Amateur Poker Playing Thread

[calculusdork]

Question for the board:

I've had several hands lately with AA/KK/AKs in the BB, and the table either completely folds around, or I get a min-raise and everyone else folds. Say the min-raiser is an average player, somewhat fishy. Do you simply call the raise to try and extract more value on later streets, or do you 3-bet? If you 3-bet, how much? I know it's a somewhat situational question, so I'm curious to hear feedback on when you 3-bet big, when you 3-bet small, when you simply call, etc.

EDIT - Here's what my gut tells me up-front about having AA/KK/AKs in the blinds:

(1) If UTG or UTG+1 opens and there is at least one other caller before me, I'm 3-betting big (say 5x-7x the opener).
(2) If I am SB and there is one raise (one player) in front of me, I'm 3-betting about 3.5x the opener.
(3) If I am BB and there is one raise (one good player) in front of me, I'm 3-betting about 2.5x the opener.
(4) If I am BB and there is one raise (one fishy player) in front of me, I'm either min-raising the opener, or I'm calling.

Also, if I am UTG with AA/KK/AKs, I usually open about 3.5x or 4x (too small?).

[jlzinck]

Originally Posted by Ray27Ray52

I love hearing Negreanu talk about the game. His mind is just on a different level. Is he a bit of a douche? Yeah, he is. But he is a great ambassador for poker.

He was a MUST follow on Twitter before he got Trump Derangement Syndrome.

Great poker mind

[KB81]

Way over my head, lol

I was told a while back to just be consistent with your betting style (when you have bad or good hands)

I try to stick to that.

[jlzinck]

Guess my hand.

Back story. Playing Pretty ABC for 1st hour to feel out the table.

Have showndown 6 hands and lost only one. All in on the turn and my Top 2 pair lose to a flush on the river.

1/2 NL Effective stacks $300

Hero is in the SB with XX.
Folds to MP who raises to 7, cutoff calls and I pop to 20.
Only MP calls.
We have shown down 2 hands and both times I had the best of him and it wasn't close.

Flop Ac Ts 6s

I bet $25, Villian Calls

Turn 4c

I check Villian bets $60.

I C/R to $140 and he knows I am committed as he should.

He throws his KK face up in the muck muttering something about an f'ing Ace Rag

I ask him why he didn't 4 bet pre. He said he didn't want to scare people out.

What did I have???

[griffan15]

Originally Posted by jlzinck

Guess my hand.

Back story. Playing Pretty ABC for 1st hour to feel out the table.

Have showndown 6 hands and lost only one. All in on the turn and my Top 2 pair lose to a flush on the river.

1/2 NL Effective stacks $300

Hero is in the SB with XX.
Folds to MP who raises to 7, cutoff calls and I pop to 20.
Only MP calls.
We have shown down 2 hands and both times I had the best of him and it wasn't close.

Flop Ac Ts 6s

I bet $25, Villian Calls

Turn 4c

I check Villian bets $60.

I C/R to $140 and he knows I am committed as he should.

He throws his KK face up in the muck muttering something about an f'ing Ace Rag

I ask him why he didn't 4 bet pre. He said he didn't want to scare people out.

What did I have???

I would assume a wide range here, but most likely As4s or TT.

[griffan15]

Originally Posted by calculusdork

Question for the board:


(1) If UTG or UTG+1 opens and there is at least one other caller before me, I'm 3-betting big (say 5x-7x the opener). - Bet Pot. UTG shouldn't be raising light in this situation and your pot bet looks like a squeeze. You have the caller dominated, so hopefully they come along for the ride too..
(2) If I am SB and there is one raise (one player) in front of me, I'm 3-betting about 3.5x the opener. - Correct, I would do the same.
(3) If I am BB and there is one raise (one good player) in front of me, I'm 3-betting about 2.5x the opener. - Sounds about right.
(4) If I am BB and there is one raise (one fishy player) in front of me, I'm either min-raising the opener, or I'm calling. - I wouldn't do this as they have a wide range and you wouldn't know where you are if a wet board comes out. Also, a fishy player is more likely to call an overbet, so bet pot here as well. He might still call you with something like KTo and more likely to fold something like 65s.
Also, if I am UTG with AA/KK/AKs, I usually open about 3.5x or 4x (too small?). - No, don't deviate from your normal open. If you get a lot of callers or the board is wet, play cautiously. You're kind of giving away your hand if you decide to overbet UTG.

My thoughts, but others can chime in as well.

[calculusdork]

Originally Posted by jlzinck

Guess my hand.

Back story. Playing Pretty ABC for 1st hour to feel out the table.

Have showndown 6 hands and lost only one. All in on the turn and my Top 2 pair lose to a flush on the river.

1/2 NL Effective stacks $300

Hero is in the SB with XX.
Folds to MP who raises to 7, cutoff calls and I pop to 20.
Only MP calls.
We have shown down 2 hands and both times I had the best of him and it wasn't close.

Flop Ac Ts 6s

I bet $25, Villian Calls

Turn 4c

I check Villian bets $60.

I C/R to $140 and he knows I am committed as he should.

He throws his KK face up in the muck muttering something about an f'ing Ace Rag

I ask him why he didn't 4 bet pre. He said he didn't want to scare people out.

What did I have???

Based on the hand history you gave, you wanted to isolate this player. You had 72o.

[calculusdork]

Originally Posted by griffan15

My thoughts, but others can chime in as well.

Good stuff. Thanks.

[jlzinck]

Originally Posted by calculusdork

Based on the hand history you gave, you wanted to isolate this player. You had 72o.

Not that bad. 9Tss

I did show it to get him to bite on a winner later but he busted soon after.

3.5 hours for a $348 profit.

Hadn't played live in a while. I do so enjoy it

[calculusdork]

Originally Posted by jlzinck

Not that bad. 9Tss

I did show it to get him to bite on a winner later but he busted soon after.

3.5 hours for a $348 profit.

Hadn't played live in a while. I do so enjoy it

Ha ... I was *somewhat* kidding, but I figured you didn't have a great hand and simply knew you could win on the fold equity from the Ace.

[KB81]

here we go

Game started at: 2018/2/20 17:3:25
Game ID: 1129035420 0.10/0.25 (PRR) Ettin - 2 (Hold'em)
Seat 6 is the button
Seat 1: AmmStocking (33.21).
Seat 3: GameOver581 (3.51).
Seat 4: ur_suspect (25.47).
Seat 5: MDNOTMD (10.86).
Seat 6: warchant (15.82).
Seat 7: Numismatist (27.74).
Seat 8: LittleTexan (18.90).
Seat 9: gawcrea1 (12.69).
Player Numismatist has small blind (0.10)
Player LittleTexan has big blind (0.25)
Player GameOver581 posts (0.10) as a dead bet
Player GameOver581 posts (0.25)
Player Numismatist received a card.
Player Numismatist received a card.
Player LittleTexan received a card.
Player LittleTexan received a card.
Player gawcrea1 received a card.
Player gawcrea1 received a card.
Player AmmStocking received a card.
Player AmmStocking received a card.
Player GameOver581 received card: [Kd]
Player GameOver581 received card: [10d]
Player ur_suspect received a card.
Player ur_suspect received a card.
Player MDNOTMD received a card.
Player MDNOTMD received a card.
Player warchant received a card.
Player warchant received a card.
Player gawcrea1 folds
Player AmmStocking folds
Player GameOver581 checks
Player ur_suspect raises (1.20)
Player MDNOTMD folds
Player warchant calls (1.20)
Player Numismatist folds
Player LittleTexan folds
Player GameOver581 calls (0.95)
*** FLOP ***: [As Qd Jh]
Player GameOver581 allin (2.21)
Player ur_suspect folds
Player warchant calls (2.21)
*** TURN ***: [As Qd Jh] [2d]
*** RIVER ***: [As Qd Jh 2d] [6s]
------ Summary ------
Pot: 8.05. Rake 0.28. JP fee 0.14
Board: [As Qd Jh 2d 6s]
Player AmmStocking does not show cards.Bets: 0. Collects: 0. Wins: 0.
*Player GameOver581 shows: Straight to A [Kd 10d]. Bets: 3.51. Collects: 8.05. Wins: 4.54.
Player ur_suspect does not show cards.Bets: 1.20. Collects: 0. Loses: 1.20.
Player MDNOTMD does not show cards.Bets: 0. Collects: 0. Wins: 0.
Player warchant shows: Two pairs. As and Qs [Qh Ad]. Bets: 3.41. Collects: 0. Loses: 3.41.
Player Numismatist does not show cards.Bets: 0.10. Collects: 0. Loses: 0.10.
Player LittleTexan does not show cards.Bets: 0.25. Collects: 0. Loses: 0.25.
Player gawcrea1 does not show cards.Bets: 0. Collects: 0. Wins: 0.
Game ended at: 2018/2/20 17:4:17

[btimm]

Thoughts ...

Originally Posted by calculusdork

Question for the board:

I've had several hands lately with AA/KK/AKs in the BB, and the table either completely folds around, or I get a min-raise and everyone else folds. Say the min-raiser is an average player, somewhat fishy. Do you simply call the raise to try and extract more value on later streets, or do you 3-bet? If you 3-bet, how much? I know it's a somewhat situational question, so I'm curious to hear feedback on when you 3-bet big, when you 3-bet small, when you simply call, etc.

It's possible that times have changed enough where my thoughts may be outdated, but when I played often (about 8 years ago), this is what I generally did.
EDIT - Here's what my gut tells me up-front about having AA/KK/AKs in the blinds:

(1) If UTG or UTG+1 opens and there is at least one other caller before me, I'm 3-betting big (say 5x-7x the opener). OOP, I generally would 3bet larger. Partially because being OOP sucks and because my range is stronger as well. In this spot, your sizing seems appropriate.
(2) If I am SB and there is one raise (one player) in front of me, I'm 3-betting about 3.5x the opener. My sizing for a 3bet wouldn't change between SB and BB. It would if I was IP in the CO or BTN though. Here, I would make it 3.5-4x.
(3) If I am BB and there is one raise (one good player) in front of me, I'm 3-betting about 2.5x the opener. Same thing, 3.5-4x is my sizing.
(4) If I am BB and there is one raise (one fishy player) in front of me, I'm either min-raising the opener, or I'm calling. No, 3bet. And 3bet your normal sizing.

Also, if I am UTG with AA/KK/AKs, I usually open about 3.5x or 4x (too small?). This is kinda fine imo. The sizing is I mean, but not varying your bet sizing based on your hand strength. But I will add the caveat that I wouldn't change my sizing up based on hand strength generally speaking, my preflop raise size depends on position. Again, because being OOP sucks and your hand strength is a function of your position. In 6max, I would open 4x UTG, 3.5x MP, 3x CO, and either 2.5x or 3x on the BTN depending on the players at the table. HOWEVER, this is just a guide. If you are playing against all recreational players for example, they aren't likely to pick up on you cbetting small with nothing and large with value. Being balanced for the sake of being balanced is silly. Balance is only important when your opponent can tell if you are not balanced. I am rambling now, so I will stop.

[calculusdork]

Originally Posted by KB81

here we go

Game started at: 2018/2/20 17:3:25
Game ID: 1129035420 0.10/0.25 (PRR) Ettin - 2 (Hold'em)
Seat 6 is the button
Seat 1: AmmStocking (33.21).
Seat 3: GameOver581 (3.51).
Seat 4: ur_suspect (25.47).
Seat 5: MDNOTMD (10.86).
Seat 6: warchant (15.82).
Seat 7: Numismatist (27.74).
Seat 8: LittleTexan (18.90).
Seat 9: gawcrea1 (12.69).
Player Numismatist has small blind (0.10)
Player LittleTexan has big blind (0.25)
Player GameOver581 posts (0.10) as a dead bet
Player GameOver581 posts (0.25)
Player Numismatist received a card.
Player Numismatist received a card.
Player LittleTexan received a card.
Player LittleTexan received a card.
Player gawcrea1 received a card.
Player gawcrea1 received a card.
Player AmmStocking received a card.
Player AmmStocking received a card.
Player GameOver581 received card: [Kd]
Player GameOver581 received card: [10d]
Player ur_suspect received a card.
Player ur_suspect received a card.
Player MDNOTMD received a card.
Player MDNOTMD received a card.
Player warchant received a card.
Player warchant received a card.
Player gawcrea1 folds
Player AmmStocking folds
Player GameOver581 checks
Player ur_suspect raises (1.20)
Player MDNOTMD folds
Player warchant calls (1.20)
Player Numismatist folds
Player LittleTexan folds
Player GameOver581 calls (0.95)
*** FLOP ***: [As Qd Jh]
Player GameOver581 allin (2.21)
Player ur_suspect folds
Player warchant calls (2.21)
*** TURN ***: [As Qd Jh] [2d]
*** RIVER ***: [As Qd Jh 2d] [6s]
------ Summary ------
Pot: 8.05. Rake 0.28. JP fee 0.14
Board: [As Qd Jh 2d 6s]
Player AmmStocking does not show cards.Bets: 0. Collects: 0. Wins: 0.
*Player GameOver581 shows: Straight to A [Kd 10d]. Bets: 3.51. Collects: 8.05. Wins: 4.54.
Player ur_suspect does not show cards.Bets: 1.20. Collects: 0. Loses: 1.20.
Player MDNOTMD does not show cards.Bets: 0. Collects: 0. Wins: 0.
Player warchant shows: Two pairs. As and Qs [Qh Ad]. Bets: 3.41. Collects: 0. Loses: 3.41.
Player Numismatist does not show cards.Bets: 0.10. Collects: 0. Loses: 0.10.
Player LittleTexan does not show cards.Bets: 0.25. Collects: 0. Loses: 0.25.
Player gawcrea1 does not show cards.Bets: 0. Collects: 0. Wins: 0.
Game ended at: 2018/2/20 17:4:17

I'll let one of the pros here knock you around

[calculusdork]

Originally Posted by btimm

Thoughts ...

Some really good stuff there man. I do try to be relatively 'balanced' pre-flop. I see some guys always min-raise when they raise, but then suddenly open 10x in position and basically turn their cards over.

I am working more on letting my position dictate my raise amounts.

[KB81]

Originally Posted by calculusdork

I'll let one of the pros here knock you around

Lol flame on!

[calculusdork]

Originally Posted by KB81

Lol flame on!

Just a few thoughts:

(1) With a very small bankroll, play the .01/.02 games for a while to get the hang of things.
(2) Don't post the blinds out of position. Just wait it out.
(3) Don't go all-in when you hit the nuts. Consider if you'd had a $25 bankroll and got into that pot for the same price ($1.20). You should check that flop HARD. Let the others bet. Someone more than likely has an A. Let them bet into you.

Heavy emphasis on #1. If you really want to learn and become a better player. Take some time on the cheap micro tables for a while. I'm preaching to myself here too.

[KB81]

Originally Posted by calculusdork

Just a few thoughts:

(1) With a very small bankroll, play the .01/.02 games for a while to get the hang of things.
(2) Don't post the blinds out of position. Just wait it out.
(3) Don't go all-in when you hit the nuts. Consider if you'd had a $25 bankroll and got into that pot for the same price ($1.20). You should check that flop HARD. Let the others bet. Someone more than likely has an A. Let them bet into you.

Heavy emphasis on #1. If you really want to learn and become a better player. Take some time on the cheap micro tables for a while. I'm preaching to myself here too.

Noted

Will play again tonight and try those out.

[griffan15]

Last night's session was brutal. I actually felt like I played pretty well for the most part, but my hands just kept getting destroyed. I did punt $34 at the very end of the session with 44 vs AA. But everything else I felt okay about.

Time: 2 hours
Tables: 10
Hands: 1252
Win/Loss -$201.05

Here are the big losses:

Seat 1: Fuste ($47.02)
Seat 2: siderealday ($25.70)
Seat 3: Reademnweep24 ($48.49)
Seat 4: StalinCCCP ($85.91)
Seat 5: olhaoas ($61.06)
Seat 6: griffan15 ($39.09)
Button is seat 5
griffan15: posts small blind $0.10
Fuste: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
griffan15: dealt [As Ac]
siderealday: raises $0.70
Reademnweep24: folds
StalinCCCP: folds
olhaoas: raises $2.50
griffan15: raises $8.35
Fuste: folds
siderealday: folds
olhaoas: raises all-in $58.56
griffan15: raises all-in $30.64
olhaoas: pulls back uncalled bet $21.97
*** FLOP *** [Kd 2h 3s]
*** TURN *** [Kd 2h 3s] [3c]
*** RIVER *** [Kd 2h 3s] [3c] [Ks]
*** SUMMARY ***
Pot: $76.13 | Rake: $2.76 | BBJ: $0.24 |
Board: [Kd 2h 3s 3c Ks]
Seat 1: Fuste lost -$0.25
Seat 2: siderealday lost -$0.70
Seat 3: Reademnweep24 didn't bet
Seat 4: StalinCCCP didn't bet
Seat 5: olhaoas won $76.13 (+$37.04) [Kc Kh] Four of a Kind, Kings
Seat 6: griffan15 lost -$39.09 [As Ac] Two Pair, Aces and Kings



Seat 1: stealwave ($7.40)
Seat 2: griffan15 ($25.85)
Seat 3: KrustyFeet ($26.89)
Seat 4: deeznutzz14 ($43.37)
Seat 5: Fishgoes2sky ($24.85)
Seat 6: Godbadugly ($99.94)
Button is seat 6
stealwave: posts small blind $0.10
griffan15: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
griffan15: dealt [Ah Kh]
KrustyFeet: calls $0.25
deeznutzz14: folds
Fishgoes2sky: raises $0.90
Godbadugly: calls $0.90
stealwave: folds
griffan15: raises $3.70
KrustyFeet: calls $3.70
Fishgoes2sky: folds
Godbadugly: folds
*** FLOP *** [9d 2c 3c]
griffan15: bets $9.31
KrustyFeet: calls $9.31
*** TURN *** [9d 2c 3c] [Ac]
griffan15: checks
KrustyFeet: raises all-in $13.63
griffan15: raises all-in $12.59
KrustyFeet: pulls back uncalled bet $1.04
*** RIVER *** [9d 2c 3c] [Ac] [Th]
*** SUMMARY ***
Pot: $50.92 | Rake: $2.44 | BBJ: $0.24 |
Board: [9d 2c 3c Ac Th]
Seat 1: stealwave lost -$0.10
Seat 2: griffan15 lost -$25.85 [Ah Kh] One Pair, Aces
Seat 3: KrustyFeet won $50.92 (+$25.07) [7c 6c] Flush, Ace High
Seat 4: deeznutzz14 didn't bet
Seat 5: Fishgoes2sky lost -$0.90
Seat 6: Godbadugly lost -$0.90



Seat 1: Fishgoes2sky ($88.08)
Seat 2: griffan15 ($32.76)
Seat 3: CrazyDiscusGuy ($28.75)
Seat 4: olhaoas ($73.66)
Seat 5: Two20Two21 ($25)
Seat 6: SmellofVictory ($24.68)
Button is seat 4
Two20Two21: posts small blind $0.10
SmellofVictory: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
griffan15: dealt [Qd Jd]
Fishgoes2sky: folds
griffan15: raises $0.70
CrazyDiscusGuy: folds
olhaoas: folds
Two20Two21: calls $0.60
SmellofVictory: folds
*** FLOP *** [Qh 3h 2d]
Two20Two21: checks
griffan15: bets $1.17
Two20Two21: raises $4.50
griffan15: calls $3.33
*** TURN *** [Qh 3h 2d] [2h]
Two20Two21: bets $5.06
griffan15: calls $5.06
*** RIVER *** [Qh 3h 2d] [2h] [8d]
Two20Two21: raises all-in $14.74
griffan15: calls $14.74
*** SUMMARY ***
Pot: $47.74 | Rake: $2.27 | BBJ: $0.24 |
Board: [Qh 3h 2d 2h 8d]
Seat 1: Fishgoes2sky didn't bet
Seat 2: griffan15 lost -$25 [Qd Jd] Two Pair, Queens and Twos
Seat 3: CrazyDiscusGuy didn't bet
Seat 4: olhaoas didn't bet
Seat 5: Two20Two21 won $47.74 (+$22.74) [8h 8s] Full House, Eights full of Twos
Seat 6: SmellofVictory lost -$0.25



Seat 2: griffan15 ($25)
Seat 3: KrustyFeet ($58.39)
Seat 4: deeznutzz14 ($65.35)
Seat 5: Fishgoes2sky ($31.84)
Seat 6: Godbadugly ($105.80)
Button is seat 6
griffan15: posts small blind $0.10
KrustyFeet: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
griffan15: dealt [Ad Ah]
deeznutzz14: folds
Fishgoes2sky: folds
Godbadugly: folds
griffan15: raises $0.65
KrustyFeet: raises $2.25
griffan15: raises $5.50
KrustyFeet: calls $3.75
*** FLOP *** [6d 8c 4d]
griffan15: bets $8.91
KrustyFeet: calls $8.91
*** TURN *** [6d 8c 4d] [2c]
griffan15: raises all-in $9.84
KrustyFeet: calls $9.84
*** RIVER *** [6d 8c 4d] [2c] [7s]
*** SUMMARY ***
Pot: $47.50 | Rake: $2.26 | BBJ: $0.24 |
Board: [6d 8c 4d 2c 7s]
Seat 2: griffan15 lost -$25 [Ad Ah] One Pair, Aces
Seat 3: KrustyFeet won $47.50 (+$22.50) [Ac 5c] Straight, Eight High
Seat 4: deeznutzz14 didn't bet
Seat 5: Fishgoes2sky didn't bet
Seat 6: Godbadugly didn't bet


Seat 1: griffan15 ($65.01)
Seat 2: Monster_Bitt ($34.60)
Seat 3: MumboJumbo ($16.13)
Seat 4: olhaoas ($49.65)
Seat 5: BoTPuMHeDichBro ($39.64)
Seat 6: SI units ($12.97)
Button is seat 1
Monster_Bitt: posts small blind $0.10
MumboJumbo: posts big blind $0.25
*** HOLE CARDS ***
griffan15: dealt [Ah Ks]
olhaoas: folds
BoTPuMHeDichBro: folds
SI units: calls $0.25
griffan15: raises $1.10
Monster_Bitt: calls $1
MumboJumbo: raises $1.70
SI units: folds
griffan15: raises $6.10
Monster_Bitt: folds
MumboJumbo: calls $5.25
*** FLOP *** [7h Ad 8h]
MumboJumbo: checks
griffan15: raises all-in $57.81
MumboJumbo: raises all-in $8.93
griffan15: pulls back uncalled bet $48.88
*** TURN *** [7h Ad 8h] [6h]
*** RIVER *** [7h Ad 8h] [6h] [2d]
*** SUMMARY ***
Pot: $31.93 | Rake: $1.44 | BBJ: $0.24 |
Board: [7h Ad 8h 6h 2d]
Seat 1: griffan15 lost -$16.13 [Ah Ks] One Pair, Aces
Seat 2: Monster_Bitt lost -$1.10
Seat 3: MumboJumbo won $31.93 (+$15.80) [Kh Qh] Flush, King High
Seat 4: olhaoas didn't bet
Seat 5: BoTPuMHeDichBro didn't bet
Seat 6: SI units lost -$0.25

[KB81]

Stuck to the low end tables like advised and surprised to see that it was better than expected.

I was too eager for the most part and lost all the 25 I put in yesterday but know I know to go straight to the cellar and hang there. with my 25 I played all day till about 1AM.

Will add funds today or tomorrow and give it a go again.

[calculusdork]

griffan15: Trying to see how many times you can lose with pocket aces? Man, that's brutal stuff.

KB81: The nice thing about the micro tables is that people are still going to play, for the most part, as they would on higher stakes tables. You can play for days on the .01/.02 tables with $25.

[griffan15]

I didn't want to post this hand history, but I think it's a fascinating hand and would welcome thought.

Effective stats, all at $25-27

EP raises to .70, I call in LP with AdTd, BB calls.

Flop is QdJd9h.

BB checks, EP bets $2, I call......BB pushes All-in, EP calls All-in.

So what should I do? What could they have?

I called, but wasn't entirely sure if that was the right play.

[KB81]

Originally Posted by griffan15

I didn't want to post this hand history, but I think it's a fascinating hand and would welcome thought.

Effective stats, all at $25-27

EP raises to .70, I call in LP with AdTd, BB calls.

Flop is QdJd9h.

BB checks, EP bets $2, I call......BB pushes All-in, EP calls All-in.

So what should I do? What could they have?

I called, but wasn't entirely sure if that was the right play.

1) Bluffs
2) someone has Pair of Qs
3) someone has QJ in hand
4) someone has 4 diamonds and is fishing for the Flush.

Which was it?

[calculusdork]

Originally Posted by griffan15

I didn't want to post this hand history, but I think it's a fascinating hand and would welcome thought.

Effective stats, all at $25-27

EP raises to .70, I call in LP with AdTd, BB calls.

Flop is QdJd9h.

BB checks, EP bets $2, I call......BB pushes All-in, EP calls All-in.

So what should I do? What could they have?

I called, but wasn't entirely sure if that was the right play.

Hmm. Have you run it through PokerTracker/Equilab to estimate your equity?

There's a decent chance one of them has KT. I'd say ranges are:

BB: AQ, KQ, KT, QJ, Q9s, J9s, T8s, 99, Kd9d, 8d7d (I don't think JJ+ is here)
EP: AA, AK, KK, QQ, JJ, AQ, KQ, QJ, KTs, 99 (but I'm really inclined to think QQ+ is not here, would have expected a bigger pre-flop raise)

I'd say the chances there is at least one K between the two of them is pretty high. So, you've still got a ton of outs, right? A, A, A, K, K, K, 8, 8, 8, 8, and seven other diamonds (2-7, 9). 17 outs. My gut says this is a call all day.

EDIT: Without knowing the math, and using some of my new poker language , my gut tells me that calling is a +EV play.

DOUBLE EDIT: Check my math here ... you're basically risking about $23 to win about $78, so you need to win this hand about 30% of the time to break even. You've definitely got more equity than that, even if we remove the Aces from your outs.

[btimm]

Originally Posted by calculusdork

Hmm. Have you run it through PokerTracker/Equilab to estimate your equity?

There's a decent chance one of them has KT. I'd say ranges are:

BB: AQ, KQ, KT, QJ, Q9s, J9s, T8s, 99, Kd9d, 8d7d (I don't think JJ+ is here)
EP: AA, AK, KK, QQ, JJ, AQ, KQ, QJ, KTs, 99 (but I'm really inclined to think QQ+ is not here, would have expected a bigger pre-flop raise)

I'd say the chances there is at least one K between the two of them is pretty high. So, you've still got a ton of outs, right? A, A, A, K, K, K, 8, 8, 8, 8, and seven other diamonds (2-7, 9). 17 outs. My gut says this is a call all day.

EDIT: Without knowing the math, and using some of my new poker language , my gut tells me that calling is a +EV play.

I would not assume that the aces are outs. And the 8s aren't always outs. You can improve on the turn and still lost on the river as well.

Assuming each stack is $25, you would be risking a $22.30 call to win $50.80, ignoring the rake. That gives your breakeven equity needed to 22.3/(22.3 + 50.8) as 30.5%. I don't think you have that much equity against two hands. If you do have sufficient equity, it is likely to be very marginally profitable and high variance. I'd fold, but would want to see it run through stove, to see what kind of equity we do have here.

If you love to gamble and don't mind potentially marginally -EV spots, I doubt it is the end of the world to call.

Results?

[btimm]

.....

Originally Posted by calculusdork

Hmm. Have you run it through PokerTracker/Equilab to estimate your equity?

There's a decent chance one of them has KT. I'd say ranges are:

BB: AQ, KQ, KT, QJ, Q9s, J9s, T8s, 99, Kd9d, 8d7d (I don't think JJ+ is here)
EP: AA, AK, KK, QQ, JJ, AQ, KQ, QJ, KTs, 99 (but I'm really inclined to think QQ+ is not here, would have expected a bigger pre-flop raise)
I would not remove QQ+ for EP due to raise size. I would remove AK (he isn't calling a shove with a gutshot and overs that aren't likely good), probably AQ, KQ as well.
For BB, I would remove AQ, KQ as well.
Removing these hands dramatically impacts your equity.

I'd say the chances there is at least one K between the two of them is pretty high. So, you've still got a ton of outs, right? A, A, A, K, K, K, 8, 8, 8, 8, and seven other diamonds (2-7, 9). 17 outs. My gut says this is a call all day.

EDIT: Without knowing the math, and using some of my new poker language , my gut tells me that calling is a +EV play.

DOUBLE EDIT: Check my math here ... you're basically risking about $23 to win about $78, so you need to win this hand about 30% of the time to break even. You've definitely got more equity than that, even if we remove the Aces from your outs.
I'm not so sure he has the required equity here at all.