2020 Politics Thread - Enter At Your Own Risk - RULES IN OP

[rman112]

Originally Posted by Mac302

No I mean supposedly they used the tazer when they were on the other side of the vehicle....when he was resisting.

Thing that pisses me off is this department still did not have body cams....that is just stupid at this point....every department should be mandated to have body cams. If they had this story would probably be a lot more clear then what we are seeing from that crappy cell phone video.

Sent from my SM-N975U using Tapatalk

Gotcha.

[RedSoxFan28]

Originally Posted by pingbling23

So if he had a knife (why they didn’t go back to hands on) and if he said he was getting a gun from the car, what is wrong with the officers actions?

Shooting him 7 times in the back is the only available action?

[dodgerfanjohn]

Originally Posted by RedSoxFan28

You're right, his past justifies him getting shot in the back in an unrelated event

Where did I say that?

[Onions]

Originally Posted by SirTommyWinAlot

They had their guns drawn on him so they must have deemed him a threat before he reached the drivers side door, otherwise, if he was just being difficult and noncompliant, they could have physically restrained him before he reached the door. The last thing they want is a guy pulling a rifle out of the car and being immediately outgunned. That is horrifying.

I empthatize with people in LE. They have a difficult job and are always second guessed on split second decisions. Are there bad apples? Sure but there are bad apples in every profession. Having said that, I think training and better selection criteria for cops are in order.

I don't disagree for the most part, but it will fix nothing.

There will still be officer involved shootings and deaths. These are humans in very volatile situations. Mistakes will inevitably be made, and even the officer was in the right, these incidents get judged by the uninformed mob on social media and MSM minutes after they happen.

The rioters, looters, and arsonists do not care about right and wrong, they don't care what the truth is. This is why they will continue to put themselves in situations where they may be shot. If they wish to be shot less, they need to learn how to listen and follow very basic instructions. They could also consider not breaking the law. They will have far less interactions with officers if they choose to follow very simple laws.

This goes for all criminals of every color. Oddly enough, we only hear/see these events when they check off enough boxes to support a narrative that is being rammed down our throats.

[Corporal Lance]

Originally Posted by RedSoxFan28

Shooting him 7 times in the back is the only available action?

I believe there has been a lot of information presented in this thread.

What would YOU do? I'm a white guy, not a cop, and don't live anywhere near Kenosha Wisconsin. And I not typically pro-law enforcement. After they engaged him, knew his violent history, tased him, and then some? It seems pretty cut and dried, but why not burn down a small part of Wisconsin?

Would you have called for a community organizer?

[pingbling23]

Originally Posted by SirTommyWinAlot

No, i'm pro police and against defunding. The best middle ground is better training and officer selection requirements which means more funding but you never hear the left propose that. They just immediately go for something radical and disastrous.

I wasn’t implying you were against police, sorry about that. I’ve seen a lot of the better training talk lately and it’s kind of funny. Ofcourse all agencies are different but we all know about the academy they go through. A lot have also had training in the military, in corrections and years of experience working in the jail before going to the road, a long training program when they go to patrol, at least a week of training every year, and honestly every call they go on is training and a learning lesson. Everything they do is under scrutiny be it from the public, their peers and supervisors, and in court. New training is implemented all the time. But it’s just easy for people to say they need better training or to hire better officers when they know little about the subject, do you know what I mean?

[techtre2003]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/ushome/index.html

"Heavily armed civilians take to the streets of Kenosha to protect locals businesses as city braces for a third night of rioting, arson and looting in wake of cops shooting unarmed black father Jacob Blake in the back"


I don't think this is going to end well for anybody. I'm praying cooler heads can prevail tonight.

[discostu]

For what it's worth, Kenosha had (has) a great place to eat just off 94 called the Brat Stop. Burned down countless times without protesting....

[techtre2003]

Looks like Blake is going to live but is paralyzed.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-shooting.html

[Onions]

Originally Posted by RedSoxFan28

Yes, he shouldve listened. That still doesnt justify the cops actions. I (also) believe in play stupid games, win stupid prizes, however the prize isnt death....

Depends on just how stupid the game is. Sometimes the prize is actually death. People plunge to their deaths every year taking selfies at the Grand Canyon. There are very stupid people among us.

I don't expect an officer to be shot at first in order to be able to take down a violent criminal who was tased already, not listening to their requests and reaching for something in the front seat of his car. That criminal could have chosen to stay un-shot quite easily.

[SirTommyWinAlot]

Originally Posted by pingbling23

I wasn’t implying you were against police, sorry about that. I’ve seen a lot of the better training talk lately and it’s kind of funny. Ofcourse all agencies are different but we all know about the academy they go through. A lot have also had training in the military, in corrections and years of experience working in the jail before going to the road, a long training program when they go to patrol, at least a week of training every year, and honestly every call they go on is training and a learning lesson. Everything they do is under scrutiny be it from the public, their peers and supervisors, and in court. New training is implemented all the time. But it’s just easy for people to say they need better training or to hire better officers when they know little about the subject, do you know what I mean?

well the training and officer selection goes hand in hand. I'm talking about hiring college graduates. Generally, higher educated cops take to training better than lesser educated cops. Take that guy who pushed the raptors president last year after they won the championship. Those are the types you want to weed out. That was a terrible escalation of use of force. Then he lies about what happened and files a bogus law suit. No awareness or reasoning whatsoever.

[TheFrenzy]

Anyone else remember just a few years ago when if a person told you that last night they watched a video of someone dying on one of those shady sites like LiveLeak—you'd take a step back and make sure you knew where the exits were?

Now it's totally normal watch a man slowly die while being choked for 8 minutes and then talk about it publicly.

Just a quick reminder that we all are engaging in things that are changing us. It's unavoidable, but it's something to be aware of.

[SirTommyWinAlot]

Originally Posted by Onions

I don't disagree for the most part, but it will fix nothing.

There will still be officer involved shootings and deaths. These are humans in very volatile situations. Mistakes will inevitably be made, and even the officer was in the right, these incidents get judged by the uninformed mob on social media and MSM minutes after they happen.

The rioters, looters, and arsonists do not care about right and wrong, they don't care what the truth is. This is why they will continue to put themselves in situations where they may be shot. If they wish to be shot less, they need to learn how to listen and follow very basic instructions. They could also consider not breaking the law. They will have far less interactions with officers if they choose to follow very simple laws.

This goes for all criminals of every color. Oddly enough, we only hear/see these events when they check off enough boxes to support a narrative that is being rammed down our throats.

This is a byproduct of having most cops wearing body cams. Everybody can second guess their actions. Who didn't see this coming?

[pingbling23]

Originally Posted by SirTommyWinAlot

well the training and officer selection goes hand in hand. I'm talking about hiring college graduates. Generally, higher educated cops take to training better than lesser educated cops. Take that guy who pushed the raptors president last year after they won the championship. Those are the types you want to weed out. That was a terrible escalation of use of force. Then he lies about what happened and files a bogus law suit. No awareness or reasoning whatsoever.

there’s not a line waiting to get into law enforcement like there was 10-20 years ago. It would be great to require a degree but it’s not realistic and really who is going to pay for a degree to come out and be under paid and under appreciated. I also disagree that someone with more schooling takes to training better. I don’t know the ins and outs of the raptors ordeal so won’t comment on that as I don’t have the time right now to research it.

[Onions]

Originally Posted by SirTommyWinAlot

This is a byproduct of having most cops wearing body cams. Everybody can second guess their actions. Who didn't see this coming?

It's like instant replay in sports. We can see what happened in slow motion, 100 times and second guess a humans reaction to it in real time with no stress or pressure on the viewer.

No one knew how "bad" umpires and referees were until we got the video immediately after the play to draw our own conclusions safely from our sofas.

[TheFrenzy]

Originally Posted by RedSoxFan28

3 of them tried restraining him and they couldn't?

I used to work at residential treatment facilities for abused adolescents.

I once responded to an all-call that required seven fully grown adults to (safely) restrain a 12 year old girl having an episode.

1 - Right leg

2 - Left leg

3 - A female staff laying across her midsection (not applying bodyweight, but bracing her so she couldn't thrash or twist)

4 - Right arm

5 - Left arm

6 & 7 - Bracing her head so she couldn't slam it backwards into the floor or bite her own shoulders

If we're talking about restraining someone who is determined to harm themselves or others, you need every body you can get. And if that person is hopped up on drugs, endorphins, adrenaline, etc. then it almost becomes irrelevant.

[I was one of the "brace the head" staff and it was also the first time I took saliva to the face while working there.]

[TheFrenzy]

And to anyone who might say "it's ridiculous that it would ever take more than one fully grown adult to restrain a 12-year old girl"—you either don't know what you're talking about or you are intentionally ignoring the word "safely".

You can always just knock someone the F out or taze them into a coma, but that's exactly what we're trying to avoid. If the officers were trying to restrain Blake as non-violently as possible and he was absolutely determined to resist then it should be zero surprise to anyone that he got away and back on his feet.

[SirTommyWinAlot]

Originally Posted by Onions

It's like instant replay in sports. We can see what happened in slow motion, 100 times and second guess a humans reaction to it in real time with no stress or pressure on the viewer.

No one knew how "bad" umpires and referees were until we got the video immediately after the play to draw our own conclusions safely from our sofas.

Exactly! I think the end result here is that you're only going to have black cops patrol predominately black communities. So if something happens, hey, you can't bring racism into it.

[Onions]

Originally Posted by pingbling23

there’s not a line waiting to get into law enforcement like there was 10-20 years ago. It would be great to require a degree but it’s not realistic and really who is going to pay for a degree to come out and be under paid and under appreciated. I also disagree that someone with more schooling takes to training better. I don’t know the ins and outs of the raptors ordeal so won’t comment on that as I don’t have the time right now to research it.

The byproduct of all of this anti-police sentiment will be what makes this cycle even more difficult to fix. Not many people want to do a job where the crazies in society have turned them into murderers and racists. We will get WORSE cops as a result of this. The very people who think they are making it better are actually making it far worse.

[pingbling23]

Originally Posted by Onions

The byproduct of all of this anti-police sentiment will be what makes this cycle even more difficult to fix. Not many people want to do a job where the crazies in society have turned them into murderers and racists. We will get WORSE cops as a result of this. The very people who think they are making it better are actually making it far worse.

I agree. We will always have the people that were born for it and want to make a positive difference in their community but we will miss out on the people that would be great officers but choose a different path. We have also seen across the country higher then normal officers leaving the profession. This is a very dangerous game that is being played.

[preakness]

Originally Posted by techtre2003

Looks like Blake is going to live but is paralyzed.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...-shooting.html

Another "hero" and outstanding citizen who will get mural painted across USA

Also, why 7 shots instead of a single bullet?
Comes down to training. You don't shoot once like in the movies

[preakness]

Originally Posted by TheFrenzy

And to anyone who might say "it's ridiculous that it would ever take more than one fully grown adult to restrain a 12-year old girl"—you either don't know what you're talking about or you are intentionally ignoring the word "safely".

You can always just knock someone the F out or taze them into a coma, but that's exactly what we're trying to avoid. If the officers were trying to restrain Blake as non-violently as possible and he was absolutely determined to resist then it should be zero surprise to anyone that he got away and back on his feet.

Working special ed since 2005
Know exactly what you talking about regarding the need of half dozen to control one person

[pingbling23]

Originally Posted by preakness

Another "hero" and outstanding citizen who will get mural painted across USA

Also, why 7 shots instead of a single bullet?
Comes down to training. You don't shoot once like in the movies

They’ve raised 1.2 million on go fund me so far for Blake. 14.7 million for George Floyd. Take a minute to see what go fund mes bring in for officers that are killed in the line of duty.

[ballhawkdawk]

Jesus Christ... they’re discussing the shooting on the NBA broadcast. No más.... por favor. If I want to hear a half-baked discussion about it I’m sure it’s on all of the dozen news channels that are on cable.

[rhigh2390]

Originally Posted by ballhawkdawk

Jesus Christ... they’re discussing the shooting on the NBA broadcast. No más.... por favor. If I want to hear a half-baked discussion about it I’m sure it’s on all of the dozen news channels that are on cable.

Like I said earlier, I'm done with pro sports. I've seen enough looting and rioting with no statements from anyone asking for it to stop for me to continue watching and not feel like I'm supporting it.