First Buzz: 2021 Topps Pro Debut baseball cards

[CanadianKid]

Anyone have a coupon code?

[BabaORiley]

Well, there have definitely been some QC issues with this product...

The backs of the '91 Throwback Draft Pick cards often have white on the back as if they were miscut (and vice versa with the base having red). The fronts often have the very feint edge of the diagonal blue border boxes from the base.

Here:


Another:


And this is NOT a rare issue with my cards after 3 Hobby and 3 Jumbo boxes. Probably somewhere around 33-40% of paper cards have some noticeable red/white that shouldn't be there.

Then we've got the "Pro Debut Logo" or "no Pro Debut logo" dilemma and many inconsistencies. For those not familiar with Pro Debut, the general rule is that if this is a player's first Topps card (Bowman not included), you get the Pro Debut logo.

An example:
Andre Lipcius base does NOT have the Pro Debut Logo (though it should as he had a Bowman auto but no Topps card). However... His base auto does have the Pro Debut logo, as it should, which makes everything fine. Except... His Orange Chrome refractor doesn't have the Pro Debut logo either.

Another:
James Beard base and parallels have no Pro Debut logo. Again, I believe they should. The Autos, however, do have the Pro Debut logo.

There are a ton of these discrepancies. I'll leave it to someone else to do the conclusive work on this but there were quite a few and they weren't all "base - no logo", "auto - logo".

Finally...

This.


See it? They're all printed on cards with the white blurry area for autos and with "Topps Certified Autograph Issue" on them. The reverse also has the bolded auto verbiage from the auto'd '64 throwbacks. Long story short, these sure do look like cards that were intended to be signed (or stickered) but weren't.

I can't tell you how excited/let down I was at pulling the Vlad Sr. My immediate thought was to send it in to Topps and have them return a signed Vlad Sr. '64 throwback. And then the next pack had the Mauer and the next the Griffey.

Turns out, only Mauer actually signed for this set unless Cardboard Connection has the checklist wrong. Any of these 3 autos would have absolutely MADE the box for me - Vlad Sr. is one of my favorite players ever, Junior is up there as well and the last MLB game I went to was a Cubs-Twins game on a scorching Wrigley day. Mauer went yard as I was telling my daughter what an amazing hitter he was.

Oh well... Still fun curiosities and we'll see if more turn up to warrant legit "error"/"variation" status.

But the other QC issues are bothersome. If you're buying singles online, be sure to check the card's reverse and make sure they're clean.

[BaseballKing]

One of my favourite products - until they split it into hobby and jumbo and chromed it.

Pro Debut and Heritage Minor League are both underappreciated( and undervalued) products imo. In short: they are both awesome.

Heritage minor for the win due to oncard autos. Stickers begone.....!

[oldgoldy97]

Originally Posted by BabaORiley

Well, there have definitely been some QC issues with this product...

The backs of the '91 Throwback Draft Pick cards often have white on the back as if they were miscut (and vice versa with the base having red). The fronts often have the very feint edge of the diagonal blue border boxes from the base.

Here:


Another:


And this is NOT a rare issue with my cards after 3 Hobby and 3 Jumbo boxes. Probably somewhere around 33-40% of paper cards have some noticeable red/white that shouldn't be there.

Then we've got the "Pro Debut Logo" or "no Pro Debut logo" dilemma and many inconsistencies. For those not familiar with Pro Debut, the general rule is that if this is a player's first Topps card (Bowman not included), you get the Pro Debut logo.

An example:
Andre Lipcius base does NOT have the Pro Debut Logo (though it should as he had a Bowman auto but no Topps card). However... His base auto does have the Pro Debut logo, as it should, which makes everything fine. Except... His Orange Chrome refractor doesn't have the Pro Debut logo either.

Another:
James Beard base and parallels have no Pro Debut logo. Again, I believe they should. The Autos, however, do have the Pro Debut logo.

There are a ton of these discrepancies. I'll leave it to someone else to do the conclusive work on this but there were quite a few and they weren't all "base - no logo", "auto - logo".

Finally...

This.


See it? They're all printed on cards with the white blurry area for autos and with "Topps Certified Autograph Issue" on them. The reverse also has the bolded auto verbiage from the auto'd '64 throwbacks. Long story short, these sure do look like cards that were intended to be signed (or stickered) but weren't.

I can't tell you how excited/let down I was at pulling the Vlad Sr. My immediate thought was to send it in to Topps and have them return a signed Vlad Sr. '64 throwback. And then the next pack had the Mauer and the next the Griffey.

Turns out, only Mauer actually signed for this set unless Cardboard Connection has the checklist wrong. Any of these 3 autos would have absolutely MADE the box for me - Vlad Sr. is one of my favorite players ever, Junior is up there as well and the last MLB game I went to was a Cubs-Twins game on a scorching Wrigley day. Mauer went yard as I was telling my daughter what an amazing hitter he was.

Oh well... Still fun curiosities and we'll see if more turn up to warrant legit "error"/"variation" status.

But the other QC issues are bothersome. If you're buying singles online, be sure to check the card's reverse and make sure they're clean.

Mine have the same back miscut.

And I don’t even want to post my J-Rod auto with a big smear right through the middle of it

Horrible QC.

[BabaORiley]

Originally Posted by oldgoldy97

Mine have the same back miscut.

And I don’t even want to post my J-Rod auto with a big smear right through the middle of it

Horrible QC.

Well, if that miscut back thing is indeed a bug among the entire print run, these just became seriously tough to GEM, should any of the prospects prove worth getting graded in the years to come.

Sorry for your J-Rod smeared auto. That's unacceptable for a 6th round pitcher auto, but to have a top-10 prospect's smeared auto in circulation really is poor QC.

And I have no idea what to make of getting "Certified Autograph Issue" cards of guys who don't even have autos in the set. Waiting to see how many of those pop up to see how prevalent an issue THAT is.

I've also noticed the collation seems to be way worse than previous years but I'm actually ok with that. Specific boxes are pretty well collated but out of 6 boxes (3 Hobby, 3 Jumbo) I think I only have 1 complete set. I have 6 of several guys (pretty sure I've gotten a Witt in every box, same for Blaze and Pete Crow-Armstrong. But only 1,2 of a few guys.

[lamiwe21]

Those unsigned cards will be prime candidates for forgeries. It will be too tempting for dishonest people.

This set is a good example of just overthinking a product. This was a great set between 2010~2013. I understand what they wanted to do with inserting chrome cards but if you wanted to give people more value with a price increase you could have just put 4 autographs in the box. This will be a Black Friday pick up for me now.

[BabaORiley]

Originally Posted by lamiwe21

Those unsigned cards will be prime candidates for forgeries. It will be too tempting for dishonest people.

This set is a good example of just overthinking a product. This was a great set between 2010~2013. I understand what they wanted to do with inserting chrome cards but if you wanted to give people more value with a price increase you could have just put 4 autographs in the box. This will be a Black Friday pick up for me now.

Well, Griffey and Vlad Sr. didn't sign so those should be easy to spot. None of the three of these have serial numbering on back so that should also help though if someone is crappy enough to attempt a forged signature, I suppose serial numbering wouldn't be beneath them.

But yeah, on these 1964 autos, I think it's in folks' best interest to check the scans, front and reverse, even more carefully than usual.

[Whodatdog]

Quality control this year for topps is just off. Got my 2 boxes on the way , so will see what happens. Sad thing is I think this will keep happening more with topps losing their license and their people probably not caring.

[airforce21one]

Originally Posted by Whodatdog

Quality control this year for topps is just off. Got my 2 boxes on the way , so will see what happens. Sad thing is I think this will keep happening more with topps losing their license and their people probably not caring.

If you're Topps at this point, why invest in quality control at all?

[OC22]

Pro Debut QC has been iffy for the past several years. A lot of the Chromes last year were diamond cut and there have been other issues over the past few years. I suspect it's the tradeoff for getting more guys to sign for the set while keeping cost low, but who knows?

[jdhaugh11]

Jumbo looks to have a case print run of 1,104, which is just slightly up from last year of 1,071.

This is based on the Chrome Superfractor odds, since it is the best to use.

An average case should yield you either a Red Refractor /5 or a Superfractor 1/1 based on the odds.

[ty5oke]

Does anyone else still have their orders pending from Topps.com? I went with 1-2 day shipping but didn't realize it would take days to process.

[k13]

My LCS is getting some tomorrow at an ok price.
Which is the better break hobby or jumbo?

Seems fun at this price.

[Giantrobot]

Originally Posted by k13

My LCS is getting some tomorrow at an ok price.
Which is the better break hobby or jumbo?

Seems fun at this price.

Jumbo, easily…see my post comparing my two.

[oldgoldy97]

Originally Posted by k13

My LCS is getting some tomorrow at an ok price.
Which is the better break hobby or jumbo?

Seems fun at this price.

I’d go jumbo. Too many bumpkin autos which is the main draw of hobby. You get a few numbered chromes per jumbo box that make up for one less auto.

[bd3d86]

Nevermind....doh!

[Stech36]

Anyone open a hobby case? How was collation? Did you get an even number of each card?

[smanzari]

Originally Posted by k13

My LCS is getting some tomorrow at an ok price.
Which is the better break hobby or jumbo?

Seems fun at this price.

Depends on the Price IMO - Jumbo/Chromes are cool but not worth a significant mark-up (Jumbos were $185 here and Hobby were $60; no brainer to rock Hobby in that case)

[Stech36]

Originally Posted by oldgoldy97

I’d go jumbo. Too many bumpkin autos which is the main draw of hobby. You get a few numbered chromes per jumbo box that make up for one less auto.

If they were the same price,

Are those chromes worth $75 and one fewer autograph?

[beauspencer]

Anyone open a hobby case? How was collation? Did you get an even number of each card?

I'm in the process of opening my case. Only 4 boxes ripped since it arrived on Wednesday (huge props to Blowout. Ordered Monday and they had it shipped out that night so it arrived on release day!). Will report back once I finish this weekend.

[bd3d86]

Originally Posted by Stech36

Anyone open a hobby case? How was collation? Did you get an even number of each card?

I opened a hobby case. I was able to make 9 sets, so 9 of every card but I did get 10-12 of some players.

Insert collation was really off. I got 4 inserts of some guys and 0 of others, which is why I was asking for some help with my Heat and Power insert sets. I was able to make the other two insert sets, but had a ton of doubles of those as well.

[BabaORiley]

Originally Posted by Stech36

Anyone open a hobby case? How was collation? Did you get an even number of each card?

I'm in the middle of opening a hobby and a jumbo case but mixing the base all up. Collation is good in the sense that you rarely, if ever, get dupes within the same box. But I'm finding certain cards pulled far more frequently (all draft cards from 151-200 seem to be fairly evenly distributed. I guess I'll see what I have after I'm done ripping these two but I'd say not as evenly distributed base within the case as I'm used to from this product.

[Archimedes]

Originally Posted by bd3d86

I opened a hobby case. I was able to make 9 sets, so 9 of every card but I did get 10-12 of some players.

Insert collation was really off. I got 4 inserts of some guys and 0 of others, which is why I was asking for some help with my Heat and Power insert sets. I was able to make the other two insert sets, but had a ton of doubles of those as well.

How was the hobby case?

[Stech36]

Thanks everyone! Ordered a case.

Hard to beat paying under $20 an auto for 48 autos with this checklist.

Throw in 9 complete sets…

[tacitdeals]

I opened 4 Hobby cases. You should complete 9 base sets per case. From 4 cases I was also able to complete 8 of each insert set. I was very pleased with the value from the hobby cases.