eBay sale: Delivered package but buyer claiming no card (empty toploader)

[eastbayak]

I have an eBay issue that I need people’s input on (particularly from those who might’ve experienced the same thing).

Yesterday, a buyer messaged me stating that they received my package without my card (2024 Topps Chrome Seneisa Estrada Orange auto). They said they only received an empty toploader and baseball/basketball cards (the latter which I use for package padding). They said the package wasn’t tampered so I either forgot to ship it or didn’t ship it (but he strongly accused me of the latter first).

Thing is, I know I packaged that card out. The card was already toploaded before sale (due to value), I put some blue painter’s tape on the toploader to secure it from not flying out, then taped extra cards to both sides of the toploader, placed it into the mail bubbler and taped the entire bubbler (including label) with shipping tape.

This is the first time I’ve had someone claim that I only shipped out an empty toploader (with extra cards on the side) in a mailer bubbler. I’ve done thousands of transactions, many for more than the sold amount ($175), and would never scam someone out of a card/money. I have excellent feedback on eBay, BO, and many vouches/references on FB and IG. The buyer has great feedback on eBay too, but seemed a little suspicious.

I know USPS has its own issues, but I’m uncertain if the package was tampered with before it reached him (he said it wasn’t) or if he’s scamming me. He requested a return.

What can I do? I don’t want to be out the card or funds. My only options in eBay's platform is to accept the return or offer a partial/full refund. I've called them twice (will call again shortly) and can't get through to a human CS rep, it kept saying that I called outside of their normal hours (9:xx AM PST and 10:xx AM PST).

[smanzari]

He's scamming you - you're going to have to accept the return, then fight it once in hand. Send a label, when you receive follow up with eBay BEFORE sending the refund (tell them they didn't return the card that you sent); You may have to try a few CSRs before they make it right (would recommend contacting them on FB or X when the time comes)

[Snowcat]

Most likely they're scamming you. If that's the case, they're also committing federal mail fraud

[Sonnys88]

Unfortunately, it sounds like you're dealing with a scam buyer.

When a buyer immediately claims that the package was not tampered with and that you didn't ship it - it is a huge red flag.

Share the buyer's username on here so they can be blocked.

[DynaEtch]

Get through to the eBay phone rep during hours….they should be able to help you get to the bottom of it. It’s very possible if this is a one-time thing eBay would eat it and let you keep the funds, but not guaranteed I guess. No real way for them to arbitrate these he said/she said things in terms of knowing what happened. I would immediately block buyer. May be able to get some clues on their behavior checking their feedback left for others.

[eastbayak]

Originally Posted by smanzari

He's scamming you - you're going to have to accept the return, then fight it once in hand. Send a label, when you receive follow up with eBay BEFORE sending the refund (tell them they didn't return the card that you sent); You may have to try a few CSRs before they make it right (would recommend contacting them on FB or X when the time comes)

Originally Posted by Snowcat

Most likely they're scamming you. If that's the case, they're also committing federal mail fraud

Originally Posted by Sonnys88

Unfortunately, it sounds like you're dealing with a scam buyer.

When a buyer immediately claims that the package was not tampered with and that you didn't ship it - it is a huge red flag.

Share the buyer's username on here so they can be blocked.

Originally Posted by DynaEtch

Get through to the eBay phone rep during hours….they should be able to help you get to the bottom of it. It’s very possible if this is a one-time thing eBay would eat it and let you keep the funds, but not guaranteed I guess. No real way for them to arbitrate these he said/she said things in terms of knowing what happened. I would immediately block buyer. May be able to get some clues on their behavior checking their feedback left for others.

Just a quick follow-up, I finally spoke with someone at eBay (escalation agent) about the issue. I went through some random help/contact us page and requested a call back via AI chat bot, a little bit of a pain TBH.

Anyway, she told me that she activated my seller's protection and requested that I report the buyer. She was kind/patient and walked me through the steps. She said because of my "top seller" status, I'd be prioritized and she also provided me with a reference number for the call.

She reassured me that I wouldn't be out the funds, it'd be covered by eBay, but I still said that buyers like him shouldn't be allowed to continue operating on the platform.

She told me that the buyer has a history of such complaints (I only saw one feedback about it [positive] from a past seller, no longer registered with eBay, complaining about accepting a return and not getting the $50 card/item back) and there are consequences for such actions, e.g., account closure, although I doubt that'll actually happen.

Regarding the need to respond to the return request by Nov. 21, it was unclear what I needed to do. Based on how she responded, it seemed that I can either accept the return or just leave it to eBay (but, despite the documented call, I'd still likely be forced to accept the return). Once the "return" has been delivered, basically do what smanzari mentioned above. She reassured me that I'd be protected though, but until the funds are release, I'll still feel uneasy about the whole ordeal.

I'll share the username after everything's resolved (don't want random people messaging him and it somehow hurting my efforts to be taken care of). The amount that's at stake doesn't bug me as much as knowing the guy will successfully cheat the system and attempted to cheat out of the card/funds too. The latter really irks me.

[eastbayak]

Okay, a turn of events but another buyer opened up the same request (didn't receive their purchased card).

I know I shipped out that card too, and I only shipped out 2 mail bubblers in my most recent batch so it's just too much of a coincidence.

The second buyer also shared a picture of the mail bubbler and it didn't look exactly like how I shipped it out. I cover the packages entirely with packaging tape (to prevent theft/rips) but there was at least one portion of the mail bubbler that didn't have tape covering it. I'm waiting for additional photos from the second buyer.

But yeah, it seems that a USPS employee (either at my local/regional facility, Albany and Oakland, respectively) stole the cards. I've never really had issues with the Albany (local) location but I've had multiple issues at the Oakland (regional) location. Never this kind of issue though, usually tracking just stops and packages/PWEs (more so the latter, if even scanned), just stops there.

Obviously I'll refund the buyers because they didn't do anything wrong (sorry 1st guy for assuming you were a thief), but is there anything that I can do on my end or am I SOL? Even if it's bringing some extra attention to the regional facility, at least it might prevent/reduce such occurrences in the future.

[sthoemke]

File a police report for the stolen card. If it turns up online you might have a chance of getting it back (and knowing who took it).

[f2tornado]

Consider sending $100+ cards in a box sealed with security tape. It's far less likely for someone to take the time finagling with one of those. That's how I ship that price point and have yet to have an issue.

Still a chance you have two buyers in cahoots.

[Snowcat]

Originally Posted by f2tornado

Consider sending $100+ cards in a box sealed with security tape. It's far less likely for someone to take the time finagling with one of those. That's how I ship that price point and have yet to have an issue.

Still a chance you have two buyers in cahoots.

^This.

[eastbayak]

Originally Posted by sthoemke

File a police report for the stolen card. If it turns up online you might have a chance of getting it back (and knowing who took it).

Thanks man, I definitely plan to do this. Hopefully can be done online instead of in-person.

Originally Posted by f2tornado

Consider sending $100+ cards in a box sealed with security tape. It's far less likely for someone to take the time finagling with one of those. That's how I ship that price point and have yet to have an issue.

Still a chance you have two buyers in cahoots.

Appreciate the recommendation. Do you use the security tape on mail bubblers or on boxes (or both)?

Haha yeah, I suppose it's statistically possible but both had great feedback and didn't seem like the type. One even went out of his way to help a past buyer who was double-charged (per feedback) and also helped me with multiple photos. Not to mention, the mail bubbler wasn't taped up the same as I taped it in multiple places. I trust these guys, can't say the same about the Oakland USPS regional facility.

[Chris Lyle]

So since you had 2 issues, you're going to automatically assume that the 1st buyer is ok? Seems like you're taking a big chance with no photo of damage or something changed.

[jamcas997]

Ouch , Oakland yes many thefts from that regional hub. I had 5 items back in 2011/12 go missing from there. You need USPS inspectors to get on this.

[hanes1111]

Its worth a phone call to the buyers to see what's going on. Their phone #s are likely in the order details and I only do that in extreme cases. Its been my experience that talking the situation through with someone live helps immensely.

[eastbayak]

Originally Posted by Chris Lyle

So since you had 2 issues, you're going to automatically assume that the 1st buyer is ok? Seems like you're taking a big chance with no photo of damage or something changed.

I am. I've never had such an issue with USPS up until now (maybe lost/stolen packages but never cards stolen out of the package, re-taped and delivered.

Too much of a coincidence. Something shady in the local area.

Originally Posted by jamcas997

Ouch , Oakland yes many thefts from that regional hub. I had 5 items back in 2011/12 go missing from there. You need USPS inspectors to get on this.

Yeah, I need to submit the inspectors general report (as well as police report). Such a pain.

Originally Posted by hanes1111

Its worth a phone call to the buyers to see what's going on. Their phone #s are likely in the order details and I only do that in extreme cases. Its been my experience that talking the situation through with someone live helps immensely.

Haha, I actually attempted to speak with the 1st buyer. Not to inquire about the package though, to apologize for how things turned out (as stated earlier, it got a little heated). Wasn't able to reach him via phone but sent some messages back-and-forth, we're good now.

He wasn't the culprit, I'm confident.

[eastbayak]

Also, I posted about the issue (with supporting evidence) on sports cards nonsense. Although it was taken down by admin, before so, another member (from my area) mentioned that he recently experienced the same issue. He dropped off his package at the same local post office (I dropped mine off outside via drop box, adjacent to the post office). We're exchanging information right now, but it could even be more local (El Cerrito) than regional (Oakland). I said Albany because that's the location that processed the package but I forgot that I actually dropped it off in a drop box at El Cerrito. Actually, its also strange that Albany processed it when it was at the El Cerrito location (neighboring cities).

[eastbayak]

Wow, cards were even swiped from at least 1 of my PWE shipments (sent out same day as the 2 bubble mailers).

[eastbayak]

I'm starting to fear all cards shipped out that day were swiped.

[Bosoxfan5990]

This is wild. I'm sorry, eastbayak.

[eastbayak]

Originally Posted by Bosoxfan5990

This is wild. I'm sorry, eastbayak.

All's good, had a good run (of insignificant issues) until now.

More of a PSA for others though.

Unsure what one can do to protect themselves, but I'll file the necessary reports and be happy to share about the process with others (as well as help) in the future.

[mtgbayarea]

Hello, I found your thread, because I received an empty top loader in the mail when purchasing an 65$ magic the gathering card from a different seller.

Maybe our timeline matches up? My order was processed through SF on Nov18, and then processed through Oakland/El Cerrito on Nov 19, and Delivered on Nov 20.

Would you happen to have any advice on how to assist with this as a buyer? The seller initiated a return request for the packaging materials although I am unsure if anything else could be done on my part.

[Sonnys88]

Wow, definitely sounds like a serious issue with your local USPS locations and no doubt others would be affected as well.

If your local USPS postmaster is not willing to help or file the proper reports - file an official complaint with the USPS Postal Inspectors. And reach out to your local news stations - they will do a story if others also claim they have had their mail tampered with - especially around the holidays.

[jamcas997]

I have one shipping out Ground Advantage on Monday to Hayward, CA. This is a repeat buyer and last item 3 weeks ago made it no problem.

[Onyx Dragon]

Originally Posted by eastbayak

All's good, had a good run (of insignificant issues) until now.

More of a PSA for others though.

Unsure what one can do to protect themselves, but I'll file the necessary reports and be happy to share about the process with others (as well as help) in the future.

I was one of EASTBAYAK's buyers and believe me there's been a string of thefts of mails and parcels within USPS. Anyone whom has issues with USPS and possibly missing lots and lots of mail, especially those whom are donations or gifts of personal checks/money orders should reach out to USPIS:

https://www.uspis.gov/.

They were able to resolve my issue with a very dishonest mail carrier many moons ago. I was one of many whom this person decided to steal from.

[eastbayak]

Originally Posted by mtgbayarea

Hello, I found your thread, because I received an empty top loader in the mail when purchasing an 65$ magic the gathering card from a different seller.

Maybe our timeline matches up? My order was processed through SF on Nov18, and then processed through Oakland/El Cerrito on Nov 19, and Delivered on Nov 20.

Would you happen to have any advice on how to assist with this as a buyer? The seller initiated a return request for the packaging materials although I am unsure if anything else could be done on my part.

Although our timelines don't overlap (my packages were shipped out/processed on 11/15), it's very possible that the act was committed by the same individual (especially if yours went through El Cerrito).

Having already encountered 2 others who've had theft-related issues with packages shipped out from the EC location, this is more than a coincidence.

I'll PM you shortly.

Originally Posted by Sonnys88

Wow, definitely sounds like a serious issue with your local USPS locations and no doubt others would be affected as well.

If your local USPS postmaster is not willing to help or file the proper reports - file an official complaint with the USPS Postal Inspectors. And reach out to your local news stations - they will do a story if others also claim they have had their mail tampered with - especially around the holidays.

Yeah, it seems to be one specific post office too (which is good because we know which to avoid and USPS investigators will know which to apply the heat/pressure on).

I just submitted reports with USPS OIG. I just heard about USPIS too, are they different entities? I'll file report with as many federal mail-related offices as possible, 1 report per unique item to increase volume of reports and hopefully resulting in sooner action.

Originally Posted by jamcas997

I have one shipping out Ground Advantage on Monday to Hayward, CA. This is a repeat buyer and last item 3 weeks ago made it no problem.

Yeah, it seems like these incidents are related to one post office (El Cerrito). Oakland has its own issues though (occasionally), glad your packages are getting through without issue.

Originally Posted by Onyx Dragon

I was one of EASTBAYAK's buyers and believe me there's been a string of thefts of mails and parcels within USPS. Anyone whom has issues with USPS and possibly missing lots and lots of mail, especially those whom are donations or gifts of personal checks/money orders should reach out to USPIS:

https://www.uspis.gov/.

They were able to resolve my issue with a very dishonest mail carrier many moons ago. I was one of many whom this person decided to steal from.

Gregory, you've been very helpful in the process. Appreciate you for your support and for sharing your experience (both here and eBay). Because you guys caught your local USPS employee, I'm hopeful that we'll catch ours.