Official 2024 NFC North Thread

[Grid]

Originally Posted by packman80

See report out Justin Fields and Nick Foles did not like each other. Saying back in 2021 When Foles and Dalton were both on team and tried teaching the young QB he would pretty much ignore them. Makes you think is this why Chicago is not bringing in a experinced vet now with Williams thinking they could have same issue. When Nate Peterman is the vet on your roster no one is going to expect him to teach anything.

I don't think there is a connection. Fields for sure did not take to coaching very well. I liked Fields, dont get me wrong. But his confidence (arrogance) made him think he knew better than everyone else. Which is why he lashed out at his coaches before, saying he felt like a robot due to all the stuff they were asking him to do/change.

By most every account, Dalton and Foles are likable people. But Justin just wanted to play his game, his way, and didn't care what anyone else had to say about him. Even though they were just trying to help.

Nate Petermen is not on the Bears. They brought in Brett Rypien, who knows new OC Shane Waldron's scheme to help the others. Tyson Bagent, who did well in the reserve role last season. Is QB2

[jplarson]

Originally Posted by Grid

I don't think there is a connection. Fields for sure did not take to coaching very well. I liked Fields, dont get me wrong. But his confidence (arrogance) made him think he knew better than everyone else. Which is why he lashed out at his coaches before, saying he felt like a robot due to all the stuff they were asking him to do/change.

By most every account, Dalton and Foles are likable people. But Justin just wanted to play his game, his way, and didn't care what anyone else had to say about him. Even though they were just trying to help.

Nate Petermen is not on the Bears. They brought in Brett Rypien, who knows new OC Shane Waldron's scheme to help the others. Tyson Bagent, who did well in the reserve role last season. Is QB2

Yeah I don't know what he is trying to drive at here aside from typical s-posting on the Bears at 5:30 AM. I would expect the OC and QB Coach to be doing the actual training/development and lean on vets as a handy resource but nothing critical to the development.

Reversing the lens, seems like Jordan Love is doing just fine when his "mentor" Rodgers was ignoring him and Love only having 2nd year "veteran" Sean Clifford (who Packer fans say was a reach lol*) and 2024 rookie QB Michael Pratt to learn from. The OC and QB Coach made more of an impact which I would expect from any team. Backup QB vets are a nice to have but aren't the reason a young QB fails or succeeds.


*5th rounders aren't reaches. If a team's draft success depends on getting the 5th round right then fire your front office.

[Soxrule111]

I hope Im wrong, but Im going with
Lions 12-5
Packers 10-7
Bears 10-7
Vikings 7-10

Good competitive division. Caleb Goes 4044/32 Sets both Bears Records but Money bags has best Numbers in division thanks to deep throws and Gibbs

[Grid]

Highest paid players in the league, NFCN edition

Highest three-year APY:

QB Jared Goff (DET), $53 million #2
WR Amon-Ra St. Brown (DET), $30 million #2
TE T.J. Hockenson (MIN), $16 million #3
OT Penei Sewell,(DET) $28 million #1
CNTR Frank Ragnow,(DET) $14 million #1
CB Jaire Alexander, (GB)$21.8 million #1
LB Tremaine Edmunds (CHI), $19 million #3

[packman80]

Originally Posted by jplarson

Yeah I don't know what he is trying to drive at here aside from typical s-posting on the Bears at 5:30 AM. I would expect the OC and QB Coach to be doing the actual training/development and lean on vets as a handy resource but nothing critical to the development.

Reversing the lens, seems like Jordan Love is doing just fine when his "mentor" Rodgers was ignoring him and Love only having 2nd year "veteran" Sean Clifford (who Packer fans say was a reach lol*) and 2024 rookie QB Michael Pratt to learn from. The OC and QB Coach made more of an impact which I would expect from any team. Backup QB vets are a nice to have but aren't the reason a young QB fails or succeeds.


*5th rounders aren't reaches. If a team's draft success depends on getting the 5th round right then fire your front office.

Jordan Love got to sit behind a future HOF'er and be able to ask questions for 3 years. I doubt Love is needing to learn from a vet at this point. But if you need me to let me spell it out for you. Williams is being named the starter with no vet QB behind him. Sorry Brett Rypien is worthless and not any kind of vet QB. Also you say the OC and QB coach is the most important? Well I would be really worried since the Bears coaches have failed to ever be able to coach up a QB. If the Bears were smart they would have signed a vet to not only have a QB Williams can go to for advice but also have a fall back option in case Williams struggles early. I have always thought the worst thing to do is throw a rookie QB no matter who or what team to the wolves right away. Most of the time it never works out. Even if you have a rookie sit for part or full season it can allow them to sit and learn and not get destroyed mentally and physically when they are probably unprepared to start right out of the gate.

[packman80]

Originally Posted by Soxrule111

I hope Im wrong, but Im going with
Lions 12-5
Packers 10-7
Bears 10-7
Vikings 7-10

Good competitive division. Caleb Goes 4044/32 Sets both Bears Records but Money bags has best Numbers in division thanks to deep throws and Gibbs

People are expecting way to much out of Williams those stats he probably is a top 5 passer right away. I think good season for Williams right away is 3200-3500 yards 23-25 TDs 12-15 INTs

[jplarson]

Originally Posted by packman80

Jordan Love got to sit behind a future HOF'er and be able to ask questions for 3 years. I doubt Love is needing to learn from a vet at this point. But if you need me to let me spell it out for you. Williams is being named the starter with no vet QB behind him. Sorry Brett Rypien is worthless and not any kind of vet QB. Also you say the OC and QB coach is the most important? Well I would be really worried since the Bears coaches have failed to ever be able to coach up a QB. If the Bears were smart they would have signed a vet to not only have a QB Williams can go to for advice but also have a fall back option in case Williams struggles early. I have always thought the worst thing to do is throw a rookie QB no matter who or what team to the wolves right away. Most of the time it never works out. Even if you have a rookie sit for part or full season it can allow them to sit and learn and not get destroyed mentally and physically when they are probably unprepared to start right out of the gate.

This wall of text is meaningless.

The hate for everything Chicago-adjacent makes any analysis biased.

Once objectivity can be achieved I'll debate the merits.

Originally Posted by packman80

Chicago fans are trash but what can you expect from that city.

[blackandgold]

Vegas got the Bears over/under at 8.5 I like the under

[Boo]

Originally Posted by blackandgold

Vegas got the Bears over/under at 8.5 I like the under

[packman80]

Originally Posted by jplarson

This wall of text is meaningless.

The hate for everything Chicago-adjacent makes any analysis biased.

Once objectivity can be achieved I'll debate the merits.

SMH you just can't agree with a Packer fan that I brought up a good point that it's often not wise to start a rookie QB right away week one and is best to let them have a good vet QB to learn from. But don't worry I still like you.

[jplarson]

Originally Posted by blackandgold

Vegas got the Bears over/under at 8.5 I like the under

I'd take the under all day.

This was my February prediction:

Originally Posted by jplarson

2024 NFC North
Detroit Lions 11-6
Green Bay Packers 8-9
Chicago Bears 8-9
Minnesota Vikings 6-11

Now that we're past FA and the draft I'm revising my rankings:

Detroit Lions 10-7
Green Bay Packers 9-8
Chicago Bears 8-9
Minnesota Vikings 5-12 (sorry Goldy )

I may revise it once more during preseason depending on injuries otherwise I feel pretty good about this.

[blackandgold]

Originally Posted by jplarson

I'd take the under all day.

This was my February prediction:



Now that we're past FA and the draft I'm revising my rankings:

Detroit Lions 10-7
Green Bay Packers 9-8
Chicago Bears 8-9
Minnesota Vikings 5-12 (sorry Goldy )

I may revise it once more during preseason depending on injuries otherwise I feel pretty good about this.

Although I hate to say it Packman80 makes a great point about not having a Vet to guide him throughout the year. He will be under an extreme amount of pressure playing savior to the fan base. Not gonna be a good look when he has a stinker game

[jplarson]

Originally Posted by packman80

SMH you just can't agree with a Packer fan that I brought up a good point that it's often not wise to start a rookie QB right away week one and is best to let them have a good vet QB to learn from. But don't worry I still like you.

I missed this lil nugget of decades old conventional wisdom sandwiched between the condescension, mocking, and general insults. Why would anyone agree with anything when the comments around it are dripping with disdain?

[Grid]

Originally Posted by packman80

SMH you just can't agree with a Packer fan that I brought up a good point that it's often not wise to start a rookie QB right away week one and is best to let them have a good vet QB to learn from. But don't worry I still like you.

I can agree with a Packer Backer. And I do agree with you in theory, but that just isn't the way the league works. At least not with a top 10 pick. Let alone a #1.

Rodgers got to sit under Favre. Rodgers was also the 24th pick in the draft, and one with (even at the time) a very weak QB draft class. Him sitting behind a known future HOFer was expected by all. He wasnt coming out to outplay Favre as the starter. He was supposed to sit and cook.

Ditto Love sitting behind Rodgers. Love was the 4th QB taken. He was never meant to take over the team his 1st year. Just like Rodgers being the long play for when Favre was gone. That was Love's role.

It worked out great for both of them! But all of the QB's taken in those sames drafts, in the top 10, were pretty much day 1 starters for their teams. Alex Smith, Herbert, Tua & Burrow.

If the Bears pay up for a decent starting Vet QB, and have Caleb sit and learn for 2-3 years. That is 2-3 years of not taking advantage of a rookie QB, on a crazy cheap deal, that allows you to spend on other players

[packman80]

Originally Posted by Grid

I can agree with a Packer Backer. And I do agree with you in theory, but that just isn't the way the league works. At least not with a top 10 pick. Let alone a #1.

Rodgers got to sit under Favre. Rodgers was also the 24th pick in the draft, and one with (even at the time) a very weak QB draft class. Him sitting behind a known future HOFer was expected by all. He wasnt coming out to outplay Favre as the starter. He was supposed to sit and cook.

Ditto Love sitting behind Rodgers. Love was the 4th QB taken. He was never meant to take over the team his 1st year. Just like Rodgers being the long play for when Favre was gone. That was Love's role.

It worked out great for both of them! But all of the QB's taken in those sames drafts, in the top 10, were pretty much day 1 starters for their teams. Alex Smith, Herbert, Tua & Burrow.

If the Bears pay up for a decent starting Vet QB, and have Caleb sit and learn for 2-3 years. That is 2-3 years of not taking advantage of a rookie QB, on a crazy cheap deal, that allows you to spend on other players

Don't even need to sit 2-3 years look in KC they drafted Mahomes had him sit behind Smith for 1 year then handed the reigns over to him. I think had Rodgers went to anywhere besides GB and been forced to start year one he would have been a bust. He needed to learn and also him sitting allowed Mike McCarthy to adjust how he held the ball. Coming out of college he had the strange thing of holding the football next to his earhole on his helmet. He was able to be taught to hold ball different which I think helped his mechanics and made him a better QB.

[Grid]

Originally Posted by packman80

Don't even need to sit 2-3 years look in KC they drafted Mahomes had him sit behind Smith for 1 year then handed the reigns over to him. I think had Rodgers went to anywhere besides GB and been forced to start year one he would have been a bust. He needed to learn and also him sitting allowed Mike McCarthy to adjust how he held the ball. Coming out of college he had the strange thing of holding the football next to his earhole on his helmet. He was able to be taught to hold ball different which I think helped his mechanics and made him a better QB.

Im exhausted. Sorry you don't understand my rebuttal. I'll do better...

Favre = HOF QB. GB = Good Team. That is why Rodgers was drafted so late, as GB was already winning. They could afford to let him cook.

Rodgers = HOF QB. GB = Good Team. That is why Love was drafted so late, as GB was already winning. They could afford to let him cook.

You tossed Mahomes out there. So...

Alex Smith = good QB. KC was a winner (12-4 the season before Mahomes). KC traded up from 27th to get Mahomes. 2017 KC won their division, had home field in the playoff. They could afford to let Pat cook.

49ers before Alex Smith, did not have a good team or QB to sit behind. They were 2-14, which is why they picked #1. Chargers were 5-11, Rivers on his way out of the league. Herbert had to start. Bengals 2-14, Dalton was horrible. Burrow had to start. Dolphins were 5-11, Fitzpatrick not good. Tua had to start.

You are trying to make it seem like these teams that draft top 10, have HOF QB's that know the system and are playing winning football. Thats not how it works. Well, not without something weird happening.

You pick a QB that high, because you desperately need a QB. And if you think its best to go out and hire a good pricey Vet, to then pick high and cook a QB. You should be the GM of the Falcons.

[jplarson]

Originally Posted by Grid

You pick a QB that high, because you desperately need a QB. And if you think its best to go out and hire a good pricey Vet, to then pick high and cook a QB. You should be the GM of the Falcons.

Boom.

[hairysasquatch]

Three year window for the Lions to win it all!

[TheFrenzy]

[erock28]

Originally Posted by TheFrenzy

This and the 2023 iteration are my favorite threads ever. None of the other 7 divisions have had a single thread (I don't think????), yet we're mid-400's post count...for this upcoming season...by mid-May! Come on out NFC North fans, let the hate flow!!!!

[erock28]

Originally Posted by Grid

Im exhausted. Sorry you don't understand my rebuttal. I'll do better...

Favre = HOF QB. GB = Good Team. That is why Rodgers was drafted so late, as GB was already winning. They could afford to let him cook.

Rodgers = HOF QB. GB = Good Team. That is why Love was drafted so late, as GB was already winning. They could afford to let him cook.

You tossed Mahomes out there. So...

Alex Smith = good QB. KC was a winner (12-4 the season before Mahomes). KC traded up from 27th to get Mahomes. 2017 KC won their division, had home field in the playoff. They could afford to let Pat cook.

49ers before Alex Smith, did not have a good team or QB to sit behind. They were 2-14, which is why they picked #1. Chargers were 5-11, Rivers on his way out of the league. Herbert had to start. Bengals 2-14, Dalton was horrible. Burrow had to start. Dolphins were 5-11, Fitzpatrick not good. Tua had to start.

You are trying to make it seem like these teams that draft top 10, have HOF QB's that know the system and are playing winning football. Thats not how it works. Well, not without something weird happening.

You pick a QB that high, because you desperately need a QB. And if you think its best to go out and hire a good pricey Vet, to then pick high and cook a QB. You should be the GM of the Falcons.

Everything you're saying makes perfect sense - and totally correct by today's NFL standards. That said, unless Bears brass REALLY believes the secret Bagent man can be a legit NFL backup, things could go south in a hurry if Williams struggles. The 1.1 plays, no matter what. But if poops the bed, an otherwise decent team will be dragged down with him.

[hairysasquatch]

Originally Posted by erock28

This and the 2023 iteration are my favorite threads ever. None of the other 7 divisions have had a single thread (I don't think????), yet we're mid-400's post count...for this upcoming season...by mid-May! Come on out NFC North fans, let the hate flow!!!!

This is the best division - fight me IRL!

[TheFrenzy]

Originally Posted by hairysasquatch

This is the best division - fight me IRL!

I heard someone wanted to punch you in the nuts.

[hairysasquatch]

Originally Posted by TheFrenzy

I heard someone wanted to punch you in the nuts.

That's not fighting - that's weird

[TheFrenzy]

Originally Posted by hairysasquatch

That's not fighting - that's weird

Very.