📈Is the correction over? What cards look attractive with an upside potential?📈

[1980bust]

Originally Posted by r338

Here are some recent examples, but I would include any insert that is easier than one per pack and easy to find.

1992 Total D
PSA 10 $19,520
PSA 9 $620
Total graded pop 1,975

1993 Inside Outside
PSA 10 $6,600
PSA 9 $120
Total graded pop 4,032

These PSA 10 prices are pure idiocy areas.

[Nomad]

So dumb old guys exist?

[JumpshotMcGavin]

The 'sweet spot' for me is buying low to mid end MJ cards in BGS 8.5 or 9... Just doesnt make sense for me to pay multiples (in some instances over 10x) for a card.

[RKH916]

Wait until the PSA 10 Premium Krew realize that 80+% of PSA 10's would cross to minimum gem BGS 9.5's (introducing a condunrum for the "a BGS 9.5 might not cross to a PSA 10 therefore ..." logic)

After that they might do a data dive on True Gem quad 9.5 rates and realize that they're often harder to attain than PSA 10's

[MJGOAT23]

Originally Posted by r338

Here are some recent examples, but I would include any insert that is easier than one per pack and easy to find.

1992 Total D
PSA 10 $19,520
PSA 9 $620
Total graded pop 1,975

1993 Inside Outside
PSA 10 $6,600
PSA 9 $120
Total graded pop 4,032

1995 Maximum Metal
PSA 10 $4,625
PSA 9 $325
Total graded pop 2,020

That's my point. The cards may be plentiful in general, but PSA 10's are not.

[MJGOAT23]

Originally Posted by drobfan8

Imagine paying $19k for a Total D

Haha. Sorry. That is a terrible buy.

You would be far better off buying rarer inserts in a 9 or Exquisite Jordan.

Why is a pop 20 something PSA 10 so terrible though? How is it any different than a red PMG that has 90 copies or any other "rare" insert. The PMG have the notoriety but is technically more plentiful. You can rip jumbo packs, if you can find them, till the cows come home and not find 70! more PSA 10 Total D's or rack packs to find a PSA 10 team leader, or maybe the most difficult of all early 90s, a 92 PSA 10 MJ All Star.

[Asian62150]

Originally Posted by MJGOAT23

Why is a pop 20 something PSA 10 so terrible though? How is it any different than a red PMG that has 90 copies or any other "rare" insert. The PMG have the notoriety but is technically more plentiful. You can rip jumbo packs, if you can find them, till the cows come home and not find 70! more PSA 10 Total D's or rack packs to find a PSA 10 team leader, or maybe the most difficult of all early 90s, a 92 PSA 10 MJ All Star.

It's because the PSA pop is artificially created.

There are only 90 PMG reds, whether they're PSA 1 or PSA 10, there are only 90 - maybe less if have been destroyed over the past 25+ years.

You can find a PSA grader asleep at the wheel who might give something a 10 that really should be a 7 or 8.

[Nomad]

I mean at $5k a pop for grading or whatever, you only have a limited number of such blanks to fire, before the cost of grading exceeds whatever market value. Fortunate that they keep no records of previous grades on numbered cards, at least you have that option. And I guess if you submit enough PSA might even feel some unconscious pressure to up the pop incrementally for something of really finite supply.

Bricking is a thing. More than that, even unbricked, a lot of 90s stuff will have had microscopic but AI- and thumb- detectible surface damage associated with the weird plastics and trace metal alloys in use.

I have even seen many cards damaged by penny holders, to the point where I had to surgically extract the card using nail cutting scissors. Remember, in the late 90s basketball collecting was the exception, not the norm in many physical shops. I remember when my LCS started stocking basketball in like 1999 and I was like, these exist?

But in the Philippines it was the opposite and this is why, also, a lot of these condition issues of the era are compounded by humidity factors.

[drobfan8]

Originally Posted by MJGOAT23

Why is a pop 20 something PSA 10 so terrible though? How is it any different than a red PMG that has 90 copies or any other "rare" insert. The PMG have the notoriety but is technically more plentiful. You can rip jumbo packs, if you can find them, till the cows come home and not find 70! more PSA 10 Total D's or rack packs to find a PSA 10 team leader, or maybe the most difficult of all early 90s, a 92 PSA 10 MJ All Star.

Lol, if you're taking a PSA 10 Total D over a PMG or a rarer Jordan card, then you're a fool.

For $19k I could grab so many better Jordan cards. I could get like 5 key inserts instead of an average looking 92 common insert.

There are 9s out there that you wouldn't be able to fault.

[Nomad]

I mean, the serious collector takes PSA 10 Total Ds while waiting for the next PMG red to show up.

[ninjacookies]

Nat got these registry gooners going gaga for low pop Total D's.

That could also double as a new MPJ headline.

[MJGOAT23]

Originally Posted by drobfan8

Lol, if you're taking a PSA 10 Total D over a PMG or a rarer Jordan card, then you're a fool.

For $19k I could grab so many better Jordan cards. I could get like 5 key inserts instead of an average looking 92 common insert.

There are 9s out there that you wouldn't be able to fault.

Nope. Didn't say take it over it. Asked why it's so terrible. It's a pop 29 that won't likely climb much higher over the years. The point is it is a rare card in PSA 10, (which we all know the market loves), that again, will barely increase in pop count and is what, 1/10th the price of a red pmg? Again, why is that so terrible .

[GOATMJ]

edited

[Asian62150]

Originally Posted by MJGOAT23

Nope. Didn't say take it over it. Asked why it's so terrible. It's a pop 29 that won't likely climb much higher over the years. The point is it is a rare card in PSA 10, (which we all know the market loves), that again, will barely increase in pop count and is what, 1/10th the price of a red pmg? Again, why is that so terrible .

I wouldn't say a Total D PSA 10 is "terrible" but again, it's nowhere near a PMG because that pop count is artificial.

The pop can go up whenever PSA wants it to go up. They've tightened the criteria on a "10" but they can just as easily announce tomorrow morning that they've relaxed the restrictions. Or, one that should be an 8 or 9 gets gifted 10 status because the grader felt like it/was asleep at the wheel.

The PMG count can only remain the same or go down. But it can not go up.

[MJGOAT23]

Originally Posted by Asian62150

I wouldn't say a Total D PSA 10 is "terrible" but again, it's nowhere near a PMG because that pop count is artificial.

The pop can go up whenever PSA wants it to go up. They've tightened the criteria on a "10" but they can just as easily announce tomorrow morning that they've relaxed the restrictions. Or, one that should be an 8 or 9 gets gifted 10 status because the grader felt like it/was asleep at the wheel.

The PMG count can only remain the same or go down. But it can not go up.

It's been over 30 years and there's 29 in the "artificial" supply. It's not ever climbing at any significant rate. check Ebay now and see how many jumbo series 2 boxes are available. There's like none, and a small handful sold since like May. Never mind pulling an MJ, and never mind pulling one remotely approximating a 10. They're always OC and chipped out of the pack. The point is it's not as laughable to see a 10 which almost never surfaces to go for a ton of $$ like people want to say.

[Asian62150]

Originally Posted by MJGOAT23

It's been over 30 years and there's 29 in the "artificial" supply. It's not ever climbing at any significant rate. check Ebay now and see how many jumbo series 2 boxes are available. There's like none, and a small handful sold since like May. Never mind pulling an MJ, and never mind pulling one remotely approximating a 10. They're always OC and chipped out of the pack. The point is it's not as laughable to see a 10 which almost never surfaces to go for a ton of $$ like people want to say.

Sure, it can "go for a ton of $$" but for it to be considered anywhere near a PMG is ridiculous.

I'm just saying it's possible for PSA to create/give out more PSA 10s.

It's not possible for there to be more PMG reds.

[MJGOAT23]

Originally Posted by Asian62150

Sure, it can "go for a ton of $$" but for it to be considered anywhere near a PMG is ridiculous.

I'm just saying it's possible for PSA to create/give out more PSA 10s.

It's not possible for there to be more PMG reds.

At the end of the day they're both extremely rare cards. The supply of PSA 10 total d will probably never exceed the PMG red. PMG has the notoriety, and the point, once again, is that being 1/10 or 1/20 the price is not absurd. A quarter mill or whatever the PMG is inflated to now? Not only that, you always have to assume one is fake until proven otherwise.

[Nomad]

The other thing people never talk about with Total D is that it's one of the first inserts people really remember. It was based on defensive prowess, I believe, and its interesting MJ even qualified on that metric. So it has nostalgia for the dollar pack busters, similar to 1960s Topps or whatever.

[r338]

Originally Posted by MJGOAT23

At the end of the day they're both extremely rare cards. The supply of PSA 10 total d will probably never exceed the PMG red. PMG has the notoriety, and the point, once again, is that being 1/10 or 1/20 the price is not absurd. A quarter mill or whatever the PMG is inflated to now? Not only that, you always have to assume one is fake until proven otherwise.

You might be the only person in the world who would compare the Total D to PMGs. I love the early Fleer inserts, but no one would ever characterize them as extremely rare when there could be a 10,000 press run.

There are 29 PSA 10 Total Ds. There are 0 PSA 10 red PMGs.

There are 235 PSA 9 Total Ds. There are 4 PSA 9 red PMGs.

There are 444 PSA 8 Total Ds. There are 7 PSA 8 red PMGs.

[MJGOAT23]

Originally Posted by r338

You might be the only person in the world who would compare the Total D to PMGs. I love the early Fleer inserts, but no one would ever characterize them as extremely rare when there could be a 10,000 press run.

There are 29 PSA 10 Total Ds. There are 0 PSA 10 red PMGs.

There are 235 PSA 9 Total Ds. There are 4 PSA 9 red PMGs.

There are 444 PSA 9 Total Ds. There are 7 PSA 8 red PMGs.

not comparing as equals, im saying having even less pop, having 1/20th (!!!!!!) the value is not absurd.. nice reading y'all though. peace.

[r338]

Originally Posted by MJGOAT23

Why is a pop 20 something PSA 10 so terrible though? How is it any different than a red PMG that has 90 copies or any other "rare" insert. The PMG have the notoriety but is technically more plentiful.

This is absurd. The PMG is not “technically more plentiful.”

[MJGOAT23]

Originally Posted by r338

This is absurd. The PMG is not “technically more plentiful.”

29 Total D in PSA 10. 90 red PMG. Yes it is. That's how math works. What's so great about the PMG that it's several hundred thousand dollars? it's all hype.. but once again, I am not saying the total D is a better card or should be worth more. I am saying for it to be 1/10 or 1/20th the price is not crazy, which was the original contention in this thread.

[ninjacookies]

Originally Posted by ninjacookies

It's funny. Many of the same arguments made against BTC from those outside the landscape are the same arguments people outside of the hobby think about the value of printed pictures of individuals on cardboard.

Nonsensical, silly, niche, price manipulation, etc.


At the end of the day, clect/invest in what you like.


There's no better transfer of value than buttcoin though. It's a lot easier and safer moving 10k in bitcoin than it is 10k in plastic slabs...particularly across borders. Plus you're not at the mercy of a banking system/3rd party institution implementing exorbitant fees, additional paperwork, and/or required hold/wait times.

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

ETH down 23.8%.

SOL down 36.7%.

ALGO down 85.3%.

BTC down 4.9%.

KhalDrogo up 37.7%.

Crypto has seen massive gains over the years. Crypto has also seen massive losses. Timing is everything. I’m not really sure what you’re advocating for as far as allocations since you’re being so dodgy. Maybe you have 5% of your investable net worth in crypto. Maybe its 25%. Maybe it’s more.

There’s certainly room for some crypto in any portfolio. But more than half of US adults can’t cover a $1000 emergency expense. Not sure how they’re going to tolerate holding any meaningful amount of such a risky and volatile asset.

Literally 3x'd since then. Less than a year and a half. Zero homework. Zero legwork. Just buy and HODL.



Still the answer.


Stop gambling on silly kardboard lest you enjoy the palpatations.

[Nomad]

I don't really get that. I mean, I know there is an active vaulted app trading segment of the hobby and it probably accounts for 90 percent of daily transactions. But it does not account for even 10 percent of important cards.

Cards are by their nature pretty much guaranteed tonic against heart palpitations as long as one gets in when one should, with value rookies. And doesn't sell for a fairly long time.

It all depends on risk appetite, etc. Now there are areas where buttcoin and speculative card investment intersect, but even there buttcoin really has no tether to reality. The moment you buy whatever Trump or Doge offers, the Jane Goodall Society's new offering is going to outshine.

Whereas even I can see how Donovan Mitchell tried and ultimately failed during playoffs. But made a heroic effort and raised his hobby profile.

[ninjacookies]

The problem is kards lack the transparency the blockchain provides. The ledger ensures there's no funny business with pricing manipulation. What you see on the exchange is what you get.

Meanwhile, the hobby is riddled with supposed 'trust me bro' offline transactions, shilling, unpaid items...and various other unscrupulous measures taken by desperate individuals to protect or hype their investments.

There's no faking in the crypto space. You cannot fabricate an immutable transaction.