Will Kevin Durant rookies ever approach Lebron rookies?

[exitmusicblue]

Come back to this thread in 4-5 years. The question then will be, can LeBron's rookies ever approach their past peaks and overtake KD's?

[imbluestreak23]

I dislike Shannon Sharpe but he made a great point about this being the first time KD performed like this in that it was the first time he was asked to carry this type of burden. KD answered the call in an epic all time way.

Also, another point made was that teams should have been asking KD to do this sooner. Hard to be point forward when Westbrook is on your team. Point KD leading the offense was a sight to behold.

More of this this postseason and bye bye "but he went to a 73-9 team" nonsense.

[gomiamigo]

Not the first time he's dragged his team to victory, although this was his best performance:
Durant also put up 34/11 to eliminate the Spurs.
33/8 eliminate Memphis G7
39/16/5 to eliminate LAC g6
33/7 eliminate Dallas
37/9 eliminate Spurs

2017 Finals: 38, 31, 33, 35, 39 in eliminating CLE

34-5-5 G7 v Houston

2018 Finals: 26/9, 26/9, 43/13 and 20/12 in a blowout G4 finish.

[sebreg]

Originally Posted by imbluestreak23

I dislike Shannon Sharpe but he made a great point about this being the first time KD performed like this in that it was the first time he was asked to carry this type of burden. KD answered the call in an epic all time way.

Also, another point made was that teams should have been asking KD to do this sooner. Hard to be point forward when Westbrook is on your team. Point KD leading the offense was a sight to behold.

More of this this postseason and bye bye "but he went to a 73-9 team" nonsense.

Yeah, to me it would be kind of cool if Durant goes on an epic 2-3 year run here where he is able to rewrite the narrative.

[pcptrade]

Originally Posted by exitmusicblue

Come back to this thread in 4-5 years. The question then will be, can LeBron's rookies ever approach their past peaks and overtake KD's?

Possible but it could also pan out like one of your past predictions

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1295621

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1216828

[Zedlaw]

I'm sure there are better examples and probably even an NBA example. But this question makes me think of Peyton Manning's legacy. In 2010 and maybe even in 2013 Manning was going to go down as the greatest quarterback ever. Brady had a following, their key cards were fairly similar in price. But Manning aged and injuries got worse and worse, he still had a long career and was a Pro Bowler at 39. But what does a 39 year old Brady do after Manning retires? Wins three super bowls and a league MVP and he's the one rewriting record books and still playing great at age 43.

In those terms, these two guys have a lot of story left. Will Durant go Brady's path and win 4 championships and 2 MVPs after his current age 32? Who is going to start aging first between him and Lebron. There's no guarantee either will keep this level up but there's also no guarantee they wont, at least for the next handful of years.

[sebreg]

Originally Posted by Zedlaw

I'm sure there are better examples and probably even an NBA example. But this question makes me think of Peyton Manning's legacy. In 2010 and maybe even in 2013 Manning was going to go down as the greatest quarterback ever. Brady had a following, their key cards were fairly similar in price. But Manning aged and injuries got worse and worse, he still had a long career and was a Pro Bowler at 39. But what does a 39 year old Brady do after Manning retires? Wins three super bowls and a league MVP and he's the one rewriting record books and still playing great at age 43.

In those terms, these two guys have a lot of story left. Will Durant go Brady's path and win 4 championships and 2 MVPs after his current age 32? Who is going to start aging first between him and Lebron. There's no guarantee either will keep this level up but there's also no guarantee they wont, at least for the next handful of years.

Brady is an anomaly of anomalies, so far off the end of the bell curve in terms of late-career greatness/achievements it's frankly unbelievable. Personally, love to see Bron (whatever he has left) and also Durant achieve similar late-career Brady-level success but man oh man is that beyond rare.

[Zedlaw]

Originally Posted by sebreg

Brady is an anomaly of anomalies, so far off the end of the bell curve in terms of late-career greatness/achievements it's frankly unbelievable. Personally, love to see Bron (whatever he has left) and also Durant achieve similar late-career Brady-level success but man oh man is that beyond rare.

What happens if one of these guys finds their Magic Johnson and wins a handful of late career championships as a top 10 to top 20 NBA player? Durant is currently Kareem's age during Magic's rookie year. Both of these guys love to play (Durant and Lebron) so I think we have more chapters to come for this rivalry. Forum rivalry at least.

[sebreg]

Originally Posted by Zedlaw

What happens if one of these guys finds their Magic Johnson and wins a handful of late career championships as a top 10 to top 20 NBA player? Durant is currently Kareem's age during Magic's rookie year. Both of these guys love to play (Durant and Lebron) so I think we have more chapters to come for this rivalry. Forum rivalry at least.

I hope so, that would be fun as hell. I am admittedly a Lebron guy, but think it would be great if Durant kept racking up some big accomplishments, adds more spice to the arguments

[rogueriver]

UM No.....Not a chance, and I personally dont collect Lebron.

[gomiamigo]

Originally Posted by Zedlaw

Who is going to start aging first between him and Lebron. There's no guarantee either will keep this level up but there's also no guarantee they wont, at least for the next handful of years.

I'm going to guarantee that Lebron starts 'aging' first given his mileage and age difference, and that he won't keep up his past level of play over the next handful of years. He's played 1570 games.

Lebron's gonna be 37 this year. He only made it through 45 games. Age 31-33 he played 232 games plus playoffs. Last 3 years it's 167 with much fewer playoff games.

The last two seasons have been his lowest scoring since his rookie year at 18. His 2pt% and FT% are down the past two years from previously. His rebounding is down, his blocks and steals are down.

Father Time is still undefeated.


Durant, previously you could say, well, maybe he won't return from an Achilles tear or won't be good anymore. That question has been permanently answered, he's back and 100% now. He plays a less physical brand of hoops. He can play off-ball with Harden and Kyrie anytime he wants.

He's played 1033 games or ~7 fewer seasons in total. He's 4 years younger. No wear and tear last year while rehabbing. He scored right on his career avg this season. His 2pt and 3pt% are better his FT was dead on average as was his rebs, and his assists were up. Even his blocks were up.

His playoff scoring is up 10% above average each of first two rounds. He's gotten better.

[titletowncards]

Originally Posted by GeechQuest

No……..

Best answer so far.

[BabaORiley]

Originally Posted by hermanotarjeta

I've mentioned before, the exquisite Lebron card is expensive because it is one of the most iconic basketball cards of all time - the highest end rookie from the highest end upper deck product ever.

That premiere set exquisite factor itself will keep it the most expensive basketball card, ever, no matter how many more rings durant gets, despite Lebron being on it.

However, I can see durant chrome rookies passing up lebron chrome rookies in the future if KD passes lebron in career rings, simply because neither card is from an iconic set. The 1996-97 chrome kobe is the most iconic chrome card ever.

2007 UD Black had some pretty sick KDs and was pretty high end in its own right. Not in the same league as LBJ Exquisite but good luck finding the UD Black in even remotely good condition.

[Giroux]

Originally Posted by chetb

It’s not purely about stats or rings. LeBron is bigger than basketball in a way that KD isn’t. He’s a pop culture icon. The dude was on the cover of Sports Illustrated with the headline “the chosen one” when he was in high school, and then managed to actually live up to that insane amount of hype. There’s just no surpassing that.

Maybe KD can beat his stats (and that’s a big maybe IMO), but LeBron’s personal brand > KD’s brand forever.

It's mostly about basketball. Prime LeBron >>> Prime KD

LeBron has the brand because he's a true generational player in the GOAT convo. KD is great but no one's comparing him to MJ.

Not like LBJ has a great personality.

[eastbayak]

Hell no

[supbro]

No LeBron has been the face of the NBA since he arrived. He brought a championship to Cleveland down 3-1 to the greatest regular season team ever. And he's got a larger and way more ardent fanbase than KD has or ever will have.

[chetb]

Originally Posted by Giroux

It's mostly about basketball. Prime LeBron >>> Prime KD

LeBron has the brand because he's a true generational player in the GOAT convo. KD is great but no one's comparing him to MJ.

Not like LBJ has a great personality.

For sure, I agree … without the basketball greatness, there is no brand.

I’m just saying hypothetically, even if the basketball achievements became magically exactly equal somehow, so that part of the equation became a wash, then LeBron would still be on top because of branding advantages. I work for the agency that does Nike’s advertising (and by extension a lot of work for LeBron), and the amount of brand equity he has built up over two decades is immeasurable.

(And fwiw a lot of people do like him even personality wise, believe it or not! And things like starting a school, being a leading voice among athletes for social justice, his forays into entertainment … whether one is a fan or not of these things personally, they all add to his legacy beyond basketball.)

[dcarado]

“Recency bias is a cognitive bias that favors recent events over historic ones.”

This should not even be a discussion, I don’t care how many rings he wins. And I can’t stand Lebron.

[rats60]

Originally Posted by Giroux

It's mostly about basketball. Prime LeBron >>> Prime KD

LeBron has the brand because he's a true generational player in the GOAT convo. KD is great but no one's comparing him to MJ.

Not like LBJ has a great personality.

No intelligent person should ever be comparing LeBron to Jordan either.

[ExpFacilitators]

Originally Posted by BabaORiley

2007 UD Black had some pretty sick KDs and was pretty high end in its own right. Not in the same league as LBJ Exquisite but good luck finding the UD Black in even remotely good condition.

I have a UD black gold ink auto /15.....that is ruined by being a dual with Vince young.

[sebreg]

Originally Posted by chetb

For sure, I agree … without the basketball greatness, there is no brand.

I’m just saying hypothetically, even if the basketball achievements became magically exactly equal somehow, so that part of the equation became a wash, then LeBron would still be on top because of branding advantages. I work for the agency that does Nike’s advertising (and by extension a lot of work for LeBron), and the amount of brand equity he has built up over two decades is immeasurable.

(And fwiw a lot of people do like him even personality wise, believe it or not! And things like starting a school, being a leading voice among athletes for social justice, his forays into entertainment … whether one is a fan or not of these things personally, they all add to his legacy beyond basketball.)

Yes, 100% on this. Lebron is working with almost 20yrs of branding advantages over Durant. So like you say, if Durant somehow achieved enough successes to equal Lebron in achievements, the advantages branding-wise are still so strong for Lebron that he will maintain card/popularity premiums over Durant.

Hehe, and yes on the last paragraph. Lebron is not always perfect in his messaging (the cop tweet!), but there are a significant amount of people for whom his social justice work resonates. Kareem Abdul Jabbar was also very outspoken and often speaks out about his respect for Lebron's social justice work and outspokenness (I believe he points this out to contrast with MJ's approach). For me, none of this stuff really bothers me because I feel athletes can speak out however they wish, I don't have to listen or consume their social media if I don't want to. I like the idea of free speech, whether it aligns with my thoughts or not. Some people I find just like to whine and complain about things all the time, and frankly, seem rather easily triggered by people who don't think like themselves.

[pcptrade]

I picked up few KD RC's recently for an experiment (KD vs Lebron prices over the next 5 years). I have a feeling Bucks will win the next game and KD's prices will take another hit. How does it affect KD's legacy if Nets lose. What will be the narrative if it happens? Will it be that he can't win without Kyrie and Harden. If Nets win next year, will the narrative be that he won because of Kyrie and Harden?

[k13]

They'll be going down after they lose game 7.

[sebreg]

Originally Posted by pcptrade

I picked up few KD RC's recently for an experiment (KD vs Lebron prices over the next 5 years). I have a feeling Bucks will win the next game and KD's prices will take another hit. How does it affect KD's legacy if Nets lose. What will be the narrative if it happens? Will it be that he can't win without Kyrie and Harden. If Nets win next year, will the narrative be that he won because of Kyrie and Harden?

Def hard to predict. Short term his prices may take a bit of a hit if they lose. Imo that means there would be more value in picking his stuff up, because the next 1-2 years are still a prime opportunity for him to win more chips. If they do in fact win, even with a stacked team, he will still get some credit especially if he were to win something like FMVP. If we zoom out, who are the all-time GREAT players of the 10s (and bleeding into are 20s)? For me: Lebron, Curry, Durant. So at the end of the day, he will still have a titanic legacy but a few more chips would still do wonders.

[imbluestreak23]

Originally Posted by pcptrade

I picked up few KD RC's recently for an experiment (KD vs Lebron prices over the next 5 years). I have a feeling Bucks will win the next game and KD's prices will take another hit. How does it affect KD's legacy if Nets lose. What will be the narrative if it happens? Will it be that he can't win without Kyrie and Harden. If Nets win next year, will the narrative be that he won because of Kyrie and Harden?

What cards did you buy bro?

To answer, catastrophic. Hope you didn’t leverage the farm