grade or not to grade

[discodanman45]

Originally Posted by rnocards

Ok, I see. An 8 would not be worth it for me to submit. I will hold on to it as raw and just keep it for my PC.

Just keep hoarding raw cards and grade when the price is right.

I send cards to CGC for $9.60 for my PC and enjoy the slabs. I feel cards like that Ripken are great to have slabbed. Here is my Ripken that I got slabbed. That is not a black mark on the card upper left, just some material that was on the case.

[rnocards]

Your Ripken looks nice, and the centering looks fine. What do you think caused it to go down to 8.5? corners? Maybe something on the surface I'm not seeing?

[discodanman45]

Originally Posted by rnocards

Your Ripken looks nice, and the centering looks fine. What do you think caused it to go down to 8.5? corners? Maybe something on the surface I'm not seeing?

Right bottom corner is a tad soft. You can look at a super magnified image at CGC below. It doesn't take make to make a card into a 8. That is why I think most 8's for 80's are undervalued compared to raw cards. Out of 230 cards graded by CGC for this card, only 17 were graded higher. It is a great example and I sold my PSA 8 that looked a lot worse.

https://www.cgccards.com/certlookup/1027907033/

[rnocards]

Originally Posted by mjohnatgt

I always look to triple the grading fee in the additional value of a slab, if I'm thinking about grading a card to resell.

So, if the total cost of a PSA graded card, let's say at least $50 (grading, shipping back and forth), then you would not submit the card for grading unless you are convinced that you can sell it in the future for at least $150?

[shayscards79]

Do people not use Beckett anymore?

[rnocards]

Originally Posted by shayscards79

Do people not use Beckett anymore?

Not as much as SGC, I think.

PSA continues to be #1

[Bob63NJ]

Originally Posted by shayscards79

Do people not use Beckett anymore?

I use them. I think their turnaround is decent and I happen to like the subgrades. PSA is fine but their turnaround was a little longer. Honestly, though, I've never tried CGC. Seems like I should, according to this thread.

[discodanman45]

Originally Posted by Bob63NJ

I use them. I think their turnaround is decent and I happen to like the subgrades. PSA is fine but their turnaround was a little longer. Honestly, though, I've never tried CGC. Seems like I should, according to this thread.

Beckett grades vintage cards (1980 and prior) under their BVG name. No subgrades are available for that service.

CGC is fine for standard sized vintage, but they will use plastic sleeves for smaller cards like 1950 Bowman, T206, 1933 Goudey, etc... They also won't grade anything like Tall Boys. I like them for 1980's cards since the price is cheaper than SGC. I can grade 3 cards for the price of 2. As a collector that is important to me.

[discodanman45]

Just to add to this thread, I think way too much crap is being graded right now. I was guilty of this myself in the past. Here is some of the crap I graded. We don't need grading companies to tell us that this is a 2/3/4 unless it is truly a rare card or needs authentication like a Mickey Mantle.



Stuff like this should be kept raw and sold raw. There is so much raw stuff in this condition that we don't need to pay a grading company $10 to $20 to tell us what we know.

I now grade with a purpose and don't submit a card unless I think it will get a collectors grade or higher. I was 15/17 with PSA in collectors grade or higher for the 80's special. I was 5/5 for my last SGC order. My last CGC order was 42/63, with 9 receiving 0.5 grade below the collectors grade. 7 of my 70's got 6.5, so they were right in the ballpark.

Personally I feel that there are way too many collectors buying these 2/3/4's that have some serious issues that they won't realize until they get the slabs in their hands. Getting collectors grades from the 50's, 60's, 70's, and 80's is more difficult than people realize. Most likely collectors would be happy with these cards without serious flaws, and you are not paying much more money right now.

[hxcmilkshake]

Originally Posted by discodanman45

Just to add to this thread, I think way too much crap is being graded right now. I was guilty of this myself in the past. Here is some of the crap I graded. We don't need grading companies to tell us that this is a 2/3/4 unless it is truly a rare card or needs authentication like a Mickey Mantle.



Stuff like this should be kept raw and sold raw. There is so much raw stuff in this condition that we don't need to pay a grading company $10 to $20 to tell us what we know.

I now grade with a purpose and don't submit a card unless I think it will get a collectors grade or higher. I was 15/17 with PSA in collectors grade or higher for the 80's special. I was 5/5 for my last SGC order. My last CGC order was 42/63, with 9 receiving 0.5 grade below the collectors grade. 7 of my 70's got 6.5, so they were right in the ballpark.

Personally I feel that there are way too many collectors buying these 2/3/4's that have some serious issues that they won't realize until they get the slabs in their hands. Getting collectors grades from the 50's, 60's, 70's, and 80's is more difficult than people realize. Most likely collectors would be happy with these cards without serious flaws, and you are not paying much more money right now.

I agree somewhat but people also grade or buy graded to ensure it's real. Knowing its real can help noobs who want to dabble in vintage.

and there's plenty of market for 2/3/4s. My 50s/60s was basically like that, sold most all of it to get a 52 Mantle


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[discodanman45]

Originally Posted by hxcmilkshake

I agree somewhat but people also grade or buy graded to ensure it's real. Knowing its real can help noobs who want to dabble in vintage.

I understand that for Mantle's, early Aaron's, and expensive HOF RC's. However, I don't think I could find a 1963 Topps fake Ernie Banks if I tried. Authenticity is pushed way too much for vintage grading IMO.

[OhioLawyerF5]

Meh, I have several 2/3/4s in my vintage runs that are placeholders for upgrades. I like my collection to be uniform. I say collect what you like. If you want your low end collection of vintage cards slabbed, by all means, slab them. If you don't like slabbing 2/3/4s, don't slab them. There are plenty still raw for you to buy. Why do we need to direct everyone else's collecting habits?

[discodanman45]

Originally Posted by OhioLawyerF5

Meh, I have several 2/3/4s in my vintage runs that are placeholders for upgrades. I like my collection to be uniform. I say collect what you like. If you want your low end collection of vintage cards slabbed, by all means, slab them. If you don't like slabbing 2/3/4s, don't slab them. There are plenty still raw for you to buy. Why do we need to direct everyone else's collecting habits?

Collect what you want is fine. However, the narrative being pushed right now is you need to grade to sell because all of the fake vintage out there that doesn't exist. People are losing money grading a $35 raw card that they spend $15 to $20 to grade and is still worth $35. Authenticity is not an issue for 99% of vintage. We have a big problem in the hobby right now of grading right now. Marketing and influencers will pushing the narrative that every card needs to be in a slab.

If you enjoy grading lower end vintage and collecting those slabs, go for it. That is collecting. The issue for me is the pushing of grading every card and using excuses like it proves it is authentic.

[VanLingoMungo46]

Not sure where you are hearing a narrative that you need to grade to sell. Sure it does help and there are many strategic instances where the right move is to grade the card if your goal is to sell it. But it’s pretty easy to move raw vintage on eBay and the market is quite liquid especially for name players such as Banks and Ted Williams. I agree the cards shown above aren’t ones that benefit from grading although I suppose the Williams might be a borderline case. I can’t stand CSG but that is just me.

I have graded cards for my PC in the past year that are technically a waste of $ to grade. An example would be a 51 Bowman Carl Furillo. It was a throw in on a recent SGC submission and it got the 2.5 I expected. The card is centered and looks awesome in a tux. I have no illusion that it was a good financial move to grade the card but it fits my graded Boys of Summer collection. I can make money on plenty of other cards.

Anyway not trying to argue with you. Probably just semantics.

[hxcmilkshake]

Need to, no. But there are some who won't buy it unless its graded, that's all I'm saying.

And it helps noobs.

Plenty of "did I overpay for this" threads started in vintage FB groups, for example, usually centered around raw cards from less seasoned collectors.

Like I wouldnt buy a raw decent Charizard, wouldn't be sure it wasn't fake---give me graded please. Raw 50s baseball , not a problem. Pokemon? Idk wtf I'm looking at yet for the most part.

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[discodanman45]

I don't want people thinking I am against collecting slabs, grading anything you want, or grading with any company you want. If you like GMA and like to grade players with the last name of Z, more power to you. It is a hobby! If you want a 1980 Topps Ozzie Smith in a PSA 1, 2, 3, ... 10 slabs, go for it!

The problem is there are a lot of new people in vintage and they are being told that you need to grade to sell. The narrative being spread is that there are a ton of fake vintage cards and all vintage should be graded, even in low grades, to ensure authenticity. There are some big YouTube channels pushing this by people new into vintage and they are just spreading bad information. These fakes just don't exist for 99% of vintage. There are so many new vintage collectors that haven't even touched a vintage card. It is pretty sad IMO.

If you have a 1953 Topps Mantle, you need to grade it for authentication even if it is in bad shape. If you have an off-centered 1968 Topps Roberto Clemente with rounded corners, you don't need to grade that card if you want to sell it. People that buy raw cards will know it is real and if you take good pictures you will easily sell it at a price better than the graded version when you incorporate grading fees.

The OP is like many people who think you need to grade to sell. This is not true and it is actually a bad decision in many instances. It is painful to see so many 60/70's cards put into slabs to sell for $25 and $5 shipping, when they could have sold for $20 with eBay's $1 PWE shipping. Both the buyer and seller would benefit for that card not being in a slab. The only person who wins is the grading company who made $20.

[Bob63NJ]

I'm about to send in another small bunch and with it a 1955 Ernie Banks in, I'm hoping, a 4/5 type of condition. But should I also include a 1956 Warren Spahn in a bit worse shape? The Banks card's price will be helped, but are you saying the Spahn won't be increased unless it's a fairly high grade? See, I don't grade many vintage cards, never saw the need. But with the way ebay has been with the graded cards, I'm inclined to start grading more. Could be expensive, you know?

[discodanman45]

Originally Posted by Bob63NJ

I'm about to send in another small bunch and with it a 1955 Ernie Banks in, I'm hoping, a 4/5 type of condition. But should I also include a 1956 Warren Spahn in a bit worse shape? The Banks card's price will be helped, but are you saying the Spahn won't be increased unless it's a fairly high grade? See, I don't grade many vintage cards, never saw the need. But with the way ebay has been with the graded cards, I'm inclined to start grading more. Could be expensive, you know?

If the Spahn grades below 4, you will probably lose value on the card. Most VG raw 1956 Spahn cards will fetch about $30 to $40 raw. A PSA/SGC 3 with great centering would get about $40. Really no need to grade unless you want to have the card in your PC slabbed. EBay is a great place to sell raw vintage and I never once had an issue with a buyer with vintage. Now with the flippers into vintage, I could see issues.

[MrSnyder]

I'm interested in the Bench if selling.