PSA Dual/Auto Grading Flip Differences/Confusion

PSA2Pac · 10-27-2023, 12:41 PM

I just submitted a Label Correction on my dual order that was shipped to me today because it was missing the word AUTO on the flip but, upon further review, it looks like it was right all along?

Wondering why there are all of these differences..

I understand the Trading Card designation on cards that aren’t subbed thru Dual. This is the cheapest option and, yet, has AUTHENTIC AUTO on the flip (the way it should read)

Then for dual, you get AUTHENTIC AND AUTO whenever you request an auto grade

And apparently they used to also include AUTO on dual, even if you didn’t request an auto grade (as AUTO AUTH)

But now on dual, if you don’t request an auto grade you get this

Like I said, I thought they messed up so immediately submitted a Label Correction but after looking on eBay it appears they updated this sometime recently.

Doesn’t make sense because you still have that empty space where AUTO/AUTO AUTH could go, so from a consumer standpoint, you’d think to avoid confusion, you just include it lol

Anybody notice when they took AUTO away from dual when you don’t request an auto grade?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

RufussCkingston · 10-27-2023, 02:51 PM

Not sure what you are confused on... when you sent in your card for Dual grading, did you ask for no grade on BOTH the card AND the Auto???

Image 1 is authentic auto because the "trading card" has not been determined to be authentic as it wasn't sent in for dual grading, it was sent in for auto encapsulation.. The card could be fake and/or altered.

Image 2 Says the card is real, and the auto is graded a 9

Image 3 is where the card was graded but the auto was not, but it was sent for dual grade and thus the auto is authentic...

Image 4. No card grade OR auto grade requested. Both the card and auto are authentic, thus only need to say Authentic which covers everything. If Auto Authentic was put on this flip, it could psychologically imply that the card has not been authenticated, just the auto... Of course if that was the case it would say Trading Card instead of the card issue...

PSA2Pac · 10-27-2023, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RufussCkingston

Not sure what you are confused on... when you sent in your card for Dual grading, did you ask for no grade on BOTH the card AND the Auto???

Image 1 is authentic auto because the "trading card" has not been determined to be authentic as it wasn't sent in for dual grading, it was sent in for auto encapsulation.. The card could be fake and/or altered.

Image 2 Says the card is real, and the auto is graded a 9

Image 3 is where the card was graded but the auto was not, but it was sent for dual grade and thus the auto is authentic... In reality the submitter could have just sent it for normal grading as it is pack issued auto, but then it would not have said PSA/DNA or Auto Auth

Image 4. No card grade OR auto grade requested. Both the card and auto are authentic, thus only need to say Authentic which covers everything. If Auto Authentic was put on this flip, it could psychologically imply that the card has not been authenticated, just the auto... Of course if that was the case it would say Trading Card instead of the card issue...

You went more in depth on each card but I summarized each of your points above each photo. I only included all 4 to illustrate the different things a buyer could see from PSA re: a signed card

My point is in re: to the last 2 examples. I get one had the card graded, the other didn’t - however I’m talking about the auto. One has AUTO AUTH, to confirm the auto is in fact authentic.

My Luka prizm silver simply reads AUTHENTIC with an empty line. PSA could streamline all of these duals and simply put AUTO AUTH, but instead chooses to leave it blank

Psychologically the opposite could also be true lol - a buyer could see the previous three cards and assume PSA only authenticated the Luka silver since there’s no mention of the AUTO

Long story short: Just weird to have some mention the auto and some that don’t

RufussCkingston · 10-27-2023, 04:56 PM

The one that says auto auth is to distinguish it from the card grade and to signify the auto was authenticated/dual graded. If it just said NM 7, then it would imply that PSA did not authenticate the auto.... or that the auto was a NM 7 too (which we know is not the case, but the flip needs to be formatted for a non-PSA expert to understand)... Just clears it up.

By putting Authentic Auto on your Luka implies that the card is neither real or fake as only the auto was authenticated, but we know that the auto AND the card was authenticated since you used dual grading and the card was identified (as opposed to Trading Card), but just like image 3, needs to be clear for the non-expert.... So it would really need to say Authentic AND authentic auto underneath that (which is not done) to signify that BOTH were authenticated. The way you want the flip to read will mean only the auto was authenticated, if strictly reading the label.

I guess it is weird, but makes perfect sense so there is no confusion.

Also, don't forget the Auto Only grade......

auburn35 · 10-27-2023, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RufussCkingston

Not sure what you are confused on... when you sent in your card for Dual grading, did you ask for no grade on BOTH the card AND the Auto???

Image 1 is authentic auto because the "trading card" has not been determined to be authentic as it wasn't sent in for dual grading, it was sent in for auto encapsulation.. The card could be fake and/or altered.

Image 2 Says the card is real, and the auto is graded a 9

Image 3 is where the card was graded but the auto was not, but it was sent for dual grade and thus the auto is authentic... In reality the submitter could have just sent it for normal grading as it is pack issued auto, but then it would not have said PSA/DNA or Auto Auth

Image 4. No card grade OR auto grade requested. Both the card and auto are authentic, thus only need to say Authentic which covers everything. If Auto Authentic was put on this flip, it could psychologically imply that the card has not been authenticated, just the auto... Of course if that was the case it would say Trading Card instead of the card issue...

The Curry in image 3 (2009 Studio) is not a pack pulled auto.

aggie4ever · 10-27-2023, 06:23 PM

It's been this way for at least several years, I have cards I submitted back in 2019 that are labeled this way.

Also, I just started a submission, and looked at the example pictures they show when you choose which type of dual service you want. It shows that doing no grade to card or autograph will be labeled this way. The only one that uses AUTO AUTH is if you do card grade only.

rnocards · 10-29-2023, 11:08 PM

For this one, are both the card and the auto graded? Are they both graded as NM 7?

When I lookup the certification number 17449598, it tells me to select between PSA Cards, or PSA DNA, and then it gives NM 7 grade on both pages. So, I was thinking both got graded, but then, isn't it supposed to say NM 7 for card, and Auto 7 for auto?

RufussCkingston · 10-30-2023, 01:57 AM

That's an old flip, so they may not have thought it through at that point... Did they always do auto grading? I'm thinking that it's just a NM on the card and that the PSA/DNA Certified signifies an Auto Auth

rnocards · 10-30-2023, 03:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RufussCkingston

That's an old flip, so they may not have thought it through at that point... Did they always do auto grading? I'm thinking that it's just a NM on the card and that the PSA/DNA Certified signifies an Auto Auth

I'm not sure when they started doing the auto grades.

For that cert number, these two pages pop up for it:

PSA Cards
https://www.psacard.com/cert/17449598/psa

PSA DNA
https://www.psacard.com/cert/17449598/dna

The grade of NM 7 appears in both pages. If it was just an Auto Auth, I would have expected that labeling in the DNA page for the grade, and not the NM 7.

Anyways, that is an old slab and label, and they might have done a few things differently back then, I don't know. You could be right too, just as you said.

RufussCkingston · 10-30-2023, 12:38 PM

That's interesting... if you lookup the 2nd Steph Curry above you only get a "psa" page, the "dna" page errors out... But the PSA page shows both grades.

https://www.psacard.com/cert/82408166/psa

PSA2Pac · 10-30-2023, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RufussCkingston

That's interesting... if you lookup the 2nd Steph Curry above you only get a "psa" page, the "dna" page errors out... But the PSA page shows both grades.

https://www.psacard.com/cert/82408166/psa

Lol that’s my card (that still hasn’t shipped, and I’m starting to lean into thinking it’s been lost)

When I input the cert number for any of the dual cards I graded recently I just get a single page that shows both the PSA and PSA/DNA info on the same page. Where are you seeing a DNA page that errors out?

I’m guessing they only do single pages for dual now? The Topps Steph and prizm silver Luka above are mine but even the other card leads you to only a single page

mjohnatgt · 10-30-2023, 08:29 PM

The Gwynn is stating the card is a 7 and the auto is authentic.

rnocards · 10-30-2023, 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PSA2Pac

When I input the cert number for any of the dual cards I graded recently I just get a single page that shows both the PSA and PSA/DNA info on the same page. Where are you seeing a DNA page that errors out?

I’m guessing they only do single pages for dual now? The Topps Steph and prizm silver Luka above are mine but even the other card leads you to only a single page

The DNA page error on your Steph card is referring to this:

https://www.psacard.com/cert/82408166/dna

It seems they used to do two pages in the past, but it looks like they only do one page now, for the dual service, both Card and DNA.

Unless perhaps a raw card was first submitted for an auto auth/grade, and so a page was built for that. Then, at some point later, the slabbed card was re-submitted for a card auth/grade, and so a second page was built. I'm not sure though if they continue with two pages on that submission and re-submission, or they just simply revise the one page for such submission scenarios.

Unfortunately, we don't have a PSA rep here who can confirm these answers.

rnocards · 10-30-2023, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mjohnatgt

The Gwynn is stating the card is a 7 and the auto is authentic.

Ok fine, but why doesn't the Gwynn say Auto Auth in the slab label?

Like the Curry #129 above.

rnocards · 10-31-2023, 12:34 AM

This is so weird... the link I posted above only errors out in a desktop browser. This one:

https://www.psacard.com/cert/82408166/dna

When I click on this link on my android phone (I have PSA app installed), a page actually shows up, but not all of the information is present. Here are the pics of that page:

That page on my phone does not show the Auto 9 in the PSA DNA information of that card. It shows it, obviously, in the PSA slab label, but not on the page information.

So, on my phone, both the "dna" link and "psa" link, when clicked on, show the limited information in the pictures i posted. But on the desk browser, the "dna" link errors out, and the "psa" link shows the whole information of card grade and auto grade.

I'm not sure why PSA has done that.

RufussCkingston · 10-31-2023, 12:43 AM

My guess is that the app is ignoring the /PSA or /DNA... it just reads the /cert/xxxxxx. The app is not configured for auto grades.

RufussCkingston · 10-31-2023, 12:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rnocards

Ok fine, but why doesn't the Gwynn say Auto Auth in the slab label?

Like the Curry #129 above.

As I said earlier, it's an old flip, so the labeling conventions were different back then, as well as there may not have even been auto-grading yet. If there wasn't auto-grading yet, then the PSA/DNA Certified = Auto Authentic.... If it was done today, it would say Auto Auth underneath. Maybe even a re-holder would spit it out.

rnocards · 10-31-2023, 01:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RufussCkingston

As I said earlier, it's an old flip, so the labeling conventions were different back then, as well as there may not have even been auto-grading yet. If there wasn't auto-grading yet, then the PSA/DNA Certified = Auto Authentic.... If it was done today, it would say Auto Auth underneath. Maybe even a re-holder would spit it out.

Ok, so you would say the Gwynn NM 7 grade is a reference to the card grade, and not the auto grade, even though it lists it under the /dna page?

https://www.psacard.com/cert/17449598/dna

PSA2Pac · 10-31-2023, 02:07 AM

Im pretty sure the 7 on the DNA page is erroneously there. It’s definitely the card grade. Looking at that auto, it’s a 9 or 10.

It’s an authentic auto with a card grade of 7.

My original point stands, there should be zero confusion - PSA should streamline the info so it doesn’t differ depending on what’s requested by a customer. Have a line for the card and a line for the auto on the flip. Authentic for each and if a grade is requested it’s reflected immediately after the ‘AUTHENTIC/AUTH’

rnocards · 10-31-2023, 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PSA2Pac

Im pretty sure the 7 on the DNA page is erroneously there. It’s definitely the card grade. Looking at that auto, it’s a 9 or 10.

That auto does look like a 10 honestly, at worst a 9.

mjohnatgt · 10-31-2023, 05:13 AM

The Authentic Auto on the Gwynn is explicitly stated on the slab as "PSA/DNA Certified".

RufussCkingston · 10-31-2023, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PSA2Pac

Authentic for each and if a grade is requested it’s reflected immediately after the ‘AUTHENTIC/AUTH’

It's aesthetically redundant... The card is identified and the flip says Authentic and also PSA/DNA Cert, which means the Auto has been autheniticated, thus everything is authentic. Just dumb looking to say
AUTHENTIC
AUTHENTIC AUTO

Hell, they might as well put AUTHENTIC CARD too!!

PSA2Pac · 10-31-2023, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RufussCkingston

It's aesthetically redundant... The card is identified and the flip says Authentic and also PSA/DNA Cert, which means the Auto has been autheniticated, thus everything is authentic. Just dumb looking to say
AUTHENTIC
AUTHENTIC AUTO

Hell, they might as well put AUTHENTIC CARD too!!

You’re too busy being funny that you’re missing the point - all I’m saying is it should be the same across sub levels. There would be zero confusion.

It doesn’t have to say:
AUTHENTIC
AUTHENTIC AUTO

It should at least look how my Topps Curry reads:
AUTHENTIC
AUTO (with a grade if requested, or simply AUTO if no grade was requested)

Streamlined. Easy.

It’s a tiny flip reflecting info on two sources. It’s not meant to be a minimalist art piece

If we’re gonna talk aesthetics, you have some cards where there is no free space. Then you have others where it’s blank.

Do you submit dual?

RufussCkingston · 10-31-2023, 11:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PSA2Pac

It should at least look how my Topps Curry reads:
AUTHENTIC
AUTO (with a grade if requested, or simply AUTO if no grade was requested)

If it says:

AUTHENTIC
AUTO

Then a dumbass will assume that means it is just an Authentic Auto and raises the question, "what about the card?". The flip has to be done so the non-PSA collector can decipher it, or at least not be confused.

I've submitted very little Dual, but not sure how that's relevant?

10-27-2023, 02:51 PM	#2
RufussCkingston Member Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Uranus Posts: 1,308	Not sure what you are confused on... when you sent in your card for Dual grading, did you ask for no grade on BOTH the card AND the Auto??? Image 1 is authentic auto because the "trading card" has not been determined to be authentic as it wasn't sent in for dual grading, it was sent in for auto encapsulation.. The card could be fake and/or altered. Image 2 Says the card is real, and the auto is graded a 9 Image 3 is where the card was graded but the auto was not, but it was sent for dual grade and thus the auto is authentic... Image 4. No card grade OR auto grade requested. Both the card and auto are authentic, thus only need to say Authentic which covers everything. If Auto Authentic was put on this flip, it could psychologically imply that the card has not been authenticated, just the auto... Of course if that was the case it would say Trading Card instead of the card issue... Last edited by RufussCkingston; 10-27-2023 at 06:18 PM.

10-27-2023, 04:56 PM	#4
RufussCkingston Member Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Uranus Posts: 1,308	The one that says auto auth is to distinguish it from the card grade and to signify the auto was authenticated/dual graded. If it just said NM 7, then it would imply that PSA did not authenticate the auto.... or that the auto was a NM 7 too (which we know is not the case, but the flip needs to be formatted for a non-PSA expert to understand)... Just clears it up. By putting Authentic Auto on your Luka implies that the card is neither real or fake as only the auto was authenticated, but we know that the auto AND the card was authenticated since you used dual grading and the card was identified (as opposed to Trading Card), but just like image 3, needs to be clear for the non-expert.... So it would really need to say Authentic AND authentic auto underneath that (which is not done) to signify that BOTH were authenticated. The way you want the flip to read will mean only the auto was authenticated, if strictly reading the label. I guess it is weird, but makes perfect sense so there is no confusion. Also, don't forget the Auto Only grade...... Last edited by RufussCkingston; 10-27-2023 at 05:01 PM.

10-31-2023, 12:34 AM	#15
rnocards Member Join Date: Sep 2023 Posts: 829	This is so weird... the link I posted above only errors out in a desktop browser. This one: https://www.psacard.com/cert/82408166/dna When I click on this link on my android phone (I have PSA app installed), a page actually shows up, but not all of the information is present. Here are the pics of that page: That page on my phone does not show the Auto 9 in the PSA DNA information of that card. It shows it, obviously, in the PSA slab label, but not on the page information. So, on my phone, both the "dna" link and "psa" link, when clicked on, show the limited information in the pictures i posted. But on the desk browser, the "dna" link errors out, and the "psa" link shows the whole information of card grade and auto grade. I'm not sure why PSA has done that. Last edited by rnocards; 10-31-2023 at 12:37 AM.

10-27-2023, 12:41 PM	#1
PSA2Pac Member Join Date: Jun 2020 Posts: 3,926	PSA Dual/Auto Grading Flip Differences/Confusion I just submitted a Label Correction on my dual order that was shipped to me today because it was missing the word AUTO on the flip but, upon further review, it looks like it was right all along? Wondering why there are all of these differences.. I understand the Trading Card designation on cards that aren’t subbed thru Dual. This is the cheapest option and, yet, has AUTHENTIC AUTO on the flip (the way it should read) Then for dual, you get AUTHENTIC AND AUTO whenever you request an auto grade And apparently they used to also include AUTO on dual, even if you didn’t request an auto grade (as AUTO AUTH) But now on dual, if you don’t request an auto grade you get this Like I said, I thought they messed up so immediately submitted a Label Correction but after looking on eBay it appears they updated this sometime recently. Doesn’t make sense because you still have that empty space where AUTO/AUTO AUTH could go, so from a consumer standpoint, you’d think to avoid confusion, you just include it lol Anybody notice when they took AUTO away from dual when you don’t request an auto grade? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Last edited by PSA2Pac; 10-27-2023 at 12:48 PM.

10-27-2023, 06:23 PM	#6
aggie4ever Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Austin, Texas Posts: 6,823 aggie4ever	It's been this way for at least several years, I have cards I submitted back in 2019 that are labeled this way. Also, I just started a submission, and looked at the example pictures they show when you choose which type of dual service you want. It shows that doing no grade to card or autograph will be labeled this way. The only one that uses AUTO AUTH is if you do card grade only.

10-29-2023, 11:08 PM	#7
rnocards Member Join Date: Sep 2023 Posts: 829	For this one, are both the card and the auto graded? Are they both graded as NM 7? When I lookup the certification number 17449598, it tells me to select between PSA Cards, or PSA DNA, and then it gives NM 7 grade on both pages. So, I was thinking both got graded, but then, isn't it supposed to say NM 7 for card, and Auto 7 for auto?

10-30-2023, 01:57 AM	#8
RufussCkingston Member Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Uranus Posts: 1,308	That's an old flip, so they may not have thought it through at that point... Did they always do auto grading? I'm thinking that it's just a NM on the card and that the PSA/DNA Certified signifies an Auto Auth

10-30-2023, 12:38 PM	#10
RufussCkingston Member Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Uranus Posts: 1,308	That's interesting... if you lookup the 2nd Steph Curry above you only get a "psa" page, the "dna" page errors out... But the PSA page shows both grades. https://www.psacard.com/cert/82408166/psa

10-30-2023, 08:29 PM	#12
mjohnatgt Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Niceville, FL Posts: 14,806 mjohnatgt mjohnatgt	The Gwynn is stating the card is a 7 and the auto is authentic.

10-31-2023, 12:43 AM	#16
RufussCkingston Member Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Uranus Posts: 1,308	My guess is that the app is ignoring the /PSA or /DNA... it just reads the /cert/xxxxxx. The app is not configured for auto grades.

10-31-2023, 02:07 AM	#19
PSA2Pac Member Join Date: Jun 2020 Posts: 3,926	Im pretty sure the 7 on the DNA page is erroneously there. It’s definitely the card grade. Looking at that auto, it’s a 9 or 10. It’s an authentic auto with a card grade of 7. My original point stands, there should be zero confusion - PSA should streamline the info so it doesn’t differ depending on what’s requested by a customer. Have a line for the card and a line for the auto on the flip. Authentic for each and if a grade is requested it’s reflected immediately after the ‘AUTHENTIC/AUTH’

10-31-2023, 05:13 AM	#21
mjohnatgt Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Niceville, FL Posts: 14,806 mjohnatgt mjohnatgt	The Authentic Auto on the Gwynn is explicitly stated on the slab as "PSA/DNA Certified".