If Tom Brady Wins the Super Bowl He will be the Greatest Athlete of All Time

[GoldPanner]

I have to start this off by saying I dislike Tom Brady, but I have been thinking and realized that if he wins the Super Bowl he will be the greatest athlete ever in any sport. Most people think Michael Jordan is, but with a win tommorow Brady will have as many championships in a sport where you are far more likely to be injured, and is far more difficult for teams to maintain sucsess. Tom Brady will have had far more clutch moments than mj. The other thing is that in the nba all the playoff series are 7 game series so the better team almost always wins, where as in football since every game is an elimination game, a lot more flukes occur where the worse teams win. If Brady has 7 game series he would probably already have more championships than mj, not to mention that he has reached the conference finals far more times. He has also defied age in his sport which is far more physical than basketball, which mj couldn’t do it. I hate to say it but I might have to finally admit Brady is the goat.

[LCM1223]

Jim Thorpe
Bo Jackson

[GoldPanner]

Originally Posted by LCM1223

Jim Thorpe
Bo Jackson

I don’t mean best athlete in terms of physical capability I mean in terms of career dominance

[Gustomania]

He's not the NFL GOAT so IMO not in the conversation in all sports........people quickly forget about Otto Graham, Unitas, Jim Brown, Montana, Rice.....not to even mention MJ, Gretzky, and the numerous iconic and legendary baseball greats....also you have to really consider athletes not from the big 4 like Michael Phelps, etc

So IMO, he's not in the discussion....

[3124508 on COMC]

There cannot just be one "Best Athlete of All Time". It's a ludicrous title. Even best football player of all time. There are simply too many factors.

[Gustomania]

I would agree with this statement....way too many legendary players across all sports to say anyone is the best.

Originally Posted by 3124508 on COMC

There cannot just be one "Best Athlete of All Time". It's a ludicrous title. Even best football player of all time. There are simply too many factors.

[Kollectornet]

Yes *

[KhalDrogo]

Nobody will ever top Jordan. Ever.

[LCM1223]

Originally Posted by GoldPanner

I don’t mean best athlete in terms of physical capability I mean in terms of career dominance

1. MJ
2. Gretzky
3. Brady

(Big 4 sports)

[tjforce]

Originally Posted by Gustomania

He's not the NFL GOAT so IMO not in the conversation in all sports........people quickly forget about Otto Graham, Unitas, Jim Brown, Montana, Rice.....not to even mention MJ, Gretzky, and the numerous iconic and legendary baseball greats....also you have to really consider athletes not from the big 4 like Michael Phelps, etc

So IMO, he's not in the discussion....

I grew up in Cleveland and am fully aware of Otto graham and Jim brown.

Hell, I used to work in the browns Berea offices and met Jim Brown a number of times.

Brady is the greatest football player ever.

As for other sports, to hard to compare Brady with MJ with Babe Ruth with Michael Phelps. But if there’s one guy to represent football on America’s sports Mount Rushmore, it’s Brady.

[GoldPanner]

Originally Posted by Gustomania

He's not the NFL GOAT so IMO not in the conversation in all sports........people quickly forget about Otto Graham, Unitas, Jim Brown, Montana, Rice.....not to even mention MJ, Gretzky, and the numerous iconic and legendary baseball greats....also you have to really consider athletes not from the big 4 like Michael Phelps, etc

So IMO, he's not in the discussion....

Im a Huge fan of Otto graham, but 4 of Otto grahams championships were in the aafc when there were only 8 teams and his 3 in the nfl were when there were only 12 teams. Its sort of similar to mj. Back then they had less teams and a lot of them were terrible expansion teams.

[kidfan9]

Wilt Chamberlain says hi

[TheFrenzy]

No. There is not a single sports-wide criteria by which one could say Tom Brady is the "greatest."

Number of championships won?
- Bill Russell won 11 pro basketball championships
- Yogi Berra won 10 pro baseball championships
- Henri Richard won 10 pro hockey championships
- Even Robert Horry won more pro championships than Brady (7)

Win/Loss percentage in championships?
- lol.
- If Brady wins, his winning percentage will still be a mediocre 66%.
- Look at the other guys across sports with six or more championship rings—most of them went undefeated or only lost once.
- In 8 Super Bowls under Brady, the Patriots have only scored opponents by a mere 4 points with their largest margin of victory being 6 points.
- Brady's claim to greatness is predicated more on his number of Super Bowl appearances than on his dominance or success in those games.

Being the "heart and soul" of multiple championship team?
- Brady is a heck of a competitor. No denying that. A case could be made for Top 10 competitors in NFL history, but there's no strong case for him being the greatest of all-time.
- The Patriots went 11-5 with Matt Cassell replacing Brady.
- His greatest Super Bowl passing line was 37/50, 328 yards, 4 touchdowns, 2 interceptions against the Seahawks. A great game, but several QBs have had much greater games with far fewer appearances.
- Again, Brady's claim to greatness is predicated more on his number of Super Bowl appearances than on his dominance or success in those games.

Fewest "bad losses"?
- Eli Manning
- Eli Manning
- Nick Foles
- We could almost add Jake Del-freaking-hommes to this list.
- For better and for worse, Brady has beaten the best QBs he's faced and lost to the worst QBs he's faced.

Best of "all-time"?
- Go read up on some of the greatest Roman gladiators and charioteers.
- Jim Thorpe would also like a word.
- Brady isn't even the greatest post-1900, North American athlete.
- Speaking of geography, Brady has never faced international competition. Thorpe, Jordan, Kobe, and many others did and walked away with gold.

Most athletic? (you did say "athlete" and not "competitor" or "player")
- I don't think anyone on earth would call Tom Brady the greatest athlete of all-time.
- Exhibit A:

[TheFrenzy]

Correction:

If we define "greatest" to mean "most likely to be played by Matt Damon in a movie, then yes, Brady is certainly the greatest.

[GoldPanner]

Originally Posted by TheFrenzy

No. There is not a single sports-wide criteria by which one could say Tom Brady is the "greatest."

Number of championships won?
- Bill Russell won 11 pro basketball championships
- Yogi Berra won 10 pro baseball championships
- Henri Richard won 10 pro hockey championships
- Even Robert Horry won more pro championships than Brady (7)

Win/Loss percentage in championships?
- lol.
- If Brady wins, his winning percentage will still be a mediocre 66%.
- Look at the other guys across sports with six or more championship rings—most of them went undefeated or only lost once.
- In 8 Super Bowls under Brady, the Patriots have only scored opponents by a mere 4 points with their largest margin of victory being 6 points.
- Brady's claim to greatness is predicated more on his number of Super Bowl appearances than on his dominance or success in those games.

Being the "heart and soul" of multiple championship team?
- Brady is a heck of a competitor. No denying that. A case could be made for Top 10 competitors in NFL history, but there's no strong case for him being the greatest of all-time.
- The Patriots went 11-5 with Matt Cassell replacing Brady.
- His greatest Super Bowl passing line was 37/50, 328 yards, 4 touchdowns, 2 interceptions against the Seahawks. A great game, but several QBs have had much greater games with far fewer appearances.
- Again, Brady's claim to greatness is predicated more on his number of Super Bowl appearances than on his dominance or success in those games.

Fewest "bad losses"?
- Eli Manning
- Eli Manning
- Nick Foles
- We could almost add Jake Del-freaking-hommes to this list.
- For better and for worse, Brady has beaten the best QBs he's faced and lost to the worst QBs he's faced.

Best of "all-time"?
- Go read up on some of the greatest Roman gladiators and charioteers.
- Jim Thorpe would also like a word.
- Brady isn't even the greatest post-1900, North American athlete.
- Speaking of geography, Brady has never faced international competition. Thorpe, Jordan, Kobe, and many others did and walked away with gold.

Most athletic? (you did say "athlete" and not "competitor" or "player")
- I don't think anyone on earth would call Tom Brady the greatest athlete of all-time.
- Exhibit A:

The fact that you say Robert Horry has more championships than Brady completely destroys the championships argument. it proves that you don't have to be the best to win a lot of championships. Bill Russell won because there were barely any teams back then, and he always had super teams with other hall of famers. Yogi Berra same thing. The whole idea that losing in the championship round is somehow worse that losing in the conference championship or divisional round is ridiculous. It just means that Brady was good enough to keep making it to the big game. A lot of great players are undefeated in the championship game, because the times that they make it it is when their team is stacked. Tom Brady can drag non championship teams to the championship unlike those other player you mentioned.

[TheFrenzy]

Originally Posted by GoldPanner

The fact that you say Robert Horry has more championships than Brady completely destroys the championships argument.

Terrible argument.
If championships matter, Brady is screwed—plenty of others have more.
If championships don't matter, Brady is screwed—plenty of NFL QBs have had comparable or better careers outside of the Super Bowl.

Originally Posted by GoldPanner

Bill Russell won because there were barely any teams back then, and he always had super teams with other hall of famers. Yogi Berra same thing.

And Brady has played his entire career in the AFC East, the weakest division in pro football. Again, terrible argument.

Originally Posted by GoldPanner

A lot of great players are undefeated in the championship game, because the times that they make it it is when their team is stacked. Tom Brady can drag non championship teams to the championship unlike those other player you mentioned.

Again, Matt Cassell led them to an 11-5 season and Bill Belichick has perennially stocked the team with talent. How many of those Patriot teams had "non-championship" talent and coaching?

Edit: You conveniently ignore the 2007 Patriots who went 16-0 and were possibly the single most-talented team in the history of league. And yet Brady lost to Eli Manning.

[SketchCollector]

Originally Posted by KhalDrogo

Nobody will ever top Jordan. Ever.

Agreed. Jordan revolutionized basketball and sports marketing as a whole. I don't think we'll ever see something like that again in our lifetime.

[GoldPanner]

Originally Posted by TheFrenzy

Terrible argument.
If championships matter, Brady is screwed—plenty of others have more.
If championships don't matter, Brady is screwed—plenty of NFL QBs have had comparable or better careers outside of the Super Bowl.



And Brady has played his entire career in the AFC East, the weakest division in pro football. Again, terrible argument.



Again, Matt Cassell led them to an 11-5 season and Bill Belichick has perennially stocked the team with talent. How many of those Patriot teams had "non-championship" talent and coaching?

In regards to championships what I am saying is that as the starting quarterback a ginormous portion of the responsibility of winning a championship falls on you, while in other sports you can be on a great team and rack them up. Once again the only other quarterbacks with more championships than hardy played when there were far less teams or played in a different league.

In regards to the fact that the patriots still did well without Brady, that proves nothing. They didn't win a championship without him. Getting to the playoffs is not that hard, but winning the championship is. If MJ were out for they year when he had good teams they still would have finished with a high seed, they just wouldn't win the championship.

[Gustomania]

Wasn't Brady and the Patriots favorites to win in all 3 losses, I know with one of the giants and vs the eagles they were huge favorites. Hard to consider him the Goat of all sports let alone football when you lose those games.

The game has changed so dramatically let's not short change all the iconic and legendary players in the past.

Obviously Brady is a legend of the game.

Originally Posted by GoldPanner

The fact that you say Robert Horry has more championships than Brady completely destroys the championships argument. it proves that you don't have to be the best to win a lot of championships. Bill Russell won because there were barely any teams back then, and he always had super teams with other hall of famers. Yogi Berra same thing. The whole idea that losing in the championship round is somehow worse that losing in the conference championship or divisional round is ridiculous. It just means that Brady was good enough to keep making it to the big game. A lot of great players are undefeated in the championship game, because the times that they make it it is when their team is stacked. Tom Brady can drag non championship teams to the championship unlike those other player you mentioned.

[GoldPanner]

Originally Posted by Gustomania

Wasn't Brady and the Patriots favorites to win in all 3 losses, I know with one of the giants and vs the eagles they were huge favorites. Hard to consider him the Goat of all sports let alone football when you lose those games.

The game has changed so dramatically let's not short change all the iconic and legendary players in the past.

Obviously Brady is a legend of the game.

I'm not short changing them, I think they are all all time greats, but I just think with another win Brady will elevate to a whole new level.

[Stat Monsters]

There really is never going to be a consensus G.O.A.T. beyond all-time stat leaders based on factual data of wins, points, games, etc.

It's too subjective as many factor in championships, individual performance, leadership, impact on others (making others around you better), off-the-field personality, sportsmanship, the dominance in the era they played in, etc.

Some like Manning, others like Brees, some like Namath, many like Brady, others opt for Montana, Elway, Marino, Bradshaw, etc. - - There is no GOAT.

The one thing that keeps Brady from rising above other players in popularity is he doesn't seem to have a very likable or personable nor charismatic personality other than being a flat out seriously dominant player, there's no warmth to him as an athlete that fans connect with, thus you don't see a lot of spokesperson endorsement deals going his way either.

[Gustomania]

What if he losses being favored again?

Originally Posted by GoldPanner

I'm not short changing them, I think they are all all time greats, but I just think with another win Brady will elevate to a whole new level.

[GoldPanner]

Originally Posted by Gustomania

What if he losses being favored again?

Then I would say that he is not unless he did something else incredible in his last few years. As I have previously stated I think its usually a bad argument to fault people for losing championships, unless they choke, but I do feel that at a certain point it should be looked at. I feel like if he losses this one and then another one without winning, and finished 500 in the Super Bowl, that he would lose G.O.A.T. status in football. I don't think that the greatest debate is a linear thing. Its not like every year somebody gets 200 greatness points and the next year they get 600 greatness points, and then whenever they pass someone else greatness points they are greater than them. I feel like you can lose greatness points meaning that someone can unbecome G.O.A.T.

[BostonNut]

Wake me up when one player gets to nine Super Bowls with one team.

Not a QB. Just a player...a kicker will do. Even waterboy.

I’ll wait.

[Ilovecards]

Secretariat and Man O' War are the greatest athletes.