2019 National Treasures

[Shanebwheeler]

Can't recall what the 2018 product sold for by the case out of the gate. Isn't this suppose to be a $2000 or less case? 2019 is looking like $3500+ is this the new normal?

[JeremyNick]

Originally Posted by Shanebwheeler

Can't recall what the 2018 product sold for by the case out of the gate. Isn't this suppose to be a $2000 or less case? 2019 is looking like $3500+ is this the new normal?

2018 was close to $800 a box. No way you’ll see a case for $2000.

[Shanebwheeler]

Originally Posted by JeremyNick

2018 was close to $800 a box. No way you’ll see a case for $2000.

OK thanks for the info.

[Spartyon]

This is the “new normal” it appears. Last year we had a rookie class with 5 QB’s in the first round so prices being higher off the bat was justified. I’ve stayed away from 2019 wax unless I can get it for close to MSRP. NT will be a blood bath at $3500 a case with this rookie class IMO.


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[majestik101]

They price these things as if every rookie is going to be a first ballot HOF'er.

[Ncguitarplyr]

I collect Jalin Moore National Treasures cards (in case anyone comes across one).

[mossoholic]

Can anyone recall a worse preorder price for a product in football, basketball, or baseball? A case is $4800 so $1200 a box. What percentage of those boxes after fees will hold $1,200 or more worth of cards? 2-3%? 2 years ago these would have been $500 and not even come close to selling out at that price. Things can change next season but as of right now this has to be the worst preorder for the price I have ever seen on a product.

[zhiyuchen90]

It’s stupid blowout price. My local shop give me $750 preorder price.

[Lockdown32]

Anyone think blowout will have any single boxes
of it again?

[Siberian13]

Originally Posted by mossoholic

Can anyone recall a worse preorder price for a product in football, basketball, or baseball? A case is $4800 so $1200 a box. What percentage of those boxes after fees will hold $1,200 or more worth of cards? 2-3%? 2 years ago these would have been $500 and not even come close to selling out at that price. Things can change next season but as of right now this has to be the worst preorder for the price I have ever seen on a product.

Ouch if opened at those prices

[mcgee2134]

Back in January Panini said the FOTL would be released on 3/11/2020 (tomorrow), but I haven't seen anything about it since then. Also back in January they said the regular release date would be 3/18 which is next Wednesday.

Are these delayed? Anyone know why?
I couldn't find any threads on here so it seems everyone is obsessed with Zion and doesn't care about these.

[tier1dc]

Originally Posted by mcgee2134

Back in January Panini said the FOTL would be released on 3/11/2020 (tomorrow), but I haven't seen anything about it since then. Also back in January they said the regular release date would be 3/18 which is next Wednesday.

Are these delayed? Anyone know why?
I couldn't find any threads on here so it seems everyone is obsessed with Zion and doesn't care about these.

think i heard 3/25 for Hobby. nothing about FOTL.

[mortatort]

Originally Posted by Spartyon

NT will be a blood bath at $3500 a case with this rookie class IMO.

I feel bad for anyone that gets murdered or maimed but I hope they don't get blood on any Quinnen Williams cards, assuming he's in it.

[majestik101]

Originally Posted by mcgee2134

Are these delayed? Anyone know why?
I couldn't find any threads on here so it seems everyone is obsessed with Zion and doesn't care about these.

Wait, is Zion in this? If he is I'm down for 4 cases.

[hilg2347]

Honestly, I get a little confused with everyone crapping on this draft class...

QB - Aside from Lamar... Are Darnold, Allen and Baker's potential that much better than Kyler, Lock and Daniel Jones (and I guess Haskins and Minshew if you like them)

RB - Are Saquon and Chubb that much better than Jacobs, Montgomery, Singletary and Sanders?

WRs - Obviously 2019 is wayyyy superior with AJ Brown, Hollywood, MetCalf, Deebo and even McLauren. Harry is still an unknown.

TE's - again obviously 2019

Def - Yes Darius Leonard is a stud... but Nick Bosa honestly looks like the best defensive rookie I have ever seen - again as a rookie.

What's the big negativity around this class? If Lamar would not have made the massive jump then where'd that 2018 class be? Is it the pricing that is making everyone so bitter on this class?

[daviswr7]

Originally Posted by hilg2347

Honestly, I get a little confused with everyone crapping on this draft class...

QB - Aside from Lamar... Are Darnold, Allen and Baker's potential that much better than Kyler, Lock and Daniel Jones (and I guess Haskins and Minshew if you like them)

RB - Are Saquon and Chubb that much better than Jacobs, Montgomery, Singletary and Sanders?

WRs - Obviously 2019 is wayyyy superior with AJ Brown, Hollywood, MetCalf, Deebo and even McLauren. Harry is still an unknown.

TE's - again obviously 2019

Def - Yes Darius Leonard is a stud... but Nick Bosa honestly looks like the best defensive rookie I have ever seen - again as a rookie.

What's the big negativity around this class? If Lamar would not have made the massive jump then where'd that 2018 class be? Is it the pricing that is making everyone so bitter on this class?

Broadly speaking current rookie draft classes are always under appreciated. In a few years we will look back on this draft as a pretty solid one imo...

Everything football is overshadowed by basketball this year.

[mrjduke]

Originally Posted by hilg2347

Honestly, I get a little confused with everyone crapping on this draft class...

QB - Aside from Lamar... Are Darnold, Allen and Baker's potential that much better than Kyler, Lock and Daniel Jones (and I guess Haskins and Minshew if you like them)

RB - Are Saquon and Chubb that much better than Jacobs, Montgomery, Singletary and Sanders?

WRs - Obviously 2019 is wayyyy superior with AJ Brown, Hollywood, MetCalf, Deebo and even McLauren. Harry is still an unknown.

TE's - again obviously 2019

Def - Yes Darius Leonard is a stud... but Nick Bosa honestly looks like the best defensive rookie I have ever seen - again as a rookie.

What's the big negativity around this class? If Lamar would not have made the massive jump then where'd that 2018 class be? Is it the pricing that is making everyone so bitter on this class?

This is like saying you would trade your $300k Ferrari for 15 $20k Hondas. Granted, Lamar has come back down to Mercedes level, but for a product to be exciting/worthwhile, it needs that "HIT." Mahomes in 2017. Lamar in 2018. Luka in 2018-19. Zion in this year. You don't see people doing breaks going alright, looking for Kyler Murrays here. Or Daniel Jones here. And I think this class has lots of potential. Daniel Jones and Drew Lock put up good rookie numbers. I'm personally not big on Kyler, but he had some fantastic games. But, until someone becomes somebody, this year is full of Honda Accords. Nice, reliable, something to be proud of, but you're still jealous of that Ferrari.

[blevins26]

Originally Posted by mrjduke

This is like saying you would trade your $300k Ferrari for 15 $20k Hondas. Granted, Lamar has come back down to Mercedes level, but for a product to be exciting/worthwhile, it needs that "HIT." Mahomes in 2017. Lamar in 2018. Luka in 2018-19. Zion in this year. You don't see people doing breaks going alright, looking for Kyler Murrays here. Or Daniel Jones here. And I think this class has lots of potential. Daniel Jones and Drew Lock put up good rookie numbers. I'm personally not big on Kyler, but he had some fantastic games. But, until someone becomes somebody, this year is full of Honda Accords. Nice, reliable, something to be proud of, but you're still jealous of that Ferrari.

Not a good analogy. This time last year, Lamar WAS a Honda. He had a little heat but not much. In 2017, Mahomes wasn't driving the whole hobby. That happened in 2018. In 2018, Lamar wasn't driving the whole hobby. That was 2019. The point in all these cases, Mahomes, Jackson, Luka, and Zion, is that their hobby dominance is driven by on-field performance.

If you think back, Baker-mania was running wild at this time last year. He was the one driving the value of the 2018 class.

If Lamar doesn't ball out in 2019, we'd be saying how terrible the 2018 class was because Baker took a MAJOR step back, no other QB (besides Lamar) took a major step forward, and Saquon had a mediocre season.

The rise & fall of Baker Mayfield + the 2019 play of Lamar & Mahomes has really hurt the 2019 class. People are less inclined to pay for draft position & hype. They want to see on-field performance. It could be a good thing for the hobby but it definitely hurt the 2019 class.

I think this class has a lot of potential. I think the NT prices Panini is charging are insane and I'll be staying away but I think that an individual player is likely to rise up in 2020 and drastically increase the value of 2019 products.

[mrjduke]

Originally Posted by blevins26

Not a good analogy. This time last year, Lamar WAS a Honda. He had a little heat but not much. In 2017, Mahomes wasn't driving the whole hobby. That happened in 2018. In 2018, Lamar wasn't driving the whole hobby. That was 2019. The point in all these cases, Mahomes, Jackson, Luka, and Zion, is that their hobby dominance is driven by on-field performance.



If you think back, Baker-mania was running wild at this time last year. He was the one driving the value of the 2018 class.



If Lamar doesn't ball out in 2019, we'd be saying how terrible the 2018 class was because Baker took a MAJOR step back, no other QB (besides Lamar) took a major step forward, and Saquon had a mediocre season.



The rise & fall of Baker Mayfield + the 2019 play of Lamar & Mahomes has really hurt the 2019 class. People are less inclined to pay for draft position & hype. They want to see on-field performance. It could be a good thing for the hobby but it definitely hurt the 2019 class.



I think this class has a lot of potential. I think the NT prices Panini is charging are insane and I'll be staying away but I think that an individual player is likely to rise up in 2020 and drastically increase the value of 2019 products.

I 100% agree with everything you said. I guess the way I should have said it was these statements are made comparing this current class to the current perception of all the other rookie classes. Current perception of the other classes have the star, performance driven or not. The next football rookie class already has a couple “Mercedes” in it. I was only speaking in terms of the OP’s post that compared this class and the perception of this year’s products as a whole in comparison to other classes (last year’s) and their products. I think this class can potentially create a breakout star, similar to Lamar’s rise. But, it hasn’t, and that’s why this class is viewed as weaker.


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[blevins26]

Originally Posted by mrjduke

I 100% agree with everything you said. I guess the way I should have said it was these statements are made comparing this current class to the current perception of all the other rookie classes. Current perception of the other classes have the star, performance driven or not. The next football rookie class already has a couple “Mercedes” in it. I was only speaking in terms of the OP’s post that compared this class and the perception of this year’s products as a whole in comparison to other classes (last year’s) and their products. I think this class can potentially create a breakout star, similar to Lamar’s rise. But, it hasn’t, and that’s why this class is viewed as weaker.


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Fair point. I'm wondering how much hype the 2020 class will generate in the pre-season before there are on-field results? There are a lot of QB's, but not really projected to exciting teams or situations IMO. No big time RB and the WR's seem just ok.

[FBallHobbies]

Originally Posted by blevins26

Fair point. I'm wondering how much hype the 2020 class will generate in the pre-season before there are on-field results? There are a lot of QB's, but not really projected to exciting teams or situations IMO. No big time RB and the WR's seem just ok.

I'd take a look again at the WR's coming out. A handful of studs. No Calvin Johnson esque, but a ton of skilled receivers coming out with as many as 6 that can go in the 1st round

[blevins26]

Originally Posted by FBallHobbies

I'd take a look again at the WR's coming out. A handful of studs. No Calvin Johnson esque, but a ton of skilled receivers coming out with as many as 6 that can go in the 1st round

I was speaking more like a Calvin Johnson-esque guy or even Julio when he came out had a ton of hype.

There are definitely WR's who could be dominant in the 2020 class, I just think that, for the most part, any non-QB player has to perform on the field in order to drive hobby box value.

For example, Saquon coming out was able to drive hobby box value before ever stepping on the field. #2 overall pick, went to a popular team in a popular city, considered a very "complete" prospect. But he's a rare example of a RB or WR who can really help hobby value before the season even starts.

[chris buk]

Originally Posted by mossoholic

Can anyone recall a worse preorder price for a product in football, basketball, or baseball? A case is $4800 so $1200 a box. What percentage of those boxes after fees will hold $1,200 or more worth of cards? 2-3%? 2 years ago these would have been $500 and not even come close to selling out at that price. Things can change next season but as of right now this has to be the worst preorder for the price I have ever seen on a product.

impeccable basketball this year is the worst i have seen. Its my favorite product, but Some cases don't have 300 dollars worth of cards, going for 3500. Newbs getting crushed finding this out IMO.

[Archangel1775]

The buy-in for anything NT has increased overall. $500-$2000 for rookie QBs have been replaced by $1000 to $5000 RPA's out the gate.

[daveyou]

nt fotl football will be dropping on 3/17