How Does The Market View CGC?

[CaptSpaulding]

So I just ran a bunch of eBay auctions that had high grade and low grade vintage PSA, SGC and CGC. All but one of the CGC cards were 7.5 to 9s and mostly 1960s. All were star cards and I thought all were graded very accurately. The low grade card sold comparable to what an SGC card would bring but the high grade material literally sold for 15% of what a PSA example would bring. I think the prices would have been higher in a GMA slab.

Is CGC really just not getting accepted in high grade by vintage collectors? I do not buy much of anything on eBay but I do spend a great deal of money in catalog auctions and preview virtually every auction even if I am not going to bid. I am not seeing much CGC in these auctions which sort of answers my question but wanted to hear other people experiences.

[discodanman45]

Originally Posted by CaptSpaulding

So I just ran a bunch of eBay auctions that had high grade and low grade vintage PSA, SGC and CGC. All but one of the CGC cards were 7.5 to 9s and mostly 1960s. All were star cards and I thought all were graded very accurately. The low grade card sold comparable to what an SGC card would bring but the high grade material literally sold for 15% of what a PSA example would bring. I think the prices would have been higher in a GMA slab.

Is CGC really just not getting accepted in high grade by vintage collectors? I do not buy much of anything on eBay but I do spend a great deal of money in catalog auctions and preview virtually every auction even if I am not going to bid. I am not seeing much CGC in these auctions which sort of answers my question but wanted to hear other people experiences.

Welcome to the power of the PSA registry!

Right now never run auctions, especially with CGC/CSG slabs. I do sell CGC slabs for decent prices, but I place at BIN and just let them sit and don't negotiate with them. Even some PSA slabs at auction are going for stupid low prices right now.

CGC grades corners easier than PSA/SGC, but they are harder on surface than both. I have stacks of cards that I think are best for CGC/SGC/PSA. Yes, PSA will grade certain cards higher than both SGC/CGC. Just need to have experience with what each grading company trains their graders to look for and how to use their rubrics.

CGC has burned collectors many times in their short existence grading cards with label changes, grade scale changes, and some issues with grading consistency in the past. It will take time for vintage collectors to trust them and unfortunately in our hobby that means to grade harder than PSA so people can crack to get a higher or same grade with PSA. Grading companies not named PSA are pre-graders for PSA right now.

[tyrith]

CGC has no pricing power in sports; even 10s might sell like they're BGS 9.5s at best. It doesn't make sense, because it's a reputable company that probably grades more accurately than most of their competition, with great looking plastic, but that's just where the world is at ATM. Even in the Pokemon space they're struggling to maintain any sort of pricing premium with the price compression we're seeing with PSA 10s now going for only about 1.75x of high quality raw cards.

[inaka]

I have a feeling the people most interested in CGC graded sports cards are likely people who seek out winning cheap CGC auctions, with the idea to crack and resubmit to PSA or SGC (for vintage).

[smanzari]

They keep having scandals (on the comic side) that I think limit their appeal. They're cheap, quick, accurate and I really like their cases - just seems once every other quarter something squirrley is going on there

[anusinha]

Cgc is a glorified top loader

[discodanman45]

Originally Posted by anusinha

Cgc is a glorified top loader

The PSA slab is important and not the card inside. I would much rather have a properly graded CGC card than an overpriced high graded PSA slab with a card 2 grades higher than it deserves.

Some people collect PSA slabs, which is fine. I collect cards.

[Scottish Punk]

Originally Posted by discodanman45

Welcome to the power of the PSA registry!


CGC has burned collectors many times in their short existence grading cards with label changes, grade scale changes, and some issues with grading consistency in the past. It will take time for vintage collectors to trust them and unfortunately in our hobby that means to grade harder than PSA so people can crack to get a higher or same grade with PSA. Grading companies not named PSA are pre-graders for PSA right now.

I think this is a lot of it. When they first started out , ugly label with subgrades. Those that graded early or watched reveals saw a bunch of over graded vintage and super harsh surface on modern chrome/prizm. Then they took away subs. Then they changed the grading scale with new labels. Then, killed the division and rolled into CGC. I just think each step just had more people tune them out. Really hard to bring back people after these first impressions. Double that, without subs for example, they don't have a "hook". PSA is the market leader and has the registry, Beckett has subs (dumb if they get rid of it), and SGC has the tux. They each have a era in which they are deemed experts.

What does CGC have. Nice holders. Great for Pokémon. I have said it before, if they just would have kept CGC labels from the beginning and bake in subs they would be a ton better off.

[tyrith]

Originally Posted by Scottish Punk

I think this is a lot of it. When they first started out , ugly label with subgrades. Those that graded early or watched reveals saw a bunch of over graded vintage and super harsh surface on modern chrome/prizm. Then they took away subs. Then they changed the grading scale with new labels. Then, killed the division and rolled into CGC. I just think each step just had more people tune them out. Really hard to bring back people after these first impressions. Double that, without subs for example, they don't have a "hook". PSA is the market leader and has the registry, Beckett has subs (dumb if they get rid of it), and SGC has the tux. They each have a era in which they are deemed experts.

What does CGC have. Nice holders. Great for Pokémon. I have said it before, if they just would have kept CGC labels from the beginning and bake in subs they would be a ton better off.

People stopped paying for subs on the Pokemon side before they got rid of them. So the 20% of slabs with subs were devaluing the 80% that weren't. It just wound up being awkward, kind of the opposite of BGS.

[Gkozsportscards]

It's interesting because I've sold a few and done pretty well (with buy it now/best offer), and they actually have a monetary guarantee on their grades - to my knowledge PSA is the only other company that does.

They seem to have pulled back on marketing sports cards, they should be marketing the heck out of the guarantee and their customer service...but it seems like its crickets on sports stuff now.

[KhalDrogo]

Originally Posted by Scottish Punk

I think this is a lot of it. When they first started out , ugly label with subgrades. Those that graded early or watched reveals saw a bunch of over graded vintage and super harsh surface on modern chrome/prizm. Then they took away subs. Then they changed the grading scale with new labels. Then, killed the division and rolled into CGC. I just think each step just had more people tune them out. Really hard to bring back people after these first impressions. Double that, without subs for example, they don't have a "hook". PSA is the market leader and has the registry, Beckett has subs (dumb if they get rid of it), and SGC has the tux. They each have a era in which they are deemed experts.

What does CGC have. Nice holders. Great for Pokémon. I have said it before, if they just would have kept CGC labels from the beginning and bake in subs they would be a ton better off.

They hired BGS goons who implemented a bunch of BGS tactics. They couldn’t have possibly product tested anything. They didn’t act on feedback until it was too late.

Really just a bunch of amateur hour mistakes that put the sports division in the ground for good.

[Gary]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

They hired BGS goons who implemented a bunch of BGS tactics. They couldn’t have possibly product tested anything. They didn’t act on feedback until it was too late.

Really just a bunch of amateur hour mistakes that put the sports division in the ground for good.

You and i agree on pretty much nothing,but in this case i do agree with you.as a vintage guy myself i view CSG/CGC as BVG vintage.the vintage space doesn't accept BVG either.it may change someday but that day isn't today.

Most guys buying CGC vintage slabs are cracking and sending to PSA/SGC in hopes of getting a card for cheap to either flip or keep depending on outcome.Guys do the same thing buying modern SGC slabs to crack and send to PSA.

[CaptSpaulding]

Originally Posted by discodanman45

Welcome to the power of the PSA registry!

Right now never run auctions, especially with CGC/CSG slabs. I do sell CGC slabs for decent prices, but I place at BIN and just let them sit and don't negotiate with them. Even some PSA slabs at auction are going for stupid low prices right now.

CGC grades corners easier than PSA/SGC, but they are harder on surface than both. I have stacks of cards that I think are best for CGC/SGC/PSA. Yes, PSA will grade certain cards higher than both SGC/CGC. Just need to have experience with what each grading company trains their graders to look for and how to use their rubrics.

CGC has burned collectors many times in their short existence grading cards with label changes, grade scale changes, and some issues with grading consistency in the past. It will take time for vintage collectors to trust them and unfortunately in our hobby that means to grade harder than PSA so people can crack to get a higher or same grade with PSA. Grading companies not named PSA are pre-graders for PSA right now.

Appreciate everyone's comments. I have been grading with PSA since the late 1990s. They have no competition, really, due to the set registry, That is what it is and as a result expect less in anyone else's holder. I was just stunned to see accurately graded cards sell for next to nothing. PRO and CSA graded cards sell in auction for a higher percentage than I got.

There is no question that this is not the time to even be selling PSA slabs in the auction format on eBay. Very little is going for strong prices.

I know they had some growing pains in the beginning with the flip change and now the name change. I did not think that would be impactful. And even the change in the grading standards did not strike me as something that would adversely impact them. SGC and PSA grading standards have been a moving target over their existence and they both go through phases with vintage, at least, where you cannot possibly estimate what the grade will be. Has not hurt their business in the very least.

If I end up with more CGC slabs I will park em in the store. Was a small price to pay to get an education on where the market is for their slabs. I like what they are doing but that is not something I can get behind.

[SandStoneSports]

Absolutely love the slab. That said, I'd only buy it to crack or PC. I wouldnt grade with them on things I intend to sell.

[YeahBuddy]

I grade with them often. love the slab and service

[JustRachel]

I'm in the camp that has no respect for CGC and will completely disregard the slab when making an offer on a card.

[discodanman45]

Originally Posted by JustRachel

I'm in the camp that has no respect for CGC and will completely disregard the slab when making an offer on a card.

I do this for all slabs. Disregard the slab and buy the card inside of it. PSA is sending me back a $2 raw card that someone will buy for $250. I never buy a slabbed card for a premium, just compare them to raw pricing.

[Scottish Punk]

Originally Posted by JustRachel

I'm in the camp that has no respect for CGC and will completely disregard the slab when making an offer on a card.

Curious, not judging. I assume you put them in the same group as TAG and HGA. What did it for you? What would it take to put them with SGC and PSA?

[collective]

Originally Posted by Scottish Punk

Curious, not judging. I assume you put them in the same group as TAG and HGA. What did it for you? What would it take to put them with SGC and PSA?

Not aligning oneself with questionable individuals from the "hobby" would be a good start.

[discodanman45]

Originally Posted by collective

Not aligning oneself with questionable individuals from the "hobby" would be a good start.

The Omega Mystery pack with Sean B is a bad look. However you will need omit PSA, SGC, and BGS as well if this is a criteria of a reputable grading company. Shenanigans has been associated with every grading company.

[Scottish Punk]

Originally Posted by discodanman45

The Omega Mystery pack with Sean B is a bad look. However you will need omit PSA, SGC, and BGS as well if this is a criteria of a reputable grading company. Shenanigans has been associated with every grading company.

Yeah, all the questionable players in this hobby have links to one or more of the grading companies. PSA is just a perpetual scandal of some kind and it really doesn't matter to the bottom line.

[collective]

Wasn't, or isn't Sean B banned/blacklisted from PSA?

[seanbros55]

/poop emoji

[Giroux]

Any idea why this didn't gem?

[Scottish Punk]

corners look good, must be a surface indent. Somebody paid $43. Must be for the novelty of it.