Target Online Sales Thread

[JeremyNick]

Originally Posted by Charmcity81

They actually don’t have to devote capital and manpower. Maybe a small retailer. They can sit around, once the product is release, wait 5 min. Open up the system, and Cancel every order. You don’t get it still. I would tell my team who cares about the bots and stuff. All they need is to see the orders. You ever think of that. You probably Pay for a bot. Let’s say you placed 50 orders of 2020 nfl mega boxes and every order went through under 45sec. Your VPN is not hiding your address and zip codes. Anyone who can place that many orders under min, I’m pretty sure any high level security person sees a red flag


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This has been discussed ad nauseam in the other thread. They have forwarding addresses, virtual cc’s - all kinds of work arounds to block and thwart these seemingly simple fixes.

If it was a simple fix with little effort involved, retail bots would not be successful.
It pushes past the law of diminishing returns with the amount of effort needed to block what for most companies is a minor irritation.

[ronzo]

Originally Posted by Charmcity81

They actually don’t have to devote capital and manpower. Maybe a small retailer. They can sit around, once the product is release, wait 5 min. Open up the system, and Cancel every order. You don’t get it still. I would tell my team who cares about the bots and stuff. All they need is to see the orders. You ever think of that. You probably Pay for a bot. Let’s say you placed 50 orders of 2020 nfl mega boxes and every order went through under 45sec. Your VPN is not hiding your address and zip codes. Anyone who can place that many orders under min, I’m pretty sure any high level security person sees a red flag


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But why? You refuse to answer me, instead go rambling on about cyber security and hacking credit card numbers. So they cancel the orders, now the next round another round of botters buys them out and they cancel 95% of the orders again. This repeats for how long, to end at the same result of selling their product.

[Charmcity81]

The creator of the bot, should be prosecuted, he created a software to sell for financial gains which in that code breaches there system. It would be different if his goal was to help companies solve the problem.


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[JeremyNick]

Originally Posted by Charmcity81

The creator of the bot, should be prosecuted, he created a software to sell for financial gains which in that code breaches there system. It would be different if his goal was to help companies solve the problem.


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On that we somewhat agree.

I think if bots continue to ravage the online retail landscape you’ll see an expansion of the BOTS Act to all retail space, not just tickets and events.

[Charmcity81]

Originally Posted by ronzo

But why? You refuse to answer me, instead go rambling on about cyber security and hacking credit card numbers. So they cancel the orders, now the next round another round of botters buys them out and they cancel 95% of the orders again. This repeats for how long, to end at the same result of selling their product.

Wrong, again. Target wouldn’t need to change anything. Those botters would get caught the same way. You make it, sound like it’s take all this effort. How, 1000 people aren’t ordering product. That’s the point, man. Your thinking lot a hacker, not the other way around.


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[Charmcity81]

Originally Posted by JeremyNick

On that we somewhat agree.

I think if bots continue to ravage the online retail landscape you’ll see an expansion of the BOTS Act to all retail space, not just tickets and events.

Tonight read this - ask your self. How could we change this

Red Teams are offensive security focused. They simulate how a possible attacker would attack cybersecurity defenses. Blue Teams are defense focused. They architect and maintain the protective internal cybersecurity infrastructure.


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[Charmcity81]

Tomorrow, calling my Boy since childhood , just saw him last week. I’m going to tell him let Jaime know I’m going to text her tom. That’s his sister in law. She is the director for IT Security & chief information security officer for DOJ. I’ll ask her what she thinks.

[salthill]

Originally Posted by Charmcity81

The creator of the bot, should be prosecuted, he created a software to sell for financial gains which in that code breaches there system. It would be different if his goal was to help companies solve the problem.


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You keep using the word “breach”. Ask your buddy to explain what that means in this context. Bots are not breaching Target’s system. (They’d be particularly sensitive to this, given they suffered a real - and very public - breach a few years ago.)

Also, which PBM are you?

[thenightman]

If all you care about is getting your hands on product then the only argument is for mass production.

If all you care about is bots getting their hands on product because they get to resale and you don't then the only argument is to STFU because nobody cares.

[Charmcity81]

Me not any, engineers all 4 categories. All at expert level.


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[Charmcity81]

Heard of SANS ?


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[J1L]

This charm guy is wilding in here lol. Literally has no clue what he’s talking about. I was going to try and respond but he posted so much false info I don’t know where to start. Hacking, breaching, etc bots do none of this.

One thing people forget is the advantage of being small and agile. A bot developer can push a hot fix in the middle of a drop and beat whatever defense a site has put up. It happens every week with shoes. Also, target and Walmart DONT CARE. They make some changes to save face but in the end they sell the product.

[ronzo]

Originally Posted by Charmcity81

Me not any, engineers all 4 categories. All at expert level.


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What are you even posting at this point. This is a thread for baseball cards sir.

[Charmcity81]

Originally Posted by thenightman

If all you care about is getting your hands on product then the only argument is for mass production.

If all you care about is bots getting their hands on product because they get to resale and you don't then the only argument is to STFU because nobody cares.

I don’t resell but the reseller like yourself self, would be screwed. You all think, that bots can out smart the world. What would happened. If you couldn’t score anymore.
For me, I’m fine. You doesn’t seem so, got really pissed. You depend on this to pay bills.


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[WalterAZ31]

definitely a PBM

[Charmcity81]

Only reason I’m going to make a change, is because you can’t keep your mouth shut on Twitter and post, and brag. Dude why weren’t you buying out targets and Walmart’s in 2019.

Your not a leader, your called a follower.


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[J1L]

And countdown to thread lock....

[wxguy44]

Originally Posted by J1L

And countdown to thread lock....

hope not...its just one person causing issue

[thenightman]

Originally Posted by Charmcity81

I don’t resell but the reseller like yourself self, would be screwed. You all think, that bots can out smart the world. What would happened. If you couldn’t score anymore.
For me, I’m fine. You doesn’t seem so, got really pissed. You depend on this to pay bills.


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I have resold and I've moved away from wax and have started selling singles. Been doing that for months now.

I don't think bots can outsmart the world, I just think retailers will only do the bare minimum to give off the impression that they care about what every day collectors think about bots snatching up all the product. In reality, they're happy because cards are instant sell-outs and they're making a boat load of money.

The true and only way to beat the bots is to blow the whole thing up; i.e. mass production. Just pump out as much wax until nobody wants it anymore. Bots come in and buy 1000 boxes. That's cool, a week later there'll be another 1000. The week after that, another 1000. This will make every collector in the world happy because they'll get to do what they want to do, which is rip wax and collect cards.

The resellers will complain because they lost their golden goose. Then they'll leave and in 10 to 20 years we'll be doing it all over again.

[J1L]

Originally Posted by thenightman

I have resold and I've moved away from wax and have started selling singles. Been doing that for months now.

I don't think bots can outsmart the world, I just think retailers will only do the bare minimum to give off the impression that they care about what every day collectors think about bots snatching up all the product. In reality, they're happy because cards are instant sell-outs and they're making a boat load of money.

The true and only way to beat the bots is to blow the whole thing up; i.e. mass production. Just pump out as much wax until nobody wants it anymore. Bots come in and buy 1000 boxes. That's cool, a week later there'll be another 1000. The week after that, another 1000. This will make every collector in the world happy because they'll get to do what they want to do, which is rip wax and collect cards.

The resellers will complain because they lost their golden goose. Then they'll leave and in 10 to 20 years we'll be doing it all over again.

This is what’s going to happen. And resellers will move on to next thing. Greed too strong to stop mass production, it’s coming. The bubble will burst and the song will go from “I want the old hobby back” to “I wish I could sell my Prizm base RC for 5x again”. And your dead on about 20 years and we will do it again haha

[IlliniBear]

Is there a chance there's a drop tomorrow morning? I'm thinking it's going to be more like Friday morning but really it could happen at any time.

[thenightman]

Originally Posted by J1L

This is what’s going to happen. And resellers will move on to next thing. Greed too strong to stop mass production, it’s coming. The bubble will burst and the song will go from “I want the old hobby back” to “I wish I could sell my Prizm base RC for 5x again”. And your dead on about 20 years and we will do it again haha

It's the most realistic scenario, really. I mean, what else are Topps and Panini supposed to do? I can only imagine the amount of hate they get, present company included, over the way things are going. The only answer is to just give the people what they want. Really, if you think about it, it's best for the hobby long term. Grading prices are beyond unreasonable, plebs can't get their hands on retail, and you got to take out a 2nd mortgage just to get a hobby box nowadays. I don't see how any of this is sustainable.

[Mahomie]

Originally Posted by thenightman

The true and only way to beat the bots is to blow the whole thing up; i.e. mass production.

Pretty much.

[BRob1]

Originally Posted by thenightman

The true and only way to beat the bots is to blow the whole thing up; i.e. mass production. Just pump out as much wax until nobody wants it anymore. Bots come in and buy 1000 boxes. That's cool, a week later there'll be another 1000. The week after that, another 1000. This will make every collector in the world happy because they'll get to do what they want to do, which is rip wax and collect cards.

The resellers will complain because they lost their golden goose. Then they'll leave and in 10 to 20 years we'll be doing it all over again.

The other option is raise the price, or create a new format. Right now there is no option between a $20 blaster and a $1400 hobby box (ok megas, but that’s not what I’m talking about). Good blasters are “worth” $100-150 based on resale price. Consumers need some option in the $100-200 range either with a price increase on blasters to take some of the margin out of flipping, or create a new “hobby lite” product at say $200 that is the equivalent of say a mega.

[Hoopscardz83]

Will see what Target does online this week when it comes to bots. Target has made strides, but nowhere near where they need to be.

Single prices are dropping and wax prices are dropping. The market is in a weird spot now. Target not selling cards, day by day covid restrictions lesson.

The next test is what happens with the Target online release after the in store suspension of card sales. If Walmart can handle the new increase of traffic is the question. If all product gets botted the hobby will be done for many.

The NBA playoffs will also show us how good the market is.