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Old 10-13-2017, 03:12 PM   #26
SDcardguy24
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Leaf is probably using Beckett Authentication now and that's one reason why I think he'd get involved
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Old 10-13-2017, 03:20 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by @SportsCardRadio
OJ Simpson got 9 years in prison for hanging out with autograph dealers like you. None for murder.

Let that sink in.
Quote:
Originally Posted by @SportsCardRadio
I donít want to associate with scum bag auto dealers. Thatís how OJ got 9 years in prison.
Talk about stereotyping at its finest

But at the same time, I'm not really on Leaf's side on this one either. More on Lillard's side personally.
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Old 10-13-2017, 03:25 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by SDcardguy24 View Post
Leaf is probably using Beckett Authentication now and that's one reason why I think he'd get involved
If true that would make sense. Doesn't Leaf have boxes/products with "buyback" cards (in quotes b/c cards are not necessarily Leaf's, but often Panini's, Topp's or UD's)? Like for example a box might contain a couple of Panini autos and BGS-authenticated in-person auto, etc.

I guess that somewhat makes sense, but again who knows.
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Old 10-13-2017, 03:50 PM   #29
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Yeah, SCR is kind of out there. He has been hammering Leaf pretty hard for two days now. He does seem to confirm the auto 8x10 noted in this thread is the right one. I asked for verification as I have communicated a little with Brian the last day, and Brian claimed he bought the 8x10...which he also noted on twitter. But he didn't reply back when SCR called that a lie and noted it was still listed. (It is still listed.)

I also questioned Brian on the following statement...

Leaf Trading Cards‏ @Leaf_Cards
Replying to @SportsCardRadio @Dame_Lillard

The fact is, I saw a player challenge an autograph on Twitter that he took cash for and signed in college,... it was witnessed by a TPA
5:33 PM - 11 Oct 2017

Mark Bostick‏ @MarkBostick3 18h18 hours ago

Mark Bostick Retweeted Leaf Trading Cards

Alternative facts? Its not a witnessed coa. You have said he was paid here (against ncaa rules) and today say it was free.


and got this reply...

Leaf Trading Cards‏ @Leaf_Cards 18h18 hours ago
Replying to @MarkBostick3

You are misunderstanding.. he was paid for Leaf Cards his rookie year. This unpaid rookie photo is on the money with leafs paid cards.
0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes

Lillard did not challenge a Leaf auto card, it was the 8x10. Brian clearly said,"I saw a player challenge an autograph on Twitter that he took cash for and signed in college."

I didn't press since he wasn't being honest and I cant even understand what half his reply means.

Anyway, I have dealt with autographs for over 25 years and was a staff writer for Autograph Times if anyone remembers them. This doesn't really mean anything, but I do understand what to look for in fakes, like signature breaks, flow of signature and the like.

Brian seems to think the photo signature looks exactly like his Leaf signed cards. To me they look nothing alike. Not really sure why Beckett is joining this so hard. Steve Grad even volunteered to go on the SCR podcast and explain his stance....which scr should not have turned down. Leaf sells cards and autos on ebay...the autos are certified by Beckett, so they have a business partnership to some degree it seems...noted by being able to get Grad to appear for them.

Last edited by MeteoriteGuy; 10-13-2017 at 03:54 PM.
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Old 10-13-2017, 04:23 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by MeteoriteGuy View Post
Yeah, SCR is kind of out there. He has been hammering Leaf pretty hard for two days now. He does seem to confirm the auto 8x10 noted in this thread is the right one. I asked for verification as I have communicated a little with Brian the last day, and Brian claimed he bought the 8x10...which he also noted on twitter. But he didn't reply back when SCR called that a lie and noted it was still listed. (It is still listed.)

I also questioned Brian on the following statement...

Leaf Trading Cards‏ @Leaf_Cards
Replying to @SportsCardRadio @Dame_Lillard

The fact is, I saw a player challenge an autograph on Twitter that he took cash for and signed in college,... it was witnessed by a TPA
5:33 PM - 11 Oct 2017

Mark Bostick‏ @MarkBostick3 18h18 hours ago

Mark Bostick Retweeted Leaf Trading Cards

Alternative facts? Its not a witnessed coa. You have said he was paid here (against ncaa rules) and today say it was free.


and got this reply...

Leaf Trading Cards‏ @Leaf_Cards 18h18 hours ago
Replying to @MarkBostick3

You are misunderstanding.. he was paid for Leaf Cards his rookie year. This unpaid rookie photo is on the money with leafs paid cards.
0 replies 0 retweets 0 likes

Lillard did not challenge a Leaf auto card, it was the 8x10. Brian clearly said,"I saw a player challenge an autograph on Twitter that he took cash for and signed in college."

I didn't press since he wasn't being honest and I cant even understand what half his reply means.

Anyway, I have dealt with autographs for over 25 years and was a staff writer for Autograph Times if anyone remembers them. This doesn't really mean anything, but I do understand what to look for in fakes, like signature breaks, flow of signature and the like.

Brian seems to think the photo signature looks exactly like his Leaf signed cards. To me they look nothing alike. Not really sure why Beckett is joining this so hard. Steve Grad even volunteered to go on the SCR podcast and explain his stance....which scr should not have turned down. Leaf sells cards and autos on ebay...the autos are certified by Beckett, so they have a business partnership to some degree it seems...noted by being able to get Grad to appear for them.
Thanks for the update.

Everything about this is honestly just weird at this point...
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Old 10-13-2017, 06:55 PM   #31
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SCR's agenda in this case seems to be "stir up controversy, make $$$"




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Old 10-14-2017, 05:14 PM   #32
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SCR's agenda in this case seems to be "stir up controversy, make $$$"


You don't make money putting up articles & podcasts with no ads/affiliate links!

No agenda. Initially I cracked a joke at how it was funny Leaf was contesting an autograph the player said was fake - twice. Brian & I texted about it later, and I was going to let it go.

Then Beckett, Brian & Gregg from Leaf tried to lie about Lillard deleting the tweets to make themselves (and Beckett) look good. There are incorrect posts in this thread from people who believed that claim.

Figured I'd set the record straight with the truth.
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Old 10-14-2017, 05:22 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by SCR View Post
You don't make money putting up articles & podcasts with no ads/affiliate links!

No agenda. Initially I cracked a joke at how it was funny Leaf was contesting an autograph the player said was fake - twice. Brian & I texted about it later, and I was going to let it go.

Then Beckett, Brian & Gregg from Leaf tried to lie about Lillard deleting the tweets to make themselves (and Beckett) look good. There are incorrect posts in this thread from people who believed that claim.

Figured I'd set the record straight with the truth.
Did I misinterpret your Tweet? I thought you were saying, "Thanks for the free advertising!"

Yeah, people were definitely wrong about Lillard deleting his Tweet. The original advertisement Tweet from someone else was deleted, so Lillard's quote-Tweet no longer made sense, but Lillard didn't delete it. I figured people were just mistaken.
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Old 10-14-2017, 07:24 PM   #34
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Did I misinterpret your Tweet? I thought you were saying, "Thanks for the free advertising!"

Yeah, people were definitely wrong about Lillard deleting his Tweet. The original advertisement Tweet from someone else was deleted, so Lillard's quote-Tweet no longer made sense, but Lillard didn't delete it. I figured people were just mistaken.
My tweet isn't all that clear to be honest. Essentially SCR makes money, primarily off content written years ago. It's enough that it gets reported & significant. So to offset this - we buy ads to unprofitable content to reduce our tax liability a little bit. Hit pieces get clicks, but they really don't make money.

What we'll gain is probably some social media followers. We got linked by the Washington Post for covering Dak, etc. But we won't make money.

To get our point across, we're bombastic, in your face and seem really worked up about it. That's how you get people's attention to read/discuss it. But seriously, I'll spend more time worrying about the grass I'm trying to grow in my backyard than any of this.
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Old 10-14-2017, 07:42 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by SCR View Post
My tweet isn't all that clear to be honest. Essentially SCR makes money, primarily off content written years ago. It's enough that it gets reported & significant. So to offset this - we buy ads to unprofitable content to reduce our tax liability a little bit. Hit pieces get clicks, but they really don't make money.

What we'll gain is probably some social media followers. We got linked by the Washington Post for covering Dak, etc. But we won't make money.

To get our point across, we're bombastic, in your face and seem really worked up about it. That's how you get people's attention to read/discuss it. But seriously, I'll spend more time worrying about the grass I'm trying to grow in my backyard than any of this.
My lawn is looking pretty good this year if I do say so myself
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Old 11-20-2017, 09:36 PM   #36
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Not a Leaf item...Lillard mistakenly identified an autograph as not real when in fact he did sign it..

I was just pointing out players make mistakes..,


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Old 11-20-2017, 09:53 PM   #37
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Not a Leaf item...Lillard mistakenly identified an autograph as not real when in fact he did sign it..

I was just pointing out players make mistakes..,


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But how do you know that he signed it for sure... I just don't understand why you seem to be so sure that Lillard is wrong and he definitely made a mistake... Why do you think third-party authenticators know better about whether a player signed something than the actual player who signed or didn't sign the item...? I wouldn't be as suspicious if Lillard had just recently started signing for Panini after signing for Leaf exclusively for the past few years...
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Old 11-20-2017, 10:02 PM   #38
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Can we get another color for LEAF? That yellow is hard as hell to read.
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Old 11-20-2017, 11:15 PM   #39
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Originally Posted by LEAF View Post
Not a Leaf item...Lillard mistakenly identified an autograph as not real when in fact he did sign it..

I was just pointing out players make mistakes..,


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How do you know he made a mistake in saying it was fake?
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Old 11-21-2017, 01:56 AM   #40
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This seems important enough to warrant a satisfying resolution. I'm not sure, do all parties agree about the authenticity of the autograph? How did Leaf get involved for a Beckett authenticated item?
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Old 11-21-2017, 10:27 AM   #41
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I went public when Sports Card Radio was making a big deal about this.

I handled Damian EXCLUSIVE for the first two years of his career. This is a rookie-era signature. The player called out the signature as NOT real, but he was absolutely mistaken. This was an older sig and he likely looked at it quickly and didn't see it as a current signature style he does.

In fact, I bought the photo from the seller after the controversy to make a point that I believe it is real so much so that I paid my own $$$ for it!

In fact, it appears to have been a blank white sheet he signed (possibly before he ever played a game for blazers) and the photo was printed after the fact.

It is 100% real. I reached out to Damian's agent and he did not reply.

Regardless, it is 100% real.

BG
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Old 11-21-2017, 10:31 AM   #42
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It wasn't that long ago, Ezekiel Elliott's mom stated on twitter that a Zeke autograph was fake because it was signed full name and she said he never did that.

He did in fact do this in college when he took $$$$ to sign large quantity of autographs.

His mom claimed no one knew her son's signature better than her.

Did she know he signed 1000's of pieces for CASH in college?

IMO, a player (or their mommy) is acting irresponsibly when they make statements that are not factual.

BG

p.s.- I don't blame a player for not remembering a signature he signed 6 years ago, but I do think they need to be more careful...
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Old 11-21-2017, 10:54 AM   #43
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I went public when Sports Card Radio was making a big deal about this.

I handled Damian EXCLUSIVE for the first two years of his career. This is a rookie-era signature. The player called out the signature as NOT real, but he was absolutely mistaken. This was an older sig and he likely looked at it quickly and didn't see it as a current signature style he does.

In fact, I bought the photo from the seller after the controversy to make a point that I believe it is real so much so that I paid my own $$$ for it!

In fact, it appears to have been a blank white sheet he signed (possibly before he ever played a game for blazers) and the photo was printed after the fact.

It is 100% real. I reached out to Damian's agent and he did not reply.

Regardless, it is 100% real.

BG
Quote:
Originally Posted by LEAF View Post
It wasn't that long ago, Ezekiel Elliott's mom stated on twitter that a Zeke autograph was fake because it was signed full name and she said he never did that.

He did in fact do this in college when he took $$$$ to sign large quantity of autographs.

His mom claimed no one knew her son's signature better than her.

Did she know he signed 1000's of pieces for CASH in college?

IMO, a player (or their mommy) is acting irresponsibly when they make statements that are not factual.

BG

p.s.- I don't blame a player for not remembering a signature he signed 6 years ago, but I do think they need to be more careful...
Even if it is real, you have ZERO proof other than your word. And your word is going against the person who's signature is in question. So whether or not its confusion on Lillard's part, doesn't matter.

It's his word versus yours.

And people are going to believe him over you.
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Old 11-21-2017, 11:18 AM   #44
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I have no doubt that a player (and, in particular, a player's mother, as in the Zeke Elliott case) can be mistaken about a signature, and that such errors can threaten the livelihood of a reputable authenticator.

But to insult Zeke Elliott's mother ("His mom doesn't know nothing. She had him and . . . who knows. That's about where her knowing ended is when she had him") and to make threatening / blackmail-y statements toward her ("Listen, if you want me to get into what [Zeke] was doing in college for money, I will, but otherwise I suggest you back off") - that's not a good look for Leaf, and any athletes looking to sign up with an authenticator are likely taking notice.
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Old 11-21-2017, 11:20 AM   #45
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Even if it is real, you have ZERO proof other than your word. And your word is going against the person who's signature is in question. So whether or not its confusion on Lillard's part, doesn't matter.

It's his word versus yours.

And people are going to believe him over you.
And they would be wrong....

Not a big deal to me, I bought it for my collection.

BUT, I may just put it up for sale and DARE Damian to call it out as fake.

If he does, then I might care... BG

p.s.- I would challenge Damian that if I show him 10 signatures (of which only one is real), he could not pick out the real one. I got $5k for charity that says he cant do it!
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Old 11-21-2017, 11:24 AM   #46
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Originally Posted by CitizunKane View Post
I have no doubt that a player (and, in particular, a player's mother, as in the Zeke Elliott case) can be mistaken about a signature, and that such errors can threaten the livelihood of a reputable authenticator.

But to insult Zeke Elliott's mother ("His mom doesn't know nothing. She had him and . . . who knows. That's about where her knowing ended is when she had him") and to make threatening / blackmail-y statements toward her ("Listen, if you want me to get into what [Zeke] was doing in college for money, I will, but otherwise I suggest you back off") - that's not a good look for Leaf, and any athletes looking to sign up with an authenticator are likely taking notice.
I never mentioned the college stuff until she basically told me I was clueless.
I strongly suggested she not make false statements as their false statements can harm people.

PLEASE NOTE: LEAF WAS NEVER HARMED IN EITHER OF THESE CASES AS NEITHER SIGNATURE BELONGED TO US OR EVER CAME FROM US.

We merely believe people should act responsibly.
Brian
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Old 11-21-2017, 11:48 AM   #47
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And they would be wrong....

Not a big deal to me, I bought it for my collection.

BUT, I may just put it up for sale and DARE Damian to call it out as fake.

If he does, then I might care... BG

p.s.- I would challenge Damian that if I show him 10 signatures (of which only one is real), he could not pick out the real one. I got $5k for charity that says he cant do it!
The shadow of doubt has already been cast by Damian saying it wasn't his.

The burden of proof is now on you. Your word does not provide that.

Do you have other instances of that similar signature?
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Old 11-21-2017, 12:17 PM   #48
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The shadow of doubt has already been cast by Damian saying it wasn't his.



The burden of proof is now on you. Your word does not provide that.



Do you have other instances of that similar signature?


Yes... Beckett and PSA have lots of college and early pro hockey exemplars which is why they certed it...
BG

Ps- and legally, if HE says itís fake, HE has to PROVE it.. him saying so isnít enough surprisingly


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Old 11-21-2017, 12:23 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LEAF View Post
I went public when Sports Card Radio was making a big deal about this.

I handled Damian EXCLUSIVE for the first two years of his career. This is a rookie-era signature. The player called out the signature as NOT real, but he was absolutely mistaken. This was an older sig and he likely looked at it quickly and didn't see it as a current signature style he does.

In fact, I bought the photo from the seller after the controversy to make a point that I believe it is real so much so that I paid my own $$$ for it!

In fact, it appears to have been a blank white sheet he signed (possibly before he ever played a game for blazers) and the photo was printed after the fact.

It is 100% real. I reached out to Damian's agent and he did not reply.

Regardless, it is 100% real.

BG
Thanks for the reply. The background & perspective is helpful and what I was hoping for. There is no proving anything in this hobby; it is all about trust. I can see why you would get involved. Your willingness to openly discuss this is enough for me. Cheers.
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Old 11-21-2017, 03:50 PM   #50
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.

We merely believe people should act responsibly.
Brian
That's funny coming from you. Just my opinion.
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