Has your PSA 10 Gem rate for modern bulk submissions changed dramatically this year?

[Icollectstuff]

I will just use what I've done with gamestop since they are the only cards I submit that I've seen in person.... I also submit on comc but they are all cards I've never seen before in person


So from my gamestop submissions I've got 9 cards back

I've gotten

10- 4x
9- 4x
7- 1x

The 7 was the only shocker because the card looked great.... the rest were about what I was expecting because I submitted a few I knew would 9 but just wanted slabbed in my pc anyways

[imbluestreak23]

2017:
GEM 10 RATE
MINT 9 RATE
NEAR MINT-MINT 8
NEAR MINT 7 Rate
EXCELLENT-MINT 6 Rate
EXCELLENT 5 Rate
83.04%
15.07%
1.01%
0.29%
0.14%
0.14%

2018:
GEM 10 RATE
MINT 9 RATE
NEAR MINT-MINT 8
NEAR MINT 7 Rate
EXCELLENT-MINT 6 Rate
EXCELLENT 5 Rate
78.00%
19.73%
1.59%
0.34%
0.11%
0.23%

2019:
GEM 10 Rate
MINT 9 Rate
NEAR MINT-MINT 8
NEAR MINT 7 Rate
EXCELLENT-MINT 6 Rate
EXCELLENT 5 Rate
60.96%
33.18%
3.50%
0.96%
0.76%
0.57%

2020:
GEM 10 Rate
MINT 9 Rate
NEAR MINT-MINT 8
NEAR MINT 7 Rate
EXCELLENT-MINT 6 Rate
EXCELLENT 5 Rate
48.83%
42.30%
5.92%
1.63%
0.97%
0.26%

2021:
GEM 10 RATE
MINT 9 RATE
NEAR MINT-MINT 8
NEAR MINT 7 Rate
EXCELLENT-MINT 6 Rate
EXCELLENT 5 Rate
53.58%
38.64%
5.66%
1.06%
0.71%
0.18%

2022:
GEM 10 RATE
MINT 9 RATE
NEAR MINT-MINT 8
NEAR MINT 7 Rate
EXCELLENT-MINT 6 Rate
EXCELLENT 5 Rate
VERY GOOD-EXCELLENT 4 Rate
62.10%
30.94%
4.88%
1.00%
0.52%
0.35%
0.21%

2023:
GEM 10 Rate
Mint 9 Rate
NRMT 8 Rate
NEARMT 7 Rate
EX-Mint 6 Rate
EX 5 RATE
VG-EX 4 RATE
VG 3 RATE
53.57%
33.99%
8.57%
2.14%
0.89%
0.48%
0.30%
0.06%

2024:
GEM 10 Rate
MINT 9Rate
NRMT 8 Rate
NEARMT 7 Rate
EX-Mint 6 Rate
EX 5 RATE
VG-EX 4 RATE
VG 3 RATE
65.72%
26.40%
5.07%
1.32%
1.18%
0.20%
0.10%
0.00%

2025:
GEM 10 Rate
MINT 9Rate
NRMT 8 Rate
NEARMT 7 Rate
EX-Mint 6 Rate
EX 5 RATE
VG-EX 4 RATE
VG 3 RATE
61.02%
28.64%
7.46%
1.53%
1.02%
0.00%
0.17%
0.17%

[thenightman]

How much did you sub each year?

[88horsepower]

This reflects very closely with my Gem Rate, as well. Yours is a little higher at the peaks, but I was at about 70% or so at my peak in the 2017-2019 range and never saw a bulk order dip below 45% (the one order that was at the low end felt like an anomaly). During 2020-2023, it was atrociously bad for me. Rarely did an order have a strong gem rate for the 80s and 90s cards I sent in. I filed a strongly worded complaint with PSA after one order came back below 10%. The order was re-subbed and let's just say the results were shockingly different that the original results. In a way, that experience was akin to pulling the curtain in the Wizard of Oz and seeing the little old man behind the curtain. I was pretty clear to me that if that could happen with one order, there's a high probability that the other low Gem rate orders I sent were also under-graded.

Since I filed the complaint and the order was re-subbed, my orders have been mostly decent, but nothing like the Gem rate I used to get before the pandemic/change in ownership. I no longer trust PSA to grade many of the sets I started working on before the pandemic because the grading on them has become so strict and inconsistent, it's useless trying, especially at $20 a card. They've priced out many registry collectors and it's sad to give up on sets, but they are making too much money to care about the common collector. It's a flippers game now and I'm not happy about it at all. Frankly, I think the whole thing looks more and more like a racket, especially when I watch YouTube videos of people re-submitting bulk orders and getting back significantly different grades, similar to my experience.

Originally Posted by imbluestreak23

2017:
GEM 10 RATE
MINT 9 RATE
NEAR MINT-MINT 8
NEAR MINT 7 Rate
EXCELLENT-MINT 6 Rate
EXCELLENT 5 Rate
83.04%
15.07%
1.01%
0.29%
0.14%
0.14%

2018:
GEM 10 RATE
MINT 9 RATE
NEAR MINT-MINT 8
NEAR MINT 7 Rate
EXCELLENT-MINT 6 Rate
EXCELLENT 5 Rate
78.00%
19.73%
1.59%
0.34%
0.11%
0.23%

2019:
GEM 10 Rate
MINT 9 Rate
NEAR MINT-MINT 8
NEAR MINT 7 Rate
EXCELLENT-MINT 6 Rate
EXCELLENT 5 Rate
60.96%
33.18%
3.50%
0.96%
0.76%
0.57%

2020:
GEM 10 Rate
MINT 9 Rate
NEAR MINT-MINT 8
NEAR MINT 7 Rate
EXCELLENT-MINT 6 Rate
EXCELLENT 5 Rate
48.83%
42.30%
5.92%
1.63%
0.97%
0.26%

2021:
GEM 10 RATE
MINT 9 RATE
NEAR MINT-MINT 8
NEAR MINT 7 Rate
EXCELLENT-MINT 6 Rate
EXCELLENT 5 Rate
53.58%
38.64%
5.66%
1.06%
0.71%
0.18%

2022:
GEM 10 RATE
MINT 9 RATE
NEAR MINT-MINT 8
NEAR MINT 7 Rate
EXCELLENT-MINT 6 Rate
EXCELLENT 5 Rate
VERY GOOD-EXCELLENT 4 Rate
62.10%
30.94%
4.88%
1.00%
0.52%
0.35%
0.21%

2023:
GEM 10 Rate
Mint 9 Rate
NRMT 8 Rate
NEARMT 7 Rate
EX-Mint 6 Rate
EX 5 RATE
VG-EX 4 RATE
VG 3 RATE
53.57%
33.99%
8.57%
2.14%
0.89%
0.48%
0.30%
0.06%

2024:
GEM 10 Rate
MINT 9Rate
NRMT 8 Rate
NEARMT 7 Rate
EX-Mint 6 Rate
EX 5 RATE
VG-EX 4 RATE
VG 3 RATE
65.72%
26.40%
5.07%
1.32%
1.18%
0.20%
0.10%
0.00%

2025:
GEM 10 Rate
MINT 9Rate
NRMT 8 Rate
NEARMT 7 Rate
EX-Mint 6 Rate
EX 5 RATE
VG-EX 4 RATE
VG 3 RATE
61.02%
28.64%
7.46%
1.53%
1.02%
0.00%
0.17%
0.17%

[Scottish Punk]

Originally Posted by 88horsepower

This reflects very closely with my Gem Rate, as well. Yours is a little higher at the peaks, but I was at about 70% or so at my peak in the 2017-2019 range and never saw a bulk order dip below 45% (the one order that was at the low end felt like an anomaly). During 2020-2023, it was atrociously bad for me. Rarely did an order have a strong gem rate for the 80s and 90s cards I sent in. I filed a strongly worded complaint with PSA after one order came back below 10%. The order was re-subbed and let's just say the results were shockingly different that the original results. In a way, that experience was akin to pulling the curtain in the Wizard of Oz and seeing the little old man behind the curtain. I was pretty clear to me that if that could happen with one order, there's a high probability that the other low Gem rate orders I sent were also under-graded.

Since I filed the complaint and the order was re-subbed, my orders have been mostly decent, but nothing like the Gem rate I used to get before the pandemic/change in ownership. I no longer trust PSA to grade many of the sets I started working on before the pandemic because the grading on them has become so strict and inconsistent, it's useless trying, especially at $20 a card. They've priced out many registry collectors and it's sad to give up on sets, but they are making too much money to care about the common collector. It's a flippers game now and I'm not happy about it at all. Frankly, I think the whole thing looks more and more like a racket, especially when I watch YouTube videos of people re-submitting bulk orders and getting back significantly different grades, similar to my experience.

I just think of PSA like McDonalds. Low wage workers zipping through orders as fast as they can. Sometimes you get a nicely stacked burger, other times it is just piled on. One billion served.

[imbluestreak23]

Originally Posted by thenightman

How much did you sub each year?

It's usually around 2000-3000 cards per year, some higher some lower.

There was a clear change around covid and onwards. Granted, condition of cards has also changed. 2017 and 2018 was extremely clean across the board, across most sports.

Cards today are more scratched up, more dented, exhibit more corner wear, are more off centered. I use to NEVER not send in cards that I bought online because it's a hassle to keep up with raw card inventory as opposed to graded card inventory that has a serial number. Today, I am selling ~40% of my purchases raw because they are literal dog **** quality. That dog **** quality comes from:
-crap manufacturers
-everybody and their mother grading everything so less gradable cards in circulation, even from new releases

Regardless, quality of grading has taken a massive decrase. The most alarming data point is my PSA 10 + PSA 9 rate often was close to 98% or greater. I never really got a PSA 8 or lower, and often times if I did, it was from a card you would want like an 86 fleer jordan. Today, I'm lucky to get a PSA 10 + PSA 9 gem rate of > 90%. Some years it's above, some years it's slighltly below. And the proportion of PSA 9s is obviously higher. But PSA 8 and lower proporition of total subs is substantially higher than it ever has been and almost all of that comes from 1-2 just HORRIBLE subs per year where gem rates are 25-30% with a 25%+ PSA 8 or lower order.

Quality control of the graders IMO is non existent at PSA. If they truly wanted to be objective, they should strive for less variance among the graders. They do that by running statistical tests, looking at standard deviations in gem rates, 9 rates, 8 rats, 7 rates among the same type of class of card compared to the population of graders. I know that they don't do this because every 10th or 20th order, you get the crap grader who would be performing at 2 or 3 standard deviations "different" than the rest of the grading room for that type of card. That to me is what is making up the variance pre and post covid.

[Bosoxfan5990]

Originally Posted by Scottish Punk

I just think of PSA like McDonalds. Low wage workers zipping through orders as fast as they can. Sometimes you get a nicely stacked burger, other times it is just piled on. One billion served.

They're making less per hour than you're paying to sub 1 card.

[88horsepower]

Originally Posted by Bosoxfan5990

They're making less per hour than you're paying to sub 1 card.

Facts.

[newfiesig]

I have no issue with PSA having tougher grading standards, I just don't want to submit and receive a bunch of 8s and 9s, only to have the standard relaxed again in a few months.

[inaka]

Originally Posted by newfiesig

I have no issue with PSA having tougher grading standards, I just don't want to submit and receive a bunch of 8s and 9s, only to have the standard relaxed again in a few months.

At PSA....

[newfiesig]

Originally Posted by inaka

At PSA....

I think their issues are exaggerated. They exist, but not as bad as many think/say.

[inaka]

Originally Posted by newfiesig

I think their issues are exaggerated. They exist, but not as bad as many think/say.

Sure, PSA's grading standards do exist the same way Angel Hernandez's strike zone also technically existed.

[yoyosh]

Originally Posted by yoyosh

I know I'm doing this mostly for myself, but updated today.
These #s are crazy to me

Jayden 13% 10s
Nix 27%
Caleb 20%
Penix 21%

(Caitlin Clark is 8.2% for silver prizm #22)

I got another 9 on a Caitlin silver today so reminded me of this thread. Updated after 2 more months of subs:

CC #22 silver prizm now 7.7% gems
Jayden 12%
Nix 25%
Caleb 20%
Penix 22%

[imbluestreak23]

Originally Posted by yoyosh

I got another 9 on a Caitlin silver today so reminded me of this thread. Updated after 2 more months of subs:

CC #22 silver prizm now 7.7% gems
Jayden 12%
Nix 25%
Caleb 20%
Penix 22%

2024 Prizm is quite literally dog***t quality. If it's not off centered, it's got damaged rear corners. If the corners and centering happen to be good, on the 50th one you look at, it's got a scratched surface. Just not enough clean ones make there way to the market. They are subbed direct or at gamestop. Fools gold chasing any Prizm 10s in 2024.

[waytoomanycards]

I love full sub crackout videos like this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yonH3hEu_YE

[88horsepower]

Originally Posted by waytoomanycards

I love full sub crackout videos like this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yonH3hEu_YE

Such a joke. These videos are just more of a validation for me about my decision to walk away from PSA.

[Boostedwrx]

Originally Posted by waytoomanycards

I love full sub crackout videos like this.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yonH3hEu_YE

Me too if they were sports cards..

[lisu]

My grades this year so far have been between 45% - 55% gem - which is probably within my norm from past years.

[bub838]

My most recent order was 20/23 gem. Granted it was Japanese Pokemon.

[metsandweezer]

14/20 gems on an ultra modern bulk order today.

[FT35]

Ultra modern orders can still see gem rates in line with what they have been. Entire orders are still trashed from time to time, but at least it’s possible to get a fair grader.

Modern however…..not so much. 80’s/90’s, don’t count on 10’s at all (even if your cards are perfect). Not trying to be negative—just hope it helps someone as they decide what cards to submit. If you’re only goal is a 10 for your collection or your profit—just be careful. Assume it will top out at an 8 and decide on that whether you send it or not. In most cases for junk era cards, you can buy a 9 for less that it would cost to grade your card and for PSA to assign it an 8.

[larry25]

Originally Posted by FT35

Ultra modern orders can still see gem rates in line with what they have been. Entire orders are still trashed from time to time, but at least it’s possible to get a fair grader.

Modern however…..not so much. 80’s/90’s, don’t count on 10’s at all (even if your cards are perfect). Not trying to be negative—just hope it helps someone as they decide what cards to submit. If you’re only goal is a 10 for your collection or your profit—just be careful. Assume it will top out at an 8 and decide on that whether you send it or not. In most cases for junk era cards, you can buy a 9 for less that it would cost to grade your card and for PSA to assign it an 8.

This is because new graders have been unreasonably applying PSA 10 Gem Mint standards for ultra modern cards to modern 80s/90s cards. It is beyond frustrating.

The 80s/90s stuff obviously has more defects and stock problems, but graders need to learn that perfect 2020s TCG and Chrome edges and surfaces cannot be the standard for pulpy and rough cut 80s/90s stuff.

**********Seriously, PSA needs to hold a seminar with all their graders about this issue!!!************

[bbollinger67]

Originally Posted by larry25

This is because new graders have been unreasonably applying PSA 10 Gem Mint standards for ultra modern cards to modern 80s/90s cards. It is beyond frustrating.

The 80s/90s stuff obviously has more defects and stock problems, but graders need to learn that perfect 2020s TCG and Chrome edges and surfaces cannot be the standard for pulpy and rough cut 80s/90s stuff.

**********Seriously, PSA needs to hold a seminar with all their graders about this issue!!!************

What company would you use then if PSA doesn't know the difference between ultra modern and 80s/90s?

[FT35]

Originally Posted by bbollinger67

What company would you use then if PSA doesn't know the difference between ultra modern and 80s/90s?

None. For me, it’s PSA or nothing because that’s where all my registry & card info records are. If I don’t use them, I’ll simply stop grading. I don’t grade just to grade/sell and I don’t NEED to grade. I’ll either buy graded or start to convert my graded stuff into a collection that I don’t plan on grading. I’ll change the way I collect before PSA changes the way I grade.

I don’t need endless gems, but I do need accuracy and consistency. When a card is a gem, it better be in a gem slab and nothing else.

[larry25]

I started this thread back in April after some disgusting results of mostly 8s and a spattering of 9s and 7s on a fairly large order I thought was at least 50% 10s.

Since then, I've had several more orders finish about 1-2x per month. Only in two of about 12 orders have I had a decent Gem rate, and I'm talking like 20-40%, which made me think I was maybe overreacting in this and another similar post.

Had another 50 card order finish last night, this one of 2000s to 2020s soccer, which I admit is somewhat new for me, but it doesn't change how I scrutinize the paper.

I got exactly TWO PSA 10s in the entire order, which in my notes I wrote could/should be 100% Gem, that everything was as perfect as I could find. I intentionally wanted to submit an entire order perfect looking cards, mostly low value, very common Messi and Ronaldo stuff, straight from packs, literally perfect cards and stickers.

PSA is absolutely blowing this thing for sports collectors in favor of what? TCG collectors submitting stuff straight off the shelves from Target? AI? I just don't get it.

Can't wait to see this stuff in person to see how many corner and edge knocks there are from the robots and computers that must be handling this stuff, because there's simply no other explanation at this point.

I've been at this game since the 1990s, and PSA is ruining the hobby for me.