**The Perennial MIKE TROUT Thread**

[tconte]

Originally Posted by SupermanBrandon

How much money are you willing to place on that bet?

$0

I only bet on myself.

[SupermanBrandon]

Take away WAR...what do you have?

[SupermanBrandon]

Originally Posted by tconte

$0

I only bet on myself.

I'll put a little on the Bravos vs " team x". Thats about it.

[ThoseBackPages]

Originally Posted by SupermanBrandon

Take away WAR...what do you have?

peace!

[theshowandme]

Not enough cards being shown. Here’s a fun one


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[ThoseBackPages]

not a 10?

BURN IT!!!!

[Shankweather]

Originally Posted by BigSeph

That's interesting because Dale Murphy reminds me of Mike Trout.

Multiple-time MVP centerfielder who physically breaks down in his early 30s and doesn't reach any significant statistical accomplishments to become HOF-worthy, instead relying on people's precious memories of him in his prime dominating to secure enshrinement.

Good comparison, except that Murphy was literally half the player Trout was through their age 31 seasons.

[jhssketchcards]

Originally Posted by theshowandme

you wouldn't want three MVP awards and to be a lock to be a first ballot hall of famer?

I’m not saying Trout isn’t worth shooting for, but I can’t say there are a lot of guys wanting to play for 10+ years and spend as much time on the IL as he has. It’s not like Trout is playing all out and getting hurt taking an extra base or running down a fly ball.
At some point we have to start wondering is Trouts body tearing down. Is he a 1st ballot HOF? Yes. Is he on the same level he was 3-4 years ago? No. I live Trout as much as anyone, but he is showing signs that his body won’t make it 16-17 years in the league sadly. I hope he does


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[theshowandme]

Originally Posted by jhssketchcards

I’m not saying Trout isn’t worth shooting for, but I can’t say there are a lot of guys wanting to play for 10+ years and spend as much time on the IL as he has. It’s not like Trout is playing all out and getting hurt taking an extra base or running down a fly ball.
At some point we have to start wondering is Trouts body tearing down. Is he a 1st ballot HOF? Yes. Is he on the same level he was 3-4 years ago? No. I live Trout as much as anyone, but he is showing signs that his body won’t make it 16-17 years in the league sadly. I hope he does


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If I’m an 18 year old prospect and you tell me I can be a 3x MVP, first ballot HOFer, and secure a $400+ million bag, you can do anything you want to my body short of cancer, paralysis, amputation, and blindness.

You could take my left nut. I’d do the act myself.


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[Stringmusic]

Anybody got an update diamond they want to sell for $500? I’ll even pay shipping

[rfgilles]

Originally Posted by SupermanBrandon

Take away WAR...what do you have?

Reminds me of the song

WAR, what is it good for?
Absolutely nothing.

[pete2345]

Trout will be remembered for his ridiculous card prices people once paid for thats about it. PS bottom isn't even close on those mass produced US175 Troutys love so much.

[Lonewolf]

Originally Posted by theshowandme

If I’m an 18 year old prospect and you tell me I can be a 3x MVP, first ballot HOFer, and secure a $400+ million bag, you can do anything you want to my body short of cancer, paralysis, amputation, and blindness.

You could take my left nut. I’d do the act myself.


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LMFAO

[theshowandme]

“I’d rather be 80 year old me than 20 year old you”

- Eminem
— Mike Trout


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[OhioLawyerF5]

Originally Posted by SupermanBrandon

Take away WAR...what do you have?

You would be left with every single stat that goes into the WAR calculation. Which those of us who understand baseball can also use to point to Trout's dominance over his peers.

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[theshowandme]

Originally Posted by pete2345

Trout will be remembered for his ridiculous card prices people once paid for thats about it. PS bottom isn't even close on those mass produced US175 Troutys love so much.

Are you hoping they keep coming down so you can finally afford one?


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[49ersSF]

Originally Posted by oplum29

Trout will be remembered as one of the best baseball players of his time, and one of top 100 of all-time.

it's just sad that he spent it all with the Angels, and wasted his prime with them. they never built a team around him to win, and that's a shame.

If Trout is the player everyone claims he is then he should have easily led those Angels teams to division championships. The A's won 6 division titles during Trout's career with absolutely nobody on their teams. Their payroll for their entire team was often less than Trout's alone. So what is Trout's true value if a franchise can consistently reach the playoffs with so little while the Angels payroll is consistently in the top 10 and can't even manage a single playoff win in his career.

Sidenote. People blame the owner. The owner bought the team in 2003. With Vlad Guerrero as their primary star and a nearly similar amount of talent surrounding him as Trout the Angels did the following.

2004 92-70 1st place
2005 95-67 1st place
2006 89-73 2nd place
2007 94-68 1st place
2008 100-62 1st place
2009 97-65 1st place

This is what the Angels did prior to Trout's arrival in 2010. Same owner. Same level of talent. Same division.

Trout years...

2010 80-82 3rd place
2011 86-76 2nd place
2012 89-73 3rd place
2013 78-84 3rd place
2014 98-64 1st place (swept in only playoff appearance)
2015 85-77 3rd place
2016 74-88 4th place
2017 80-82 2nd place
2018 80-82 4th place
2019 72-90 4th place
2020 26-34 4th place
2021 77-85 4th place
2022 73-89 3rd place

People commonly say that the Angels robbed him of his true greatness. Perhaps Trout robber the franchise of it's greatness after 5 first place finishes in 6 years before his arrival.

[Stringmusic]

For everyone saying that Trout should have led the team to the playoffs, what exactly should he have done differently over his career? Cheered from the dugout louder? Tried pitching? Got a job in the front office?

[RiceBondsMT2Yng]

Originally Posted by SupermanBrandon

Take away WAR...what do you have?

You still have SLG, OBP, AVG, runs created. I don't disagree it doesn't look good for him right now in terms of the kinds of numbers that earn you the hobby adulation he currently receives.

What's your overall opinion about Trout's accomplishments and where you see them going? I haven't been following.

I'm not even a Mike Trout fan, and I'm not talking about you or your posts in particular, but the backlash against Trout is a little over the top. He's still at a minimum a great player and the best of his generation.

[bryan2points]

Trouts a HOF no doubts. I feel like this injury is just a little more confirmation that he wont be a top 5-10 player all time. I remember reading stories like this and was definitely convinced he was gonna be in the goat conversation.

https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/...-espn-magazine

[ThoseBackPages]

#ThanksTopps

[Chris P]

Originally Posted by Stringmusic

For everyone saying that Trout should have led the team to the playoffs, what exactly should he have done differently over his career? Cheered from the dugout louder? Tried pitching? Got a job in the front office?

I really don't understand that argument either..i mean Ohtani is amazing..should he be single handedly leading the angels to the playoffs too?

[Halonut]

Originally Posted by 49ersSF

If Trout is the player everyone claims he is then he should have easily led those Angels teams to division championships. The A's won 6 division titles during Trout's career with absolutely nobody on their teams. Their payroll for their entire team was often less than Trout's alone. So what is Trout's true value if a franchise can consistently reach the playoffs with so little while the Angels payroll is consistently in the top 10 and can't even manage a single playoff win in his career.

Sidenote. People blame the owner. The owner bought the team in 2003. With Vlad Guerrero as their primary star and a nearly similar amount of talent surrounding him as Trout the Angels did the following.

2004 92-70 1st place
2005 95-67 1st place
2006 89-73 2nd place
2007 94-68 1st place
2008 100-62 1st place
2009 97-65 1st place

This is what the Angels did prior to Trout's arrival in 2010. Same owner. Same level of talent. Same division.

Trout years...

2010 80-82 3rd place
2011 86-76 2nd place
2012 89-73 3rd place
2013 78-84 3rd place
2014 98-64 1st place (swept in only playoff appearance)
2015 85-77 3rd place
2016 74-88 4th place
2017 80-82 2nd place
2018 80-82 4th place
2019 72-90 4th place
2020 26-34 4th place
2021 77-85 4th place
2022 73-89 3rd place

People commonly say that the Angels robbed him of his true greatness. Perhaps Trout robber the franchise of it's greatness after 5 first place finishes in 6 years before his arrival.

One thing you’re leaving out is the Angels had the top
farm system prior to going on that run. Howie, Aybar, Napoli/Mathis, Kotchman, Garrett Richards, Ervin Santana, Joe Saunders, K Rod, Shields, etc all graduated to the bigs between 2002 and 2006. Also they had much more payroll flexibility. Both Vlad and Torii’s contracts were well under 100 million dollars. The Angels decline began when they didn’t sign Adrian Beltre. That led to the Vernon Wells trade, the Pujols/Hamilton/Rendon signings and loss of first round picks. Tony Reagins fired Eddie Bane, Arte pulled out of Latin America and the farm went to hell. Another thing which has prolonged the futility is they never committed to a rebuild. They’ve been stuck in mediocrity, not good enough to make the playoffs, not bad enough to draft high.

[TBTC Baseball]

Originally Posted by 49ersSF

If Trout is the player everyone claims he is then he should have easily led those Angels teams to division championships. The A's won 6 division titles during Trout's career with absolutely nobody on their teams. Their payroll for their entire team was often less than Trout's alone. So what is Trout's true value if a franchise can consistently reach the playoffs with so little while the Angels payroll is consistently in the top 10 and can't even manage a single playoff win in his career.

Sidenote. People blame the owner. The owner bought the team in 2003. With Vlad Guerrero as their primary star and a nearly similar amount of talent surrounding him as Trout the Angels did the following.

2004 92-70 1st place
2005 95-67 1st place
2006 89-73 2nd place
2007 94-68 1st place
2008 100-62 1st place
2009 97-65 1st place

This is what the Angels did prior to Trout's arrival in 2010. Same owner. Same level of talent. Same division.

Trout years...

2010 80-82 3rd place
2011 86-76 2nd place
2012 89-73 3rd place
2013 78-84 3rd place
2014 98-64 1st place (swept in only playoff appearance)
2015 85-77 3rd place
2016 74-88 4th place
2017 80-82 2nd place
2018 80-82 4th place
2019 72-90 4th place
2020 26-34 4th place
2021 77-85 4th place
2022 73-89 3rd place

People commonly say that the Angels robbed him of his true greatness. Perhaps Trout robber the franchise of it's greatness after 5 first place finishes in 6 years before his arrival.

bWAR for Rest of Team, not including Trout or Vlad, (Other position players/Pitching)
2005 - 40.4 (17.8/22.6)
2006 - 36.7 (14.6/22.1)
2007 - 37.0 (17.2/19.8)
2008 - 38.6 (16.7/21.9)
2009 - 43.1 (36.6/6.5)
Average - 39.2

2012 - 35.1 (28.3/6.8)
2013 - 25.6 (15.1/10.5)
2014 - 39.3 (23.7/15.6)
2015 - 22.7 (12.5/10.2)
2016 - 19.0 (12.8/6.2)
2017 - 24.6 (13.6/11)
2018 - 27.5 (13.5/14)
2019 - 19.2 - (10.2/9)
2021 - 19.1 - (5.3/13.8) 10 of this from Ohtani
2022 - 25.1 - (6.9/18.2) 9.7 of this from Ohtani
Average - 25.7

[SupermanBrandon]

Who are the best hitters, fielders and bag stealers from 2011-2020? And where do they rank all-time?