2023 Veterans Committee Ballot Announced

[Skipscards]

Originally Posted by caster513

West should get in, 1976-2021 with 5,460 games, most ever. I get the hate on him, but man he's been around...

True, but he's "been around" because the MLB wasn't allowed to remove him.

[Skipscards]

Originally Posted by Silent George

I wrote about this, and obviously I disagree with everyone.

In order of how likely in my opinion:

1.White - First black league president, very good player, and nearly 90. It's their chance.

2.West - there are not a lot of umps in. Umps are judged by longevity and personality. West is in.

3.Piniella - 7 votes his first time, missed by 1 vote his last time, it his "turn" - he's 3rd instead of 1st because of lots of manager competition

4.Leyland - Well respected, lots of win, etc.

5.Gaston - 2 WS, 1st black manager to win WS, but not a long tenure. 1/2 wins of other guys, would have 2nd fewest wins in Hall

6.Johnson - has been on vets ballot several times, never making the vote threshold. He's just not well liked personally, and neither are the mid-80s Mets

7.Montague - they are only voting for one ump

8.Peters - The one dead guy on the ballot, barely belongs in the contemporary era, no need or want to elect him right now

Let's face it, a lot of this will come down to who is in the room. If Eddie or Ripken or Larkin are there and have a loud voice, that would help Johnson. If Griffey or Edgar are on the committee, it probably bodes well for Lou.

And if Leyland's guys are there, you know...Bonds, Kevin Brown, Sheffield, etc. Then that would help him.

[JoshMN]

Originally Posted by Skipscards

Let's face it, a lot of this will come down to who is in the room. If Eddie or Ripken or Larkin are there and have a loud voice, that would help Johnson. If Griffey or Edgar are on the committee, it probably bodes well for Lou.

And if Leyland's guys are there, you know...Bonds, Kevin Brown, Sheffield, etc. Then that would help him.

Solid troll. LOL. We talking BARRY Bonds? This is a Hall of Fame thread, right? How the heck is Barry Bonds going to get himself on a Hall of Fame committee? Did they remove the integrity and character criteria from the voting rules?

[PoPCulture]

I’d want to see Leyland elected just, if for no other reason, to see if he fires up a cigarette at the podium during enshrinement.

[mfw13]

So....now that Dusty Baker is officially retiring, how does he compare to all the managers on this year's VC ballot?

[Skipscards]

Originally Posted by mfw13

So....now that Dusty Baker is officially retiring, how does he compare to all the managers on this year's VC ballot?

Davey Johnson is the only one who has a better winning percentage and better average finish, but Dusty managed a lot longer and got over 2,000 wins. Without doing a deeper dive, I’d say Baker’s HOF case is stronger than all four.

[Sal316]

Just another way to water down what it means to be in the HOF. Are we going to add trainers, or groundskeeper next? How about the ball boy/girl who makes those awesome catches every now and then?

[Skipscards]

Originally Posted by Sal316

Just another way to water down what it means to be in the HOF. Are we going to add trainers, or groundskeeper next? How about the ball boy/girl who makes those awesome catches every now and then?

First of all, Managers, Executives, etc have been getting inducted since the beginning so not sure how that waters down the Hall of Fame. This isn't new. It takes skill to succeed at the highest level and honoring those who succeeded the most isn't watering it down, it's actually telling the story of the history of the game.

Second of all, I would 100% support George Toma's induction.

[Silent George]

Originally Posted by Skipscards

Let's face it, a lot of this will come down to who is in the room. If Eddie or Ripken or Larkin are there and have a loud voice, that would help Johnson. If Griffey or Edgar are on the committee, it probably bodes well for Lou.

And if Leyland's guys are there, you know...Bonds, Kevin Brown, Sheffield, etc. Then that would help him.

The committee has been announced and it’s zero players. Zero executives even I think. The names were so boring I didn’t even bother remembering. There’s one Canadian sports news guy, so check box for Gaston.

[Skipscards]

Originally Posted by Silent George

The committee has been announced and it’s zero players. Zero executives even I think. The names were so boring I didn’t even bother remembering. There’s one Canadian sports news guy, so check box for Gaston.

It hasn’t. You’re thinking of the Historical Overview Committee who selected the 8 candidates. They haven’t announced who the 16 voters will be yet but it will include members of the Hall of Fame:

The Contemporary Baseball Non-Players Committee shall consist of 16 members, comprised of members of the National Baseball Hall of Fame, executives, and veteran media members.

[Silent George]

Originally Posted by Skipscards

It hasn’t. You’re thinking of the Historical Overview Committee who selected the 8 candidates. They haven’t announced who the 16 voters will be yet but it will include members of the Hall of Fame:

The Contemporary Baseball Non-Players Committee shall consist of 16 members, comprised of members of the National Baseball Hall of Fame, executives, and veteran media members.

Got it. My bad. I was very confused why they would be chosen for this.

[Skipscards]

Originally Posted by JoshMN

Solid troll. LOL. We talking BARRY Bonds? This is a Hall of Fame thread, right? How the heck is Barry Bonds going to get himself on a Hall of Fame committee? Did they remove the integrity and character criteria from the voting rules?

Thanks. Yeah, Leyland has no players in the Hall other than Mike Piazza who he managed for 5 games and Larry Walker who he managed for one unforgettable season in Detroit. I mentioned Bonds, Brown, and Sheffield specifically because they aren't in. While he's sure to get respect, Leyland will likely not get much love in the room.

[Skipscards]

The Committee has finally been announced:

Hall of Fame players Jeff Bagwell, Tom Glavine, Chipper Jones, Ted Simmons, and Jim Thome

Hall of Fame manager Joe Torre and Hall of Fame commissioner Bud Selig

Executives
Sandy Alderson
[Oakland Athletics (1981–1998)
San Diego Padres (2005–2009)
New York Mets (2011–2018)
Oakland Athletics (2019–2020)
New York Mets (2021–2023)]
Bill DeWitt
[Owner of the Cardinals]
Michael Hill
[MLB President of Baseball Operations
Marlins GM (2007-2013)]
Ken Kendrick
[Owner of the Diamondbacks]
Andy MacPhail
[Former GM of the Minnesota Twins, Chicago Cubs, Baltimore Orioles, and Philadelphia Phillies]
Phyllis Merhige
[Retired MLB’s Senior Vice President for Club Relations]

Media members/historians Sean Forman (Founder of Baseball-Reference.com), Jack O'Connell (Covered Yankees, Secretary/Treasurer BBWAA) and Jesus Ortiz (Houston Cronicle, BBWAA President).

With this list, I see no major connection with the managerial candidates and anyone on the Committee. I think this committee may bode well for Bill White as I suspect Selig and Torre will support him and possibly DeWitt as White was a long time Cardinal. But it’s one of the most unconnected committees I’ve ever seen.

[MiamiMarlinsFan]

I love how eclectic the group is. I think ALL HOF voting should be from mixed groups like this.

[awz50]

Hooters made the voting committee

[OhioLawyerF5]

Makes me think about when the committee is made up of guys like Piazza, Bagwell, Ivan Rodriguez, etc... Seems like the steroid guys get a better shot with a committee like that.

[MiamiMarlinsFan]

Originally Posted by OhioLawyerF5

Makes me think about when the committee is made up of guys like Piazza, Bagwell, Ivan Rodriguez, etc... Seems like the steroid guys get a better shot with a committee like that.

The guys in the HOF who (may have) used steroids want nothing to do with the guys who have been shadow banned from the Hall. They want no association. So I don’t think that would help Bonds, Clemens, etc. at all.

[fabiani12333]

Originally Posted by MiamiMarlinsFan

The guys in the HOF who (may have) used steroids want nothing to do with the guys who have been shadow banned from the Hall. They want no association. So I don’t think that would help Bonds, Clemens, etc. at all.

What are you talking about?:

Ivan Rodriguez -- 2022/01/26:

“The numbers those two guys put up, we’re talking about a guy (Bonds) that is number one in home runs in the history of baseball and you have a guy (Clemens) with the most Cy Youngs (Awards) in baseball. Obviously they have tremendous careers,” Rodriguez said on a Zoom news conference to promote his appearance at the ClubCorp Classic golf tournament April 22-24 at Las Colinas Country Club in Irving, Texas. “… Hopefully one day they both can be in the Hall of Fame because their careers are unbelievable.”

https://nypost.com/2022/01/26/barry-...van-rodriguez/

David Ortiz -- 2022/01/25:

Ortiz, the lone player elected into the National Baseball Hall of Fame on Tuesday, couldn’t fathom entering Cooperstown without the sport’s home run king Barry Bonds and one of his generation’s greatest pitchers, Roger Clemens.

“Not having them join me is hard for me to believe, to be honest with you,” Ortiz said to reporters after the results were announced. “These guys, I did not even compare myself with them.”
...
“Barry Bonds, I don’t think there’s ever going to be a human being capable of doing what he did when he played,” Ortiz said. “He’s special. Sometimes it’s going to be hard for people not in this game to understand that. Barry Bonds, to me, separated himself from the game at the highest level.”

https://www.nbcsportsbayarea.com/mlb...-hall/1174016/

Mike Piazza -- 2019/06/17:

I've been very complimentary towards Barry. I think there's no question that he's the greatest player that I've ever seen or played with. And he left me in aw many times.
...
You realize how difficult it is to go out there and play every day and be productive. It's not justifying or rationalizing that era, but at the end of the day, as a player, you know it's so difficult to go out there and play every day. And you just keep it in perspective and realize you have to dwell on the positive.

https://www.espn.com/video/clip/_/id/14528569

[MiamiMarlinsFan]

Originally Posted by fabiani12333

What are you talking about?:

Ivan Rodriguez -- 2022/01/26:

https://nypost.com/2022/01/26/barry-...van-rodriguez/

David Ortiz -- 2022/01/25:

https://www.nbcsportsbayarea.com/mlb...-hall/1174016/

Mike Piazza -- 2019/06/17:

https://www.espn.com/video/clip/_/id/14528569

I still doubt they would go into a Veterans Committee and come out like “We got ‘em in! We did it!”

…but that’s just, like, my opinion, man.

I had not seen those interviews before. My opinion is based on interviews I’ve seen where as soon as steroids come up they seem uncomfortable and want to change the topic, for obvious reasons. So it makes me think they would be hesitant to vote the roids guys into the Hall, even if they respect the players and their careers.

[base set]

Saw that the result of this one will be announced tonight at 7:30, not sure if Eastern or maybe Central as is it is happening at the Winter Meetings in Nashville.

[awz50]

Welcome Jim Leyland to the hall

[awz50]

Sweet lou was 1 vote shy and Bill white was 2

[bub838]

Originally Posted by Skipscards

Thanks. Yeah, Leyland has no players in the Hall other than Mike Piazza who he managed for 5 games and Larry Walker who he managed for one unforgettable season in Detroit. I mentioned Bonds, Brown, and Sheffield specifically because they aren't in. While he's sure to get respect, Leyland will likely not get much love in the room.

Larry Walker never played in Detroit

[bub838]

Originally Posted by Sal316

Just another way to water down what it means to be in the HOF. Are we going to add trainers, or groundskeeper next? How about the ball boy/girl who makes those awesome catches every now and then?

Smoking hot take. It’s been watered down since the beginning.

[Skipscards]

Originally Posted by bub838

Larry Walker never played in Detroit

That was a joke. Leyland managed Walker for one very forgettable season in Colorado…