Kyle Lowry HOF worthy?

[Avi]

Originally Posted by Justin7

I thought it was funny as I read this thread I just turned on the game and first thing I see is Lowry missing an open layup, then rebounds and dribbles it to the midcourt and misses a bad fadeaway. Pretty much his career, a lot of volume and empty stats with accomplishments that look better on paper than how he actually plays.

I watched probably 85% of Lowry's games in the past 10 years, and that is the opposite of his game. I know people like to get all excited in the debates on here, but this is just wrong. Not aure where its coming from.

[Justin7]

Originally Posted by Avi

I watched probably 85% of Lowry's games in the past 10 years, and that is the opposite of his game. I know people like to get all excited in the debates on here, but this is just wrong. Not aure where its coming from.

The way he plays is not fun to watch and he does not pass the eye test. He has great advanced stats. He's not a flashy PG by any means and he looks better on paper than in the game. Stand by it 100%. I understand Lowry has a very big and zealous fanbase. I find him annoying and most people watching him that I know in real life do too. Your mileage may vary. That doesn't mean he didn't have a good career but more chauncey billups than Chris Paul or Allen Iverson. Not a 1st ticket guy and may get in many years later but not really "worthy" will probably get it at some point though.

[Avi]

Originally Posted by BuffiBlowout

Hahaha this thread...

To be nice to everyone and respect their opinions, I won’t quote anyone specifically but yes Kyle Lowry is a near lock Hall of Famer if he retired today (sitting at 85% probability on bbref right now + has a gold medal which doesn’t get factored into their formula)

He has the 7th most win shares this decade..

He is the ONLY constant for a team that has the second most regular season wins and 3rd most playoff wins in the past seven years (will likely move into 2nd in playoff wins this year). He was the best player on all of those teams except for one (Kawhi).

The Raptors are almost +2500 with him on the court and only +100 with him off the court since he arrived in Toronto.

He is statistically the most clutch performer in the playoffs over the past five years with 14 made buckets in the situations (next is LeBron with 11) and he’s shooting over 70% (LeBron is in the 30s if memory serves correct)

He averages 25/6/6 on almost 60% TS in playoff elimination games

The only player to defeat him in a seven game series since 2016 is LeBron James (Lowry averages 20/5/7 vs LeBron in those games)

6x all-star (should have 7... coaches voted Joe Johnson as the mast in over Kyle in 13-14 when he was averaging 14/3/3 and Kyle was at 18/5/8 with a better team record...)

He’s the best defender in NBA history for his size and then best player ever listed at 6 feet or under (Chris Paul is 6’1” and sorry Allen Iverson fans, Kyle Lowry is in an other league as far as overall talent on both ends of the floor)

Hes led the league in charges drawn And offensive fouls against over a 7 year period

He’s routinely top 10 in every hustle stats year in and year out (deflections, loose balls recovered, offensive fouls drawn, charges taken, Screen assists for PG, secondary assists, etc)

He’s an NBA champion who posted a 26/7/10/4 line in the close out game of the NBA finals

Hes the best player in the history of an entire franchise

He will likely end his career top 15 all time in assists, top 10 in made threes, and top 30 in steals.

He will end his career holding almost every single Toronto Raptors record

And there are so many more stats but I think this proves my point pretty well.... guy is a clutch player who makes winning plays against the best of the best in the biggest moments. He is elite in every aspect of the game except raw scoring where he is still very very good.

When you add everything up and factor in that he still has a few years left in him, there is almost no way He doesn’t make the Hall.

-Buffi
Blowout Cards

What he said

[Justin7]

Ai is by far the better two way player and the two players are not in the same conversation.

[thefranchise3]

He will be in the HOF. However he is already in the first-ballot thicc HOF.

[TuukkaTime]

Originally Posted by BuffiBlowout

Hahaha this thread...

To be nice to everyone and respect their opinions, I won’t quote anyone specifically but yes Kyle Lowry is a near lock Hall of Famer if he retired today (sitting at 85% probability on bbref right now + has a gold medal which doesn’t get factored into their formula)

He has the 7th most win shares this decade..

He is the ONLY constant for a team that has the second most regular season wins and 3rd most playoff wins in the past seven years (will likely move into 2nd in playoff wins this year). He was the best player on all of those teams except for one (Kawhi).

The Raptors are almost +2500 with him on the court and only +100 with him off the court since he arrived in Toronto.

He is statistically the most clutch performer in the playoffs over the past five years with 14 made buckets in the situations (next is LeBron with 11) and he’s shooting over 70% (LeBron is in the 30s if memory serves correct)

He averages 25/6/6 on almost 60% TS in playoff elimination games

The only player to defeat him in a seven game series since 2016 is LeBron James (Lowry averages 20/5/7 vs LeBron in those games)

6x all-star (should have 7... coaches voted Joe Johnson as the mast in over Kyle in 13-14 when he was averaging 14/3/3 and Kyle was at 18/5/8 with a better team record...)

He’s the best defender in NBA history for his size and then best player ever listed at 6 feet or under (Chris Paul is 6’1” and sorry Allen Iverson fans, Kyle Lowry is in an other league as far as overall talent on both ends of the floor)

Hes led the league in charges drawn And offensive fouls against over a 7 year period

He’s routinely top 10 in every hustle stats year in and year out (deflections, loose balls recovered, offensive fouls drawn, charges taken, Screen assists for PG, secondary assists, etc)

He’s an NBA champion who posted a 26/7/10/4 line in the close out game of the NBA finals

Hes the best player in the history of an entire franchise

He will likely end his career top 15 all time in assists, top 10 in made threes, and top 30 in steals.

He will end his career holding almost every single Toronto Raptors record

And there are so many more stats but I think this proves my point pretty well.... guy is a clutch player who makes winning plays against the best of the best in the biggest moments. He is elite in every aspect of the game except raw scoring where he is still very very good.

When you add everything up and factor in that he still has a few years left in him, there is almost no way He doesn’t make the Hall.

-Buffi
Blowout Cards

AI had over 2 steals per game for 9 straight years, it's not like he was complete garbage on defense. Lowry is a solid player but he isn't even in the same stratosphere as prime AI.

I agree he has a shot at the hall but that is a bananas thing to say.

[Braswell10]

Originally Posted by BuffiBlowout

Hahaha this thread...

To be nice to everyone and respect their opinions, I won’t quote anyone specifically but yes Kyle Lowry is a near lock Hall of Famer if he retired today (sitting at 85% probability on bbref right now + has a gold medal which doesn’t get factored into their formula)

He has the 7th most win shares this decade..

He is the ONLY constant for a team that has the second most regular season wins and 3rd most playoff wins in the past seven years (will likely move into 2nd in playoff wins this year). He was the best player on all of those teams except for one (Kawhi).

The Raptors are almost +2500 with him on the court and only +100 with him off the court since he arrived in Toronto.

He is statistically the most clutch performer in the playoffs over the past five years with 14 made buckets in the situations (next is LeBron with 11) and he’s shooting over 70% (LeBron is in the 30s if memory serves correct)

He averages 25/6/6 on almost 60% TS in playoff elimination games

The only player to defeat him in a seven game series since 2016 is LeBron James (Lowry averages 20/5/7 vs LeBron in those games)

6x all-star (should have 7... coaches voted Joe Johnson as the mast in over Kyle in 13-14 when he was averaging 14/3/3 and Kyle was at 18/5/8 with a better team record...)

He’s the best defender in NBA history for his size and then best player ever listed at 6 feet or under (Chris Paul is 6’1” and sorry Allen Iverson fans, Kyle Lowry is in an other league as far as overall talent on both ends of the floor)

Hes led the league in charges drawn And offensive fouls against over a 7 year period

He’s routinely top 10 in every hustle stats year in and year out (deflections, loose balls recovered, offensive fouls drawn, charges taken, Screen assists for PG, secondary assists, etc)

He’s an NBA champion who posted a 26/7/10/4 line in the close out game of the NBA finals

Hes the best player in the history of an entire franchise

He will likely end his career top 15 all time in assists, top 10 in made threes, and top 30 in steals.

He will end his career holding almost every single Toronto Raptors record

And there are so many more stats but I think this proves my point pretty well.... guy is a clutch player who makes winning plays against the best of the best in the biggest moments. He is elite in every aspect of the game except raw scoring where he is still very very good.

When you add everything up and factor in that he still has a few years left in him, there is almost no way He doesn’t make the Hall.

-Buffi
Blowout Cards

Lol. Someone is pumping Kyle Lowry

[Braswell10]

Before Kawhi came and Lebron left the east, Lowry was literally known as someone who never showed up in the playoffs and couldn’t get it done when it counted.

Funny how Kawhi carrying them to a ring somehow makes a career 14/4/6 guy a hall of famer.

[BC81]

Originally Posted by BuffiBlowout

Hahaha this thread...

To be nice to everyone and respect their opinions, I won’t quote anyone specifically but yes Kyle Lowry is a near lock Hall of Famer if he retired today (sitting at 85% probability on bbref right now + has a gold medal which doesn’t get factored into their formula)

He has the 7th most win shares this decade..

He is the ONLY constant for a team that has the second most regular season wins and 3rd most playoff wins in the past seven years (will likely move into 2nd in playoff wins this year). He was the best player on all of those teams except for one (Kawhi).

The Raptors are almost +2500 with him on the court and only +100 with him off the court since he arrived in Toronto.

He is statistically the most clutch performer in the playoffs over the past five years with 14 made buckets in the situations (next is LeBron with 11) and he’s shooting over 70% (LeBron is in the 30s if memory serves correct)

He averages 25/6/6 on almost 60% TS in playoff elimination games

The only player to defeat him in a seven game series since 2016 is LeBron James (Lowry averages 20/5/7 vs LeBron in those games)

6x all-star (should have 7... coaches voted Joe Johnson as the mast in over Kyle in 13-14 when he was averaging 14/3/3 and Kyle was at 18/5/8 with a better team record...)

He’s the best defender in NBA history for his size and then best player ever listed at 6 feet or under (Chris Paul is 6’1” and sorry Allen Iverson fans, Kyle Lowry is in an other league as far as overall talent on both ends of the floor)

Hes led the league in charges drawn And offensive fouls against over a 7 year period

He’s routinely top 10 in every hustle stats year in and year out (deflections, loose balls recovered, offensive fouls drawn, charges taken, Screen assists for PG, secondary assists, etc)

He’s an NBA champion who posted a 26/7/10/4 line in the close out game of the NBA finals

Hes the best player in the history of an entire franchise

He will likely end his career top 15 all time in assists, top 10 in made threes, and top 30 in steals.

He will end his career holding almost every single Toronto Raptors record

And there are so many more stats but I think this proves my point pretty well.... guy is a clutch player who makes winning plays against the best of the best in the biggest moments. He is elite in every aspect of the game except raw scoring where he is still very very good.

When you add everything up and factor in that he still has a few years left in him, there is almost no way He doesn’t make the Hall.

-Buffi
Blowout Cards

This is well said. Thanks for sharing.

Makes me want to go out and look for more Lowry items for my PC


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Justin7]

Originally Posted by TuukkaTime

AI had over 2 steals per game for 9 straight years, it's not like he was complete garbage on defense. Lowry is a solid player but he isn't even in the same stratosphere as prime AI.

I agree he has a shot at the hall but that is a bananas thing to say.

For sure. Here's a great video on the pound for pound GOAT- Lowry is not featured as a contender. This one does focus mostly on offense but still and what you said 1000%. AI closer to Kobe. Lowry like Chauncey Billups. lol https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jWljt9rDw90

[cowboyzqna]

I think yes. It will be just like his career. Will take some time but he will get his moments.


It's more to legacy than ppg. Lowry was the face of a franchise and did everything he could to win. Like him or not he played his heart out.


10 years on he gets in... and I think it will be cool.

[BuffiBlowout]

Originally Posted by Justin7

For sure. Here's a great video on the pound for pound GOAT- Lowry is not featured as a contender. This one does focus mostly on offense but still and what you said 1000%. AI closer to Kobe. Lowry like Chauncey Billups. lol https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jWljt9rDw90

Every meaningful stat out there shows Allen Iverson being a very inefficient, high usage player who contributes almost no positives to winning basketball games outside of individual scoring. Literally his only positive attribute is taken away by his inefficiency.

Kyle Lowry is the exact opposite. A very efficient player who contributes at an elite or near elite level of every single aspect of the game.

It's really not much of a debate despite how popular and highly regarded Iverson is.

-Buffi
Blowout Cards

[Orangejello727]

Im sure many of you posting about Lowry not having much have never really watched Raptors games. Outside of reading boxscore stats, you really have to watch the games to see how much he means to the raptors team and winning. His contributions may not fully translate from stats to how essential this guy was/is to the raps championship and their run in winning games in the regular season as well as the playoffs. He is so emotional and full of heart.

True greats are not based on sheets and numbers. They prove it on court as you watch them.

[Scottish Punk]

I think the comparison to Billups is probably good. Of course, I am biased towards "Mr. Big Shot" in that scenario. I can see Lowry making the HOF, especially if he notches a couple more all-stars. The NBA HOF isn't an inner circle kind of deal.

If I was building a team and had to choose between AI and Lowry. I would pick Lowry. Better team player and higher chance of playing winning basketball. AI would sell more tickets though.

[BuffiBlowout]

Theres millions of ways to enjoy the game so player preference really comes down to what you like. I think more like a coach then a fan which is why players like Lowry are the ones I enjoy.

If you love the individual one on one part of the game, guys like Iverson and Kyrie will be what you enjoy. It's not a bad thing. We like what we like.

But objectively speaking, the point of playing is to win the game and I don't think any rational person could sculpt a case for Iverson over Lowry in that regard. Again, not a bad thing if you a fan of Iverson, just is what it is lol

-Buffi
Blowout Cards

[Justin7]

Not in the same realm or discussion not worth responding to as the distance is like comparing Kobe to Alex Caruso.

[Braswell10]

I don’t understand some of these posts. So Kyle Lowry is a hall of famer because he gave his all and played with emotion?? I can name hundreds of players that do that and don’t belong in the hall of fame.

He’s a hall of famer because he was the face of the franchise? Of course he will be the face of the franchise. Everyone surrounding him has only been on the the team for 2 or 3 years.

I watched plenty of Raptors games, especially playoffs. I remember Lebron absolutely owning them, and I remember they got swept by the Wizards in the 1st round!

He has never been the best player on his team. It used to be Derozen, then it was Kawhi, and now it is Siakam.

[spurs50fan]

It makes for a great feel good story but not quite there

And I hate the # of All-Star used in any context because that weekend excludes players that absolutely deserve to be there. You can be in due to popularity, in a position-deficient conference, or because of injury.

[Ober12]

I like Lowry, but saying that a one-time 3rd team All-NBA player is incomparably better than a 7x All-NBA (3 1st team, 3 2nd, 1 3rd), MVP, multiple time steals and scoring leader is a biiit much

[gomiamigo]

Originally Posted by BuffiBlowout

Every meaningful stat out there ...

I think Lowry gets in, but nobody but you thinks Lowry is a better offensive player than AI. Much less 'in another league' than Iverson which is just troll-tastic.

He is better on defense.

I'm a Lowry fan.

[gomiamigo]

Originally Posted by Ober12

I like Lowry, but saying that a one-time 3rd team All-NBA player is incomparably better than a 7x All-NBA (3 1st team, 3 2nd, 1 3rd), MVP, multiple time steals and scoring leader is a biiit much

Yeah, Iverson only averaged 31 ppg in the playoffs with the 76ers. MJ averaged 33 ppg for the Bulls. Iverson 2nd alltime in playoff scoring average above Jerry West.

AI 34th in VORP, Lowry down at 63rd. Not close.

The guys above/below AI on that list are Nash below and Curry above. 2 guys with multiple MVPs.

Lowry is just above Mark Jackson and Jason Terry.


Advanced stats ftw. 'Every meaningful stat....' LMAO.

[cardrcomeback]

Someone mentioned it but Chauncey Billups is a great comparison. Might get in one day.

[gomiamigo]

I think Billups and Lowry should both get in. Lowry has the gold medal and a Final Four appearance also.

[BuffiBlowout]

Originally Posted by gomiamigo

I think Lowry gets in, but nobody but you thinks Lowry is a better offensive player than AI. Much less 'in another league' than Iverson which is just troll-tastic.

He is better on defense.

I'm a Lowry fan.

Allen Iverson's career ORTG is 105. Kyle Lowry's is 115. That pretty much sums up the type of player Allen Iverson is.

It not even close.

-Buffi
Blowout Cards

[BuffiBlowout]

Originally Posted by gomiamigo

Yeah, Iverson only averaged 31 ppg in the playoffs with the 76ers. MJ averaged 33 ppg for the Bulls. Iverson 2nd alltime in playoff scoring average above Jerry West.

AI 34th in VORP, Lowry down at 63rd. Not close.

The guys above/below AI on that list are Nash below and Curry above. 2 guys with multiple MVPs.

Lowry is just above Mark Jackson and Jason Terry.


Advanced stats ftw. 'Every meaningful stat....' LMAO.

Nevermind.... I don't want to argue with you guys. You can enjoy Iverson, I'll enjoy Lowry and his championship.

-Buffi
Blowout Cards