Why are Muhammad Ali auto cards undervalued compared to the other greats (GOATs) ?

[MavsRChamps]

Originally Posted by shu4040

hey all - if interested i have my sealed my 2000 master collection set in the monthly PWCC auction.

Its now an absurdly low price of $210 (um maybe PWCC was a poor choice since these were last like 7K on ebay)

https://www.pwccmarketplace.com/items/3033348

I think it'll go near or even above $7K - Still early. I have 1 sealed I bought last year, not looking to sell anytime soon but definitely hope you get a good price for yours.

[shu4040]

Originally Posted by MavsRChamps

I think it'll go near or even above $7K - Still early. I have 1 sealed I bought last year, not looking to sell anytime soon but definitely hope you get a good price for yours.

Thanks I hope so! I have a couple autos from the set still but have had a few big purchases lately so figured it was time to move on from it- I hope it finds a good home


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[yoyosh]

Just wanted this one encapsulated, it sat at PSA for almost 9 months but back today:

[nabzy28]

Originally Posted by yoyosh

Just wanted this one encapsulated, it sat at PSA for almost 9 months but back today:

Nice! I've noticed that even the Leaf "Greatest" boxes are now pushing $800.

[gottagitdemjs]

Was finally able to pick up a PSA/DNA authenticated Cassius Clay version!

[kingofsnake]

Originally Posted by gottagitdemjs

Was finally able to pick up a PSA/DNA authenticated Cassius Clay version!

Did they encapsule all Pro Line cards backwards like that? That's interesting.

[gottagitdemjs]

Originally Posted by kingofsnake

Did they encapsule all Pro Line cards backwards like that? That's interesting.

I think you have to ask them to.

[salthill]

Originally Posted by gottagitdemjs

Was finally able to pick up a PSA/DNA authenticated Cassius Clay version!

Did he continue signing as Cassius Clay after 1964?

Asking as this is one of my favourite cards (I’m a Dolphins fan too), and I’d love to buy one but I’ve read so much about the faked versions of it.

A little more about Ali fakes…
https://theathletic.com/1827419/2020...li-autographs/

[gottagitdemjs]

Originally Posted by salthill

Did he continue signing as Cassius Clay after 1964?

Asking as this is one of my favourite cards (I’m a Dolphins fan too), and I’d love to buy one but I’ve read so much about the faked versions of it.

A little more about Ali fakes…
https://theathletic.com/1827419/2020...li-autographs/

Yes, he signed very few of the Pro Line Portraits with the name Cassius Clay. It's listed in Beckett as version A (Ali back) and version B (Clay back). I would definitely recommend staying away from ungraded versions. Beckett has only authenticated 6 of the Clay version.

[aggie4ever]

Saw that a Master Collection robe+trunk auto graded BGS 9.0/10 sold recently for $5700:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/29495564041...UAAOSwsX1ia1Hy

Nice to see these selling strong! I remember buying some raw in the $500-650 range several years ago, and I'm happy I picked up several. Happy that my decision to collect the GOAT many years ago has finally worked out so well!

[Bart Allen]

Originally Posted by aggie4ever

Saw that a Master Collection robe+trunk auto graded BGS 9.0/10 sold recently for $5700:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/29495564041...UAAOSwsX1ia1Hy

Nice to see these selling strong! I remember buying some raw in the $500-650 range several years ago, and I'm happy I picked up several. Happy that my decision to collect the GOAT many years ago has finally worked out so well!

Is it even worth it getting the fight trunks, gloves and rope (without the signature)? :O

[wdmullins]

Along with a signed Islam tract, I got this through the mail ca. 1993.

[Algo]

Hey guys! Sorry to resurrect a dead thread but I wanted to get your opinions on this...

I was speaking to one of the biggest Muhammad Ali collectors in the world (he owns many vintage Ali and Cassius Clay signed pieces, including training and fight worn memorabilia).

We both couldn't understand why sports cards (eg 1960 Hemmets) are worth more than actual Muhammad Ali fight worn stuff and think it's crazy.

Your insight would be much appreciated!

[Cactuspies]

Originally Posted by Algo

Hey guys! Sorry to resurrect a dead thread but I wanted to get your opinions on this...

I was speaking to one of the biggest Muhammad Ali collectors in the world (he owns many vintage Ali and Cassius Clay signed pieces, including training and fight worn memorabilia).

We both couldn't understand why sports cards (eg 1960 Hemmets) are worth more than actual Muhammad Ali fight worn stuff and think it's crazy.

Your insight would be much appreciated!

Storage issues are probably the biggest reason, and maybe authentication prices. Someone can buy the whole shebang and cut it down for the rest of us to get a piece of.

for some reason, a small swatch in a card goes for more than the actual full product would. it's a crazy world.

win win all around I suppose in the end.

[nabzy28]

Originally Posted by Algo

Hey guys! Sorry to resurrect a dead thread but I wanted to get your opinions on this...

I was speaking to one of the biggest Muhammad Ali collectors in the world (he owns many vintage Ali and Cassius Clay signed pieces, including training and fight worn memorabilia).

We both couldn't understand why sports cards (eg 1960 Hemmets) are worth more than actual Muhammad Ali fight worn stuff and think it's crazy.

Your insight would be much appreciated!

Many reasons, I'd imagine, but you'd have to ask the people in that specific market. Portability and ease would be considered. Being able to display such a piece would be another. Cards are more widely collected, etc. Same thing in other sports. Top auto'd/jersey cards of just about any player will go for more than a game used/signed jersey.

[mikecala98]

Picked this up recently. Got it for a great price but always will have concerns about it.





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[gameissued]

Gotta lean toward no on that.. just doesn’t look right.

Originally Posted by mikecala98

Picked this up recently. Got it for a great price but always will have concerns about it.

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[Grid]

Originally Posted by Algo

Hey guys! Sorry to resurrect a dead thread but I wanted to get your opinions on this...

I was speaking to one of the biggest Muhammad Ali collectors in the world (he owns many vintage Ali and Cassius Clay signed pieces, including training and fight worn memorabilia).

We both couldn't understand why sports cards (eg 1960 Hemmets) are worth more than actual Muhammad Ali fight worn stuff and think it's crazy.

Your insight would be much appreciated!

There are many more card collectors, than memorabilia collectors it seems. Not just with boxing, but across all sports.

The same reason a 51 or 52 Mantle in great condition is worth way more than a Mantle signed jersey. A Mantle game used jersey can sell for $500K, but a high grade 1952 Topps has sold for over $5MIL

For the 1960 Hemmets Clay, that is considered his rookie card. And even those who do not collect boxing would still want an RC of The Greatest in their collection.

A pair of his trucks is not something they would chase (which would lead to higher prices). But to add a top RC of one of the greatest athletes in modern sports is.

[DontToewsMeBro]

Many people still despise and hate Ali from back in the 60's when he dodged Vietnam. Many still hold a grudge.

[Algo]

Originally Posted by Cactuspies

Storage issues are probably the biggest reason, and maybe authentication prices. Someone can buy the whole shebang and cut it down for the rest of us to get a piece of.

for some reason, a small swatch in a card goes for more than the actual full product would. it's a crazy world.

win win all around I suppose in the end.

Thanks for all your feedback guys (I don't know how to quote everybody), my theory was that people are scared of autographs unless it's from a licensed product (topps/ud), and could have similar concerns regarding provenance of training/fight worn items.
So you've given me insight into other reasons that I didn't consider.

Personally I would not pay huge money for a tiny square cut out from a glove or robe, I'd want the whole piece or nothing at all.

[Algo]

Originally Posted by DontToewsMeBro

Many people still despise and hate Ali from back in the 60's when he dodged Vietnam. Many still hold a grudge.

This right here makes me think of this quote:
"A lion doesn't concern himself with the opinion of sheep"

[DontToewsMeBro]

Originally Posted by Algo

This right here makes me think of this quote:
"A lion doesn't concern himself with the opinion of sheep"

Ask a Vietnam vet what they think of Ali.
Then say that quote and call him a "sheep".
See what happens.

[Algo]

Originally Posted by DontToewsMeBro

Ask a Vietnam vet what they think of Ali.
Then say that quote and call him a "sheep".
See what happens.

I don't really give a #@#@#@#@ tbh.
Unfortunately till this day sheep blindly follow orders by corrupt politicians and officials under the guise of "patriotism".

Attacking a third world country for no reason, the tragic result was more post-war suicides than deaths in actual combat, due to the devastating effects of a pointless war on the psyche.

Ali saw through the bull***, and if you and others don't like him because of that, then it only makes him greater in my eyes because he did the right thing.

[MavsRChamps]

Curious if anyone saw any Ali autos at the National? I went yesterday and I didn’t look everywhere but saw nothing. I’m not necessarily a buyer since I have enough but may consider if price is right. Just mainly curious.

[corndog]

I am just now seeing this thread.
I created a thread in 2015 to warn collectors of forged/counterfeit stamped Ali 1992 Pro Line cards.

It is here: https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=878278

The creator of the counterfeits also had his forgeries "authenticated" and/or graded by PSA and Beckett.

Personally, I would completely avoid all Pro Line autos of Ali and Cassius Clay.
The Beckett slabbed Cassius Clay 1992 Pro Line National embossed signed card a few posts up looks exactly like a Ketron forgery.
I am very aware that Ketron purchased multiple unsigned Ali Pro Line National embossed cards as well as dozens and dozens of the regular (unsigned) base cards.