Rank the COA companies

[unclemonkey]

I am working on a collection of autographed baseballs.

Do JSA, PSA, Beckett, Fanatics all rank the same?

Are there any to stay away from?

[jdandns]

Best to worst:

1. 5ladys
2. All others

[dropshot808]

I would add Steiner to the list.

[BlowoutBuzz]

Steiner, TRISTAR and Fanatics mostly sell the stuff they pay to get signed. That's different than third-party authenticators.

[ucLAkers]

JSA/PSA same......but if your looking to get fakes authenticated then look no further than.......... https://www.globalauthentics.com/certcheck/main.asp

[rj.cataldo]

I am pretty active in autographs and have been for some time. I go to shows, buy online, and direct from companies. Included my thoughts below, with regard to the MAJOR companies, but one thing to note is there are several companies that have (or had) exclusives with select athletes which may not be well known, but are completely legit. I couldn't list them all out, but I just wanted to note that there are other completely legit companies, that are reputable, but not listed below, many of which I would put in Tier 1/2. You just have to do your research. In my opinion, this is how I look at the COAs:

Tier 1 - Ironclad: MLB authentication solo or combined with a company. Fanatics authentics, NEW Steiner, TriStar, Panini, Topps [Would include recent UDA, but they don't do baseball anymore] - These are the items that I buy with total faith. They have well documented exclusives and are the standard of the industry

Tier 2 - Trust, but verify: Older UDA items, Mounted Memories, Older Steiner, JSA Witness Protection, PSA In the Presence, Reggie Jackson - Like the above, these are all reputable companies that I trust, however they are prone to some forgers as there are examples of old holograms being moved to new items (UDA/Steiner) or abuse of "In person" 3rd party services (such as bringing fake items to the show). I always check to make sure they pass the eye test.

Tier 3 - A valuable Opinion: PSA/DNA, JSA, [Note: I own no SGC so I can't speak to them, and BAS is too new for me to have an opinion] - These are the only third parties I use. I ONLY use third party for vintage/deceased players (with the occasional exception of in person authentication listed in Tier 2), because there is no other option in most cases. These COAs can add value and confidence to a piece, but there are many well documented BAD autos that have gotten through. They are simply an opinion of a trained professional, but the quality of authentication can vary. For any of my BIG vintage pieces, I get BOTH. I also ALWAYS, do research online. PSA has a very good online library of exemplar signatures for most HOFers and stars. It's very helpful to weed out suspect items.

Tier 4 - Buyer Beware: These are the items/authentication that may have, at one point, been legit, maybe even reputable, but are very prone to fakes due to their methods of authentication OR the companies themselves went/were crooked. Generally, just stay away from these - There are too many to list but some include, Scoreboard, MVP, ASI, GAI, ACE, Say Hey/Mays (unless accompanied with MLB), Green Diamond (Williams)

[dmanrico]

Originally Posted by rj.cataldo

I am pretty active in autographs and have been for some time. I go to shows, buy online, and direct from companies. Included my thoughts below, with regard to the MAJOR companies, but one thing to note is there are several companies that have (or had) exclusives with select athletes which may not be well known, but are completely legit. I couldn't list them all out, but I just wanted to note that there are other completely legit companies, that are reputable, but not listed below, many of which I would put in Tier 1/2. You just have to do your research. In my opinion, this is how I look at the COAs:

Tier 1 - Ironclad: MLB authentication solo or combined with a company. Fanatics authentics, NEW Steiner, TriStar, Panini, Topps [Would include recent UDA, but they don't do baseball anymore] - These are the items that I buy with total faith. They have well documented exclusives and are the standard of the industry

Tier 2 - Trust, but verify: Older UDA items, Mounted Memories, Older Steiner, JSA Witness Protection, PSA In the Presence, Reggie Jackson - Like the above, these are all reputable companies that I trust, however they are prone to some forgers as there are examples of old holograms being moved to new items (UDA/Steiner) or abuse of "In person" 3rd party services (such as bringing fake items to the show). I always check to make sure they pass the eye test.

Tier 3 - A valuable Opinion: PSA/DNA, JSA, [Note: I own no SGC so I can't speak to them, and BAS is too new for me to have an opinion] - These are the only third parties I use. I ONLY use third party for vintage/deceased players (with the occasional exception of in person authentication listed in Tier 2), because there is no other option in most cases. These COAs can add value and confidence to a piece, but there are many well documented BAD autos that have gotten through. They are simply an opinion of a trained professional, but the quality of authentication can vary. For any of my BIG vintage pieces, I get BOTH. I also ALWAYS, do research online. PSA has a very good online library of exemplar signatures for most HOFers and stars. It's very helpful to weed out suspect items.

Tier 4 - Buyer Beware: These are the items/authentication that may have, at one point, been legit, maybe even reputable, but are very prone to fakes due to their methods of authentication OR the companies themselves went/were crooked. Generally, just stay away from these - There are too many to list but some include, Scoreboard, MVP, ASI, GAI, ACE, Say Hey/Mays (unless accompanied with MLB), Green Diamond (Williams)

Great info. Thanks for sharing!

[unclemonkey]

That was very helpful... thank you!

[Tradegeek]

Originally Posted by ucLAkers

JSA/PSA same......but if your looking to get fakes authenticated then look no further than.......... https://www.globalauthentics.com/certcheck/main.asp

Ya... a Global sticker is the kiss of death. If you took a pristine white, authentic Mickey Mantle autographed ball and put a Global sticker on it.. it would sell for about $75 on eBay.

[Tradegeek]

Originally Posted by rj.cataldo

Tier 4 - Buyer Beware: These are the items/authentication that may have, at one point, been legit, maybe even reputable, but are very prone to fakes due to their methods of authentication OR the companies themselves went/were crooked. Generally, just stay away from these - There are too many to list but some include, Scoreboard, MVP, ASI, GAI, ACE, Say Hey/Mays (unless accompanied with MLB), Green Diamond (Williams)

Great info. Totally agree, with one minor exception. Green Diamond (The company Ted Williams son owned) are typically good. Ted's family was a bit.. well... nuts. They were sued by Upper Deck, they sued each other.. his son even had his dads severed head frozen (which resulted in another family lawsuit). That caused understandable credibility issues associated with Green Diamond. Especially since the market has been flooded by GD Williams items at various times. So much so that they have really harmed Williams' autograph value. But they do appear to be authentic. I have picked up several over the years which some respected collectors I know all gave a thumbs up (and were also PSA authenticated). Many GD items have since been authenticated by PSA in addition to the GD hologram. If you are patient, you can pick up a solid, authentic 16 by 20 Williams with a Green Diamond hologram for around $100.

Or this one.. framed for $150 with a PSA COA as well.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ted-William...cAAOSwgd1arvQH

[Daddymc]

Originally Posted by Tradegeek

Great info. Totally agree, with one minor exception. Green Diamond (The company Ted Williams son owned) are typically good. Ted's family was a bit.. well... nuts. They were sued by Upper Deck, they sued each other.. his son even had his dads severed head frozen (which resulted in another family lawsuit). That caused understandable credibility issues associated with Green Diamond. Especially since the market has been flooded by GD Williams items at various times. So much so that they have really harmed Williams' autograph value. But they do appear to be authentic. I have picked up several over the years which some respected collectors I know all gave a thumbs up (and were also PSA authenticated). Many GD items have since been authenticated by PSA in addition to the GD hologram. If you are patient, you can pick up a solid, authentic 16 by 20 Williams with a Green Diamond hologram for around $100.

Or this one.. framed for $150 with a PSA COA as well.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ted-William...cAAOSwgd1arvQH

This is not true. William’s son using Green Diamond is directly responsible for many of the Williams forgeries that are out there.

[Tradegeek]

I heard bad things about Green Diamond years ago. But I can't find a single example of PSA or JSA rejecting a Williams auto with a Green Diamond hologram. The best auto collectors I know say they are legit, albeit most are post stroke so not as desirable as older examples.

Steiner has no issue selling them.

https://www.steinersports.com/produc...sort=asc-title

[rj.cataldo]

Originally Posted by Tradegeek

I heard bad things about Green Diamond years ago. But I can't find a single example of PSA or JSA rejecting a Williams auto with a Green Diamond hologram. The best auto collectors I know say they are legit, albeit most are post stroke so not as desirable as older examples.

Steiner has no issue selling them.

https://www.steinersports.com/produc...sort=asc-title

I’m sure your version is legit, as are many GD Williams autos. But there are a number of stories out there about GD and Williams son. They range from John Henry (his son) forcing his dad to sign around the clock to maximize money, to his son flat out forging the auto. Some said his son could basically sign nearly identical.

For me personally, I lean towards UDA for anything Mantle/Williams, but if you’ve done your homework and got authentication then that should suffice.

One more thing I will add though, I would NOT take Steiner selling it as a clear demonstration of authenticity. While they likely do some diligence, they don’t authenticate. They buy from dealers or other “reputable sources” sometimes and sell on their site. They have sold Mays “Sey hey” items in the past pretty cheap and PSA/JSA basically doesn’t touch that stuff anymore. I don’t think Steiner is intentionally defrauding, but I think when they see a chance to profit, they will, and sometimes they might get duped as well. I also bought a DiMaggio ball from Field of Dreams (20!years ago) which was owned by dreams inc (mounted memories and now fanatics), and that later turned out to be fake.

The point is, unless the company (e.g., Steiner) got the item through their own signings, I treat it like I’m buying off eBay.


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