a listen.

Again I don’t agree with everything but it gives you a good look into the workings of the justice system from anecdotal viewpoints.

[JeremyNick]

Originally Posted by NeedChapmans

I agree, but we probably don't agree on said issue.

I don’t agree with targeting a specific demographic if that is what you think.

I do believe in evaluating current practice if it’s producing a singularity of applicants.

I have traveled a good bit for a 35 year old and experienced many different culture, some that may be labeled as less, backwards, or 3rd world. I have appreciated the perspective gained from each and find great value in it.

While I’m staunchly conservative, I think there is real value in having a diverse workforce and striving to represent as much as the population they serve as possible.

[blackbears86]

Originally Posted by JeremyNick

I would challenge you to think differently. That is, does my workforce represent the diversity of the community it/we serve. It’s an easy cop out to just say, “we hire the best candidates”. Best candidate is just a silly term regardless. The best candidate is the one you are specifically setting out to hire, if you change the parameters of what you are looking for, you’ll find other candidates.

Maybe no one applies at a firm of all white lawyers because that firm doesn’t attract anyone of color. That becomes a liability to the firm because it only represents one part of the community it is looking to serve.

That isn’t to say, “we need to hire a black lawyer” should be the mission from the onset, but if you recognize a lack of diversity in your staff, it’s only going to be a detriment to you if you don’t evaluate why and try to address it.

Admittedly, I'm in Maine, where there isn't a significant amount of diversity in my small city. That being said, my co-workers are quite diverse . Perhaps it's related to my profession (healthcare).


In regards to your second point: there are absolutes. If someone scores poorly on standardized testing in their particular field of employment versus someone who does well, I will pick the person who does well 10 times out of 10.

[GeechQuest]

Originally Posted by NeedChapmans

Did you happen to read this report? Set aside that the two commissioners were appointed by Obama and Clinton; the extremely long and detailed report shows no data of any kind. I have 60 footnotes, regression models and an section titled "methodology".

It's WAR for prison sentences!

https://www.ussc.gov/sites/default/f...mographics.pdf

The summaries are literally on page 2 of the report. They’re under the “key findings” if you missed it...

Generally, that’s where you take the bulk of the report and condense the information. I guess this one is different...

[yanksfan1]

The betting markets on the election have gotten a little out of control imo in favor of the Dems. I'm not gonna bet it since I want the Dems to win, but definitely think there is value on the GOP

Presidency: Biden -160, Trump +140 in candidate market; Dems -185, GOP +140 in party market
Senate control: Dems -145, GOP +110

[NeedChapmans]

Originally Posted by JeremyNick

I don’t agree with targeting a specific demographic if that is what you think.

I do believe in evaluating current practice if it’s producing a singularity of applicants.

I have traveled a good bit for a 35 year old and experienced many different culture, some that may be labeled as less, backwards, or 3rd world. I have appreciated the perspective gained from each and find great value in it.

While I’m staunchly conservative, I think there is real value in having a diverse workforce and striving to represent as much as the population they serve as possible.

Two bolded statements. Starting w/ the latter, there is nothing but truth to the words. There certainly is a value and anyone wanted to run a successful business is best served to serve the entire community.

However, the former statement is dangerous isn't it? "A singularity of applicants". Take the example provided earlier, 17 white guys in a law-firm. Why do they need to change? Guy has been w/ the same firm 33 years, business is good, they're celebrating an award received for excellence ... do they "suffer" in any way? They may now as a result of whatever you want to call it but why does producing said singularity matter, if it doesn't inhibit your business in any way?

Is it the job of the business to promote diversity?

[GoTribe!!!]

Originally Posted by GeechQuest

To suggest it wasn’t, is beyond me.

To suggest that racism doesn’t exist in the judicial system is beyond me as well.

Do you have any logical reason why blacks are sentenced to longer jail sentences than their white counterparts? I’m sure it will be a non-nuanced answer that FEELS right but just isn’t. Like when Covid was the flu or when Bloomberg was going to roll Super Tuesday.

This statement does not reflect the link you provided earlier. Black males were sentenced longer, however females of all races (including black) received shorter sentences than white males. So maybe its not completely about race.

[NeedChapmans]

Originally Posted by GeechQuest

The summaries are literally on page 2 of the report. They’re under the “key findings” if you missed it...

Generally, that’s where you take the bulk of the report and condense the information. I guess this one is different...

It's just generalizations. I hate you of course because I find myself going through footnotes trying to locate the data they used.

Your lazy argument will inevitably turn into a small, short-term hobby for me. No sports for 3 more weeks, I'll make it work.

[blackbears86]

Originally Posted by yanksfan1

The betting markets on the election have gotten a little out of control imo in favor of the Dems. I'm not gonna bet it since I want the Dems to win, but definitely think there is value on the GOP

Presidency: Biden -160, Trump +140 in candidate market; Dems -185, GOP +140 in party market
Senate control: Dems -145, GOP +110

I think until we have one or two debates, things will be up in the air.


Will biden be like a demented grandfather?
Will trump be like a crazy uncle?


should be interesting.

[JustinVerlander07]

Originally Posted by NeedChapmans

It's amazing. Every second of every day watching as people call you a racist, watching as people say everything you do is because Russia tells you to.

Being blamed for every single thing that happens even when you're policy or response is fantastic (The worst was when he was blamed for Iran shooting down the passenger jet). I give the man a tremendous amount of credit for continuing to stand in the face of it all.

....He is a racist, that is for sure.

[DegaBama]

RIP Arizona.

[NeedChapmans]

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

....He is a racist, that is for sure.

No, it isn't.

[JustinVerlander07]

Originally Posted by NeedChapmans

No, it isn't.

I bet you don't think any of his sexual assault allegations are true either.

It's painfully obvious he's a racist. Take off the blinders. He's an overall awful human being.

[JeremyNick]

Originally Posted by blackbears86

Admittedly, I'm in Maine, where there isn't a significant amount of diversity in my small city. That being said, my co-workers are quite diverse . Perhaps it's related to my profession (healthcare).


In regards to your second point: there are absolutes. If someone scores poorly on standardized testing in their particular field of employment versus someone who does well, I will pick the person who does well 10 times out of 10.

We may have discussed this before but what part of Maine? My wife is from Bowdoin. In fact we are leaving in 48 hours to head north and spend a week with my in-laws.

In your scenario if the only measure of “the best employee” is their standardized test score, then yes - that’s how you find the best. However I hope more goes into the hiring process that just a raw score.

[NeedChapmans]

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

I bet you don't think any of his sexual assault allegations are true either.

It's painfully obvious he's a racist. Take off the blinders. He's an overall awful human being.

Perhaps you can offer some of the painfully obvious evidence?

[jdandns]

Originally Posted by TheFrenzy

Am I alone in thinking that today has been uniquely productive in this thread?

It's a pretty smart group, all right, but give it a minute.

[GeechQuest]

Originally Posted by GoTribe!!!

This statement does not reflect the link you provided earlier. Black males were sentenced longer, however females of all races (including black) received shorter sentences than white males. So maybe its not completely about race.

That is true and I stated as much.

You ever seen the statue of Lady Justice? Any idea why she wears a blindfold?

If these aren’t the fruits of inequality in “the system” I’m not sure what you call it. The inequality isn’t ONLY racial though, but just because that is the case doesn’t mean that race isn’t also a factor.

Originally Posted by NeedChapmans

It's just generalizations. I hate you of course because I find myself going through footnotes trying to locate the data they used.

Your lazy argument will inevitably turn into a small, short-term hobby for me. No sports for 3 more weeks, I'll make it work.

I didn’t write the report, just so we’re clear.

I also didn’t intend for it to be a “lazy argument”. People study this for a living so I don’t have to. Thankfully.

You still haven’t answered my question though. Why is there a difference in sentencing lengths? I understand race isn’t the ONLY qualifier, but it sure does seem to be the determining one.

[TheFrenzy]

Originally Posted by DegaBama

RIP Arizona.

It's been nice knowing you guys. Anyone have any use for a Terrance Williams collection?

[RedSoxFan28]

Originally Posted by JeremyNick

We may have discussed this before but what part of Maine? My wife is from Bowdoin.In fact we are leaving in 48 hours to head north and spend a week with my in-laws.

In your scenario if the only measure of “the best employee” is their standardized test score, then yes - that’s how you find the best. However I hope more goes into the hiring process that just a raw score.

[DegaBama]

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbc.ca/amp/1.5630546

CFL player got released for saying, "Man ain't suppose to be with a man. A women is not supposed to be with another women"

We may as well close churches and burn bibles now.