***Official 2023 Detroit Tigers Baseball Thread*** - Page 13

JustinVerlander07 · 08-21-2023, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scottish Punk

Agreed, It is the kind of player the Tigers should target. The "top" free agents don't typically come to Detroit. We would need to be one step away from a World Series for that to happen. Target guys who are still young and have a little doubt/bad mark against them. My only concern is if Baez opts in and you get somebody like Gleyber, will they both feed off each other and both become like what Baez is this year.

No if with Baez opting in. Homie isn't giving up all that money to take a minor league deal.

base set · 08-21-2023, 08:21 AM

Didn’t we just draft a College 2B - how is he doing this summer?

regularp · 08-21-2023, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scottish Punk

Agreed, It is the kind of player the Tigers should target. The "top" free agents don't typically come to Detroit. We would need to be one step away from a World Series for that to happen. Target guys who are still young and have a little doubt/bad mark against them. My only concern is if Baez opts in and you get somebody like Gleyber, will they both feed off each other and both become like what Baez is this year.

Baez doesn't seem to be affecting Greene, Carpenter and Torkelson. No use playing worst case scenario with potential targets.

I just want them to stack talent. I don't care where they play or where they fit in. Get them in the fold and figure it out. You can always trade guys later.

Shockingly, I feel some hope with this team, which I didn't think was possible coming into the year. Greene has hit well all season and Carpenter emerged out of nowhere to become a rock. If Tork closes the season strong and finishes with 30+ HRs, you're looking at a nice top of the lineup trio with those three.

Harris needs to add talent this winter though. He can't punt again.

hairysasquatch · 08-21-2023, 06:04 PM

Sucked to see Haase end up with freaking Cleveland.

Stifle · 08-21-2023, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by regularp

Baez doesn't seem to be affecting Greene, Carpenter and Torkelson. No use playing worst case scenario with potential targets.

I just want them to stack talent. I don't care where they play or where they fit in. Get them in the fold and figure it out. You can always trade guys later.

Shockingly, I feel some hope with this team, which I didn't think was possible coming into the year. Greene has hit well all season and Carpenter emerged out of nowhere to become a rock. If Tork closes the season strong and finishes with 30+ HRs, you're looking at a nice top of the lineup trio with those three.

Harris needs to add talent this winter though. He can't punt again.

The issue with Harris is that he is a so all in with defensive outfield coverage. How about having what the 84 Tigers had, Lemon covering the gaps with Gibson and Herndon giving the Tigers big hits? In 12 the Tigers had one of the worst defensive teams but had players who would be clutch in hitting.

Why pitch to Bellinger in that situation ?

regularp · 08-22-2023, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stifle

The issue with Harris is that he is a so all in with defensive outfield coverage. How about having what the 84 Tigers had, Lemon covering the gaps with Gibson and Herndon giving the Tigers big hits? In 12 the Tigers had one of the worst defensive teams but had players who would be clutch in hitting.

Why pitch to Bellinger in that situation ?

You're preaching to the choir on bats > defense. The over emphasis on defense drives me nuts. Way too overvalued.

You can find a glove anywhere; you cannot find guys who can rake on the regular.

salas1991 · 08-22-2023, 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by regularp

Baez doesn't seem to be affecting Greene, Carpenter and Torkelson. No use playing worst case scenario with potential targets.

I just want them to stack talent. I don't care where they play or where they fit in. Get them in the fold and figure it out. You can always trade guys later.

Shockingly, I feel some hope with this team, which I didn't think was possible coming into the year. Greene has hit well all season and Carpenter emerged out of nowhere to become a rock. If Tork closes the season strong and finishes with 30+ HRs, you're looking at a nice top of the lineup trio with those three.

Harris needs to add talent this winter though. He can't punt again.

^^^^^^^^^^^^

salas1991 · 08-22-2023, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hairysasquatch

Sucked to see Haase end up with freaking Cleveland.

I'm sure he'll hit 10 bombs for them the rest of the way.

Stifle · 08-22-2023, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by regularp

You're preaching to the choir on bats > defense. The over emphasis on defense drives me nuts. Way too overvalued.

You can find a glove anywhere; you cannot find guys who can rake on the regular.

Harris is so metric managed that if Detroit had him in the late 00’s to 14, the Tigers would never have had the roster that was constantly competing for the Post Season. No Miggy, Fielder, Delmon Young. Victor Martinez & G. Laird may have been the slowest players in MLB. If Cabrera didn’t lose 35 lbs to play 3rd, Detroit probably had the 3 of the top 5 largest players in 2012.

JustinVerlander07 · 08-22-2023, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stifle

Harris is so metric managed that if Detroit had him in the late 00’s to 14, the Tigers would never have had the roster that was constantly competing for the Post Season. No Miggy, Fielder, Delmon Young and G. Laird who may have been the slowest of the bunch. If Cabrera didn’t lose 35 lbs to play 3rd, Detroit probably had the 3 of the top 5 largest players in 2012.

The reason the early 2010 Tigers were as great as they were was because they had 2 HOF pitchers, and a cast of really good/great pitchers at the peak of their abilities (Price, Sanchez, Porcello, Fister).

Delmon Young sucked, and the Tigers offense was very good, yet in the postseason couldn't score runs. Crucifying Scott Harris doesn't make a lot of sense to me here. Let it play out, it hasn't even been a year and the team definitely looks to have building blocks.

JustinVerlander07 · 08-23-2023, 03:03 PM

Carpenter is the real deal!

IronCladLou · 08-23-2023, 06:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

Carpenter is the real deal!

Hope so! I was devastated when I hit this "nobody". Now I see he goes yard every game!

JustinVerlander07 · 08-23-2023, 06:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IronCladLou

Hope so! I was devastated when I hit this "nobody". Now I see he goes yard every game!

The plus to Carpenter rookie Autos is that he has no Bowman 1st Autos or ANY Bowman cards, so that will help value if he proves to be a great player for a long time.

IronCladLou · 08-23-2023, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

The plus to Carpenter rookie Autos is that he has no Bowman 1st Autos or ANY Bowman cards, so that will help value if he proves to be a great player for a long time.

Then this series 1 would be the first (Along with silver pack autos I guess)

regularp · 08-23-2023, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

Carpenter is the real deal!

I just hope he doesn't turn into Brennan Boesch when teams get more tape on him. He's been awesome this season.

Stifle · 08-25-2023, 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JustinVerlander07

The reason the early 2010 Tigers were as great as they were was because they had 2 HOF pitchers, and a cast of really good/great pitchers at the peak of their abilities (Price, Sanchez, Porcello, Fister).

Delmon Young sucked, and the Tigers offense was very good, yet in the postseason couldn't score runs. Crucifying Scott Harris doesn't make a lot of sense to me here. Let it play out, it hasn't even been a year and the team definitely looks to have building blocks.

If you look closely you will find out that the Cardinals in the same time period as the tigers 2011-2014 had played the most post season games. Both teams were horrible on Defensive range, GIDP’s, Very few stolen bases. What these teams had were Great Situational hitting ! When there were RISP opportunities the Cardinals and Tigers were outstanding. It’s not WAR, it’s about being successful in situations where runs can be scored. It was huge having Cabrera and Pujols on those teams at their peak.

Pitchers can keep games close but it comes down to not just creating opportunities “WAR” but capitalizing in situations by being successful in those meaningful opportunities “Old School”. Be clutch !

So far this season the team that scores first in Detroit Tigers games are 92-35 which is a .7244 winning percentage. How many times did Pujols and Cabrera put their teams in the lead to help their pitchers? The data for teams winning by scoring the first run of the game is .689% Giving pitchers and those who were on these teams a huge advantage. The .689% isn’t this season it’s historical data. WAR doesn’t apply this data and neither is Scott Harris. You can have all the pitchers you want but give me a team that has a guy in his prime who is clutch when men are on base.

Delmon and Cabrera were basically the 2 who had the highest WPA’s in post season play for the Tigers when they did play in so many playoff games. Miggy 1.55 WPA, Young .52 was AL Championship MVP. The rest of Tigers were garbage. Miggy also played on ONE Leg in 12 & 13.

Stifle · 08-25-2023, 06:46 PM

Thought the ball Cabrera hit was a for sure 3 run home run but Tucker and his 6’4” frame with long arms made a incredible catch to rob Miggy of 510. Well, if the first run score goes to the winner, Detroit is in trouble.

regularp · 08-25-2023, 08:24 PM

Parker Meadows with a walkoff HR while his brother is still having a mental breakdown.

base set · 08-25-2023, 08:26 PM

I hope Topps buys some photos of that one.

corndog · 08-25-2023, 10:27 PM

That was a nice comeback win for the Tigers.
That's why I love baseball over other sports...
The game is not over until it's over - the outcome is not controlled by a clock counting down.

regularp · 08-30-2023, 10:30 PM

Javy Bozo in August:

.175/.242/.246 with 19 strikeouts in 57 at-bats.

Stifle · 08-31-2023, 03:03 PM

That is why you put the ball into play even if it may create a GIDP. Force the fielder to make a play.

spuds1961 · 08-31-2023, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stifle

That is why you put the ball into play even if it may create a GIDP. Force the fielder to make a play.

Especially when that fielder is Gleyber Torres.

Archangel1775 · 08-31-2023, 07:11 PM

Good time to repost this.

Stifle · 08-31-2023, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spuds1961

Especially when that fielder is Gleyber Torres.

Torres took the throw and went directly in front of the baseline. If this was in the days of Albert Belle, Torres would be in flight or in pieces. It was a easy double play and Gleyber ended up throwing the ball to the Tigers dugout as a souvenir.

08-21-2023, 06:04 PM	#304
hairysasquatch Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: In the Woods, Central NY Posts: 36,059	Sucked to see Haase end up with freaking Cleveland. __________________ I am going signature-free

08-23-2023, 03:03 PM	#311
JustinVerlander07 Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: michigan Posts: 17,291 gladdyontherise gladdyontherise	Carpenter is the real deal! __________________ Collecting Justin Verlander, Detroit Tigers, Michigan State Spartans, Miz, Jey Uso, Kelani Jordan, Macho Man, WWE "Cavs in 7. Write it down"

08-25-2023, 10:27 PM	#320
corndog BODA Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: From a table in McDonalds, with lovely fake flowers on it. Posts: 18,072	That was a nice comeback win for the Tigers. That's why I love baseball over other sports... The game is not over until it's over - the outcome is not controlled by a clock counting down. __________________ He has no rival, He has no equal.

08-31-2023, 07:11 PM	#324
Archangel1775 Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Cali baby! Posts: 21,875	Good time to repost this. __________________ *There are the intangibles that set someone apart from the pack.So the blur isn't your inability to see his greatness, it's merely the inability to measure it.*

08-21-2023, 08:21 AM	#302
base set Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: NW Michigan Posts: 9,490	Didn’t we just draft a College 2B - how is he doing this summer?

08-25-2023, 06:46 PM	#317
Stifle Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: I've met great collectors throughout MI and N. Indiana / CHI. Posts: 9,373 Stifle	Thought the ball Cabrera hit was a for sure 3 run home run but Tucker and his 6’4” frame with long arms made a incredible catch to rob Miggy of 510. Well, if the first run score goes to the winner, Detroit is in trouble.

08-25-2023, 08:24 PM	#318
regularp Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,171	Parker Meadows with a walkoff HR while his brother is still having a mental breakdown.

08-25-2023, 08:26 PM	#319
base set Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: NW Michigan Posts: 9,490	I hope Topps buys some photos of that one.

08-30-2023, 10:30 PM	#321
regularp Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,171	Javy Bozo in August: .175/.242/.246 with 19 strikeouts in 57 at-bats.

08-31-2023, 03:03 PM	#322
Stifle Member Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: I've met great collectors throughout MI and N. Indiana / CHI. Posts: 9,373 Stifle	That is why you put the ball into play even if it may create a GIDP. Force the fielder to make a play.