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Old 01-23-2018, 09:25 AM   #1
thebrokepoet
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Default When cops kill somebody on the side of a wall ...

... first off ... I am a fan of police officers , most days ... but yesterday at 8:30 am the police department decided to serve a warrant and deliver 12-15 shots to his mid section. I understand they had a job to do , and occasionally shooting a man in his own living room is on that list ... but as the barrage of bullets came through the living and dining room wall and exited out out sliding glass door ... I wondered to myself if they were actually doing their job correctly, or perhaps they should have cleared neighbors ... seems how the warrant they are were serving was felons in possession of firearms, robbery, and threats to commit suiccide or shoot at the cops . Counted ten holes in the wall ... shot the couch , and dining room table .

.... second .... I am not a fan of lawsuits , most days .... but I feel like my wife’s and my life were not appropriately assessed in this mess , and five feet in the wrong direction and the outcome would have been much more tragic . I am not sure what to do ... let it go , or raise hell
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Old 01-23-2018, 09:32 AM   #2
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OH my.

They are responsible for their bullets. I'd be making a call and having the damage repaired.
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Old 01-23-2018, 10:10 AM   #3
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Wow, poorly executed by them. I would be upset as well.
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Old 01-23-2018, 10:22 AM   #4
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This is a vote in the RAISE HELL column. That is utterly unacceptable.
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Old 01-23-2018, 10:25 AM   #5
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Raise hell ...they should at least be repairing the damages
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Old 01-23-2018, 10:26 AM   #6
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Out of curiosity how do you know what the warrant was for?

And I can answer a few of the questions/concerns being a former LEO in the military.

We're taught that we have to be aware and cognizant of the backdrop when shooting. In other words, if there's a schoolyard full of children behind someone you generally don't shoot. The issue here is that there's no way of knowing what's behind a wall, and even if the bullet(s) will penetrate that wall. If you had to worry about what was behind a wall all the time we would have a lot more dead cops.

Clearing neighbors prior to any action only happens in the movies. You never know which neighbors may or may not tip off the suspect. Even when raiding a known drug house the neighborhood will not be cleared. It's simply too risky. Surprise gives the best odds of keeping the situation under control and not having any significant external factors (i.e. hostages, barricading and booby trapping).

Now the damage done is 100% on the City/State/County (depending on what agency actually served the warrant) to fix.
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Old 01-23-2018, 10:46 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by thebrokepoet View Post
... first off ... I am a fan of police officers , most days ... but yesterday at 8:30 am the police department decided to serve a warrant and deliver 12-15 shots to his mid section. I understand they had a job to do , and occasionally shooting a man in his own living room is on that list ... but as the barrage of bullets came through the living and dining room wall and exited out out sliding glass door ... I wondered to myself if they were actually doing their job correctly, or perhaps they should have cleared neighbors ... seems how the warrant they are were serving was felons in possession of firearms, robbery, and threats to commit suiccide or shoot at the cops . Counted ten holes in the wall ... shot the couch , and dining room table .

.... second .... I am not a fan of lawsuits , most days .... but I feel like my wifeís and my life were not appropriately assessed in this mess , and five feet in the wrong direction and the outcome would have been much more tragic . I am not sure what to do ... let it go , or raise hell
First off If cops shoot up my house I'm reigning down hell fire and causing the biggest fuss you've ever seen. Its a very fortunate thing you and your family are alive. I recall years back my father was on his mail route and someone carelessly fired a round through his window and the drivers seat head rest. Luckily, since he was delivering mail he was in the passenger seat. Other wise he would have died that day. You definitely have to hold people accountable when it comes to bullets being fired, especially law enforcement.
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Old 01-23-2018, 10:52 AM   #8
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did they not immediately send somebody over to track all the rounds fired after the situation was handled? Seems like that's something that's supposed to happen...
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Old 01-23-2018, 11:11 AM   #9
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did they not immediately send somebody over to track all the rounds fired after the situation was handled? Seems like that's something that's supposed to happen...
They were at the door within 30 seconds probably
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Old 01-23-2018, 11:14 AM   #10
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Out of curiosity how do you know what the warrant was for?
it’s all over the news ... they were very upfront about everything ... they forced entry into the apartment and reigned shots at him when he pulled a gun ( well ... pulled two guns , apparently)
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Old 01-23-2018, 11:39 AM   #11
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did they not immediately send somebody over to track all the rounds fired after the situation was handled? Seems like that's something that's supposed to happen...
I would assume so. Almost every time a gun is fired by an officer they are placed on paid leave while there is an investigation. That's how it is around here anyways.
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Old 01-23-2018, 12:23 PM   #12
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Old 01-23-2018, 12:25 PM   #13
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Wow, that is scary stuff. I woudln't hesitate to pursue whatever you think is appropriate.

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Old 01-23-2018, 12:25 PM   #14
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Old 01-23-2018, 12:27 PM   #15
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Holy moly--time to move..........thats nuts! 15-20 bullets fired on one guy?
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Old 01-23-2018, 12:42 PM   #16
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As a former Sheriff's Deputy and member of the tactical entry team, my primary concern isn't the number of shots fired (considering likely a 6 man team and each began discharging their weapon after suspect drew), not clearing people out first (which, when you think about it probably the most absurd idea when trying to execute a search warrant), not surveying down range effect (which will get you killed), rather it's how many MISSED the target. I assume that's a shared wall and also eliminates the likelihood those rounds were fired by the suspect.
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Old 01-23-2018, 02:54 PM   #17
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not clearing people out first (which, when you think about it probably the most absurd idea when trying to execute a search warrant), not surveying down range effect (which will get you killed)

I respectfully disagree ... I donít think clearing out innocent people that could be in the line off fire is the most absurd idea ...




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Old 01-23-2018, 03:25 PM   #18
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I respectfully disagree ... I donít think clearing out innocent people that could be in the line off fire is the most absurd idea ...


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I sympathize with what you and your family have gone through. However, I did provide a couple of possible outcomes that can come with trying to clear out innocent people.

Should plain clothes officers knock on doors? What happens if/when the suspect hears people knocking on all the doors except his? What happens if one of those doors belongs to an accomplice who can then warn the individual? If the suspect saw officers knocking on doors and evacuating people you can be damn sure that they would have guns loaded and pointed at the door.

It's just not realistic and in actuality will place significantly more people (both officers and civilians) at more risk then if they take the suspect by surprise. It greatly increases the chance that the suspect will have some sort of warning and thereby either already have weapons drawn and pointed at cops or run and place the general populace at significant risk.
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Old 01-23-2018, 03:40 PM   #19
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Old 01-23-2018, 03:43 PM   #20
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You're entitled to fixed damages. Are you wanting more then that? The officers didn't decide to shoot the suspect, the suspect made the decision when he pulled out 2 guns. The police are accountable for their rounds and will fix your damages.
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Old 01-23-2018, 04:01 PM   #21
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You're entitled to fixed damages. Are you wanting more then that? The officers didn't decide to shoot the suspect, the suspect made the decision when he pulled out 2 guns. The police are accountable for their rounds and will fix your damages.

Just not sure how any of this works . It was quite troubling to tell you the truth ... a little shook . The police fired a ton of bullets through the wall .... First timer here .... Everyone has been very nice , and like I said , not a fan of lawsuits ... just didnít know if the police are going to replace my couch and whatnot .. or really any of the process , just thought it was a cool story and thought Iíd share


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Old 01-23-2018, 04:03 PM   #22
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We are all happy you and your family are ok. That's just ridiculous. Post the photos and story on their social media page.
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Old 01-23-2018, 04:05 PM   #23
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I sympathize with what you and your family have gone through. However, I did provide a couple of possible outcomes that can come with trying to clear out innocent people.



Should plain clothes officers knock on doors? What happens if/when the suspect hears people knocking on all the doors except his? What happens if one of those doors belongs to an accomplice who can then warn the individual? If the suspect saw officers knocking on doors and evacuating people you can be damn sure that they would have guns loaded and pointed at the door.



It's just not realistic and in actuality will place significantly more people (both officers and civilians) at more risk then if they take the suspect by surprise. It greatly increases the chance that the suspect will have some sort of warning and thereby either already have weapons drawn and pointed at cops or run and place the general populace at significant risk.


I donít think they went in with intentions of killing the guy ... just wish it didnít happen I guess ... also not a fan that there was man next door armed at 8 am ... but hey ... I get there is always a risk to the public in general during raids like this ... but it really sucks to be that Ďpublic in dangerí and when you are it feels like they really didnít give a damn who or what was on the other side of that wall


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Old 01-23-2018, 05:00 PM   #24
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Jesus man....thank god you and your family were not at home during this.

Any idea what happened to the suspect?
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Old 01-23-2018, 05:09 PM   #25
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Jesus man....thank god you and your family were not at home during this.

Any idea what happened to the suspect?


Shot 7 times .. 5 to the torso


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